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Worst digital delay pedals. Effects Pedals, Units & Accessories
Old 25th July 2014
  #31
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
And the typically well thought out user interface that you can't negotiate without referring to the manual ("tweak" and "tweeze"? Gimme a break - what's that supposed to mean?)

And, of course, that famous Line 6 tone quality. Jeez, my cheap old Boss delay sounds better. Easier to use, too.
Yeah - we know you hate Line6 ... they must have beat you up real bad.

I don't have any problem with Line6 delays - they give you a wide range of options and features with low noise which get the job done. If you can't figure out what Tweak or Teaze means then maybe you should not not look at boutique pedals - they can name things real strange too ... a sense of humor might be required i'm afraid ...

Line6 stuff is very easy to work out - but the downside of having a bunch of extra features that are musically useful is that sometimes you need to have a brain to be able to switch 'em on and off and tricky stuff like that ...
Old 26th July 2014
  #32
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I am a POD hater myself. So done with their stuff.
Old 26th July 2014
  #33
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiwi View Post
Yeah - we know you hate Line6 ... they must have beat you up real bad.

I don't have any problem with Line6 delays - they give you a wide range of options and features with low noise which get the job done. If you can't figure out what Tweak or Teaze means then maybe you should not not look at boutique pedals - they can name things real strange too ... a sense of humor might be required i'm afraid ...

Line6 stuff is very easy to work out - but the downside of having a bunch of extra features that are musically useful is that sometimes you need to have a brain to be able to switch 'em on and off and tricky stuff like that ...
Yes, they do almost anything you could possibly want - they're extremely versatile.

The only things they don't do are sound good and be easy to use.

Cheap converters? Cheap DSP? I dunno, but they sound like a plastic model of the thing they're trying to emulate.

So what, exactly, do "tweak" and "tweeze" mean? I shouldn't have to memorize a multi-page manual to be able to set up a frikkin' delay pedal. It has NOTHING to do with a sense of humor - it has to do with confusingly re-purposing thew knobs to do different things on different patches - which is totally unnecessary for a well thought user interface designed to be used by MUSICIANS, not computer nerds.

If a car was designed with such a stupid interface traffic fatalities would skyrocket. Oh, yeah - sometimes this is the gas pedal but other times it's the gearshift - except when it's the brake. Brilliant interface, genius.
Old 26th July 2014
  #34
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I like this chap.
Old 26th July 2014
  #35
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Joe Porto's Avatar
 

I remember a pedal I got about 15 years ago...Korg Toneworks 301DL. It was one of the first of the Toneworks series. A programable digital delay. The problem was not the delay sound or functionality, which was pretty cool at the time...EQ and HI/LoFi, pre-delay and ducking. It was the fact that when you plugged your guitar into it, it sucked the life out of it. Not sure if it was just a crappy preamp, or maybe just the whole signal was digitized, but that thing lasted about 5 minutes on my board.

Old 27th July 2014
  #36
Lives for gear
Technology continues to expand exponentially nearly every few months.
Remember the first portable phones?
High end delay units these days are marvelous technology.
Strymon, Eventide, tc and others are just amazing sound quality.
Personally I am not into the modeling of effects, the amp thing is all fine and good but instead of creating a badly rendered model of a cheap ass pedal why not just offer a great more unique circuit?
They constantly model things like tubescreamers which really, that is not something that interests me. The case of effect models is summed up for me in their Metal Zone model of the Boss pedal. That pedal has an interactive stacked parametric EQ, they offer you two or three "tone" controls and that suffers as a "model" for that pedal. Spare me.
If anyone is in love with Line6 and floats your boat, have at it. I have moved on from that line some time back. Have no use for nostalgia mimic models of pedals that were not all that great to begin with.
Some cat was arguing with me his Line6 Vibe was as good as my photocell circuit vibe. Really, I guess I have magic ears as I can easily hear and feel the difference. It's not that these pedals sound terrible but there are better units.
Old 27th July 2014
  #37
Quote:
Originally Posted by darkhorse View Post
Some cat was arguing with me his Line6 Vibe was as good as my photocell circuit vibe. Really, I guess I have magic ears as I can easily hear and feel the difference. It's not that these pedals sound terrible but there are better units.
That's an interesting point because sometimes a pedal that does sound "terrible" can be a much more interesting device than one that just sounds "blah"....
Old 27th July 2014
  #38
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GeminIAm's Avatar
No mention of Behringer yet
Old 27th July 2014
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
That's an interesting point because sometimes a pedal that does sound "terrible" can be a much more interesting device than one that just sounds "blah"....
I thought about that for a second and it seems to make sense. i have not had one that was terrible. I tried a lot of delays some that were just blah, sterile, lifeless, all were digital merely because I have little interest in analog pedals. I've had all the memory man, mxr, and what not when the better digital came out like Boss that started it all just changed the delay thing for me.
I was pondering the notion of crappy, lo fi, muddy, warble modulation, repeats and I can see at times where that might be interesting. Then I considered what if I have this massive Vibe Tremolo overdriven thick tone, why would I want my delays to be incoherent and adding more warble and mud? In that regard a 2290 type delay is amazing. I sort of want my cool tone to repeat under the groove not have the delay whack it out or trim off the high and low end.

I liked the tc Flashback the best of them, the way the straight signal gets passed through untouched and it lays in the mix very well just made it sound more musical on my rig anyway. I upgraded to the larger ability X4 and I have been very pleased with how the delays just sound more musical. It is hard to explain really.

I've been waiting on Beringher and Castle Rock to make an appearance, But I just know someone loves them. I do not get the el cheapo pedal thing myself. I guess if you have nothing, but why not save up a little and go for some better quality? Then there are the cats who claim we are wasting money on "boutique" level pedals, like we are just wasting money. Seriously if you can play through a Strymon, Eventide and tc and go back to your cheap pedal I do not know what to say.
I''ll take the Jaguar over the Fiesta any day.
Old 27th July 2014
  #40
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Porto View Post
I remember a pedal I got about 15 years ago...Korg Toneworks 301DL. It was one of the first of the Toneworks series. A programable digital delay. The problem was not the delay sound or functionality, which was pretty cool at the time...EQ and HI/LoFi, pre-delay and ducking. It was the fact that when you plugged your guitar into it, it sucked the life out of it. Not sure if it was just a crappy preamp, or maybe just the whole signal was digitized, but that thing lasted about 5 minutes on my board.


I bought a cheap plastic version of this series for bass - so I didn't have to lug around a whole bass rig to get EQ and a little comp when rehearsing with a choir....

The pre-amp on it was awful, or maybe it was the converter. I never did get around to trying it with a decent pre-amp in front of it (what's the point, then?). Too bad, it seemed like the underlying processing was pretty good...






-tINY

Old 27th July 2014
  #41
Quote:
Originally Posted by OktoberStorm View Post
No mention of Behringer yet

..likely because their plastic stomp boxes are actually pretty decent sounding. They're more durable than you'd expect too.

Not unlike a budget Boss pedal for the few I've used.



-tINY

Old 27th July 2014
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OktoberStorm View Post
No mention of Behringer yet
Quote:
Originally Posted by tINY View Post

..likely because their plastic stomp boxes are actually pretty decent sounding. They're more durable than you'd expect too.

Not unlike a budget Boss pedal for the few I've used.



-tINY

They only rip off the good stuff.
Old 27th July 2014
  #43
Quote:
Originally Posted by darkhorse View Post
I thought about that for a second and it seems to make sense. i have not had one that was terrible. I tried a lot of delays some that were just blah, sterile, lifeless, all were digital merely because I have little interest in analog pedals. I've had all the memory man, mxr, and what not when the better digital came out like Boss that started it all just changed the delay thing for me.
I was pondering the notion of crappy, lo fi, muddy, warble modulation, repeats and I can see at times where that might be interesting. Then I considered what if I have this massive Vibe Tremolo overdriven thick tone, why would I want my delays to be incoherent and adding more warble and mud? In that regard a 2290 type delay is amazing. I sort of want my cool tone to repeat under the groove not have the delay whack it out or trim off the high and low end.

I liked the tc Flashback the best of them, the way the straight signal gets passed through untouched and it lays in the mix very well just made it sound more musical on my rig anyway. I upgraded to the larger ability X4 and I have been very pleased with how the delays just sound more musical. It is hard to explain really.

I've been waiting on Beringher and Castle Rock to make an appearance, But I just know someone loves them. I do not get the el cheapo pedal thing myself. I guess if you have nothing, but why not save up a little and go for some better quality? Then there are the cats who claim we are wasting money on "boutique" level pedals, like we are just wasting money. Seriously if you can play through a Strymon, Eventide and tc and go back to your cheap pedal I do not know what to say.
I''ll take the Jaguar over the Fiesta any day.

It's really all a matter of context. After finally dumping my Line 6 I'm left with a Boss DD-5 and a Boss RE-20 Space Echo for pedals and 2 Roland SDE-1000s and a Lexicon PCM-90 with expander card for rack. Of the rack gear, on of the Rolands is available for non-studio stuff. The Lexi is a great delay but a bit complicated for a stage unit (although it's still easier to negotiate than the damn Line 6.) The Space Echo works pretty much like a Space echo with added tap tempo except for a couple mildly annoying quirks (changing the "head settings" erases the adjustment on the speed knob for some damn reason), and the DD-5 is just a good all around delay pedal. I haven't tried the Strymon or Eventides yet.

One of the things I look for most in stage gear is simplicity of operation, and that's one area where every Line 6 device I've ever tried fails miserably.
Old 28th July 2014
  #44
Lives for gear
I am not sure "everyone" experiences the same but many I talk to have, like me, go through phases of various pedal lines eventually moving on and progressing. Seems like I started with Boss, went through various lines from there and over time just have several I no longer consider. Don't care much about Boss, EH, Line6, and just cannot deal with the Chinese tiny pedal thing, and Beringher or Castle Rock, really low priced pedals not on my radar.

I like to think I am progressing, my tones are at a level now it is hard to imagine they will get better. I only look at upgrading my delay and reverb as possibilities without radically altering my base tone. Seems like over time the majority of my pedals end up being hand made USA as they just seem to sound the best and survive a lot of trial and error changes.

As for delay, I like my Tc X4 right now, cannot say anything bad about it. I would like to get into Strymon or Eventide but with the PC editor the X4 has, I doubt it would be gaining a whole lot of improvement.
As much as love Lexicon reverbs my sort of budget level MX unit does not have the more in depth control I would like plus I like that shimmer reverb and some other new algorithms the Eventide and others have going on.
I get a good reverb out of the Lexicon but I have to build my own shimmer effect using combinations of pitch shift and reverb. That Eventide Space unit really blows me away with the level of special reverbs it has. the H9 has potential as well as one can load it with just what you want.

As for the delay thing, I think once you get to a certain level of circuit design and component quality there are no "bad" units. I mean they all work, they all manifest repeats, but some seem to have that more musical quality and tone without being sterile and dull. What got me right off the bat with the tc was the way the delays laid back into the overall mix and it was "warmer" and the dry signal was untouched.
Old 28th July 2014
  #45
Quote:
Originally Posted by darkhorse View Post
I am not sure "everyone" experiences the same but many I talk to have, like me, go through phases of various pedal lines eventually moving on and progressing. Seems like I started with Boss, went through various lines from there and over time just have several I no longer consider. Don't care much about Boss, EH, Line6, and just cannot deal with the Chinese tiny pedal thing, and Beringher or Castle Rock, really low priced pedals not on my radar.

I like to think I am progressing, my tones are at a level now it is hard to imagine they will get better. I only look at upgrading my delay and reverb as possibilities without radically altering my base tone. Seems like over time the majority of my pedals end up being hand made USA as they just seem to sound the best and survive a lot of trial and error changes.

As for delay, I like my Tc X4 right now, cannot say anything bad about it. I would like to get into Strymon or Eventide but with the PC editor the X4 has, I doubt it would be gaining a whole lot of improvement.
As much as love Lexicon reverbs my sort of budget level MX unit does not have the more in depth control I would like plus I like that shimmer reverb and some other new algorithms the Eventide and others have going on.
I get a good reverb out of the Lexicon but I have to build my own shimmer effect using combinations of pitch shift and reverb. That Eventide Space unit really blows me away with the level of special reverbs it has. the H9 has potential as well as one can load it with just what you want.

As for the delay thing, I think once you get to a certain level of circuit design and component quality there are no "bad" units. I mean they all work, they all manifest repeats, but some seem to have that more musical quality and tone without being sterile and dull. What got me right off the bat with the tc was the way the delays laid back into the overall mix and it was "warmer" and the dry signal was untouched.
I'm not a huge fan of the more "affordable" Lexi stuff.
Old 29th July 2014
  #46
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GearAndGuitars's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
Daniel Lanois could play a tin can with a piece of fishing line and make it sound great.
That's probably his next album! Songs from the lake as sung from the dock…
Old 29th July 2014
  #47
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
I'm not a huge fan of the more "affordable" Lexi stuff.
Yeah, it has it's limitations.I can get some decent reverb out of it for now but in time I am getting the Eventide.
Old 31st July 2014
  #48
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GearAndGuitars's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
I'm not a huge fan of the more "affordable" Lexi stuff.
Personally, the MPX1 is a very underrated box. It's not an eventide, and wasn't intended to be.
Old 31st July 2014
  #49
Gear Nut
 
Alza's Avatar
 

These any good? Their distortions are impressive, after all.....
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Worst digital delay pedals.-image_4938.jpg  
Old 1st August 2014
  #50
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
Yes, they do almost anything you could possibly want - they're extremely versatile.

The only things they don't do are sound good and be easy to use.

Cheap converters? Cheap DSP? I dunno, but they sound like a plastic model of the thing they're trying to emulate.

So what, exactly, do "tweak" and "tweeze" mean? I shouldn't have to memorize a multi-page manual to be able to set up a frikkin' delay pedal. It has NOTHING to do with a sense of humor - it has to do with confusingly re-purposing thew knobs to do different things on different patches - which is totally unnecessary for a well thought user interface designed to be used by MUSICIANS, not computer nerds.

If a car was designed with such a stupid interface traffic fatalities would skyrocket. Oh, yeah - sometimes this is the gas pedal but other times it's the gearshift - except when it's the brake. Brilliant interface, genius.

It's simple. No more difficult than using a decent rack delay. It's not great sounding but it has enough there to satisfy a lot of people. The RE-20 on the other hand is complete meh. Nothing about that pedal appealed to me. If it's truly a great Space Echo emulation, then it's saved me splashing a ton of cash on a Space Echo :D
Old 1st August 2014
  #51
Quote:
Originally Posted by GearAndGuitars View Post
Personally, the MPX1 is a very underrated box. It's not an eventide, and wasn't intended to be.
The MPX1 has tons of great sounds in it. Very easy to pick up at real bargain prices secondhand. Definitely need to read the manual to get the best out of it and it is well worth your time in doing so.
Old 2nd August 2014
  #52
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
Daniel Lanois could play a tin can with a piece of fishing line and make it sound great.
That's sort of why we should not fall over backwards as to what some master class player uses, as we have no idea of why that might be. They are of such a caliber player they literally could use the "worse" pedals of all time and make them sound great. Ever hear John 5 cut loose, he does not sound like that from the Boss pedals, he could render a tin can and fishing line as well. Smell endorsement deal? The argument now shifts as to what gauge fishing line and the can size...
Isn't the chasing of copying what someone uses a bit of a neophyte approach to guitar?

I recently saw Pagey using a Boss OD and I could hear the limitations of the sound and tone despite his mastery of the instrument.
It was not bad or a poor performance but you could just tell if a higher level of gear was chosen it would have been that much better an icing on the cake.
Using an old model Whammy as well, not true bypass, a poor "tone sucker" buffer(certainly not a class A buffer). only a monophonic pedal that tracking glitches like crazy. Verses the new Whammy V, bypass, polyphonic chord mode(and switchable old circuit toggle), by far and away a much better quality and sounding pedal, even on std toggle mode.
Bad advice, ignorant guitar tech, why would someone use less quality worse sounding gear? Nostalgia, just out of touch, paid endorsement, any number of reasons and if one wants to argue a cheap pedal sounds the same and of the same component circuit quality as a high end hand made. Then best of luck to you, I'll take the Strymon level any day. I am very sure Jimmy could use any drive made for free, a Boss, really? Makes no sense, Boiling Point or any number of higher end drives.

Could be more often that someone sounds good in spite of what they use, instead of because of it? I learned in this life just because someone reaches a level of fame or wealth we should not weigh that much into their opinions. Some are really potato brains. Not saying that is the case with Pagey, as I dearly love that guy and his work, but just probably someone put that one in front of him or he is just really back in the day of the MKII and not up on anything in recent times.
Old 2nd August 2014
  #53
Quote:
Originally Posted by GearAndGuitars View Post
Personally, the MPX1 is a very underrated box. It's not an eventide, and wasn't intended to be.
No, it wasn't, but it's not even a particularly impressive Lexicon.

I guess it depends on whether you're looking for a box that carries a logo from a (previously) highly respected manufacturer of professional quality FX which you can buy for dirt cheap and impress your friends with the label ("Hey man - I got a LEXICON! I'm MOIST PRO!") or whether you're looking for a (formerly) highly respected company to maintain their standards of quality.
Old 2nd August 2014
  #54
Lives for gear
Man has a point. I paid $100 for a used mint condition Lexicon MX200, it is OK and yet, I confess I only bought the unit because it said Lexicon.
I expected more but for a $100 what can you expect?
I seriously think my former RV-7 Hardwire stereo in/out with the Lexicon chip (as Digitech owns Lexicon) had better reverbs.
The MX has very locked in algorithm that has very little edit range. I use it just to add some separation between my cabs.
Sounds OK but not where I want to get.
Lexicon used to be the benchmark but these days I look to Eventide or Strymon.
Old 8th August 2014
  #55
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GearAndGuitars's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
No, it wasn't, but it's not even a particularly impressive Lexicon.

I guess it depends on whether you're looking for a box that carries a logo from a (previously) highly respected manufacturer of professional quality FX which you can buy for dirt cheap and impress your friends with the label ("Hey man - I got a LEXICON! I'm MOIST PRO!") or whether you're looking for a (formerly) highly respected company to maintain their standards of quality.
The MPX1 is a great dual chip multi effects box. Current used prices are at about $300, which makes it an underrated value for time based effects and reverb in the same box regardless of whose name is on it.
Old 8th August 2014
  #56
Quote:
Originally Posted by GearAndGuitars View Post
The MPX1 is a great dual chip multi effects box. Current used prices are at about $300, which makes it an underrated value for time based effects and reverb in the same box regardless of whose name is on it.
Meh.

I guess it all depends on where you set your standards.

I have a PCM 90 with the expansion card. It's adequate.
Old 10th August 2014
  #57
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GearAndGuitars's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
Meh.

I guess it all depends on where you set your standards.

I have a PCM 90 with the expansion card. It's adequate.
I have a PCM91. It doesn't make the MPX1 any less valuable for what it does as a dual chip box. One chip dedicated to time based effects such as delays, chorus, etc, and another dedicated chip just for reverb. That's not a bad deal. It's not a PCM series box and wasn't intended to be, which is why it's not branded as such.

As far as I'm concerned an Eventide Eclipse makes owning any PCM series box a non-starter.
Old 10th August 2014
  #58
Gear Addict
 
nomoneymoproblem's Avatar
 

Pretty much all the TCE stuff sounds pretty awful to me... as do the modern boss DD pedals .. ugh

Same goes for the Line 6 junk...

Saying that, the biggest ripoff delay has to be the handwired Mad Professor... had one and sold it almost immediately... just so underwhelming for it's price tag, which is ludicrous...

FTR: My last three delays were/are: Strymon Timeline (sold it, because I found it uninspiring), Analogman ARDX20 (amazing sounding, but needed more out of my delay) and finally my Pigtronix Echolution 2 - a total keeper. Sounds much better than the timeline and does stuff no other delay can!
Old 7th August 2018
  #59
Gear Nut
 

Personally I don't like TC delays,
I dislike the sound of Nova Delay, Flashback or Alter Ego.

Alter Ego tries to emulate analog and tape delays, but every preset has too much modulation that seems that in every Delay theres a TC Chorus connected. It seems every preset has the same lush chorus character, it's horrible.


The Line 6 DL4 is a great sounding unit, The Echoplex, Deluxe Memory Man and DM-2 emulation sound really good.
Each model has it's own character in terms of grit, distortion, wow and flutter and frequency response degradation, and quite similar to the character of the original units.
It's quite versatile, and sorry to you all Line6 haters, I can agree that most Line 6 emulations are not good, but they really done their job well with the DL4, it sounds great and thats the main reason it's already a classic pedal and quite popular on pedalboards around the globe.
The same goes to the Echo Pro rack version and the Echo Farm plugin, great sounding.
The plugin was even re-introduced this year after a so many requests of users.

Congratulations Line 6 for the development of the DL4 delay pedal
Old 7th August 2018
  #60
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Mikhael's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by iLCacciLLo View Post
Personally I don't like TC delays,
I dislike the sound of Nova Delay, Flashback or Alter Ego.

Alter Ego tries to emulate analog and tape delays, but every preset has too much modulation that seems that in every Delay theres a TC Chorus connected. It seems every preset has the same lush chorus character, it's horrible.


The Line 6 DL4 is a great sounding unit, The Echoplex, Deluxe Memory Man and DM-2 emulation sound really good.
Each model has it's own character in terms of grit, distortion, wow and flutter and frequency response degradation, and quite similar to the character of the original units.
It's quite versatile, and sorry to you all Line6 haters, I can agree that most Line 6 emulations are not good, but they really done their job well with the DL4, it sounds great and thats the main reason it's already a classic pedal and quite popular on pedalboards around the globe.
The same goes to the Echo Pro rack version and the Echo Farm plugin, great sounding.
The plugin was even re-introduced this year after a so many requests of users.

Congratulations Line 6 for the development of the DL4 delay pedal
I'm just the opposite. All my time-based FX come from a t.c. electronic G-Major - no pedal. I have tried some of the Line6 pedals, and they weren't my cuppa. Considering I now use few pedals, I'm probably not the right one to respond (although he did mention rackmount units).
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