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Danger in Digital ???
Old 31st July 2020
  #31
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Mikhael's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by enorbet2 View Post
I suppose we shouldn't talk about Digital Drum Machines vs/ Real Drummers
I think that's fine for demos, or some certain enhancements, but I do prefer the interaction of a live drummer with a band. But yes, this is totally one aspect of the digital environment. So many recordings heard on the radio now are completely programmed, and I miss the human element.
Old 31st July 2020
  #32
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enorbet2's Avatar
There's a really decent interview with Studio guitarist Tim Pierce that talks in-depth about the difficulties and obstacles, both human and digital, faced by guitarists in the studio workplace on one of Rick Beato's podcast shows.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubGOWfLFniw
Old 1st August 2020
  #33
Quote:
Originally Posted by enorbet2 View Post
I suppose we shouldn't talk about Digital Drum Machines vs/ Real Drummers
Digital, schmidgital.

ALL drum machines suck balls, the old analog ones usually even worse than the digital boxes.
Old 1st August 2020
  #34
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikhael View Post
I think that's fine for demos, or some certain enhancements, but I do prefer the interaction of a live drummer with a band. But yes, this is totally one aspect of the digital environment. So many recordings heard on the radio now are completely programmed, and I miss the human element.
I don't bother with the typical radio anymore.

Sirius is good.
Old 1st August 2020
  #35
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enorbet2's Avatar
Yup! Funky machines break. Funky people break dance or into a serious sweat.
Old 1st August 2020
  #36
Gear Head
 
Glue2020's Avatar
 

Quote:
I suppose we shouldn't talk about Digital Drum Machines vs/ Real Drummers
oh no not that again
Old 2nd August 2020
  #37
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enorbet2's Avatar
Re: Digital Drum Boxes vs/ Real Drummers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glue2020 View Post
oh no not that again
Why? Do you imagine controversy? I don't.
Old 4th August 2020
  #38
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by enorbet2 View Post
Re: Digital Drum Boxes vs/ Real Drummers



Why? Do you imagine controversy? I don't.
As tech marches on it will be interesting to see how AI controlled drums will do
Old 4th August 2020
  #39
Old 18th August 2020
  #40
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I treat digital audio and midi just like I did when using linear tape systems. I disregard the grid and work completely via real tempo. There are lots of really nice features I've read about with rapid editing by using snap clicking to the grid. Sounds interesting from a functional use - but sounds horrible from a musical approach. I wonder how well those things actually work anyways. Digital audio give you great editing and compositional tools with out all the tempo based arraignments. I just never found a need to bend music into a grid shape.
Old 18th August 2020
  #41
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Yuri Kogan's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RBHan View Post
I treat digital audio and midi just like I did when using linear tape systems. I disregard the grid and work completely via real tempo. There are lots of really nice features I've read about with rapid editing by using snap clicking to the grid. Sounds interesting from a functional use - but sounds horrible from a musical approach. I wonder how well those things actually work anyways. Digital audio give you great editing and compositional tools with out all the tempo based arraignments. I just never found a need to bend music into a grid shape.
Digital audio gives you a different soundstage and is purely additive which may not sound as good with many tracks. But for every-day its fine
Besides after years of cutting tape, I much prefer digital editing. And tape machines were just as unreliable (and much more expensive in maintenance) as DAW
Old 19th August 2020
  #42
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuri Kogan View Post
Digital audio gives you a different soundstage and is purely additive which may not sound as good with many tracks. But for every-day its fine
Besides after years of cutting tape, I much prefer digital editing. And tape machines were just as unreliable (and much more expensive in maintenance) as DAW
NOT TRUE! My Studer is totally reliable. On any given day it can be totally relied on to blow a couple of chips. Which is why I keep a bunch of them on hand.

Frankly, I'd much rather replace chips in my audio cards than troubleshoot most software problems.

The headaches I had with my old converters were both epic and intractable. Fortunately the Orion 32 has been solid as a rock.
Old 20th August 2020
  #43
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Yuri Kogan's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
NOT TRUE! My Studer is totally reliable. On any given day it can be totally relied on to blow a couple of chips. Which is why I keep a bunch of them on hand.

Frankly, I'd much rather replace chips in my audio cards than troubleshoot most software problems.

The headaches I had with my old converters were both epic and intractable. Fortunately the Orion 32 has been solid as a rock.
I had 3 Studer's. 2xA800, 1xA827 (?). The last one is still ok. The 2 older ones were ok until some faults became noticeable. Then we cannibalised one to restore the other. Mainly because maintaining them became prohibitively expensive. Now we run out of spare parts and I sold them as spare parts to an archive studio. I also had a 24-track Otari MTR-90 which was ho-ham, but reasonably reliable for a while, then ...... And the Ampex ATR (16 track) was a real dog - a maintenance nightmare.
Things fail and wear out (heads for example wear out, capstans need replacing, all sort of motor issues, cards go faulty, controllers f***k up, cabling issues, sinchro issues...). If you use it continuously on professional level things go wrong. It may be better in the US (although some people i contacted were very expensive, had a waiting list and shipping was $$$$). But is you us it once a month and have a "donor" machine or a friendly serviceman, then you are ok. For a while at least.
Old 20th August 2020
  #44
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Yuri Kogan's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
NOT TRUE! My Studer is totally reliable. On any given day it can be totally relied on to blow a couple of chips. Which is why I keep a bunch of them on hand.

Frankly, I'd much rather replace chips in my audio cards than troubleshoot most software problems.

The headaches I had with my old converters were both epic and intractable. Fortunately the Orion 32 has been solid as a rock.
Antelope stuff is ok while it works. I had 2 of their top of the range clocks crap out, contacted the company and got quoted more for the repair (plus more for shipping) then to buy a new one. Don't want to deal with them again. I am quite happy with my lynx Aurora 16s (got 8 of them) and my Radar converters (2x24track).
Old 20th August 2020
  #45
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The big factors here are beyond music really.
Technology allows for people to 1.) create a clone of what a band playin together should sound like and much easier now than syncing multiple hardware boxes, Mocs and synths and then recording them all to to tape or even recording them all to digital.
Now you can play it all in in your daw, but you can also quantize everything of course.
Which isn’t necessarily all bad. Editing isn’t all bad. It happened on basically all of our favorite records. But infinite editing without forethought.
Not having to write arrange and really practice the song before hand.. doesn’t have to be done anymore because of daws.
And then, even if if the writing arranging and playing out live (practicing) is done.. many producers/mixers are so programmed by the modern popular music that they MAY over edit things.
So we have become accustomed to this sound of very precise playing as well, as players producers and mixers.
2.) technology also allowed for the tech giants to rake in 30% profits off the backs of content creators. Initially this sounded great to many people. No labels, no trying to deal with distribution. Just sign up to a website, upload your music and you’re on all the platforms.

But the platforms set the rate that the content creator gets, and they effectively set pricing.
I.e. 99c per track or 9.99 a month for streaming.
What people didn’t realize with this is that they were giving up control of their business, and contributing to the Tech abyss that would suck every other artist in because... the major labels signed with Apple google and amazon, and they have the biggest music catalogs. The ease, cheapness, and convenience of downloading ends up trumping everything else.. so indies are forced to tow the line with iTunes and then Spotify as well.

The trickledown effect of both 1 and 2 is that since budgets are so small, smaller groups of less experienced and educated people work together on albums.
And because DAWs allow one person to so easily record, edit and organize everything many people choose to just do it al themselves and every once in a while they may collaborate.

You combine it all and the grove and soul of human music has been lost, but it was basically bought and sold, imo.

I’m not against technology.
But my perspective is that these things happen with entertainment first (subscriptions and huge companies setting pricing).
Because many people who aren’t in the Entertainment biz think entertainers (which includes musicians) are just “talented” and either rich or can easily make money with their talent.
They don’t realize that 90+% of the best entertainers spent most of their lives practicing and perfecting their craft.
But the rest of the world will realize when the likes of Apple google and amazon invade the healthcare system and automate that.
When they set pricing and advertising for contracting services/blue collar work and make 30% off of that work.

Keep in mind, in the case of the music industry how automated the distribution is.
This is how google Apple and amazon have raked in so much money over recent years.
Off the backs of content creators.
Apps, books, music, tv and music. Etc.

I worked for amazon In 2012 and they were selling kindles at just over cost, because it wasn’t about making money off of the hardware.
It was about the content and sitting back and collecting 30% off the backs off content creators 24/7 365.
The masses don’t really care and don’t have the time or energy to deal with it, until it affects their industry and it goes to sh!t.

Last edited by Tnevz; 20th August 2020 at 10:20 PM..
Old 20th August 2020
  #46
Gear Head
 





On my last trip to earth, I discovered people heat up glass tubes, run a current through it, make a cardboard sphere vibrate, then use a primitive microphone to capture the sound...
Old 21st August 2020
  #47
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Yuri Kogan's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gixertrix View Post




On my last trip to earth, I discovered people heat up glass tubes, run a current through it, make a cardboard sphere vibrate, then use a primitive microphone to capture the sound...
But you liked the sound so much, ever since then you have been trying to simulate it using your latest tech?
Old 21st August 2020
  #48
Gear Head
 

I still boil potato's...
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