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So tired of this bass recording problem.
Old 14th July 2020
  #1
Lives for gear
 

So tired of this bass recording problem.

This is driving me nuts. When I record bass and like get a bop using the 4th string and pop back two frets up and hit the 2nd string octave and get a groove going, THE 2ND STRING OCTAVE IS FRICKING POKING OUT LOUD AS HELL AND I CAN'T FIGURE OUT HOW TO FIX IT IN THE MIX.

HELP!!!. I am going to have to go back and record my bass again and I have to figure out how to do the part just using the 3rd and 4th strings and then that causes strange sounds too having to slide way up the neck.

I have downloaded the frequencies chart of bass and guitar notes on the fretboard and tried using tight Q cuts at the note frequencies, BUT THIS. DOESN'T WORK for some reason, I still hear the octave note blaring out loud and bright and it is literally painful.

If I low pass with eq (Crave eq). I can then drag the low pass way down and finally stop it, but then the lower strings sound horrible and muddy with no definition.

I'm a guitar player that has to play bass for myself. I have fairly newer strings, just a few months old. I don't know what to do other than just relearn my parts having to slide all over the neck and only use the 3rd and 4th string but heck, grooving with that octave on the first 2 strings on the back beat is so useful and can be a such a cool part of a groove.

Anyone have any tips I can try?
Old 14th July 2020
  #2
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffguitar View Post
This is driving me nuts. When I record bass and like get a bop using the 4th string and pop back two frets up and hit the 2nd string octave and get a groove going, THE 2ND STRING OCTAVE IS FRICKING POKING OUT LOUD AS HELL AND I CAN'T FIGURE OUT HOW TO FIX IT IN THE MIX.

HELP!!!. I am going to have to go back and record my bass again and I have to figure out how to do the part just using the 3rd and 4th strings and then that causes strange sounds too having to slide way up the neck.

I have downloaded the frequencies chart of bass and guitar notes on the fretboard and tried using tight Q cuts at the note frequencies, BUT THIS. DOESN'T WORK for some reason, I still hear the octave note blaring out loud and bright and it is literally painful.

If I low pass with eq (Crave eq). I can then drag the low pass way down and finally stop it, but then the lower strings sound horrible and muddy with no definition.

I'm a guitar player that has to play bass for myself. I have fairly newer strings, just a few months old. I don't know what to do other than just relearn my parts having to slide all over the neck and only use the 3rd and 4th string but heck, grooving with that octave on the first 2 strings on the back beat is so useful and can be a such a cool part of a groove.

Anyone have any tips I can try?
If you don’t eq the note, does it still pop out on other systems like in the car? Possibly a room issue you’re hearing?
Old 14th July 2020
  #3
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noah330's Avatar
Sounds like it may be more of a technique issue vs something you should fix in the mix.

You say you're a guitar player. Maybe take some bass lessons? Similar instrument, totally different technique.

As a guitar player myself that's what I did.
Old 14th July 2020
  #4
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JB872 View Post
If you don’t eq the note, does it still pop out on other systems like in the car? Possibly a room issue you’re hearing?
It pops on my headphones and speakers, Sony 7605 using eq curve to flat. The 3rd and 4th strings sound wonderful, deep, but with that nice finger definition. But it's like the 1st and 2nd strings just sound so high pitched and really loud, and if I try to compress it out I have to smash it so hard it ruins the dynamics.

I'm blown away that trying to grab the frequency of the note doesn't seem to work. I mean, it quiets them a little but not nearly enough.
Old 14th July 2020
  #5
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffguitar View Post
This is driving me nuts. When I record bass and like get a bop using the 4th string and pop back two frets up and hit the 2nd string octave and get a groove going, THE 2ND STRING OCTAVE IS FRICKING POKING OUT LOUD AS HELL AND I CAN'T FIGURE OUT HOW TO FIX IT IN THE MIX.

HELP!!!. I am going to have to go back and record my bass again and I have to figure out how to do the part just using the 3rd and 4th strings and then that causes strange sounds too having to slide way up the neck.

I have downloaded the frequencies chart of bass and guitar notes on the fretboard and tried using tight Q cuts at the note frequencies, BUT THIS. DOESN'T WORK for some reason, I still hear the octave note blaring out loud and bright and it is literally painful.

If I low pass with eq (Crave eq). I can then drag the low pass way down and finally stop it, but then the lower strings sound horrible and muddy with no definition.

I'm a guitar player that has to play bass for myself. I have fairly newer strings, just a few months old. I don't know what to do other than just relearn my parts having to slide all over the neck and only use the 3rd and 4th string but heck, grooving with that octave on the first 2 strings on the back beat is so useful and can be a such a cool part of a groove.

Anyone have any tips I can try?
1. you could cut and paste the parts of the audio file that are popping out in the same track and lower the volume (clip gain) of those specific parts and you can always delete the portion of the file that contains the slide noise.

2. You could try (demo) a copy of Waverider tg and have it automate the volume of the bass part. This will even out the volume based on your parameters, it won't get rid of the fret noise though.

3. You can also import the audio into Melodyne and manipulate and edit the notes and the amplitude of the notes while deleting the noise from the file. you might be able to get rid of the issues. Melodyne can also convert your audio to midi and then you could trigger the midi with a bass software as a last resort.

4. Demo a copy of EZBass. You can import your audio and it will convert the audio to midi. Once your audio is converted to midi, the noise should be gone since you will be triggering the software bass samples.

5. Play the bass part with a Bass midi software....there are some decent ones, IK's MODO bass, Native Instruments has some decent ones Scarbee Fender, Rickenbacker, even the stock sounds from most DAWs are decent. Perhaps you can just use Midi for the parts that you can't get to sound good and use your live playing for the rest.

6. If all else fails, you can get a session bass player off Airgigs. Depending on the importance of the song, it might be your best option.

I'm out of other ideas. Good luck.
Old 14th July 2020
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jason kalman View Post
1. you could cut and paste the parts of the audio file that are popping out in the same track and lower the volume (clip gain) of those specific parts and you can always delete the portion of the file that contains the slide noise.

2. You could try (demo) a copy of Waverider tg and have it automate the volume of the bass part. This will even out the volume based on your parameters, it won't get rid of the fret noise though.

3. You can also import the audio into Melodyne and manipulate and edit the notes and the amplitude of the notes while deleting the noise from the file. you might be able to get rid of the issues. Melodyne can also convert your audio to midi and then you could trigger the midi with a bass software as a last resort.

4. Demo a copy of EZBass. You can import your audio and it will convert the audio to midi. Once your audio is converted to midi, the noise should be gone since you will be triggering the software bass samples.

5. Play the bass part with a Bass midi software....there are some decent ones, IK's MODO bass, Native Instruments has some decent ones Scarbee Fender, Rickenbacker, even the stock sounds from most DAWs are decent. Perhaps you can just use Midi for the parts that you can't get to sound good and use your live playing for the rest.

6. If all else fails, you can get a session bass player off Airgigs. Depending on the importance of the song, it might be your best option.

I'm out of other ideas. Good luck.
Thanks for all those options, great response. I hadn't thought of using vocal rider in my Waves ugs, or MV2. I also like the idea of cutting the notes to a different track. I do also have modo bass from IK.

Looks like I have more stuff to try.
Old 14th July 2020
  #7
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Rick Dalton's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffguitar View Post
It pops on my headphones and speakers, Sony 7605 using eq curve to flat. The 3rd and 4th strings sound wonderful, deep, but with that nice finger definition. But it's like the 1st and 2nd strings just sound so high pitched and really loud, and if I try to compress it out I have to smash it so hard it ruins the dynamics.

I'm blown away that trying to grab the frequency of the note doesn't seem to work. I mean, it quiets them a little but not nearly enough.
Adjust your pickups, those strings have a lot of mass.
Old 15th July 2020
  #8
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffguitar View Post
It pops on my headphones and speakers, Sony 7605 using eq curve to flat. The 3rd and 4th strings sound wonderful, deep, but with that nice finger definition. But it's like the 1st and 2nd strings just sound so high pitched and really loud, and if I try to compress it out I have to smash it so hard it ruins the dynamics.

I'm blown away that trying to grab the frequency of the note doesn't seem to work. I mean, it quiets them a little but not nearly enough.
Does the bass possibly need a setup? Sounds like those strings might be too close to the pickups

Last edited by JB872; 15th July 2020 at 12:39 AM..
Old 15th July 2020
  #9
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffguitar View Post
Thanks for all those options, great response. I hadn't thought of using vocal rider in my Waves ugs, or MV2. I also like the idea of cutting the notes to a different track. I do also have modo bass from IK.

Looks like I have more stuff to try.
Jeff,
Actually you could use vocal rider or bass rider (another waves plugin). waverider tg is a different plugin made by QuietArt, but it does the same thing. Here is the link:

https://quietart.co.nz/waveridertg/

You can demo it for free and having used it on a recent project it works well, but you can do the same with vocal rider from Waves, so really doesn't matter.

Again, good luck.
Old 15th July 2020
  #10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffguitar View Post
It pops on my headphones and speakers, Sony 7605 using eq curve to flat. The 3rd and 4th strings sound wonderful, deep, but with that nice finger definition. But it's like the 1st and 2nd strings just sound so high pitched and really loud, and if I try to compress it out I have to smash it so hard it ruins the dynamics.

I'm blown away that trying to grab the frequency of the note doesn't seem to work. I mean, it quiets them a little but not nearly enough.
Yeah like the other dudes said...try to play it better. Be conscious of those strings...you probably need better execution when fretting them. Easy does it...good luck!

Old 15th July 2020
  #11
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Rick Dalton's Avatar
I wonder if the OP is using a pick? That will bind you up also,,, until you're use to playing.
Old 15th July 2020
  #12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Dalton View Post
I wonder if the OP is using a pick? That will bind you up also,,, until you're use to playing.
That was my experience. I know I've ditched the pick when playing all but fast, straight rock on bass. Made a big difference for me, but it has taken a lot of practice to get a clean consistent tone.
Old 15th July 2020
  #13
Gear Head
 

New bass strings can always be a bit of noise source (brighter but that makes fret noises louder too), noticeable with round strings, less with flats.
Also for recording, it helps a bit to play quieter I think. Not sure about the poping though, I agree with others idea of a proper setup (action & pickup height)
Old 15th July 2020
  #14
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Rick Dalton's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by 56tweed View Post
That was my experience. I know I've ditched the pick when playing all but fast, straight rock on bass. Made a big difference for me, but it has taken a lot of practice to get a clean consistent tone.
Bass is an complete animal on its own. The OP needs to clue us in on what he has. As in Brand Model, Active/Passive, etc,,,,
Old 15th July 2020
  #15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Dalton View Post
Adjust your pickups, those strings have a lot of mass.
start here^^ ..then work on your technique
Old 15th July 2020
  #16
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Rick Dalton's Avatar
For all we know. The OP may have piezo saddles and intonation issues.

"1st and 2nd strings just sound so high pitched and really loud"
Old 15th July 2020
  #17
Gear Head
compress on the way in. bass>di>comp>interface . knock that loud stuff down a bit.
Old 15th July 2020
  #18
Gear Head
 
Stoneblack's Avatar
 

"I recorded myself playing and it doesn't sound very good - what should I do?"
Old 15th July 2020
  #19
js1
Lives for gear
 

You're not going to EQ your way out of this - sorry. You're trying to EQ out the fundamental, but the harmonics, and the non-harmonic components (squeaks, clanks, etc), will still be there. As you found, by the time you're able to make a difference in eliminating what you want, the collateral damage is huge.
Old 15th July 2020
  #20
Gear Head
Quote:
Originally Posted by JB872 View Post
Does the bass possibly need a setup? Sounds like those strings might be too close to the pickups
I'd guess this is the issue. Lower the pickups, and then focus on the balance of force used while playing the bass.
This should fix it.
Old 15th July 2020
  #21
Gear Maniac
 
Kozmos88's Avatar
 

Quote:
Lower the pickups, and then focus on the balance of force used while playing the bass.
+1 to that
~~~~~~
as others have said .. bass be another animal entirely compared to regular guitar ..
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
'Jeffguitar' .. maybe post a mp3 of the offending issue ??
~~~~~~
a.t.b.
` s `
Old 15th July 2020
  #22
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JayTee4303's Avatar
What's a spec-A telling you, with and without EQ?
Old 15th July 2020
  #23
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Kronos147's Avatar
There have been many good comments about playing, and setup, and getting what you want on the way in. That being said, the question is how to process and existing track, no?

The idea of the frequency chart sounds like a good start. Let's say that we are talking about an "A" note. Let's start with A = 440 Hz. With a multi-band EQ, try cutting 440 (obvously), but also 220, 110, 880, 1760... in other words the octaves. Experiment with bypassing the bands (octaves) and with the resonance (Q) and gain.

When the EQ is set to where you feel this is the 'closest you have been' to the solution, use the EQ curve to sidechain a compressor.

Put the compressor on the bass, but have it trigger off of the EQ'ed sound. See if that is what you are looking for.
Old 15th July 2020
  #24
If it can't be recorded, I'd weep for 5 minutes and then commit to automating the volume of each note before I reached for EQ/Comp.

It would be a nightmare, but if we're at last resort territory.
Old 15th July 2020
  #25
Lives for gear
 

Good gracious you guys are some smart cookies here.
It's like you are so experienced you saw right in to the problems.

YES, I was using a pick. I'm a guitar player, and, well, I am horrible at trying to use my index and middle finger with ring finger pointed down over the strings, so I opt for just trying to play with my thumb, and I'm sure you know what happens then, BIG BLISTER and pain for the next day.

So I resort to a pick.

But you guys are even smarter. I use one of those long neck Yamaha bases, and when new the strings were very high, so what would a guitar player do?. You guys knew, of course, I LOWERED THE DARN SADDLES TO GET THE STRINGS LOWER. Not only did this get those higher pitched strings lowered to the pickups, well, it also messed my intonation up.

But the smarts here keep going. I broke out Bass rider and wow, that helped a ton. Then I put the MV2 that Warren Huart loves so much, an upside down compressor, and gently compressed things after the rider, just a tad and the track is MUCH MUCH BETTER.

But, of course, you all taught me that I have several things to do.

Time to take my bass to a shop and get a proper setup.

Learn to use the felt bass picks I bought. I stopped using them because they fricken bend and feel wierd, like that felt gives me the feeling of scratching a chalk board.

I also need to learn to play with my fingers in the end.

Of course, all this makes me realize how great true bass players are, what a unique instrument they play and just how impressive they are.

So as usual, the experience here just astonishes. You NAILED the reasons, you suspected the reasons and sure enough, you got the problem explained and several ways to approach fixing it and then explained how to avoid it from the start.

Absolutely brilliant guys.
Old 15th July 2020
  #26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffguitar View Post
This is driving me nuts. When I record bass and like get a bop using the 4th string and pop back two frets up and hit the 2nd string octave and get a groove going, THE 2ND STRING OCTAVE IS FRICKING POKING OUT LOUD AS HELL AND I CAN'T FIGURE OUT HOW TO FIX IT IN THE MIX.

HELP!!!. I am going to have to go back and record my bass again and I have to figure out how to do the part just using the 3rd and 4th strings and then that causes strange sounds too having to slide way up the neck.

I have downloaded the frequencies chart of bass and guitar notes on the fretboard and tried using tight Q cuts at the note frequencies, BUT THIS. DOESN'T WORK for some reason, I still hear the octave note blaring out loud and bright and it is literally painful.

If I low pass with eq (Crave eq). I can then drag the low pass way down and finally stop it, but then the lower strings sound horrible and muddy with no definition.

I'm a guitar player that has to play bass for myself. I have fairly newer strings, just a few months old. I don't know what to do other than just relearn my parts having to slide all over the neck and only use the 3rd and 4th string but heck, grooving with that octave on the first 2 strings on the back beat is so useful and can be a such a cool part of a groove.

Anyone have any tips I can try?
You can't "fix" a problem like this with EQ or compression - you need to improve your technique so you don't hit that note as hard as the others.

Practice. There are no shortcuts.
Old 15th July 2020
  #27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffguitar View Post
It pops on my headphones and speakers, Sony 7605 using eq curve to flat. The 3rd and 4th strings sound wonderful, deep, but with that nice finger definition. But it's like the 1st and 2nd strings just sound so high pitched and really loud, and if I try to compress it out I have to smash it so hard it ruins the dynamics.

I'm blown away that trying to grab the frequency of the note doesn't seem to work. I mean, it quiets them a little but not nearly enough.
Your bass also needs a setup to bring those two strings into balance.
Old 17th July 2020
  #28
Gear Maniac
 
Kozmos88's Avatar
 

Jeffguitar ..

neat freebee plugin worth having to hand ..
https://www.kvraudio.com/product/lou...y-thomas-mundt

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Old 18th July 2020
  #29
Lives for gear
try parallel comp?
Old 20th July 2020
  #30
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play/record's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffguitar View Post
This is driving me nuts. When I record bass and like get a bop using the 4th string and pop back two frets up and hit the 2nd string octave and get a groove going, THE 2ND STRING OCTAVE IS FRICKING POKING OUT LOUD AS HELL AND I CAN'T FIGURE OUT HOW TO FIX IT IN THE MIX.

HELP!!!. I am going to have to go back and record my bass again and I have to figure out how to do the part just using the 3rd and 4th strings and then that causes strange sounds too having to slide way up the neck.

I have downloaded the frequencies chart of bass and guitar notes on the fretboard and tried using tight Q cuts at the note frequencies, BUT THIS. DOESN'T WORK for some reason, I still hear the octave note blaring out loud and bright and it is literally painful.

If I low pass with eq (Crave eq). I can then drag the low pass way down and finally stop it, but then the lower strings sound horrible and muddy with no definition.

I'm a guitar player that has to play bass for myself. I have fairly newer strings, just a few months old. I don't know what to do other than just relearn my parts having to slide all over the neck and only use the 3rd and 4th string but heck, grooving with that octave on the first 2 strings on the back beat is so useful and can be a such a cool part of a groove.

Anyone have any tips I can try?
I played bass for 16 or 17 years.. a bit rusty right now.. But what you described is a performance/technique issue.. If those transients from the pull offs are that high, you wont be able to fix them in any satisfying way. You't better off retracking the bass being more concous of going easier on the pull off... Or pop the E string harder with ur thumb so that the dynamic is the same between the pop and the pull off.. you'll get more even compression and uniform level. You can also try folding up a small piece of cloth or paper towel and putting it under just the D string by the bridge to tame it down a little. But l would just suggest going a little easier on your pull off technique and you should be alright. Hth..
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