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Studio MIDI Guitar by Jamstik
Old 27th January 2020
  #1
Gear Head
 

Studio MIDI Guitar by Jamstik

There aren't really good videos of demos showing the MIDI capability. What do you guitar players think of the Studio MIDI guitar by Jamstik? Mainly I'm a keyboard player but I'm thinking of getting it as the cost is relative low in comparison with other MIDI guitars.
Old 28th January 2020
  #2
Old 28th January 2020
  #3
Lives for gear
 

John is our resident head guru supreme on midi/synth guitars, amp modeling, and Line 6 anything, so it makes complete sense that he would chime in first, but if you want the perspective of someone that actually uses this type of equipment: I would wait until it’s released. It seems unlikely that this is any great break thru product (ie: better than anything else already available), and if it were, it wouldn’t be priced like that. It’s also a miss (IMHO) that it lacks 13 pin output. Why is 13 pin useful? When you realize that straight “midi” guitar can be challenging (mistriggering, muting, anomalies, latency), but 13 pin into a device that processes the strings individually for a non midi sound (such as many of the Roland GK devices and upcoming Boss SY1000) results in much more reliable results and very minimal latency. In other words, it’s way more playable “like a guitar” than straight guitar to midi historically has been.


Namm showroom videos are really tough to use to appreciate the full capabilities of something like this. I’d be happy to try one out if they sent one my way to demo, but I’m not going to gamble on it.
Old 28th January 2020
  #4
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I tried the original jamstick and some other relatively inexpensive midi guitar that was supposed to be good. Didn’t like them it at all as a guitar player. They didn’t track well plus there was latency at times. So the editing required was going to be as much as if I just played the parts on piano, or even more.

No idea about the new one but I’d definitely wait for some reviews, or at least buy from a place with a 30 day refund policy.
Old 30th January 2020
  #5
Gear Head
 

The original Jamstik is an interesting toy, but the Studio model is a full-fledged guitar with built-in MIDI. Still, I have yet to see good demos showing how well it tracks MIDI. If the guitar were my 1st instrument, a top notch guitar with a hex pickup would make sense.
Old 30th January 2020
  #6
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilSound View Post
The original Jamstik is an interesting toy, but the Studio model is a full-fledged guitar with built-in MIDI. Still, I have yet to see good demos showing how well it tracks MIDI. If the guitar were my 1st instrument, a top notch guitar with a hex pickup would make sense.
Well this is a guitar with a hex pickup, they’ve just taken it a step further with building midi conversion into it and such, but then taken it a step back by not giving you a standard 13 pin output. Why I suspect there is nothing about this that is better than any GK equipped guitar, unless they have accomplished something extraordinary in their conversion process. “As far as I can tell” there is nothing going on along the lines of fretboard sensing/etc that might improve things.

A GK equipped guitar with a matching GK processor can also often give you midi out, or adding a fishman triple play.
Old 30th January 2020
  #7
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Bstapper's Avatar
 

It does have a midi output, it is just on a mini jack instead of standard 13-pin which is actually an advantage for a guitar. And it is a guitar with added Fishman Triple Play - literally. With added software in an attempt to speed up and enhance pitch detection.

I'm intrigued - just not enough to pre-order based on videos that don't clearly show how well it tracks.
Old 31st January 2020
  #8
Gear Nut
 

I am always interested in such things, but agreeing with above sentiments ... I also have GK3, Godin and Fishman TP guitars ... but it's Rob O'Reilly I am looking too. (IR Solange is dead I believe)
Old 31st January 2020
  #9
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Bstapper's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TobyB View Post
I am always interested in such things, but agreeing with above sentiments ... I also have GK3, Godin and Fishman TP guitars ... but it's Rob O'Reilly I am looking too. (IR Solange is dead I believe)
Hey, thanks for that!

The Rob O'Reilly instrument is a new to me. I think they are really missing the boat by not offering an instrument that ditches the pad and all the traditional electronics and just give the world a studio midi input device that works like a world with flying cars should.

It looks like a promising solution that will hopefully spur the genre forward a bit.
Old 31st January 2020
  #10
Gear Head
 

This is my situation; I sold my last guitar due to my trigger finger. I still can play a nylon or an electric guitar without much effort. Now that I read a few posts which gave me a little more clear picture, my options are 1, go with the Studio MIDI Guitar; an electric guitar which will be easier on my fingers, Bluetooth midi, USB MIDI, 3.5 mm MIDI, 2. Get a better guitar like a Godin Multiac Nylon with a 13 pin pickup, 3 a guitar of my choice plus a Fishman pickup, 4 a cheap guitar with a piezo and combine it with MIDI Guitar2 by Jam Origin. There is a new video on the Studio MIDI Guitar showing how it tracks MIDI. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQikk3JGmNg I don’t know but it really doesn’t show much. I want to hear how it controls a hardware sound source.
Old 31st January 2020
  #11
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As mentioned, unless it has some kind of tech that senses the fretboard it’s basically no different that what’s been around for years.

I know victor wooten had a bass that did this but nothing ever became of the company afaik.


I’m definitely a skeptic because honestly I’ve never played a midi guitar that could keep up without constantly editing, or adjusting things.
But, I’d love that alternative because I’m fairly terrible piano player.
Old 31st January 2020
  #12
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilSound View Post
This is my situation; I sold my last guitar due to my trigger finger. I still can play a nylon or an electric guitar without much effort. Now that I read a few posts which gave me a little more clear picture, my options are 1, go with the Studio MIDI Guitar; an electric guitar which will be easier on my fingers, Bluetooth midi, USB MIDI, 3.5 mm MIDI, 2. Get a better guitar like a Godin Multiac Nylon with a 13 pin pickup, 3 a guitar of my choice plus a Fishman pickup, 4 a cheap guitar with a piezo and combine it with MIDI Guitar2 by Jam Origin. There is a new video on the Studio MIDI Guitar showing how it tracks MIDI. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQikk3JGmNg I don’t know but it really doesn’t show much. I want to hear how it controls a hardware sound source.
I don’t know your exact requirements, but have you considered something like the Roger Linn Linnstrument? Since it’s not doing guitar to midi, won’t have any of the associated limitations. Compact model available at what I perceive to be a reasonable price.

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...nce-controller
Old 31st January 2020
  #13
Gear Nut
 

Strongly recommend the Linnstrument too. FTP a MUCH cheaper, and arguably better, option than 13 pins, but Godin might be a good instrument.
Sonuus i2M and MIDI guitar 2 good for playing monsynths.
I think the bass with tracking was an Industrial Radio fret sense ... sadly they seem to be a website without any production behind it.
Old 1st February 2020
  #14
Gear Head
 

Oh, my! Now I'm looking at Linnstrument videos closely. I agree that it seems to be a reasonable price. A lot cheaper than the Eigenharp Alpha.
Old 1st February 2020
  #15
Gear Nut
 

Linnstrument is terrific, you can change tunings for 4ths or 5ths for instance... guitar or mando patterns for me MPE if your synths have it but no confusion if they don't... sequencer etc also built in ... it's my go-too interface although MIDI-fretboard remains my hope.
Old 1st February 2020
  #16
Quote:
Originally Posted by kslight View Post
John is our resident head guru supreme on midi/synth guitars, amp modeling, and Line 6 anything, so it makes complete sense that he would chime in first, but if you want the perspective of someone that actually uses this type of equipment: I would wait until it’s released. It seems unlikely that this is any great break thru product (ie: better than anything else already available), and if it were, it wouldn’t be priced like that. It’s also a miss (IMHO) that it lacks 13 pin output. Why is 13 pin useful? When you realize that straight “midi” guitar can be challenging (mistriggering, muting, anomalies, latency), but 13 pin into a device that processes the strings individually for a non midi sound (such as many of the Roland GK devices and upcoming Boss SY1000) results in much more reliable results and very minimal latency. In other words, it’s way more playable “like a guitar” than straight guitar to midi historically has been.


Namm showroom videos are really tough to use to appreciate the full capabilities of something like this. I’d be happy to try one out if they sent one my way to demo, but I’m not going to gamble on it.
In other words, "Meh".

I'm trying to cut down on the verbosity.
Old 9th February 2020
  #17
Gear Addict
 

I had an idea years ago about building a midi guitar and using direct fret wire to string continuity for key contacts for determining pitch. Trigger and velocity tracking would utilize a piezo contact per string. I think it would produce the fastest, surest tracking - but would need some software for setting gate levels for false triggers and buzzes.
Old 10th February 2020
  #18
Gear Nut
 

Rob O'Reilly Expresive E MIDI guitar ... I have one being built ...
Industrial Radio Solange 6 (fretsense) I think is dead ...
Old 10th February 2020
  #19
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RBHan View Post
I had an idea years ago about building a midi guitar and using direct fret wire to string continuity for key contacts for determining pitch. Trigger and velocity tracking would utilize a piezo contact per string. I think it would produce the fastest, surest tracking - but would need some software for setting gate levels for false triggers and buzzes.
Sounds like the old guitorgan from many years ago. I still have a dead one that was given to me by Johhny Cash's house guard many years ago. He said Johnny was going to trash it and he knew I played so he gave it to me. The inside was a mass of chips and thin wires never to be repaired if it went bad. I can only imagine all the hits he wrote on this thing. LOL
Old 11th February 2020
  #20
Lives for gear
 
Kronos147's Avatar
Question:
Isn't every system available today limited to MIDI 1.0.

Doesn't that mean it will take at least two MIDI 2.0 compatible systems to hit the market in order to have a discussion of 'best' again?

P.S. Roland GR-50 owner here.
Old 12th February 2020
  #21
Gear Nut
 
Clash's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
In other words, "Meh".

I'm trying to cut down on the verbosity.
Cut down further by just not posting?
Old 13th February 2020
  #22
Lives for gear
 

I saw the price was cut again by $200, to $599...before this thing is even released. Perhaps not getting the kind of preorders they were anticipating...

The sad part is if they gave it a GK out then this would be an obvious inexpensive new guitar for anyone buying the new Boss SY1000 (to my knowledge there are no off the shelf built in GK guitars at this price point).
Old 16th February 2020
  #23
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kslight View Post
...The sad part is if they gave it a GK out then this would be an obvious inexpensive new guitar for anyone buying the new Boss SY1000 (to my knowledge there are no off the shelf built in GK guitars at this price point).
$600 and no tax added. Also, they take trade-ins for the previous models of Jamstik.

Once again, I'm not much of a guitar player, but isn't a standard MIDI out better than the GK pickup so that you can use any keyboards/modules directly without conversion? For someone like me who has half a dozen modules plus keyboards and plugins, not having to deal with guitar midi modules/conversion would be a good thing.
Old 17th February 2020
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilSound View Post
$600 and no tax added. Also, they take trade-ins for the previous models of Jamstik.

Once again, I'm not much of a guitar player, but isn't a standard MIDI out better than the GK pickup so that you can use any keyboards/modules directly without conversion? For someone like me who has half a dozen modules plus keyboards and plugins, not having to deal with guitar midi modules/conversion would be a good thing.
On paper, yes. In practice, guitar to midi is more difficult to play “naturally” because of latency and tracking/mistriggers, which is partially dependent on your playing style. Example, I can make guitar synth sound fine in a mix if I play well, but it’s possible that when you solo the track you might hear some weirdness (extra notes/wrong notes/etc) and the raw midi data itself will almost certainly have anomalies.

If you are understanding of that and can play guitar cleanly then you could maybe make this work acceptably. I might be more interested if I didn’t already own guitar synth devices.

IMHO a GK equipped guitar and an SY1000 is the best bet for a modern solution (gives you best of both worlds).

I would be surprised if this guitar does any better than that, but it may also do guitar to midi just as well as the above combination too.
Old 17th February 2020
  #25
Gear Nut
 

I have GK-3 on a couple of guitars, and a Godin xtSA on order, to go with an SY 1000 also on order. That's a higher price point for sure ... but GK-3 on a decent Squire/Epiphone/etc will do the job if you want to buy into 13 pin ... a TriplePlay is much better for MIDI (I have one on a Chapman and my Variax) ... I started off with a FTP to drive a second-hand IKM Uno like a pedal.
Sonuus do a neat little bit of brush damping at the nut which cleans up the string sensing too.
Old 19th February 2020
  #26
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kslight View Post
On paper, yes. In practice, guitar to midi is more difficult to play “naturally” because of latency and tracking/mistriggers, which is partially dependent on your playing style. Example, I can make guitar synth sound fine in a mix if I play well, but it’s possible that when you solo the track you might hear some weirdness (extra notes/wrong notes/etc) and the raw midi data itself will almost certainly have anomalies.

If you are understanding of that and can play guitar cleanly then you could maybe make this work acceptably. I might be more interested if I didn’t already own guitar synth devices.

IMHO a GK equipped guitar and an SY1000 is the best bet for a modern solution (gives you best of both worlds).

I would be surprised if this guitar does any better than that, but it may also do guitar to midi just as well as the above combination too.
Curious to know if the MIDI out of these guitar MIDI modules does better than a typical guitar to midi setup in terms of tracking and triggering? TobyB says TriplePlay does better than the GK3, and I heard some guitar players saying that MIDI Guitar 2 does better than TriplePlay or GK pickups, and MIDI Guitar 2 is software. It must be really smart.
Old 19th February 2020
  #27
Gear Guru
 
Muser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilSound View Post
$600 and no tax added. Also, they take trade-ins for the previous models of Jamstik.

Once again, I'm not much of a guitar player, but isn't a standard MIDI out better than the GK pickup so that you can use any keyboards/modules directly without conversion? For someone like me who has half a dozen modules plus keyboards and plugins, not having to deal with guitar midi modules/conversion would be a good thing.
I think the GR55 provides a Midi out from a GK. also the Fishman with the extra box does as well. no idea how they perform, but usually the main issue is the sound you are triggering needs to be well crafted to the variables of the way the guitar dynamics perform. it explains why GK based guitar modelers can be extremely articulate played from a guitar armed with a GK, while as soon as you connect to any kind of other instrument, you will suddenly encounter a gulf between what you expect in terms of articulation, and what you get from the synthesizer or sampler etc.

the Roland SY systems are possibly narrowing this divide, but even subtle differences in stringed instrument construction and tunings can provide very large differences. such as the differences between say, an acoustic guitar and a mountain dulcimer. so any kind of synthesis / instrument modeling would effectively have to be creating new instruments which are convincing, but also respond similar to plucked strings. Roland don’t seem to be currently concentrating on string modeling technologies.
I think they should. they have done in the past. and so have yamaha to some degree.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #28
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Im getting hit with ads for this JamSchtick...started looking into it but found this thread pretty quick, glad for that, saved me some time..the whole thing is very interesting to me..i use Midi in some stuff and would love to have a 'working' instrument like this...but , from reading here, it doesn't seem to be working yet.

nothing worse than having this thing show up and then having to hurl it though the window onto the garage roof across the alley..
Old 1 week ago
  #29
Gear Head
 

I cancelled my pre-order today. A lack of good demo videos showing midi tracking is the main reason.
Old 1 week ago
  #30
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilSound View Post
Curious to know if the MIDI out of these guitar MIDI modules does better than a typical guitar to midi setup in terms of tracking and triggering? TobyB says TriplePlay does better than the GK3, and I heard some guitar players saying that MIDI Guitar 2 does better than TriplePlay or GK pickups, and MIDI Guitar 2 is software. It must be really smart.

No idea about MIDI Guitar 2, I kind of doubt a non hex system would be better.

The most “current” guitar to midi box I’ve used is the Roland GM70 (which is ancient), and it’s absolutely not perfect but I can make it work, with a G707 guitar (great guitar for synth), even with a G77 bass (not great just because of limitations with bass to midi), like any guitar to midi it really requires a certain technique.

I think the strength of 13 pin guitars is NOT guitar to midi, but individual string processing, which eliminates most of the problems we associate with guitar to midi. And that’s where most of my interest lies, because I can play keys if I need midi.
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