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Old 27th October 2019
  #64
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Originally Posted by Infa View Post
Right. Invent might be bad word. Everything in this universe is math, even things that someone thinks are not math, are math in areas they do not recognize. Math is literally everything.

But, it takes someone to implement that math into something like this, (formula to something useful) and then after that, implement that useful thing into a device to harness the usefulness. So I was curious who was responsible for taking the formula and implementing it into something like we now see. Obviously it happened one day or Conversion would have been born from day one with 32bf. So "implementation" happened somewhere. Who is that masked man ? LOL
No idea. Probably some faceless programmer...I don't know what the first DAW to incorporate a floating point summing engine was.



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Originally Posted by Infa View Post
Yea, I definitely know where you are coming from. I been over this a trillion times with folks. Yes bro, you just met a overly picky person. I get teased all the time by my friends. Just who I am. And I love the results being picky about life gets me. Picky about health, foods I eat, exercise, quality of products I buy, OVERLY picky about looks and women I date, and extremely picky about the things I decide to claim my passion. Its just me man. Go ahead and make fun of me for it, I get it all the time from my slacker friends. lol So I am used to it.
It's not really to do with being picky - we're ALL picky - it's to do with if the conclusions you draw are correct!

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Anyway that said. Prism is not much more if you think about dollar per channel. Its less than the JCF Latte or Antelope Eclipse I got.
Prism is currently $10.5k on vintage king for 8 channels. the equivalent Avid HDIO is $4.5k at sweetwater for 16 channels, plus a whole load of other functions and integrated support.

Yep, the Prisms are far more expensive, pound for pound...and some have even preferred the HDIOs!

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You are right, honestly its always small differences, not night and day, BUT that small difference was *going in a direction* of "cardboard" is the way I should have worded it. There were others there too, double blind testing so we couldn't influence each other in anyway. Our results were not 100% equal or identical, but everyone did rank the Symphony and Ensemble lowest. All with the same feeling. Loss of depth. It was a colleague of mine that coined the "cardboard" phrase because of that. I am actually stealing his word, cause it was the best way to describe the inferiority. (even if small like you did point out).

There was nothing wrong with the test, we are pretty meticulous when making tests, variable free, totally fair, etc.. - modern Apogee just aint as good as you think. Blind test it all day against either of them 3 pieces I mentioned above, you'll see.
you're entitled to your opinion. I just don't agree Although I'm not surprised the Prism was the winner!

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I will say this, this was so many years ago that it was the first editions of the Symphony and Ensemble. So if they got better, maybe I am off base for my remark. But just the way Apogee starting looking, and releasing stuff, bad taste in my mouth. They went the Toys R Us route. Making kids toys is the vibe and energy I feel. The company just isn't the same. Several people left, replaced by marketing tactics types, etc.. I don't think they make things as good as they used to, plain and simple.
Again, don't agree, but that's up to you!

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I'm tripping out right now how your not freaking out over me more for saying Lavry Gold and Weiss was in the test and didn't win. haha. They didn't dude. To me both them units sound great, BUT they change the audio to sound great. Lavry kinda hypes the low mid. Sounds swollen/thicker compared to source. Weiss has a roll off up top somewhere (people mistake this for "warmth") Now this might be exactly why some would like it. But I am not into *conversion* that hype in or scoop out. I liked the ADA-8XR because nothing changed frequency wise. Nothing at all changed except it somehow did something to the source that made it sound more honest ? Lack of better word ? IDK ? And whatever that is, is undeniable amongst 4 colleagues.
I can understand that. Lavry Gold is a mastering capture converter - it's not even designed for tracking, too high latency...I have no interest in converters that attempt to "add" something to the sound...and plus mixing ITB means I don't *need* a capture converter.

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I tried (not in the test though) several other known "vanilla" converters, and Prism has something beyond Vanilla, its like Vanilla in the right parts, but gives you a better translation of your source than any other converter I've heard, so its not vanilla there, you HEAR that deeper more honest translation. Just a very nice converter and it does D to D on a per channel basis simultaneously, different sample rates per channel simultaneously if wanted, and DSD if wanted AND its 16 channel modular using all XLR, which is very important to me (not a DB25 fan and try to avoid it when possible). So IMO for the price, that aint bad.
db25s make a LOT of sense when interfacing with a patch bay, but to each their own.

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To me, just to be honest and blunt, I don't care what 30mil dollar places do, most of the bigger pro places/industries make decisions based on bang for buck and not totality. Which I understand, so I am not bashing them. My point is using them as examples doesn't make any point to me that the conversion they chose is best.. All it means to me is I would not record there. lol
My point is that they did the same sort of shootouts you did and came to a different conclusion.

I really don't follow "big box store" mottos. I'm more: the few, narrow path, boutiquey, esentric type. But even more important than that, I use testing to make my decisions. I feel its the most fair to me personally if it me that will be using it. Know what I mean ?

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I thought we just cleared this up ? lol You even confirmed it. Please let me know if this was also misunderstood. If a track has a plugin (or multiple plugin chain) process on that track and the processing you do raises the *tracks* volume enough past the 0.0db, and that track gets exported/bounced with said processing on it, if both sessions had been in/are in 32bf, then that track/file is still ok. Technically never clipped.

If this is true, then I like that safety net is what I am saying. Especially for the unnoticeable cons recording at 32bf gives me.

Now, if this isn't the case - lol Then damn, I misunderstood you and Matt yet again ! haha and please let me know.
Right. I'd personally be more worried about what ELSE they're screwing up, and if they're not able to follow the simple request of "turn off all processing before exporting", then they're possibly not going to be able to select the correct bit depth either.

You are right - if someone is competent enough to choose the bit depth you request, but not so competent to be able to follow other basic instructions, AND has the habit of turning things up so they clip...you could be saving yourself.

I'd personally just re-request non-clipped, unprocessed files.....simpler all round!