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Rectangular capsule users, unite! And tell us your experiences...
Old 2nd December 2017
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peller View Post
Really, they are all back-to-back cardioids? In that case, what is the rationale for the existence of the ELM-B? Why would you not just buy the multi-pattern version of the ELM design?
The B version has one Fet conditioning amplifier inside. A switched version would have only one amplifier on board, but you need both negative and positive polarization voltages, at least if you want to make a figure of eight. More expensive, and you need other metal housings for adding switches. I think it is the cost saving factor to offer single pattern versions.

The ELM multi-pattern version has two amplifiers where both capsule sides get one polarization voltage, and you mix in the desk either in phase or out of phase to create. You don't need any switches.

Both ways offers the cheapest solution to buy the microphone one needs. And you can use the multipattern version also as a stereo mike.

If I remember well the single pattern ELM's are quite cheaper than the multi pattern.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #92
Bumping for advice. TL4; CC30N

I've got a chance to buy a couple Pearl mics at descent pricing. I'm new to rectangular capsules. I read most of the threads I could find and understand strengths and weaknesses.

Can anybody comment on these particular mics?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #93
Gear Addict
 

I recently demo'd a pair of Pearl's ELM-B long diaphragm figure 8 mics. These are pretty esoteric, so I am guessing they are not the specific ones you are considering, but the main points which come to my mind are:

1. They are very much still condenser mics, but behaved more like ribbons than I was expecting, in a pleasant way. For example, a gentler transient response which was flattering for close mic'ing of guitar or percussion.

2. The vertical axis directionality, which is especially prominent in Pearl's "long membrane" series, is really interesting. The ability to exclude floor and ceiling reflections (when placed in a vertical "ribbon-like" orientation) even more than a typical figure 8 mic is potentially extremely useful.

3. I don't know that I would choose them as part of a main array unless the room was very difficult and they were used in a spaced "Faulkner array" type of context (i.e. as a problem-solver). That said, I was impressed at how well they compared to the Schoeps MK8 (the only fig 8's I own) in a variety of more intimate close placements I informally tried with guitar, piano, and percussion.

As many others have remarked about Pearl mics (I have no experience with other rectangular capsules) they have a very honest, neutral sound which is certainly different from other more ubiquitous manufacturers, but could be potentially as good or better in certain situations. I was impressed.

In the end, I couldn't justify buying them at the moment, but I would love to do so at some point in the future, especially for use as a "ribbon substitute" in those typical applications. Again, I am speaking about the figure 8 Pearl ELM-B, so please take this with a grain of salt depending on which mics you are considering...
Old 3 weeks ago
  #94
Super Moderator
 
Remoteness's Avatar
I love my Milab microphones!

At the moment I have 6 VIP50s, 6 DC96Bs, 2 DC196s, and a XY82.

I would like to also purchase some Pearl microphones someday soon.

Milab happens to own Pearl. Quite a full circle story about these two transducer/electronic manufacturers.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #95
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Earcatcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Remoteness View Post
I love my Milab microphones!

At the moment I have 6 VIP50s, 6 DC96Bs, 2 DC196s, and a XY82.
What in particular do you use them for?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #96
Super Moderator
 
Remoteness's Avatar
Any way I look at them, I truly love my Milab condensers. I get very clear and open sound using these large rectangular diaphragm mics. DC96Bs give me that large diaphragm tonal quality I like in a much smaller package. I fit them almost anywhere I want. Besides using them as room mics, I like placing them on vocals (group, chorus, choir, etc.), on (some) acoustic pianos, over string sections, as drum or percussion overheads and such.

The specific models have been used on the following positions:
The VIP50s are used on (some) solo vocals, group vocal, chorus or choir mics.

The DC96Bs, are most often used for audience or room mics. I also love them as choir, chorus and group vocal mics. They are use the same capsule as the VIP50 without the multi pattern switch and such.

My DC196s are often used as my go to acoustic piano mics. I used them for Jon Batiste's residency at the Village Vanguard which yielded two albums on Verve Records last year.

I haven't used the XY82 in quite a while.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Earcatcher View Post
What in particular do you use them for?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #97
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mljung's Avatar
I have 2 DC96C and 2 DC196 and also love them!

These are always part of my setup when doing remote recordings, usually on acoustic instruments, but I think I could use them on anything really. They simply sound natural (full frequency spectrum without strange peaks on top).

They are also quiet and can take loud sound pressure levels without breaking up (+ they do the key-jangle test admirably). Moreover they can be shaped in post without loosing their soul - takes eq very well. The DC196 has three patterns and all work great - I use them most often in cardioid.

Highly recommend to give them a test-run :-)

I'm aware that the question was about Pearl, but since they are said to be quite close (same origin), I don't think you can go wrong - give them a spin!

::
Mads

Last edited by mljung; 3 weeks ago at 02:29 PM..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #98
Gear Nut
Quote:
Originally Posted by dorkjackson View Post
I've got a chance to buy a couple Pearl mics at descent pricing. I'm new to rectangular capsules. I read most of the threads I could find and understand strengths and weaknesses.

Can anybody comment on these particular mics?
I looked at those, and decided not to buy- two experiences shaped my decision. 1. I have a pair of Dc196 (which are great mics!) and one capsule went bad after several years. I sent them both back, and they replaced both capsules out of caution- lifetime 1st purchaser warranty is real, and good. 2. I scored two purple badge tlm170s after months of looking for a deal... And then spent $800 getting then cleaned up. And it easily could have been more...
So my conclusion was that the potential repair cost takes these mics into new price territory. Add to that the unknown model (btw, write to Pearl. If they're anything like Milab you'll hear back quickly)

As far as the rectangular capsule goes. I like. I've tried the dc196 next to the Pearl cc22 and they are different; but not different enough to warrant owning both sets (unless I need 4 at some point....hmmmm) I wouldn't put any large sum of money on a bet they you could tell them apart in a double blind test.

Last edited by VillageOp; 3 weeks ago at 05:24 PM.. Reason: Spelling
Old 3 weeks ago
  #99
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Plush's Avatar
Relying on 5 Pearl CC22 cardioids here. Always a very natural sound with a seductive sparkle in the treble. Response is to 25kHz.

Very transparent electronics in these mics.

The capsule is the star with its absence of resonances. Much different from a round capsule.

Hand made in Sweden. Does not get better than Pearl.
Old 1 week ago
  #100
Gear Head
 
Mattias_Milab's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by VillageOp View Post
I have a pair of Dc196 (which are great mics!) and one capsule went bad after several years. I sent them both back, and they replaced both capsules out of caution- lifetime 1st purchaser warranty is real, and good.
I'm glad to hear that you are happy with your Milab DC-196's. I just wanted to inform you that Milab acquired Pearl in 2017 and that we are now the same company. Both product lines are built and serviced in the same workshop.
Old 1 week ago
  #101
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattias_Milab View Post
I'm glad to hear that you are happy with your Milab DC-196's. I just wanted to inform you that Milab acquired Pearl in 2017 and that we are now the same company. Both product lines are built and serviced in the same workshop.
Do you still make the MP30 Boundary microphone...I would like to get some more of these ?
Old 1 week ago
  #102
Gear Head
 
Mattias_Milab's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 View Post
Do you still make the MP30 Boundary microphone...I would like to get some more of these ?
I'm afraid we don't.
Old 1 week ago
  #103
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattias_Milab View Post
I'm afraid we don't.
Yes, I can see it's now passed into your "Historic models" listing: http://www.milabmic.com/historic_mics.asp ....so I'll go searching for a used sample.
Old 1 week ago
  #104
Gear Nut
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattias_Milab View Post
I'm glad to hear that you are happy with your Milab DC-196's. I just wanted to inform you that Milab acquired Pearl in 2017 and that we are now the same company. Both product lines are built and serviced in the same workshop.
Hi Mattias,

Could you tell us a little more about the difference between the Pearl cc22 and the dc196 (in cardioid). Or perhaps the difference in capsule technology?
Old 1 week ago
  #105
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elektrovolt's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plush View Post
Relying on 5 Pearl CC22 cardioids here. Always a very natural sound with a seductive sparkle in the treble.
Plush, intrigued about these mics now. What would you say about how they perform with somewhat bright sounding sources, do they get scratchy, like some condenser mics do, or would they tame the source in a smooth way?

The thing is, I am looking for better mics for recording the hurdy gurdy. Those instruments are not the easiest to record as they feature a 'buzzing bridge' that makes a rhythmical, bright buzzing sound and in a recording you will see that it needs to soften the buzz a bit, while keeping it tight. Most ribbon mics do make this more dark and obvious which is not what I want at all.. My Schoeps mics perform well but I guess there must me something that fits better.
Old 1 week ago
  #106
Gear Head
 
Mattias_Milab's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by VillageOp View Post
Hi Mattias,

Could you tell us a little more about the difference between the Pearl cc22 and the dc196 (in cardioid). Or perhaps the difference in capsule technology?
They are based on quite different designs, but because of the capsule dimensions they sound very similar.

We did an event in New York a while back when we compared multiple sources with a range of Milab and Pearl mics. Our engineer had a hard time hearing any difference at all between the CC22 and the DC-series, but after a while he said they were like two siblings - very similar but with slightly different personalities.
Old 1 week ago
  #107
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mljung's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattias_Milab View Post
They are based on quite different designs, but because of the capsule dimensions they sound very similar.

We did an event in New York a while back when we compared multiple sources with a range of Milab and Pearl mics. Our engineer had a hard time hearing any difference at all between the CC22 and the DC-series, but after a while he said they were like two siblings - very similar but with slightly different personalities.
I'm curious Mattias, about what kind of personalities your engineer experienced - in which way they were different from each other (even if it was only a slight difference)?

::
Mads
Old 1 week ago
  #108
Gear Head
 
Mattias_Milab's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mljung View Post
I'm curious Mattias, about what kind of personalities your engineer experienced - in which way they were different from each other (even if it was only a slight difference)?

::
Mads
I'll ask him to see if he can put it into words. We may even have some audio files left from the event. Let me get back to you.

/Mattias
Old 1 week ago
  #109
Lives for gear
 
mljung's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattias_Milab View Post
I'll ask him to see if he can put it into words. We may even have some audio files left from the event. Let me get back to you.

/Mattias
Great - looking forward!

::
Mads
Old 1 week ago
  #110
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Plush's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by elektrovolt View Post
Plush, intrigued about these mics now. What would you say about how they perform with somewhat bright sounding sources, do they get scratchy, like some condenser mics do, or would they tame the source in a smooth way?

The thing is, I am looking for better mics for recording the hurdy gurdy. Those instruments are not the easiest to record as they feature a 'buzzing bridge' that makes a rhythmical, bright buzzing sound and in a recording you will see that it needs to soften the buzz a bit, while keeping it tight. Most ribbon mics do make this more dark and obvious which is not what I want at all.. My Schoeps mics perform well but I guess there must me something that fits better.
Thank you for your question. The Pearl CC22 offers a neutral sound so a bright sounding instrument would be picked up just as it is. The CC22 is not a bright mic but it does have a very extended treble sound up past 25kHz.

Hurdy gurdy has a lot of mechanical noises and these are usually as loud as the musical notes it produces. I would recommend using a ribbon mic on the hurdy gurdy and then rolling off treble with EQ. Mic more distantly to assuage mechanical noises.

Also work on the hurdy gurdy instrument so that it is quieter than it is now. Since hurdy gurdy was meant to be a medieval street instrument, the street noise would have covered the mechanical movement noises. That's not the case in the studio or concert hall.

I use Pearl CC22 as a universal mic for any instrument. I particularly like them for choirs and early music recordings.
Old 1 week ago
  #111
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elektrovolt's Avatar
The modern hurdy gurdy is quite different from the historical and traditional instruments. mechanical noises are also part of the charm, depending on the playing style and particular instrument. The ones I play are the high end of modern alto hurdy gurdies, which sound more like a viola. Those well known 'street instruments' are different.

Ribbon mics do work well except for when the buzzing string kicks in and that is where the natural high end roll off of ribbon mics create a more obvious sound. The 'taming' of the high end goes the wrong way

My gefell um70 and 930 and Schoeps cardioids and omnis do a better job, but I was curious if the Pearl would do this well enough too.

Edit: not trying to hijack this thread of course
Old 6 days ago
  #112
Gear Head
 
Mattias_Milab's Avatar
 

Milab DC-196 vs. Pearl CC22

Here are two recent frequency charts from a Milab DC-196 (top) and a Pearl CC22 (bottom). Both measured in the same lab with the same equipment.
Attached Thumbnails
Rectangular capsule users, unite! And tell us your experiences...-20200211_095038.jpg  
Old 4 days ago
  #113
Gear Head
Hi,

A short video about Pearl ELM-A, the ELM with double membranes and outputs.

/Pär
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