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Mics for saxes
Old 27th January 2003
  #1
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Mics for saxes

Going to have 2 saxes on Thursday, a tenor and a baritone. Any mic suggestions much appreciated.

DW
Old 27th January 2003
  #2
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e-cue's Avatar
 

Royer 122 (or 121 with a beefy mic pre) or a C12 on both or either of these should do you good. The Sax is the instrument closest to the human vocal so sometimes I tend to treat saxes similar to how I treat vocals. Go into the live room, have the sax player play what you will be recording, get on your knees and move your head around until you hear what you want to capture and put the mic there.

Sometimes I stick a 414 on the sax itself to capture the "clicks" the player makes... I love hearing the stuff you aren't supposed to hear, but the producer may think you are a moron.
Old 27th January 2003
  #3
Yes, Royers are going to sound great without any processing (with a good player in a good room that is).
Old 27th January 2003
  #4
Quote:
Originally posted by e-cue

Sometimes I stick a 414 on the sax itself to capture the "clicks" the player makes... I love hearing the stuff you aren't supposed to hear, but the producer may think you are a moron.
I work with a saxist who likes 2 x 414. One in front of the bell and one on the keys. I find the main 414 way too thin and bright.
As e-cue says, the one near the finger work can sound great especially for picking up extra breathiness.
Royers would be an easy option. Even Coles.
But watch out for the Baritone. It can be a different beast - sometimes too boomy, sometimes too honky.
Old 27th January 2003
  #5
Moderator emeritus
 

I'll typically use either a Lawson L-47 MP or a Neumann U-87 on saxes, including the bari.
Old 27th January 2003
  #6
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malice's Avatar
 

Royer 121,122 or U87, even U67 on tenor, might be good.

OR

421 ...

malice
Old 28th January 2003
  #7
Gear Maniac
 

I was a few feet away from Ernie Watts as he was blowin' into a 421 a couple of days ago. It sounded great, very true to the sound. BTW, it was a new 421.
Old 28th January 2003
  #8
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malice's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Tubelover
I was a few feet away from Ernie Watts as he was blowin' into a 421 a couple of days ago. It sounded great, very true to the sound. BTW, it was a new 421.
mmh, I have both new and vintage, alwys choosed Mark 1 for this

malice
Old 28th January 2003
  #9
Gear Maniac
 

More Sax...

I love an RE-20 on tenor sax.

jason
Old 28th January 2003
  #10
urumita
 
7rojo7's Avatar
 

Pattern response on ribbons is always a little tight, they have the right sound but you have to move the mic far away to get the whole instrument, and of course it'll pick up everything at 180°.
Beyer has some Hypercardioid ribbons that I find more useful for trumpet or flugel or horn. And they work quite nicely.
The peculiarity of sax is that the sound comes from every where on the instrument. A lot of times i'll put up a complicated looking mic at the bell, RE20, 441 and put up another mic to catch the whole instrument, U48, M249 or other nice mike (MPLD condensor), this keeps the player in a fixed spot, live, the bell mic serves for monitor and the other for FOH.
My friend a sax, flute, bass clarinet and string player carries his own for gigs. Electrovoice RE10 for bell, 441 for top and a Beta98 for violin and viola, this of course is for live work.
In the studio it's a D12 or U67 on the bell and a 441 or RCA JV74 on top or for flute (live an N90) and a U67 for the strings.
Of course 1 mic. setups are easier.
Anyone know where to get a good D12 these days? Mine is broken.
Old 28th January 2003
  #11
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Thanks 7rojo7, you might watch the Funkyjunk secondhand list ( I think they have a base in Milan) and also Alison at Gear on Line in Bristol, England. I wish I could trade my D12 for an RE20

DW
Old 28th January 2003
  #12
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CrazyBeast's Avatar
 

I like an old 421 or a royer up close, and a condensor in the room.
Old 28th January 2003
  #13
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hollywood_steve's Avatar
 

I like an old 421 or a royer up close, and a condensor in the room.
****************************************

This is sorta off-topic, but what specifically is wrong with new 421s? I have a circa '90 model and a '99 model (both probably considered the "New" version) and they are the two most versatile mics I own. Definitely my "desert island" mics as I can cover just about anything with a 421, if I have to. What am I missing compared to an original model in good shape? (I do admit that the old off-white 421s are cool looking)

For that matter, what's wrong with the current 57, besides its south-of-the-border heritage? I have a new 57 and a 20 year old model that I purchased new and that is still in perfect shape. I can not tell them apart on any source.

are there real differences that set the new and old models apart?

steve
[email protected]
Old 29th January 2003
  #14
Han
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Nothing's wrong with the 421 mk2, it only doesn't sound like the old ones. I have both the old and the newer 421's and like them both, but sometimes you just want the sound of the old ones, which is less hot. On sax it's a matter of taste. If I have to record a sax for rock music and only have a couple of 421's, it's the new one. For jazz I would use the old one.
Old 29th January 2003
  #15
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Han
Nothing's wrong with the 421 mk2, it only doesn't sound like the old ones...
Exactly!

It's like anything else. Does this Sax player have a tone that works with this particular mic, whichever one you put up.
Old 29th January 2003
  #16
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studjo's Avatar
 

Last year I recorded a Jazz Band live. They had 2 sax players (tenor and alto) I used a Royer 121 on the "old-style" player and on the "fusion-man" an AT 4050. They complimented each other in a nice way and were very easy to mix.

Jo
Old 29th January 2003
  #17
urumita
 
7rojo7's Avatar
 

I guess it's over for the old D12. They still make the RE20, they called it PL20 for a while, didn't change much thank the All.
Today's your day, merde, break a leg and all that jive tora tora tora. Whatever you use, it's more important to make someone feel important while at the same time not wasting much energy or gear, to let them blow without a doubt.
Old 29th January 2003
  #18
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David R.'s Avatar
 

I recorded Kenny Brooks, used an RE20 on him. He told me it was the best tone he ever had.

BTW, it is called sax-a-ma-phone now.

Bleeding Gums Murphy, R.I.P.
Old 30th January 2003
  #19
Gear Addict
 
muddy's Avatar
 

anyone used a baby bottle for sax? i'm gonna give mine a go in the next coupla weeks for james chance (remember no new york/contortions?). i'll let you know how it goes.


ml
Old 30th January 2003
  #20
Lives for gear
Thanks for your help. I don't have any Royers (yet) so I went for an AKG 414 TL, an Oktava ML52 (has anyone ever used one?) and a Soundfield. The AKG was scrapped straight away for being too bright, so I blended the Oktava (which is a ribbon by the way) and the Soundfield. The Soundfield was positioned about head height, in front of the player. It worked very well.
It's actually only the second time I've used the Oktava since I got it last year. I thought it might be a good vocal mic, but boy I was wrong. It did give the sax that old sound, kinda reminded me of Steve Silvermint for some reason yuktyy .

DW
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