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Where to find more info like this? (Kazuya Nagae)
Old 2 weeks ago
  #1
Where to find more info like this? (Kazuya Nagae)

Hello fellow Slutz,

Recently I found this wonderful website of Mr. Kazuya Nagae (The Research on Classical Music Recording).
http://kazuyanagae.com/

I wonder if there is some other online resource where I can find diagrams of mic setups etc. It's interesting to see the particular choices of each recording. I'm having little luck so far. (In German is also fine for me)

Or maybe we could share our own notes? I enjoy keeping a record of all of our recordings.

Thanks.
Ludwig
Attached Thumbnails
Where to find more info like this? (Kazuya Nagae)-setup1.jpg  
Attached Files
File Type: pdf 16BISRecordsMinnesotaOrchestraSetup.pdf (474.4 KB, 19 views) File Type: pdf 29MicSetup.pdf (464.0 KB, 17 views) File Type: pdf 20171008ElbphilharmonieSetup.pdf (462.1 KB, 14 views) File Type: pdf DresdnerKammerchor07_MicSetup.pdf (363.3 KB, 16 views) File Type: pdf MyriosDLR_MicSetup.pdf (404.8 KB, 13 views) File Type: pdf Nalepastr_Polyhymnia11_MicSetup.pdf (359.4 KB, 15 views) File Type: pdf PolyhymniaMicSetup.pdf (369.2 KB, 17 views) File Type: pdf TonkunstlerIFig2MicSetup.pdf (457.9 KB, 13 views)
Old 2 weeks ago
  #2
Gear Addict
 
lukedamrosch's Avatar
 

There are a handful of other good diagrams like this if you dig around on the Sengpiel website, for example:

http://www.sengpielaudio.com/Klavier1.pdf
http://www.sengpielaudio.com/Klavier2.pdf
http://www.sengpielaudio.com/Klavier3.pdf
Old 2 weeks ago
  #3
Lives for gear
Thanks for providing this source, there's some good information amongst Kazuya's links.

I like some of his instrument miking comparisons...unfortunately his experiment comparing short vs long analog mic cables seems flawed. Am I right in assuming that one mic pair (of the 4 shown in the session photos) was driving the long cables, and the other pair the short cables ? The shown spot mics are apparently not included in the mix ?

The disparity of mic placements across the front of the musicians (rather than having them paired on a single mic bar, or better, sharing suspensions) seems to negate the subtleties of the cable length comparison (and any perceived differences) ?

http://kazuyanagae.com/20131201Analo...fer/index.html

Last edited by studer58; 2 weeks ago at 07:14 AM..
Old 2 weeks ago
  #4
Old 2 weeks ago
  #5
Quote:
Originally Posted by lukedamrosch View Post
There are a handful of other good diagrams like this if you dig around on the Sengpiel website, for example:

http://www.sengpielaudio.com/Klavier1.pdf
http://www.sengpielaudio.com/Klavier2.pdf
http://www.sengpielaudio.com/Klavier3.pdf
Thanks for sharing! I have some wonderful books on the subject with diagrams. But, these real worlds recordings are also very interesting. Especially seeing which microphones you can see being used at Funkhaus, Philharmonie etc.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #6
Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 View Post
Thanks for providing this source, there's some good information amongst Kazuya's links.

I like some of his instrument miking comparisons...unfortunately his experiment comparing short vs long analog mic cables seems flawed. Am I right in assuming that one mic pair (of the 4 shown in the session photos) was driving the long cables, and the other pair the short cables ? The shown spot mics are apparently not included in the mix ?

The disparity of mic placements across the front of the musicians (rather than having them paired on a single mic bar, or better, sharing suspensions) seems to negate the subtleties of the cable length comparison (and any perceived differences) ?

http://kazuyanagae.com/20131201Analo...fer/index.html
I think that all omis where together on the bar:
http://kazuyanagae.com/20131201Analo...nsferLarge.jpg

EDIT: Not on the bar, but on top.

Last edited by Julian J. Ludwig; 2 weeks ago at 03:45 AM..
Old 2 weeks ago
  #7
I'm intrigued by these two scenarios (see attachment).

We can see Violas or Violins being miced from behind (carioid and wide cardioid).
I wonder if that was a "no other choice" situation because of video, or if I'm missing out on some secret techniques.

I understand that with the second violins on the right side of the stage, the instruments are projecting to the back of the stage. But violas would not.

Any ideas?
Attached Thumbnails
Where to find more info like this? (Kazuya Nagae)-screenshot-2019-11-22-23.10.30.jpg   Where to find more info like this? (Kazuya Nagae)-screenshot-2019-11-22-23.10.43.jpg  
Old 2 weeks ago
  #8
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian J. Ludwig View Post
I think that all omis where together on the bar:
http://kazuyanagae.com/20131201Analo...nsferLarge.jpg
No, if you look at the floor there are 4 mic stands, 2 pairs quite wide apart
http://kazuyanagae.com/20131201Analo...sfer2Large.jpg
Old 2 weeks ago
  #9
Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 View Post
No, if you look at the floor there are 4 mic stands, 2 pairs quite wide apart
http://kazuyanagae.com/20131201Analo...sfer2Large.jpg
Yes, but I believe they are side by side at the end of the stand. I'm sending a zoom in another angle.
Looks like there is a B&K or DPA infiltrated also.
Attached Thumbnails
Where to find more info like this? (Kazuya Nagae)-screenshot-2019-11-22-23.34.42.png  
Old 2 weeks ago
  #10
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian J. Ludwig View Post
I'm intrigued by these two scenarios (see attachment).

We can see Violas or Violins being miced from behind (carioid and wide cardioid).
I wonder if that was a "no other choice" situation because of video, or if I'm missing out on some secret techniques.

I understand that with the second violins on the right side of the stage, the instruments are projecting to the back of the stage. But violas would not.

Any ideas?
i've been positioning directional mics behind strings (vln and vla) to take advantage of the capsule's rear damping capability: to avoid spill from instruments behind the strings or reflections from the walls but also in situations with a dense seating, cutting down the 'forest' in front of the musicians or simply 'cause a conductor (or a camera team) didn't like stands in a specific position much - so plenty of reasons imo.



[i dunno about the reasons in the above mentioned scenarios though - i can't think of too many engineers who are willing to reveal their mic setup, mic choice and positions (what's next: preamps, gain settings, converters?): depending on circumstances, this might actually cause legal issues which i assume is one of the reasons why you may not find tons of information on these topics].
Old 2 weeks ago
  #11
They aren’t being mic’d from behind;

Those are section mics for the strings. They are high up and pointing almost straight down. In the Philharmonie they might even be dead hung. They are placed in front of the desk that they are “focused” on, but are high enough up to catch a nice blend of section sound.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian J. Ludwig View Post
I'm intrigued by these two scenarios (see attachment).

We can see Violas or Violins being miced from behind (carioid and wide cardioid).
I wonder if that was a "no other choice" situation because of video, or if I'm missing out on some secret techniques.

I understand that with the second violins on the right side of the stage, the instruments are projecting to the back of the stage. But violas would not.

Any ideas?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #12
Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya View Post
They aren’t being mic’d from behind;

Those are section mics for the strings. They are high up and pointing almost straight down. In the Philharmonie they might even be dead hung. They are placed in front of the desk that they are “focused” on, but are high enough up to catch a nice blend of section sound.
Indeed, that makes sense. On other diagrams hung microphones are represented as a circle (aka looking down). But he is probably representing a slight angle.

Thanks for the clarification.
Old 1 week ago
  #13
Gear Maniac
 
DaveyJones's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya View Post
They aren’t being mic’d from behind;

Those are section mics for the strings. They are high up and pointing almost straight down.
Yes, probably this. But the way the graph is written it does make it look like somebody is trying to mic up the Vln 2 from the same angle as the Vln 1 section so pointing towards the natural projection side or the side that the bow hand is on.

That seems really odd. In my experience here in the UK, people tend not to like this left to right Violin 1 to Violin 2 setup but I have seen it done and the reasoning given is usually repertoire driven. My instinct would be to mic as normal for string section spots: hung or angled straight down facing the floor (make it a KM84, please).
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