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Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?
Old 8th May 2019
  #1
Gear Head
 

Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?

Those of you who utilize the Faulkner four-mic-array (and its variants): What mic bars do you use? Let's see them all (including DIY solutions)!
Old 8th May 2019
  #2
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jnorman's Avatar
Hi - I regularly use the boojum/jnorman array :-) with ORTF cmc64s and AB km183s, and I like the AEA smp-17:
https://www.aearibbonmics.com/produc...17-stereo-bar/
Prior to that, I used a k&m 236, which worked fine, and is quite affordable.
Old 8th May 2019
  #3
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JCBigler's Avatar
Christian (@NorseHorse) turned me on to the Sabra-Som bars and mounts. I bought a couple of 24" wide aluminum 6061-T6 3/8" hex rod from Onlinemetals.com for like $2 each. I bougth 4 and they sent me 3 extras that were about 22 1/2" along with the 4 that I paid for. I rattled canned the hex rod and they work perfect.

Okay, I guess I have to measure them out and check the angles with a protractor, but the whole set up cost me about $60 after shipping.

I like this combination, because you can adjust the width of the mounts and the angle if you need to. And the hex rod keeps the mounts in place since they won't rotate around the rod like a round rod will.
Old 8th May 2019
  #4
Lives for gear
 

I use my DIY stereo bar made from
(aluminum) Heavy Duty T-track. See
my thread and post for details.
Only update is that I now use a Star Knob
to snug against the mic mount as well as another Star Knob to snug against the T-track.
So quick and easy to loosen/tighten.
I haven’t tried it but no reason you couldn’t use my design to make a Decca Tree.
Happy to answer questions.
DIY Stereo and more Mic Bar
Old 8th May 2019
  #5
Lightbulb

For the semantic record, I don't consider or call a four-mic-array a Faulkner Array, which is AB figure-8s ~20cm.

What you are getting at is simple double-mains. Or mains and flanks (depending on spacing, purpose, and who you are talking too). Can be whatever mics and patterns you like, and you can intend to use them together or use them separately. And if you want to specify mics, patterns, and spacing and give it a cool name for yourself, go for it!

You can even put more pairs up if you want. Why stop at two?



JCBigler has some good tips!
Attached Thumbnails
Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-threemicrophonepairs.jpg  
Old 8th May 2019
  #6
Lives for gear
Superlux MA90 AB bar....heavy, overbuilt... but solid and dependable...has angle markings scribed on the rotatable inner mic mounts. I drilled or pin-punched out the locking pins holding the smooth hanging/suspension pegs at each end of the bar, and replaced them with short 3/8" threaded stubs (then screwed 5/8 adapter barrels over the top to match my mic suspension.

You could just as easily cut a 3/8" thread into the stub perhaps, and minimize the mutilation ? The outer threaded stubs give you close to 67 cms, if the mic is angled out at 45 degrees, while the inner pair of course can be adjusted for distance and angle as intended by the manufacturer. The distance markings etched into the main bar are both puzzling and pointless...neither cms nor inches ! You could probably call it a Faulkner 4 mic phased array with some accuracy, as that's what TF himself refers to it as.

https://www.thomann.de/gb/superlux_ma90.htm
Attached Thumbnails
Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-superlux-ma90-end-stub-replacement.jpg  
Old 8th May 2019
  #7
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Bruce Watson's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by NorseHorse View Post
For the semantic record, I don't consider or call a four-mic-array a Faulkner Array, which is AB figure-8s ~20cm.
But Faulkner describes both the AB figure 8s, and the four mic array of Schoeps mk21s and mk2Hs.

This thread might refresh some memories. Especially post #9 .
Old 8th May 2019
  #8
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Plush's Avatar
No, a Faulkner array is spaced figure-of-eight microphones. That is what it has always been called.

The other set up Tony uses is called the "phased array."

I recommend the AEA bars-especially the 1 meter bar.
Old 8th May 2019
  #9
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tourtelot's Avatar
AEA 1m bar. The short bar is too short for me to get the "flankers" out far enough to really hear their impact.

D.

BTW, the Superlux bars ARE nice. I have a couple of them. They work well for any number of two mic arrays and I have mod'd mine as well with a mounting point on the center piece. Cheap too.

AEA bars are better but cost way more money.
Old 8th May 2019
  #10
Gear Guru
 
John Willett's Avatar
 

Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plush View Post
No, a Faulkner array is spaced figure-of-eight microphones. That is what it has always been called.

The other set up Tony uses is called the "phased array."
Agreed

I use the new Gefell "phased array" bar (pictured below).

I have also used the Grace DSpace Bar for this.
.
Attached Thumbnails
Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-m930_m221_phased_array_angled_view_edited-1.jpg   Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-phased_array_underslung_m930.jpg   Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-t-bar-phased-arrray.jpg  
Old 8th May 2019
  #11
Gear Head
 

I made some fittings for Ø12mm carbon fiber tubing so I can mount 2 pair of mics on one stand. Haven't quite figured out how to make a swiveling clip, but most of the time the fixed 90° angle works well in the halls I record in. The spacing is variable from 20mm to 60mm for the inner pair, and 160cm to 200cm for the outer pair.

This is a tough crowd when it comes to discussing 3D printed stuff, so I'm prepared for the mocking...
Attached Thumbnails
Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-img_20190427_134526.jpg   Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-img_20190405_082222.jpg   Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-img_20190330_081527.jpg   Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-img_20190330_081508.jpg   Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-img_20190329_120935.jpg  

Old 8th May 2019
  #12
Another affordable option is the Manfrotto 154 bar. Get a couple of them and put 4 clamps on one bar.

Whatever you call them: Faulkner 4 mic, Boojum/Jnorman, BJ array, phased array, forward gain array, whatever. I will once again, unapologetically, express my general dislike for the technique. A single pair with flankers always seems to sound better to me. There is something off-putting about the lopsided frequency response and sensitivity, especially with microphones that are not perfectly compatible like the Schoeps.
Old 8th May 2019
  #13
Gear Maniac
 
DaveyJones's Avatar
 

I use this:
https://sxpro.co.uk/grace-design-sb6...SABEgKu8_D_BwE
Which is the Grace Design Space bar 66cm. However it is over £500 + you need to buy another 2 mounts for it. It is VERY pricey.

Recently Thomann started selling this which looks fantastic at 77 EUR:
https://www.thomann.de/gb/the_t.bone...obar_1_pro.htm
I am gutted I spent so much but have had perfect service from the Grace bar since purchase.

What really makes these two bars stand out for me is that once mounted on the bar you can then change the angle they are pointing at without touching the mics.
Old 8th May 2019
  #14
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tourtelot's Avatar
Hard to beat that bar for 77 EUR.

D.
Old 8th May 2019
  #15
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celticrogues's Avatar
 

I’ve used the Manfrotto Triple Mic bar with one of the SRS 3D printed mounts for the cardioid pair in the middle. Works great for me.

I also have the K&M 23560 which is nice and long.

That TBone bar looks nice too!
-Mike
Old 8th May 2019
  #16
Gear Maniac
 
DaveyJones's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Willett View Post
Agreed

I use the new Gefell "phased array" bar (pictured below).

I have also used the Grace DSpace Bar for this.
.
Hi John,

what spacing do you use for that Gefell Array?
Old 8th May 2019
  #17
Gear Guru
 
John Willett's Avatar
 

Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveyJones View Post
Hi John,

what spacing do you use for that Gefell Array?
ORTF and 60cm spacing for the omnis.
Old 8th May 2019
  #18
Grace Space-Bar here. Expensive, but immensely modular.
Attached Thumbnails
Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-img_0139.jpg   Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-fullsizeoutput_200b.jpg   Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-fullsizeoutput_2003.jpg  
Old 8th May 2019
  #19
Gear Maniac
 
DaveyJones's Avatar
 

Interesting, this is almost my exact go-to choral setup (with additional spots and width mics too). Except I use the TLM102 which I adore on chamber choirs!

The combo works well but I've always thought it looks a little ugly with two side address mics in the middle and two, comparatively, long mics on the side. 4 schoeps CMC6 bodies with caps looks much better (luckily I don't have to worry about that too much )
Old 9th May 2019
  #20
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Tommy-boy's Avatar
 

I also use the grace space bars. I have a long one and a short one. They are fantastic.

Tom
Old 9th May 2019
  #21
Gear Maniac
 
elpillo's Avatar
 

I use 15mm rods (the ones for video equipment.) They are super light, extremely modular, good looking and inexpensive compared with the ones in pro-audio. They don't come engraved but most likely you'll be bringing a measuring tape anyways. I also use the Supelux MA90 stereo bar. It's heavy, sturdy and not super expensive.
Old 9th May 2019
  #22
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by elpillo View Post
I use 15mm rods (the ones for video equipment.) They are super light, extremely modular, good looking and inexpensive compared with the ones in pro-audio. They don't come engraved but most likely you'll be bringing a measuring tape anyways. I also use the Supelux MA90 stereo bar. It's heavy, sturdy and not super expensive.


Very good idea. That's what I do as well. The rods are strong, they are cheap, and they are easy to source. I get ours on Amazon.
Old 9th May 2019
  #23
Gear Nut
 

For you who use 15mm rods -- I love that idea! -- what mic mounts have you found that clamp securely to the rods?
Old 10th May 2019
  #24
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrReid View Post
For you who use 15mm rods -- I love that idea! -- what mic mounts have you found that clamp securely to the rods?
In the UK you can find all sorts of mounts on Amazon UK. Smallrig is a Chinese company which makes all manner of 15mm rod based attachments.

If you are in the US you may find Smallrig's end-user prices going up after the new tariff surcharges imposed today take effect as stocks run down.
Old 10th May 2019
  #25
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John Willett's Avatar
 

Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommy-boy View Post
I also use the grace space bars. I have a long one and a short one. They are fantastic.
Same here: one centre, one each of the short and long bars, 4 x mounts, one riser, plus the centre mount.

Not inexpensive, though.

Euro version, of course, with the standard 3/8" threads.
Old 11th May 2019
  #26
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boojum's Avatar
I use a real low-roller approach. I start with a Sabra-Som mic stand where I usually place an Mk8 + Mk21 or Mk4 for MS. With little strips of gaffers tape I strap on about 40cm of thin carbon fiber rod. Williams in his Stereo Zoom paper (https://rycote.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/...honic_Zoom.pdf) iindicates that around a 38cm separation of omnis is good for a 160 to 180 degree soundfield. According to Williams' research the effect is the same as widely spaced omnis. It works for me.

FWIW I recorded Elijah for the local chorale in a very good venue using just the omnis (DPA 4061's) at the 38cm spacing. The upright was telescoping carbon fiber tubes from a kite shop. Like really skinny. The mics and their DPA specific cabling were wispy. The locals were sure that what they were seeing was a micro-wave antenna broadcasting the performance to the local community radio station.

And, yes, the recording was a pretty good one.

Last edited by boojum; 11th May 2019 at 07:33 AM.. Reason: Final comment
Old 11th May 2019
  #27
Gear Maniac
 
elpillo's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrReid View Post
For you who use 15mm rods -- I love that idea! -- what mic mounts have you found that clamp securely to the rods?
I'm using these. For heavier mics you could always tighten them up a bit more using pliers, just in case.
Attached Thumbnails
Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-15mm-rod-mic-clamp.png  
Old 11th May 2019
  #28
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ronmac's Avatar
While not as elegant as the above, I use these, with and without the 15mm bar...

https://www.amazon.ca/SmallRig-Threa...6YC1P4XA2VKBFR

I chose these because they can be used individually in a variety of situations where a bar is not practical (table edges, balcony rails, on existing mic stands, etc.) and I am trying to reduce the amount of single-use pieces in my ever growing clamp kit.
Attached Thumbnails
Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-71wzx4h73vl._sl1500_.jpg   Faulkner 4 mic array and variation users: What mic bars do you use?-71leujnnnjl._sl1500_.jpg  
Old 11th May 2019
  #29
+1 on Thomann bar

Quote:
the t.bone StereoBar 1 Pro – Thomann España



Riel de montaje para pareja de micrófonos estéreo Los marcajes grabados posibilitan recuperar ajustes de posición usados previamente, 4 sujeciones de micrófono, Soporte de micrófono alto para configuraciones de...
Old 12th May 2019
  #30
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Tommy-boy's Avatar
 

That t.bone bar looks very similar to the grace space bar. Doesnt look like it has a center mount though, which i use frequently on the grace bar.

My typical configuration on the long bar is ortf in the center with AB 60+ omnis on the outside. This is a versatile array. I sometimes run a wider spaced ortf in the center with MK21s.

Tom
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