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HAPI, Son of Horus Audio Interfaces
Old 24th June 2014
  #61
Gear Addict
 

Few weeks ago, I tried to demo the Horus system. Got the hardware in hand but at the last minute before the session was about to start I discovered that Merging does not support Windows8/8.1 OS. According to Independent Audio Inc, Merging decided that W8 is a "transitional" OS therefore there would be no support for the current OS until next OS comes out. I have been using W8.1 since it came out and benefited from the new OS so much that I would never go back to W7 again. Unfortunately, the demo never happened…

I guess nobody in the audio business is using W8/8.1? Am I the only one who uses W8.1?

Best regards,

Da-Hong
Old 24th June 2014
  #62
Gear Maniac
 

May I know what is the benefits of Win8.1 vs. Win7 in terms of audio recording?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dseetoo View Post
Few weeks ago, I tried to demo the Horus system. Got the hardware in hand but at the last minute before the session was about to start I discovered that Merging does not support Windows8/8.1 OS. According to Independent Audio Inc, Merging decided that W8 is a "transitional" OS therefore there would be no support for the current OS until next OS comes out. I have been using W8.1 since it came out and benefited from the new OS so much that I would never go back to W7 again. Unfortunately, the demo never happened…

I guess nobody in the audio business is using W8/8.1? Am I the only one who uses W8.1?

Best regards,

Da-Hong
Old 24th June 2014
  #63
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Plush's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by dseetoo View Post
Few weeks ago, I tried to demo the Horus system. Got the hardware in hand but at the last minute before the session was about to start I discovered that Merging does not support Windows8/8.1 OS. According to Independent Audio Inc, Merging decided that W8 is a "transitional" OS therefore there would be no support for the current OS until next OS comes out. I have been using W8.1 since it came out and benefited from the new OS so much that I would never go back to W7 again. Unfortunately, the demo never happened…

I guess nobody in the audio business is using W8/8.1? Am I the only one who uses W8.1?

Best regards,

Da-Hong
Hello Da-Hong,

I am using Windows 8 with SADiE 6. It works fantastically here. I also like Windows 8.
Old 24th June 2014
  #64
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Yannick's Avatar
 

I can't do the simplest thing on Windows 8.
Change network adapter settings, shut down the PC etc...

I cannot imagine making a full install on a Windows 8 machine.

IMO Merging is right. Windows will abandon the extremely awkard user interface (for PC users anyway), so there is no point in spending days/weeks to get to know the quirks of W8.

But, there is no reason everything shouldn't run as smoothly (and maybe even slightly quicker) on Win8. So if you know Win8, why not.

I guess Win8 should be able to install Win7 stuff ?
Old 24th June 2014
  #65
Gear Addict
 

Windows 8 is a vastly better coded OS than W7. Everything runs more efficiently and uses less computer resources. For people who still refuse to move forward from W7 I say you are missing out a lot. But, I guess you wouldn’t know what you are missing if you never try the new one.

Being a Windows based solution, for Merging not to support W8 is something I can never understand. I tried every trick there is to force the provided driver to work under W8 but it would not go. For whatever it is worth, I have a very old, out of production and support interface by M-Audio; the Fast Track Pro, which I use to measure speakers and studio room, even that box has full support for Windows8. Go figure. Lastly, every program I ever cared to use, doesn’t matter how old it is, all function perfectly under W8, with the only exception of Merging Horus driver.

For me, there is a real important issue that I had with Windows7 and my current motherboard. I use Asus Z87 series boards and Windows7 USB3 native driver simply does not work with this latest Intel USB3 hub at all. W8 did not work with this new hardware either at beginning but MS quickly came out with a new driver at the beginning of this year that solved the problem. There is no new USB3 driver for W7, by the way. MS stopped the developing cycle for W7.

As they say, YMMV.

Da-Hong
Old 24th June 2014
  #66
Quote:
I guess nobody in the audio business is using W8/8.1? Am I the only one who uses W8.1?
Using 8.1 here. Love it, especially with an SSD OS drive. The thing goes from off to ready to use in 12 seconds.
Old 24th June 2014
  #67
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Don S's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rumleymusic View Post
Using 8.1 here. Love it, especially with an SSD OS drive. The thing goes from off to ready to use in 12 seconds.
Is this in a laptop?
Old 24th June 2014
  #68
Quote:
Originally Posted by dseetoo View Post
Being a Windows based solution, for Merging not to support W8 is something I can never understand.

For me, there is a real important issue that I had with Windows7 and my current motherboard.
I guess you can find a problem if you want to.

First of all, Pyramix runs fantastically on Windows 7, so why want to upgrade? I was running Pyramix for many year on Win 2k without any hiccup ever. Ever. Personally, I like companies that do not want their users to take risks with something that might not be perfectly stable yet. Surely, you want to be on the safe side when recording a valuable project?

Then, in our times buying computers has become so ridiculously inexpensive, that I'd say simply buy a new motherboard if yours is not working. You are considering buying a Horus, it can't be a problem laying down a few hundred Dollars for a new Mobo?

A few years ago, the money for tapes was more than a completely new computer...

Best,
Dirk
Old 24th June 2014
  #69
Quote:
Is this in a laptop?
No, a desktop. I built it in December so it is rather current in terms of speed. My laptop (Lenovo W520) has a standard 7200rpm drive and it loads 8.1 to desktop in about 25 seconds. Still about a minute faster than 7 loaded.

I have noticed programs load much faster as well. I don't know if they perform any better but it is sure nice to have the major cut in load times.
Old 24th June 2014
  #70
Gear Addict
 

I don’t use Pyramix software. I use Sequoia myself. The problem I have with Horus is that the ASIO driver Merging provides does not work under W8. It does not work with any application that supports ASIO under W8, not just Sequoia. If Horus is the latest and greatest then get on with the current OS as well. I love technology and always keep myself up to date with all the hardware and software I care to use. Moving from W7 to W8 is no brainer to me. My parting word with Horus was “call me when it supports current OS”.

Da-Hong
Old 24th June 2014
  #71
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Yes , its certainly disappointing that Merging will not support W8. I tried a few things to try to get PMX9_64 Native to install on W8.1, which I also like from a technical viewpoint. But to no avail. I think its mainly because MassCore does low level things to hook into the CPU. I wish they would compile a separate version for Native as this should not be a limitation with Native. Who knows what else is disadvantaged with the single compile set.

That all said, everyone knows that with Microsoft, its best to go with every other version. The W8.1 interface for a non-touch device, ie a computer you can actually do real productive work on, is completely and utterly ridiculous. The OS is a lot better coded but the UI is a disgrace for mouse and keyboard workstations. "Full screen" "apps" and Windows Store "apps" are nonsense on a workstation. The craziness reached its peak when they put this UI on the server OS (W2012).

I think it is a transitional OS and that W9 will be great. They (MS) have already said that they are releasing yet another update to 8.1 that restores the start menu, so that you can actually find programs you have just installed.

I went to an MS demo session last week and the reps said all their "business" customers, ie the ones doing real work with their computers, are all screaming. They have heard them.
Old 24th June 2014
  #72
Quote:
Originally Posted by dseetoo View Post
I don’t use Pyramix software. I use Sequoia myself. The problem I have with Horus is that the ASIO driver Merging provides does not work under W8.
Hi Da-Hong,

Missed that - sorry. I am obviously looking at this from the angle of a Pyramix user. I can understand that if you want to use Horus via ASIO, it is a different perspective.

Best,
Dirk
Old 24th June 2014
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dtf View Post
Hi Da-Hong,

Missed that - sorry. I am obviously looking at this from the angle of a Pyramix user. I can understand that if you want to use Horus via ASIO, it is a different perspective.

Best,
Dirk
You don't need PMX to enjoy Horus. All you need is the Ravenna ASIO driver. Works superbly on W7.
Old 24th June 2014
  #74
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NetworkAudio's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by matyas View Post
I'm currently spec'ing out a potential system. We're still in the very early planning stages here, and nothing might come of it, but I'd like to go Merging if possible. I'm looking at 16 in/8 out to start out. It looks to be cheaper to buy two Hapis than a single Horus, and this would also provide more flexibility in terms of being able to locate the D/A in a second box in a control room.

Thoughts?
Getting two hapi units is by far the best solution for you rather than one Horus.

Spec a redundant set of 2808 switches and get the redundant DC psu option for the Hapi.

If you want the flexibility to run more than 64chIO and redundancy with non-merging DAWs get the Digigram dual port ravenna card with the madi option.

The digigram card supports windows 8

This way you get great flexibility and redundancy and if you need more channels, just add another hapi to the switch using the same infastructure.
Old 24th June 2014
  #75
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NetworkAudio's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by dseetoo View Post
I don’t use Pyramix software. I use Sequoia myself. The problem I have with Horus is that the ASIO driver Merging provides does not work under W8. It does not work with any application that supports ASIO under W8, not just Sequoia. If Horus is the latest and greatest then get on with the current OS as well. I love technology and always keep myself up to date with all the hardware and software I care to use. Moving from W7 to W8 is no brainer to me. My parting word with Horus was “call me when it supports current OS”.

Da-Hong
If you are not on a laptop the Digigram AES67/Ravenna cards support win8 as well as higher trackcounts.
It will be shipping about the same time as the Hapi
Old 24th June 2014
  #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klaukholm View Post
Getting two hapi units is by far the best solution for you rather than one Horus.

Spec a redundant set of 2808 switches and get the redundant DC psu option for the Hapi.
Hello Kjetil,

Thanks for the input. A question about the redundant switches: are multiple switches needed purely as a backup, or do you need multiple switches for three or four devices (two Hapis and one or two computers) on a network? Of course, I agree that backup and redundancy are important, and the switches are cheap enough that it makes sense to have a backup. I'm just trying to understand how the network architecture works.

Also, how does redundancy work with the ASIO and CoreAudio drivers? I'm not currently using Pyramix (although I may switch eventually). Could I have the main computer running Sequoia, and a second machine running something basic like Reaper? Would this work under ASIO?

Thanks!
Old 25th June 2014
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matyas View Post
Hello Kjetil,

Thanks for the input. A question about the redundant switches: are multiple switches needed purely as a backup, or do you need multiple switches for three or four devices (two Hapis and one or two computers) on a network? Of course, I agree that backup and redundancy are important, and the switches are cheap enough that it makes sense to have a backup. I'm just trying to understand how the network architecture works.

Also, how does redundancy work with the ASIO and CoreAudio drivers? I'm not currently using Pyramix (although I may switch eventually). Could I have the main computer running Sequoia, and a second machine running something basic like Reaper? Would this work under ASIO?

Thanks!

Redundancy can come in a few ways.
the simplest is connecting the unit to a switch and treating it as a simple splitter. The main running Sequoia and the backup runing reaper should work fine. As long as one horus or hapi is present on the network you can use the merging ravenna driver - you can also simultaneously have sequoia running a digigram card




Multiple switches is only needed if you want an entire redundant network point to point - this is more for broadcast with failsafe switchover etc. I can report back how well this works once the digigram ships and once merging gets the redundant port working
Old 25th June 2014
  #78
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matyas's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by klaukholm View Post
Redundancy can come in a few ways.
the simplest is connecting the unit to a switch and treating it as a simple splitter. The main running Sequoia and the backup runing reaper should work fine. As long as one horus or hapi is present on the network you can use the merging ravenna driver - you can also simultaneously have sequoia running a digigram card




Multiple switches is only needed if you want an entire redundant network point to point - this is more for broadcast with failsafe switchover etc. I can report back how well this works once the digigram ships and once merging gets the redundant port working
Thank you. This was very helpful.

A further question: what (if anything) do you know about AES67 integration with Dante networks? I run into Yamaha digital consoles in my PA work, and I was wondering if the promise of AES67 to bridge the Dante and Ravenna protocols would make it possible to use a Merging box as a high-quality front end for a Dante-equipped Yamaha desk.

Thanks again!
Old 25th June 2014
  #79
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NetworkAudio's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by matyas View Post
Thank you. This was very helpful.

A further question: what (if anything) do you know about AES67 integration with Dante networks? I run into Yamaha digital consoles in my PA work, and I was wondering if the promise of AES67 to bridge the Dante and Ravenna protocols would make it possible to use a Merging box as a high-quality front end for a Dante-equipped Yamaha desk.

Thanks again!
Ravenna has had AES67 support for a while now.
Audinate said in february that they would have AES67 support within 12 months. Once that is done your horus should work fine with the yamaha desk.
Old 26th June 2014
  #80
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NetworkAudio's Avatar
First batch should ship shortly
Old 9th August 2014
  #81
Just FYI

We have updated our website recently this list is formed of partner products that are actually shipping now.
https://www.audinate.com/products/dante-enabled

The 128x128 @96KHz PCIe Dante card with 150uS latency and dual redundant option has been shipping for over 2 years.

High quality Standalone Mic Pres here include DAD and Focusrite... but of pretty much equal significance is the availability of a whole plethora of console connectivity solutions - SSL, Studer, Stagetec etc.
Old 9th August 2014
  #82
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Any news on Dante/AES67 compatibility?
Old 10th August 2014
  #83
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To return this thread to its subject, Hapi's are now being delivered, at last!
Old 10th August 2014
  #84
Dante AES67

I think the term you are looking for is compliance, as one complies to a standard and implementations of a standard may be considered "compatible" with each other on a spectral basis.

It is important to highlight this, because AES 67 is a standard to which various organisations have committed to comply with, Audinate included. We try as best we can to work to the timeframes we say, and there is no update on the timeline that I am aware of - we have tried to be as realistic as possible on this, rather than promising immediately and deferring (which would obviously just cause frustration continually).
Old 10th August 2014
  #85
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 

I'm putting an AES Nashville meeting together for September 18th that will hopefully include representatives of several manufacturers, broadcasters and live sound people. We recording types really need to get up to speed about this technology so we'll have lots of questions. The meeting is a work in progress that could conceivably be rescheduled but so far it's looking like the 18th is going to work.
Old 13th August 2014
  #86
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Plush's Avatar
I got Hapi.
Old 13th August 2014
  #87
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Don S's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plush View Post
I got Hapi.
Do you have time to write a short review? There are more slutz who want to get HAPI!
Old 13th August 2014
  #88
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Larry Elliott's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plush View Post
I got Hapi.
Great News Plush
Old 13th August 2014
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Plush View Post
I got Hapi.
Very strong move.
Old 13th August 2014
  #90
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Spearritt View Post
Very strong move.
David

Did you buy local from Frank or off shore?

I'm in the stage of either upgrading my current SD to a 788 or a Nagra VI or taking the Hapi route. Either Hapi with MacBook or the SD970 via MADI. Still pondering this last option.


Regards
John
Littlehampton, SA
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