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CM3 - really THAT good? Condenser Microphones
Old 11th June 2013
  #661
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya View Post
Jesus Christ.... Mathematical purity?
Absolutely.

All music harmony is basically overtones, harmonics,
numerical ratios, etc.

It's been shown that music instruction can improve Math abilities.....
Old 11th June 2013
  #662
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oren View Post
Hi there Paul,
thanks for your friendly feedback! I am too amazed by the quality of the CM3. Whenever I place it in front of a sound source it sounds exactly like I wanted. It's nearly the only Cardioid out there that doesn't have a HF boost of some kind. It also doesn't have a LF "treatment" like my beloved Senn 8040. It doesn't need any of those, because it has it's own natural and relaxed sound.

I see people here comparing the CM3 to Schoeps and DPA, claiming that the Line Audio mics are not on the same level. I wouldn't be so sure of that. We humans have a hard time being objective (what is objective anyway...) and distinguishing between real quality differences and details of taste and flavor. Also when holding a 2k mic in your hand, it's very very difficult to criticize it's quality. On the other hand, a 150 dollar mic...

One ought to consider the production tolerance of Line Audio: I bought 6 CM3's and they are all perfectly matched even without ordering them as matched pairs. All the 6 could be used arbitrarily as a stereo pair. My two KM183's which I have ordered as stereo pair have a difference of around 1.2 db! Neumann doesn't really match, they just give your following serial numbers claiming that production tolerances are near zero. well...

Yes, thanks for posting your recording Oren.

Was this recording done with 2 mics? ORTF? How far
away from the sources? What pre-amp did you use?

Can you give us more details about the post production
on this particular track? You wrote, "No processing/ filtering what so ever."

Do you mean you didn't EQ or compress this track at all? Incredible.

Thanks for your time.....I'm on the waiting list for two CM3s!!!

DAMN YOU ALL!!!!

Old 11th June 2013
  #663
nkf
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chk23 View Post
Never listened to J.S.Bach? Mathematical purity.
Music is math.

Those interested in the subject should read "Gödel, Escher, Bach – An Eternal Golden Braid" from Douglas R. Hofstadter.
I've learned that music is based on physics, which can be described by math and that some kind of musical structures can be described by mathematical models.
Music is much more in the social domain as it otherwise couldn't be deciphered as music and separated from other noises and sound.
Old 11th June 2013
  #664
Quote:
Originally Posted by nkf View Post
I've learned that music is based on physics, which can be described by math and that some kind of musical structures can be described by mathematical models.
Music is much more in the social domain as it otherwise couldn't be deciphered as music and separated from other noises and sound.
NKF, the way you describe the relationship between physics and math is right in line with how I think about it. Music, ie the notes on the page, can be described by mathematics. But math cannot even begin to grasp the nuances of dynamics, inflection, articulation, rubato, all the things that really make music.... Music! The notes are only half the battle, if even that.

And yes, I've listened to JS Bach.... :-P
Attached Thumbnails
CM3 - really THAT good?-imageuploadedbygearslutz1370976258.571563.jpg  
Old 11th June 2013
  #665
Lives for gear
 
jpgerard's Avatar
Great find! I'll see if I can get some samples too. Thanks!
Old 11th June 2013
  #666
Gear Maniac
Music isn't math.
But there's a lot of math in music, especially in Bach's music.
Old 11th June 2013
  #667
Gear Head
 
egor's Avatar
 

Hey guys, check this out!
Vox, Bass, English Horn and Strings-all cm3.
I had only 2 hours, MacBook with Duet and 2 cm3 to make it all
happened..

La Vida es un Sueño - WORLD : Latino | Hispasonic

P.D. Instruments were recorded separately!
Old 11th June 2013
  #668
Gear Head
 

Wow, wow!
Old 12th June 2013
  #669
Lives for gear
 
boojum's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by egor View Post
Hey guys, check this out!
Vox, Bass, English Horn and Strings-all cm3.
I had only 2 hours, MacBook with Duet and 2 cm3 to make it all
happened..

La Vida es un Sueño - WORLD : Latino | Hispasonic
Are you ****ting me? Tell me how you did this. Maravillosa!!
Old 12th June 2013
  #670
Mar
Gear Nut
 

Math is the code behind the universe, it can describe all. If you can't describe something with math is simply because you have not understood.
I think the associations that the majority of people usually do with math are totally wrong because math is pure magic, math is THE magic of the universe.
There are some algorithms that can describe and reproduce the movement of a flock, the geometry of a beehive also have a mathematical reason...
The real problem is that a simple calculator can't describe math.

Ok, nice OT

PS: and to me music is pure math, especially exciting music.
Old 12th June 2013
  #671
Gear Head
 
egor's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by boojum View Post
Are you ****ting me? Tell me how you did this. Maravillosa!!
Putting the mic in a right place, basically..
Keep in mind that those are the finest musicians in the city and the arrangement is very cool. And i believe that this mics are the finest i ever had.
Btw, that day i used Soundcraft Notepad124 pres..
Old 12th June 2013
  #672
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Hey guys, check this out!
A good example of "it's not what you've got, it's the way that you use it"! Sounds like a well located group in a favourable acoustic, with good internal self-balance, and a well placed stereo pair. Nicely done.
Old 12th June 2013
  #673
Gear Head
 
egor's Avatar
 

Well, i believe i did not express myself right..
All the instruments were recorded separately. We´ve got the basic playback track and recorded the rest of the instruments in 2 hours.. Bass, vox and english horn first and then the strings session.
Old 12th June 2013
  #674
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by egor View Post
Putting the mic in a right place, basically..
Keep in mind that those are the finest musicians in the city and the arrangement is very cool. And i believe that this mics are the finest i ever had.
Btw, that day i used Soundcraft Notepad124 pres..

Great recording.

And done with cheap pre-amps! Wow!

These mics really kick ass!

Can't wait to get mine!
Old 12th June 2013
  #675
Lives for gear
 
boojum's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by egor View Post
Well, i believe i did not express myself right..
All the instruments were recorded separately. We´ve got the basic playback track and recorded the rest of the instruments in 2 hours.. Bass, vox and english horn first and then the strings session.
OK, now I can wrap my brain around it better. A great session. The whole thing is excellent. Thanks.
Old 12th June 2013
  #676
Gear Head
 
egor's Avatar
 

It was multitrack, sorry for confusion!!
Old 12th June 2013
  #677
Lives for gear
And all of it was done with CM3 mics?
Old 12th June 2013
  #678
Gear Head
 
egor's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2manyrocks View Post
And all of it was done with CM3 mics?
Bass, Vox, English Horn and Strings-cm3.
Strings were recorded with a pair. One mic between 1,2 violins and the second between viola and cello. +-2 feet away from the source both .
Percussion is all 57 i believe.
Piano is vsti.
Old 12th June 2013
  #679
Lives for gear
That is a very, very nice recording.
Old 12th June 2013
  #680
great work and great music egor!

How would the cm3's compare to something like this:

the t.bone SC 140 Stereoset - Thomann UK
Old 12th June 2013
  #681
Gear Head
 
egor's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2manyrocks View Post
That is a very, very nice recording.
Thank you.. That was a very challenging session. But then i got home and listened thru the song i was kinda:"wow, is it me or it is just sounds very good?!". Now, there is a lot of eq in a mix. Not because it not sit properly in a mix but because of the esthetics of the entire CD..
P.S And may i say that this woman can sing!?!
Old 12th June 2013
  #682
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mar View Post
Math is the code behind the universe, it can describe all. If you can't describe something with math is simply because you have not understood.
.
I'm gonna go ahead and say that the burden of proof lies with you on this one. Mathematics is just a system designed by humans to help better organize and understand patterns, Both of our own construction as well as those that occur naturally. But it cannot explain musicality. It can explain different harmonic or melodic or rhythmic ratios, but this does not mean that it is explaining the Deeper "music" behind the notes, as I said before the inflections, dynamics, articulations, all the things beyond just the notes that make music interesting, organic, and "art". How could math possibly explain such intangibles?
Old 12th June 2013
  #683
Gear Head
 
egor's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dharma one View Post
great work and great music egor!

How would the cm3's compare to something like this:

the t.bone SC 140 Stereoset - Thomann UK
For me there is no better mic than cm3 in 600$€+ category. For me!
The most important thing is that this mic is well balanced. It is not bright but it takes eq and compression very well.
Old 12th June 2013
  #684
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya View Post
I'm gonna go ahead and say that the burden of proof lies with you on this one. Mathematics is just a system designed by humans to help better understand patterns, Both of our own construction as well as those that occur naturally. But it cannot explain musicality. It can explain different harmonic or melodic or rhythmic ratios, but this does not mean that it is explaining the Deeper "music" behind the notes, as I said before the inflections, dynamics, articulations, all the things beyond just the notes that make music interesting, organic, and "art". How could math possibly explain such intangibles?
Probably some logarithm would work.
Old 12th June 2013
  #685
nkf
Lives for gear
 

OT comment

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mar View Post
Math is the code behind the universe, it can describe all. If you can't describe something with math is simply because you have not understood.
I think the associations that the majority of people usually do with math are totally wrong because math is pure magic, math is THE magic of the universe.
That is kind of funny because it is a very common mistake to confuse models describing something with the object to be described - even when you use the term 'describe' you assume math can describe 'all'. And it's this 'all', which we don't know and cannot describe fully, that you're just started to speculate about. If 'all' could be entirely described by math the whole universe would be math as an entity. There is a space of knowledge we can produce with our sciences and math but it's far from being 'all' in different ways. Our models are refined during development of sciences and, lets say, asymptotic approaching 'real world' complexity. And 'magic' is completely the wrong term unless it's just a weak metaphor.
Old 12th June 2013
  #686
Lives for gear
 
jpgerard's Avatar
Great recording, and it proves once again that the CM3 works very, very well on vocals.
Old 12th June 2013
  #687
Lives for gear
 
jpgerard's Avatar
Dharma, the TBones are simple Chinese imports. They are simply not comparable to the CM3. not only is the CM3 a quality hand made in sweden product, it also happens to be very linear and offers adecent noise floor. The TBones are, well, cheap chinese mics with the typical issues like annoying high frequency peaks, poor matching and relatively high noise floor. You need to look at higher priced mics to find a serious opponent for the CM3.
Old 12th June 2013
  #688
Gear Head
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul678 View Post
Yes, thanks for posting your recording Oren.

Was this recording done with 2 mics? ORTF? How far
away from the sources? What pre-amp did you use?

Can you give us more details about the post production
on this particular track? You wrote, "No processing/ filtering what so ever."

Do you mean you didn't EQ or compress this track at all? Incredible.

Thanks for your time.....I'm on the waiting list for two CM3s!!!

DAMN YOU ALL!!!!

Hi there Paul,
yeah, only 2 mics in DIN configuration, quite close to the vocal ensemble, around 1.5m far at chest height. They went into my Lake People preamps and RME converters. It was only a short test recording using close mickage. Too bad I didn't try to capture more of the beautiful acoustics of the church. It's definitely worth waiting for your two CM3s
Old 12th June 2013
  #689
Mar
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by nkf View Post
That is kind of funny because it is a very common mistake to confuse models describing something with the object to be described - even when you use the term 'describe' you assume math can describe 'all'. And it's this 'all', which we don't know and cannot describe fully, that you're just started to speculate about. If 'all' could be entirely described by math the whole universe would be math as an entity. There is a space of knowledge we can produce with our sciences and math but it's far from being 'all' in different ways. Our models are refined during development of sciences and, lets say, asymptotic approaching 'real world' complexity. And 'magic' is completely the wrong term unless it's just a weak metaphor.
Magic isn't the wrong term but may be' I have a different concept than you about this word. Think at 3,14~, is this number a simple model of reality or something more? Think about a bubble, isn't the perfection of this number magic??? This is what I mean... This is my personal opinion: math is the map AND the territory.
Why you distinguish science and math? What's the difference? A model is an opinion, math is just math.
At pixar they DON'T build their landscape pixel by pixel, they use fractals and BOOM! Almost "boom" :D
Search for this beautiful documentary, it speaks also about the math behind the sound: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RAtF...E41A0C254CD1D5
Old 12th June 2013
  #690
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oren View Post
Hi there Paul,
yeah, only 2 mics in DIN configuration, quite close to the vocal ensemble, around 1.5m far at chest height. They went into my Lake People preamps and RME converters. It was only a short test recording using close mickage. Too bad I didn't try to capture more of the beautiful acoustics of the church. It's definitely worth waiting for your two CM3s
Well, it sounds great as-is for sure.

Which model # did you get for the Lake People pres? And where
did you get them? I couldn't really find a place to buy them...you have to purchase direct from the company?

Yes, cannot wait to try these babies myself!

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