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SOUND DEVICES... I seriously need to rant!!! Dynamics Processors (HW)
Old 14th May 2006
  #61
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octatonic's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by limestone
Maybe we should send a link to this thread to the guys at sounddevices... if they haven't read it already!
I suggested this before, but a couple of people said the'd prefer not as they are customers.

JR
Old 14th May 2006
  #62
Gear Maniac
 
cheeky b's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by heathen
Every one of my purchases in Sydney has been this way, being that they don't advertise the best price straight up indicates a certain dishonesty in pricing. Why not haggle for the best price, this has been done for thousands of years in most cultures.
I'd always prefer to buy local and I have not made an overseas purchase yet, yet that is. I'm seriously considering it.

As you can see above I saved $6000 on 2 purchases just by way of a little haggleing, that is no pocket change unless your names "James Packer". All you guys doing the huge markup thing deserve to go bust, just like every other business with poor service and unrealistic pricing.
I'm not quite sure what you're saying here - it's cool that they try and rip you off and let you think that you've driven a hard bargain? Those were the prices they had in mind from the start, but, if you or anyone else is fool enough to pay more they will definitely let you. As I said further up, this practice really, really pisses me off - they should give us a fair price from the offset, if you buy in bulk shave a little bit more off perhaps, but otherwise it's a transaction - money, product, thankyou.
Old 14th May 2006
  #63
Gear Maniac
 

Do they have the same procedure in the U.S. i.e. is the advertised price the final price or do they haggle?
Old 14th May 2006
  #64
Gear Maniac
 
David Robinson's Avatar
 

sound devices, mediocre.
turramurra, good but haven't dealt with 'em in a while.
intermusic bondi, no dealings but heard bad reports.

import gear when you can. most warranties are only a year anyway.

DJR
Old 14th May 2006
  #65
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entropy's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundog
I'm sympathetic - I really am - and agree in principle with what you're saying, but the cold reality is that the bottom line is now the simple economics of the transaction. The internet has definitely levelled the playing field in terms or pricing - and product knowledge.

1) Haggling a deal - the internet now does that. Consumers don't have to haggle as hard anymore because finding the lowest price is a google away. Unrealistic prices won't work because buying from one web site is functionally not much different from buying from another in terms of ease of transaction. A web site that charges too much won't last too long. What about after sales service you say ? read on...

2) Biased view point from salesman - This is where boards like Gearslutz etc come in. The dissemination of knowledge now empowers the customer. Sure, you still can't compare two products in the flesh from an internet bulletin board, but chances are, the local shop is not going to carry both the high end products you want either. That leaves you with the shop salesman's opinion vs opinions of actual users on the internet. Who is likely to be more more knowledgabe ? The shop salesman or the internet ?

I'm not a "know it all" as James Richmond says, but I do research products carefully. Then I give Aussie suppliers the first sale chance by going in and asking about them. Last year I dropped in to a local retailer to ask about a DPA 4090 ( they were listed as DPA retailers ). After being palmed off onto the third salesman, he proceeded to say he'd never heard of them and that Rode were the best mics around. I would have just said thankyou and left, but then he persisted with a spiel of utter bull****. Despite his forgiveable lack of knowledge, it was his offhandedness and arrogance that pissed me off, so I became a 15 minute "know it all" - then left.

There is no way I can a/b a DPA 4006 TL vs a Josephson C617 in Sydney for myself. No retailer here keeps those kind of items in stock. My best bet then becomes the internet where I can read many people's personal experiences and find audio samples where I can take my time and make a better informed decision. Then find the 'cheapest' price world wide. I say 'cheapest' because the true cost of an item also includes shipping and taxes obviously, but also problems that might occur with it and the cost of getting those problems fixed. That leads me to :

3) Service. The internet is currently providing me with better sales service than the local retailers are and also lower prices ! The question for a local retailer is whether their service is so good that people don't mind paying extra for it. In my experience, that anwer is sadly, no and I am prepared to take the risk that the unit won't blow up in the warranty period. The money I save by importing several items myself more than covers the cost of repair of the 1 in 20 item that might blow up in the warranty period that I might have to ship back.

4) If as a retailer, you are going to charge higher prices, then you'd better be providing something that makes those higher prices worthwhile - like service.

A couple of years ago, I ordered two mogami cables - thinking they were common items - from a local dealer for a cable shoot out I did. The shop didn't have them in stock ( strike 1). The salesman ordered them right there and then in front of me. After 4 weeks had passed I dropped in and asked about them. The salesman rang up the the Distributor (Innovative Music) and was told that everybody was at NAMM and there was nobody to do the order. Two weeks later I got a phone call to say they had showed up. I called in and as the salesman opened the package, only one cable was inside. The salesman rang up the distributor and asked about the second. The distributor said it was on backorder ( strike 2 ). Being Christmas by now, the salesman was told everybody at the distributor was now on holiday. After another seven weeks had passed by, I called in again. The salesman said it still wasn't there and gave me a refund for the undelivered cable ( Strike 3). I ordered it on the internet from my usual US dealer and it was on my desk 4 days later for $5 more than it would have cost me through the local dealer.
richardjames summised the difficulties of running a retail store here perfectly. And for the most part I agree with what you're saying as well but let me make a few points;

Haggling.
I don't know how other retailers run but we have a pretty much standardised margin for each and every product, normal "street" customer or trade. You get a price and that's it. Chances are, we have it in stock or if not, I'll quote an ETA. The haggle comes into play when your looking for a few things or a system. But that's normally something instigated by the customer and up to a point, we'll play ball. And I expect that if their serious, they'll go away and make some calls to see if they can get a better deal, fine. No prob. Hopefully we'll be in the ballpark and the customer has enough trust in us to deliver on the transaction without any hiccups. But if it gets into an auction, we'll walk away everytime.
Haggle heh
Auction

Ok, you're only looking for one piece, fine. There's your price. That's all I can do. I know that there will be plenty of places abroad that'll do it cheaper. I can only hope that the customer thinks that yes, we are offering something extra (demo gear, the odd "special", info etc ) and that there may be some advantage in keeping a local dealer in business.

I'm definately not asking for sympathy toward dealers... ****, if you're crap, good riddance. But we having a fast changing retail enviroment out there, by the end of year, the landscape will be very different. Which is even more reason to cherish those that serve the industry well because they are a dying breed.

Biased opinins.
It's fukking hard here in Aussie. There is a politics to who you can and can't deal with and it ****s me no end. When I was in the UK, you bought the gear from suppliers that you knew was good, you didn't have to also buy the crap that would never move. So invariably you're going to get stock in that you know you'll be selling at a loss in 12-24 months down the line.

And the "if you deal with this supplier you can't deal with that supplier" game.... is just infantile.

SO yes, chances are you'll get biased opinions, particularly if you're shopping in a chain. But if you've researched on GS before, you know what you want anyhow.

And surely you want the guy (girl) to at least have an opinion???

Service.
Everyone says they have great service but few do. But if you're in the shop, go and look at their service department. Speak to a tech directly.... czech them out.

There are certain brands (again, nameless) or should I say, distributors, that are hopeless when it comes to keeping spares so on those occasions, it can be difficult keeping a customer happy.

But personally, when (if) my gear goes down, I'd be much happier being able to take it to my local dealer and dumpimg it on him than organizing it's repair/replacement abroad. Yes, it doen't happen often but it does occur.

Service is an unquantifable thing and it varies from customer to customer. How much is it worth to a studio for them to be able to get a replacement piece within a day? How much is it worth to the noob who's struggling to get his computer working? (chances are the noob went with the cheapest price and he's about to find out why!)



I've been both sides of the counter so have empathy with what you're all saying. But in my opinion it serves us all to have a good supply of reasonably cheap gear locally available. But that's just me.... I also buy my records/cds locally (and I don't mean at JB HiFi etc). It's in my interest keeping him in business because I can go down, try some things out, talk some **** and he might point me to a few new things I hadn't considered. And I like rummaging thru record shops, it's much more fun than clicking thru the net.

I wanted to bring up the point about 30% margin that someone mentioned. If we are talking nice gear, usually our buy price is only 20-30% off rrp (and quite often, less sometimes our buy is only 10%) so suggesting that it's a regualr thing to make 30% on pres is way off the mark. And don't even get me started about Apple margin

It's fast approaching Grand Prix time and I've got to settle into the tedium that is, the Spanish GP with a strong coffee so I'll leave it there for now.
Old 14th May 2006
  #66
Here for the gear
 

(haha - my favourite bad-vibe-dude in there is the trent reznor looking guy with the dyed black long hair and the painted-on sideburns).

on the other hand i guess i can admit to being a regular broswer who has never bought a damn thing from them - but last time i went in there i was seriously interested in just a mini-me for tracking 1-2 channels at a time for a small project studio i have. i ended up being pressured to buy a big ben and a rosetta instead...kind of a massive price hike.

anyway some of the guys there really are keen to help - as someone said earlier, these seem like the younger/newer guys who aren't quite as jaded yet..?
Old 15th May 2006
  #67
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by entropy
...the customer has enough trust in us to deliver on the transaction without any hiccups.
That's the problem. In my experience it hasn't happened often enough. Every Autralian retailer ( except ironically Sound Devices ) I've bought from has put me through some sort of defective transaction or frustration - whether that be a faulty product showing up or a ridiculous waiting time for the product to show up or an order never being filled at all. All bar one ! - and that includes retailers who I've bought only two items from.

Quote:
Originally Posted by entropy
...But if it gets into an auction, we'll walk away everytime.
I agree on this. Playing one retailer off another is something I would never do and something which I think is disgusting. My policy is to ask what a retailer's best price is where I know the marked price is too high ( if you call that haggling ) and no more. I don't want a retailer being pressured into selling at a loss just to get new custom. It's better to not sell an item at all rather than sell at a loss. And I don't always go for the lowest price either. Simple courtesy, lack of attitude, and helpfullness mean a lot to me.

Regarding the DPA 4090 case above, all I wanted was a price that the guy felt comfortable selling it to me for. I even told him to ring Amber Technology and had the phone number ready for him. All he had to do was pick up the phone and get the RRP and his buy price, then decide if he wanted to give me a discount or not. No pressure, no auctioning. I was happy to pay the RRP but the problem was that picking up a phone was too hard for him and he insisted on selling me a rode instead.
Old 15th May 2006
  #68
Gear Maniac
 

Most of the above examples seem to indicate that the retailer is squeezed to the bone and making very little, then who is?
Why differences of $1500 or so on large ticket items?
Is it the distributor/importers then?
Old 15th May 2006
  #69
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entropy's Avatar
Johnny Howard?
Old 15th May 2006
  #70
Gear Maniac
 

He only takes 10% GST, so where's the rest?
Old 15th May 2006
  #71
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davemc's Avatar
 

Yeah 10% plus shipping so what happened to the FTA. Nothing seems to have gone down in price?
I know its not the retailers its the distributors. So I just buy there competitors stuff.
I looked at a Yamaha Subkick. around $1k compare to around $500 to bring it in myself. I just made myself one
Looked at a Manley VariMu. $8k.. so I brought a Pendulum ES-8 for $5k. There is one on special on awave for $3900 at the moment. There is not AUD$4k difference between then in the US. So what gives there?
Then there is the time you wait for product.
MD421's none in stock a month wait I was told. So order from ebay US save $150 a mic and here in 3-4 days.
I know I waited 3 months for something from the electric factory. Every couple of weeks when I rang they said later next week. Ordered it from sweetwater here in 3 days $100 cheaper...

I really would like to know what is up with some of this stuff. Like others yeah I am happy to pay a little more to buy stuff local. If they have it.
Old 15th May 2006
  #72
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octatonic's Avatar
Lets look at one product.

Avalon 737sp.

US retail is $2295 USD and merc's deal price is $2k.

AUS retail is $3629 AUD and the deal price would be around 15% off or $3084 AUD.
Convert the figures to US dollars.
$2895 USD retail in AUS and deal price of $2400 USD.

The USD price is without tax, the Aus price is with GST so take 10% off the AUS prices.

$2605 and $2160 are the rrp and deal price.
The remainder goes in freight and import duty to Australia and wholesale margin.

There really isn't much in it.

JR
Old 15th May 2006
  #73
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by entropy
.... I also buy my records/cds locally (and I don't mean at JB HiFi etc).
Now there's an interesting story :

15 years ago, HMV had a virtual monopoly on cd sales in Parra. They had a big store with a very wide range of different types of music and specials on a few different new titles every week. They even had a dedicated, sound proofed, classical sales and listening room. I bought a lot of stuff there and it had absolutely nothing to do with the fact that the girl behind the counter was really cute.

Anyway, the bean counters must have moved in because they started to rationalise the lines that didn't sell so well. When the variety of titles decreased, so did the variety of customers and the number of customers. The shop withered and died and they moved to Westfield into a smaller shop selling just the main titles.

JB moved in not far from the original HMV megastore and by using their huge range of titles, cheaper prices, high turnover strategy are now killing everybody else. What I saw was that a wide range of items brings people in - even if the items that are slow movers. When browsers come in to a shop, if they see lots of cool stuff, even if they don't buy much, they'll remember it's there and it gives a shop 'buyer cred'. People come back because they know they're likely to be able to get what they want in the future.

I know CD's are a very different market to gear, but I would like to see retailers and manufacturers enter into agreements whereby the longer an item of stock sits on the shelf unsold, the retailer gets a small obsolescence rebate each quarter from the manufacturer. This would allow the retailer to bring the price down over time as the cost of the item is reduced over time. Assuming wholesalers and retailers are honest and pass on the rebates to the buyer, it would encourage the "tyre kickers" to buy at the point where they can afford it. If the price watchers know that an item will come down in price over time ( as CD's do ), as the price comes down the demand will increase as the price watchers circle like vultures until the price is right for them.

Hopefully this would encourage retailers to stock a few more items and be able to sell them at higher prices earlier rather than holding onto things that will never sell at full price, then have to write off huge amounts of stock value at clearance sales.

The only problem with this great idea is that it would be a nightmare to administer.... I dunno.... it's all too hard sometimes.

The other way I see small retailers surviving is by specialising. There are a couple of very small CD shops that survived in Parra for a long time. One sells just country music. The other did specialise in Metal and finding obselete CD's for you. He sold the store to a second hand dealer who didn't specialise and got squashed by JB eventually.
Old 15th May 2006
  #74
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by richmondjames
Lets look at one product.

Avalon 737sp.


JR

I'm certainly not trying to stir up trouble, but could we look at another product eg
Focusrite Red 3
US retail in US dollars $3895
Aus retail in Aus dollars $10 499

The Avalon stuff actually seems not to bad price wise here - you can get them for about $3k AUS.
Old 15th May 2006
  #75
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entropy's Avatar
yep, no argument there. Focusrite is well overpriced. I used to do ok with Reds in the UK, there's no point even trying here. I can only guess the disributor has no interest in selling them so the are overpriced to justify holding no stock.

Avalon, as richardjames points out, ain't too far away from the US once you take shipping, duty and GST into account
Old 15th May 2006
  #76
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entropy's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossco
He only takes 10% GST, so where's the rest?
He also takes customs and excise duty, product depending can vary anywhere from between 5-15%
Old 16th May 2006
  #77
Gear Addict
 
matt82aust's Avatar
 

i have always found sound devices a pleasure to deal with. in between setting up my small home studio to building an expensive recording studio, they have always been there to help out, and offer tech support when a session goes dead in water. (and even come out and help install and trouble shoot a studio set up once!)

Matt there is a dude as previously mentioned by other users as well!

I guess their main problem is they are busier than they can handle at times,

I like turramusic as well, i find them very similar (in more ways than their website!) but have a better history with sound devices!
Old 16th May 2006
  #78
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heathen's Avatar
 

Avalon works out very close to the US price, got a great deal on ad 2055. Focusrite farout whats the story.
Old 16th May 2006
  #79
Gear Maniac
 

According to the Focusrite website, the Australian distributor is listed as Electric Factory in Melbourne. Perhaps somebody from their company can help us all out with an answer?
Old 16th May 2006
  #80
My only two transactions since arriving:
Mbox and G4 Powerbook from Sound Devices
Drum instructional DVD from Billy Hyde.

I shopped around Mac places for a better deal on the G4, but they all quoted above or the same as Devices. In the end Sound Devices delivered the set-up ahead of schedule and it all worked when I got it home. Perhaps it was a lucky first time experience.
The DVD however.
I ordered it on the spur of the moment. The sales person said they'd most likely have it within a week, so I paid the full amount up front. Over 8 weeks and several exasperrated phone calls later, I finally got it off them. No apology, they even tried to over charge me for it. All along I knew if I'd just ordered it from Amazon I'd have had it in less than a week.
So I can see how some of you have just about had it with Aussie retailers.
On the other hand I can sympathise with Entropy.
Old 16th May 2006
  #81
Gear Nut
 
AmbientSound's Avatar
 

I want to put a shameless plug in for Brisound. They have always given me a reasonable price. It sometimes may not be as cheap as importing it, but I know the guys are willing to help out if something goes wrong, and do everything in there power to get me back up and running again.

And its not the retailers to blame for the prices most of the time, its the distributors that set the RRP and then give the retailers bugger all off the price.


Jason
Old 16th May 2006
  #82
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octatonic's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by KimSira
I'm certainly not trying to stir up trouble, but could we look at another product eg
Focusrite Red 3
US retail in US dollars $3895
Aus retail in Aus dollars $10 499

The Avalon stuff actually seems not to bad price wise here - you can get them for about $3k AUS.
Yeah- that is Electric Factory being crap.
I won't slate them- I know them and they have been extremely good to me when I was in Australia- but jaysus that is a huge markup.
Maybe they bought a ****load ages ago when they cost more and are still trying to sell them- who knows?
I certainly wouldn't be getting a Focusrite product in Australia.
To be honest, I thought about grey marketing them into Australia for a while but decided it would be too much effort for too little return.

Also, whilst Focusrite has it's place in the market but nothing of theirs I own is my 'go to' device.
Who is importing Great River into Aus?
or Groove Tubes?

JR
Old 16th May 2006
  #83
Quote:
Originally Posted by richmondjames
I thought about grey marketing them into Australia for a while but decided it would be too much effort for too little return.
Hmmm, I wonder if that's why the dealers charge more?
Old 16th May 2006
  #84
Gear Maniac
 
cheeky b's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso
Hmmm, I wonder if that's why the dealers charge more?
The other way round, surely?
Old 16th May 2006
  #85
I don't understand what you mean.
It's one thing importing cheaper priced US gear for personal use, another selling it on 'as new', with all the extra hassle of paperwork, emails, faxes, phone calls, providing technical support and problem solving.
richmondjames looked at undercutting dealer prices and decided it was too much effort with not enough financial return. If you want to make it worthwhile you've got to charge more surely.....hence the Aussie dealer prices.
Old 17th May 2006
  #86
Gear Maniac
 
cheeky b's Avatar
 

It's pretty simple - grey markets only thrive if a commodity is overpriced or the grey marketer can get the commodity for way cheaper than the official retailer. There's no suggestion by anyone that Australian dealers are charged substantially more for wholesale than anywhere else in the world. Taxes, freight and distribution are the reasons given for the price hike.

The grey market still has to pay tax and freight and possibly pay more per unit - bringing stuff in with your luggage is just not a viable option. So for anyone to even contemplate grey marketing audio equipment they just have to take less profit. There are items that you can buy retail in the states, pay freight, GST and customs and still sell cheaper than some of our stores if you wanted to - that's why people get pissed off.

Kill the middle man and problem solved.

Edit: forgot to say that the average grey marketer won't be indulging in aftercare service!
Old 17th May 2006
  #87
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I don't think the majority of suppliers are very good businesspeople when it comes to puchasing high end gear. I still think most of the high prices we are suffering today are a direct result of the aussie dollar crashing a few years back, I mean if it is then thats utter stupidity impoorting gear with such a low local dollar.
Now is the time these companies should start aquiring gear, stocking up and spending thier fat profits while the dollar is low, so they can pass on good deals and let it be known that while the dollar is good the gear will be cheaper, but no they will be rubbing thier slimy little hands with glee going "oh we are going to make such a huge profit" on US gear and not say a thing. I mean they can play this to thier advantage so they are either too stupid or are just plain scamming.
Turramurra music has a Manley Massive Passive for sale RRP $9900, discount price $8500 , Manley recommend $4800 USD "street price" and I bet a little cheaper if you bought say 5 or 10 of em. OK thats roughly $6000 Aussie dollars "strret price" actually less now the dollar is creeping back up to around 80cUS, so they want $2500 just for importing the thing. For that much you could fly to the US and buy one and still save $$$.
Since Entopy is the only dealer here defending himself and laying his cards straight on the table, he sounds like a reputable dealer with customers interests in his mind, also defending his own interests as a businessman, which is of course the idea behind setting up shop, you do need to make a profit.
How about equipment brokering, I've always known what I wanted before purchase so what if Aussie dealers started importing gear after making a deal with a customer IE: Customer pays up front a pre negotiated price and then waits a short time for the gear to arrive via air, then they still have the knowledge that they bought from an Aussie and if anything goes wrong then they have bought from a reputable dealer and will have no worries with warranty. Dealers could charge a flat %10 fee as the deal, then theres no stock sitting around gathering dust and the buyer has nothing to whinge about. This would be best for US manufactured gear. This is improbable as if any other dealers found out they would start crying foul. Just goes to show the price fixing which goes on.
Old 17th May 2006
  #88
Gear Maniac
 
cheeky b's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by heathen
How about equipment brokering, I've always known what I wanted before purchase so what if Aussie dealers started importing gear after making a deal with a customer IE: Customer pays up front a pre negotiated price and then waits a short time for the gear to arrive via air, then they still have the knowledge that they bought from an Aussie and if anything goes wrong then they have bought from a reputable dealer and will have no worries with warranty. Dealers could charge a flat %10 fee as the deal, then theres no stock sitting around gathering dust and the buyer has nothing to whinge about. This would be best for US manufactured gear.
Sounds good to me.
I had an idea that several high end US manufacturers could get together and set up their own distribution centre - doesn't have to be large , a one man operation in a large garage size space. Cost split between the manufacturers and onselling - they'd sell more gear and there'd be stock available or ordered in within days.
Old 17th May 2006
  #89
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Kingtone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossco
According to the Focusrite website, the Australian distributor is listed as Electric Factory in Melbourne. Perhaps somebody from their company can help us all out with an answer?
i know someone at elfa... i will pass on the link and see if he can respond
Old 17th May 2006
  #90
Here for the gear
 

Guys guys guys...

Just be mindful (and yes I work in the Australian products industry) that it's a tough gig working in a retail store. There is a lot of hard yards to go through to make only a meager living. Many customers want to play the "I know more than you" or "I'm a better muso than you" game that it's no wonder store guys to become cynical and frustrated. Generally, the nicer the customer the better the deal and service. If you go into a store and act like an arse, you'll get treated back the same way.

Store guys are also not perfect and there are some real nasty pricks in the caper...

The wholesalers and retailers of the Australian music products business are honestly not trying to rip anyone off. Yep, you can buy a number of brands cheaper overseas. But this is because manufacturers are so often going direct to the stores in the USA.

Australia does not have the population to make going direct, in most cases, a worthwhile venture.

Here are some perspectives of which just to be mindful. And I'm not looking for an argument, just keep this in mind.

1) If everybody buys off shore there will be no retail stores in the future. And that means young kids don't get to go check out stuff, get inspired or even have a local store where they can get lessons. You're all smart enought to extrapolate where that might go. eg: it's an hour to the gig and the guitar player needs a new lead, strap or some single .009 strings.

What's going to happen; Order them on line and wait a week?

EM-U and Ensoniq decided that Australia was not worth dealing with and now can only be bother dealing in Europe and the USA. If all vendors took this attitude, we'd all be very disspointed I'm sure.

2) All the store guys, dudes in the hire shops, people in wholesale, those that write magazine articles, that own the magazines (Like Audio Technology which is an independant Australian run magazine), the technicians in the stores and distributors, the guys and gals that do the accounts, the phone sales guys, the sales reps etc...etc...

These people make up a huge perecentage of giging and working muscians.

PARTICULARLY IN THE ORGINAL MUSIC SCENE

So every time you screw for a deal or send your money off shore, you take money out of the industry as a whole.

And it's not that you're not entitled to hustle for a deal and good service; just remember that the more you screw for a deal, the less enthusiastic a store guy will be when you call for service.

Because margins have shrunk so much and eveyone wants a "great price" store guys have to always be on the hunt for the next opportunity. This means that there is less time to offer support.

It's more about the financial viability of the business than being pricks for the sake of it.

And think about this: when you have finished your record or have your band ready to go on the raod; you're going to want Australian people to buy the CD, pay for the download and pay at the door to see your gig. Is it inequitable then that the local supply industry is disregarded?

IT'S ALL WELL AND FUN TO HAVE A GOOD BITCH ABOUT THE CAPER ON CHAT, BUT PLEASE TAKE A SECOND TO SEE IT ALL FROM THE OTHER SIDE.
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