The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 All  This Thread  Reviews  Gear Database  Gear for sale     Latest  Trending
New MixPre10 II substantially cheaper than MixPre10T?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #1
Here for the gear
 

New MixPre10 II substantially cheaper than MixPre10T?

I spent $1800 on my MixPre 10T, another $100 for the power supply, and another $100 for the musicians plugin, a total of 2 grand.

Now suddenly the MixPre10 II (with superior features) is released with power supply included for $1399 (at B&H) and an option to get the musicians plugin for $50.

Surely a lot of R&D went into the updated model, and one would assume that the superior hardware is more expensive to manufacture, yet it's substantially cheaper all around.

Seems like Sound Devices made a pretty penny off of all the early adopters, who essentially beta tested the MixPre series for them, as there have been quite a few bugs along the way (several still unresolved, like in the musicians plugin when you record something with reverb and then go back to record over it -- as one would in a vocal session where the vocalist makes a mistake and needs to start over -- you hear the reverb of the prerecorded material as you're re-recording...and if it's only a single track in the project there is no option to clear the audio, meaning you have to start a whole new project..super annoying workflow.)

Yesterday I probably could've sold my mint condition MixPre10T for at least $1600, now I can't imagine it's worth over a grand.

Any other MixPre10 users feeling a little jaded about this?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #2
Lives for gear
 

i can feel your pain but at the same time, i guess/hope/assume you'll not want to stop any manufacturer from further developing their gear either?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #3
Here for the gear
 

Of course not, and Sound Devices is really incredible at continuing to develop new innovations both in hardware and firmware. I'll also say that even though some of the bugs have been frustrating, support has been some of the best I've ever experienced with any company (audio gear or otherwise.) I do hope they'll release a firmware update soon and address the remaining issues, though, as some of them have been reported even before the last firmware update. I guess it's just the drastically different price point (and relatively soon after the launch of the original MixPre series) that leaves me scratching my head a little bit. Then again, total speculation here, but I suppose maybe they took a chance releasing the original version and perhaps after its success they're bottom line is up and they're passing some of the profits back to the consumer by offering their newer products at a better price point, which is great. I just wish my investment in their product had held its value a little longer, especially since otherwise I'd probably be interested in upgrading to the new one, but at this point My 10T is now worth probably half of what I paid for it and it's only a year old. Think about the folks who maybe just bought the whole 10T/M plugin/power supply package in the last month or two!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #4
Here for the gear
 

yikes sorry about that, the server was freezing up earlier so I kept trying to post and then came back and apparently every attempt posted eventually
Old 2 weeks ago
  #5
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by flatpicksam View Post
yikes sorry about that, the server was freezing up earlier so I kept trying to post and then came back and apparently every attempt posted eventually
It happens sometimes to many of us, just hit the edit>delete-post process.

Would you happen to know if a pair of 10T or 10M's can be chained together during recording with reliable sync-lock to give up to 16 mic inputs ? I'm guessing the T version would be necessary for this, as it outputs timecode ? That would be a cheaper option than buying a Scorpio....
Old 2 weeks ago
  #6
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by flatpicksam View Post

Seems like Sound Devices made a pretty penny off of all the early adopters, who essentially beta tested the MixPre series for them...
Probably they made the margin then needed to bring the initial design to the market and be as price competitive as they could. It's a quality product, the bugs are inevitable but they will be resolved.

Quote:
Originally Posted by flatpicksam View Post
Yesterday I probably could've sold my mint condition MixPre10T for at least $1600, now I can't imagine it's worth over a grand.
It's dollar value is far exceeded by it's practical value. Use it to create music.

If you think any form of technology today is going to hold it's value you're going to be disappointed. I have a PT HD system here that I paid a fortune for years ago. PCI cards, right before they went to PCIE. Lost it's dollar value overnight. Still does what it did the day I bought it. Got my money out of it by using it and not worrying about it's resale value.

If you really want to know what kind of company they are why don't you go see them. They're in the state right above you. Ask them for a tour of their products, the different lines for different price points, different markets. Ask them what it's like to try and compete in the global market and maintain the quality they're know for.

https://www.sounddevices.com/contact/
Old 2 weeks ago
  #7
Here for the gear
 
linkevich's Avatar
The price, new specs and features, box kit – all this is a SPIT ON THE FACE of the owners Mixpre 1st series. Especially those who bought the first generation recently.
I’ll never buy again any gears from sounddevices!!!
It's not fair!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #8
Gear Head
I fully understand your feeling.

One can guess that SD are feeling the immense pressure from lower priced units and are trying their best to keep up their heritage, cling onto reducing market share and at the same time push cost and price point down to ensure not loosing customers to competitors.

If it was not for Zooms F-series, I do not believe we would have seen the MixPre-3/6/10 series at all.
And SD was very lucky with the mk2 release as Zoom apparently ran into quality issues and delayed the release of the F6.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #9
Gear Addict
 

Why do you think it is unfair?

Is the product defective?

When you bought it, you thought you would be better off trading your dollars for the gear, just as it was. You could not find a better alternative to spend your money on. You exchanged your dollars for something you would rather have than the dollars. It was a fair exchange, and neither you nor Sound Devices made any further contract with each other regarding how they might improve the product. Or when. Or at what price. You were entirely free to withhold your dollars and wait for a product improvement and a price reduction.

Or, how about another perspective... How long do you think a company is obligated to keep a product or price constant after you purchase it? Do they have any such obligation. And, how are you harmed by someone else buying a different product at a different price from the product and price that you chose?

I have also experienced this. (Not with this product, but another time.) But, then I have to remind myself that I was the one who made the purchase decision for the specific product, at the specific time, and at the specific price. I could have refrained.

That's how I see it.

Of course, you may feel differently, but I believe the statements above are factually correct.

Respectfully,

DG
Old 2 weeks ago
  #10
Here for the gear
 
linkevich's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by dgpretzel View Post
Why do you think it is unfair?

Is the product defective?
I can’t to understand pricing reasons.
And just because i make classical music recording, 32 bit float is very important for me.
These are all reasons for my dissatisfaction.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #11
Lives for gear
 
Don S's Avatar
 

As many here, I am surprised that the cost is less than the original 10t. I expected this next series to be the same price if not slightly higher. But I see that they are aggressively going after the zoom f8 market. Now that they are almost the same price, there's no reason to buy an F8!
It's too bad that they didn't keep the price the same and add a digital input and improve the battery sled design.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #12
Lives for gear
 
Don S's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by flatpicksam View Post
I spent $1800 on my MixPre 10T, another $100 for the power supply, and another $100 for the musicians plugin, a total of 2 grand.

Now suddenly the MixPre10 II (with superior features) is released with power supply included for $1399 (at B&H) and an option to get the musicians plugin for $50.
I spent 1800 on the 702, which is now $500 on fleabay. The 788 which is still 6800 goes for 2900. Hopefully, you made great recordings, saved your back and made enough money to grow your business. You still have one of the best location recorders on the market right now. I don't know anyone who regrets investing in an SD product.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #13
Gear Maniac
 

I bought a Mixpre series recorder when they first appeared, adding the Musician plug-in as soon as that became available, and then adopted the useful firmware updates as released (which have increased functionality as well as providing bug fixes). I have no regrets and I do not resent the new models or their pricing (even in the UK, where prices seem rather steeper). No personal need to upgrade urgently: and, in the meantime, my Mixpre-3 seems as good as it did a week ago!

Cheers,

Roland
Old 2 weeks ago
  #14
Lives for gear
 
cheu78's Avatar
SD (and a lot of other companies) should be careful with these moves..
The customer feel like cheated by them..

It's not only a price perspective (it's a feeling that the customer have when these things happen).

Althought the "old" (which is indeed not old enough) drops its value due to new functions/price of the mk2 unit.

I'm avalaible to offer SD my insight on this and how to come out with style from this. Just send me a pm, if you want.
This IS customer service 101.




Cheu
Old 2 weeks ago
  #15
In terms of 'making music' rather than gear speculation: always invest in gear for it's ability to make music rather than as a financial investment.

I paid top dollar for a new 702 recorder around 12 years ago; despite the newer, cheaper variants, the 702 is still as good value as it was when new. The 702 has been an integral component of my 'audio success' - my 10,000 hours - so regardless of the subsequent price of similar products it has held it's value.

Speculating: perhaps this Mix Pre II has a larger production run, with a different design/components with a better scale of economy. The software is matured and perhaps development costs have been re-couped. In todays fast-paced world; novelty is at a premium.

Still, I feel your pain OP...maybe enjoy using such great gear as Sound Devices and profit elsewhere
Old 2 weeks ago
  #16
Here for the gear
 
linkevich's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by norfolksoundman9 View Post
...(even in the UK, where prices seem rather steeper
Just imagine... For users from Russia, price of $1800 is as least in 6 times higher than for residents of the UK!!!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #17
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 View Post

Would you happen to know if a pair of 10T or 10M's can be chained together during recording with reliable sync-lock to give up to 16 mic inputs ? I'm guessing the T version would be necessary for this, as it outputs timecode ? That would be a cheaper option than buying a Scorpio....
There is a video somewhere on youtube of Paul Isaacs linking two MixPre10Ts via timecode to have 20 tracks of simultaneous recording (dont forget the stereo in which can be used with external mic pres), triggered by the controls on one of the machines. I did inquire with Sound Devices about whether this will work between a MixPre10T and a MixPre10 II, they replied "Yes, you can use timecode and rec run to `link` together. What this means is you can have them run on the same timecode and use Rec Run to trigger the recording function of the slave MixPre-10 "

I believe he may even have set up simultaneous playback as well by routing the outputs of one unit to the stereo in, which I suppose actually makes for 18 usable inputs at once.

Good points above and I'll say again that Sound Devices has been nothing but excellent in their service (I've been on the phone with them numerous times). All and all I'm very satisfied with the product I bought and have made many excellent recordings with it. I still think Sound Devices is a great company.

Nobody expects technology to hold its value for very long these days and I'm certainly not in the business of speculating on gear, I'm in the business of making music, but you must admit that this particular situation is somewhat unique. Mainly, I guess I'm just frustrated because I would actually like to upgrade to the new one, but the hit I'm going to take now on the current machine makes it difficult to justify. Don't care much about 32bit personally but the adjustable limiters would be a really fantastic tool.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #18
Yes. I'm guessing this is a bigger issue in the professional field (where relative value is important).
Old 2 weeks ago
  #19
I bought one of the first MixPre-6's off the line, and it has served me well, I was meaning to buy a 10t, so this is welcome news for me. I can understand feeling cheated if you just bought a 10t and suddenly find an upgrade for $300 less. Sound Devices probably had a list of ideas they wanted to implement that a firmware upgrade would not allow in the first generation, so the second was necessary. The 10 is now more in line with the pricing structure of the 3 and 6 and they probably have improved their manufacturing efficiency with the demand of these units.

This is progress folks, not a slap in the face.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #20
Gear Addict
 
lukedamrosch's Avatar
 

To offer a slight counterpoint:

The previous (10T / 10M) recorders are by now established for good performance and reliability, a few well-documented quirks notwithstanding. From what I have read, the new MixPre II series offers no sonic improvements (e.g. to the preamps) other than the new ADC system.

While this may be a tantalizing feature, I would be wary to commit to a product with this sort of topology without knowing how it will perform in the long run over months/years of regular use in critical recording situations. There are some excellent posts by David Satz on another forum explaining some of the design challenges inherent in these 32-bit systems -- as usual, there is no free lunch, and though recording without concern for gain may be a life-saver in some situations, these systems also require very careful design, extraordinarily tight tolerances in component-matching, etc. such that if something does go wrong or deteriorate over time, the sonic effects could outweigh the advantages of the 32-bit format.

Rather than earlier MixPre users being the beta-testers for this new series, I would argue that a well-designed preamp feeding a single high performance ADC chip is a pretty mature technology, whereas whatever potential pitfalls may exist with these new designs will be discovered the hard way by early adopters of the F6 or MixPre II.

Again, speaking somewhat hypothetically here as someone with zero expertise in high-end audio equipment design, but just thought the point is worthy of consideration.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #21
I must admit I do feel a little ripped off, but what I have is still very good. Seeing as I won't be buying any new recorders anyway I suppose it doesn't really matter ...
Old 2 weeks ago
  #22
Lives for gear
 

What a great time to buy one of the Mk1 versions. Its not that difficult to fit the mic output correctly into the 100 dB of available dynamic range by adjusting the preamp gain.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #23
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkevich View Post
Just imagine... For users from Russia, price of $1800 is as least in 6 times higher than for residents of the UK!!!
Sounds like you need an Irish border backstop....!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #24
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by flatpicksam View Post
There is a video somewhere on youtube of Paul Isaacs linking two MixPre10Ts via timecode to have 20 tracks of simultaneous recording (dont forget the stereo in which can be used with external mic pres), triggered by the controls on one of the machines. I did inquire with Sound Devices about whether this will work between a MixPre10T and a MixPre10 II, they replied "Yes, you can use timecode and rec run to `link` together. What this means is you can have them run on the same timecode and use Rec Run to trigger the recording function of the slave MixPre-10 "

I believe he may even have set up simultaneous playback as well by routing the outputs of one unit to the stereo in, which I suppose actually makes for 18 usable inputs at once.

Good points above and I'll say again that Sound Devices has been nothing but excellent in their service (I've been on the phone with them numerous times). All and all I'm very satisfied with the product I bought and have made many excellent recordings with it. I still think Sound Devices is a great company.
Thank you flatpicksam, that's good to know, as a pair of 10's would provide me with enough inputs at much lower cost than 'going Scorpio'...
Old 2 weeks ago
  #25
Here for the gear
 
linkevich's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 View Post
Sounds like you need an Irish border backstop....!
Sorry, but sounds like a racist mockery of millions of people
Old 2 weeks ago
  #26
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by linkevich View Post
Sorry, but sounds like a racist mockery of millions of people
Hint: Google "Brexit" ...
Old 2 weeks ago
  #27
Here for the gear
 
linkevich's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by panatrope View Post
Hint: Google "Brexit" ...
Ok, I forgot about the local nuances.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #28
Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 View Post
Sounds like you need an Irish border backstop....!
Many here in the UK would like a European Union backstop! I expect mic and electronics manufacturers in Europe are going to see sales plummet from the UK. Also car manufacturers and others as well. If the EU want to give the UK a hard time leaving then they will dig their own grave.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #29
Gear Head
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkevich View Post
Just imagine... For users from Russia, price of $1800 is as least in 6 times higher than for residents of the UK!!!
Why?
MixPre-3 646,22 €
647+(647 - 500)x0.3+10+20 = 721.1 € only.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #30
There is an easy solution to this. Let's all email Sound Devices and tell them to put the prices back up. That will fix the problem, right? How dare Sound Devices cheat us by offering an updated location recorder with more features at an even more competitive price!

Charge us more Dangnabbit!

Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump