The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
Mic set up suggestions for recording in a small club Virtual Instrument Plugins
Old 4 days ago
  #1
Here for the gear
 

Mic set up suggestions for recording in a small club

Hi all, so hopefully someone can point me in the right direction here, Im going to need to record a jazz band playing in a small venue, I'll also be renting for dialogue and interior interviews and the budget is limited, so hopefully I can get good results for both with one set.

I was thinking along the lines of a pair of Schoeps with hyper capsules as I've had good results with them for more standard interior stuff in the past, but would anybody suggest something different, perhaps shotguns would be preferable.
also whats considered good practice for positioning, I don't need to place any focus on the crowd.

Thanks in advance
Old 4 days ago
  #2
Gear Addict
 

With a spaced pair I’ve always had a problem with the bass and piano being nowhere in the mix
Old 4 days ago
  #3
Gear Addict
 

For the "dialogue and interior interviews," how many people do you expect to record at a time? Are you wanting one mic per person? Are we talking booms, camera mount, fixed mic stands?

I feel like the interview/dialogue requirements may pull in very different directions than what's ideal for ensemble music recording, depending on all the specifics.

Shotguns for music, esp indoors, seems risky. Haven't tried it myself, but from what I hear, I think there's a high risk of phasey, comb filtering effects in that scenario.

My first thought was MS. Mid mic could be used as tighter mono source for recording individual speakers, while MS combo would work well for music.

Cardioid mid matrixes to super cardioid XY
Super or hyper will matrix to hyper XY or beyond

But, if you need to record more than one speaker, this may not be the right rig for that.
Old 4 days ago
  #4
Lives for gear
 

shotguns will give you just a bit more damping off axis than hypercardioids so i doubt you'll gain a lot - more importantly though, how does the venue and the setup look like and what gear do you have available?
Old 4 days ago
  #5
Lives for gear
 
tourtelot's Avatar
"Shotguns" are notorious for comb-filtering indoors. That's why movie dialog recordists have always put them aside for hypers or cardioids. The one exception to that rule, for me at least, was the Sanken CS3e which performed pretty well on interiors as long as there was a bit of space around them.

D.
Old 4 days ago
  #6
Gear Addict
Is the band playing acoustically, or through a PA system?
If the latter, there's a bunch of mics there you might be able to tap into.

Chris
Old 3 days ago
  #7
Lives for gear
 
jimjazzdad's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by chris661 View Post
Is the band playing acoustically, or through a PA system?
If the latter, there's a bunch of mics there you might be able to tap into.

Chris
I was wondering when that question was going to be asked. If the 'venue' is a 'club' with food / beverage service, etc. you can pretty much forget about a main mic pair and just go with splits off the PA. If it is a concert and the venue is 'small' (as you say), why have a PA at all? If no PA, then some combination of mains and spots will work, depending on the venue's acoustics. When asking for opinions here, "a jazz band playing in a small venue" is not enough information.
Old 3 days ago
  #8
Lives for gear
 
tourtelot's Avatar
Jazz in a club is a hard job. I've "dabbled". I have not been very successful. I tried adapting my usual acoustic methods and failed pretty miserably. Had to give back the fee :(

Next time, I think I will treat that sort of job as a multi-track "pop" scenario. Take some splits from the PA; vocals, electric keys, etc. Put some mics on the kit, put some mics in the piano, horns, saxes, guitar amps, bass DI and mic. Audience mics. Just like I would a rock show. It will certainly take the "soul" out of the recording but I won't be left with too much timbales and not enough trumpet.

Hard to believe that the timbales overwhelmed the horns, but they did.

D.
Old 3 days ago
  #9
Quote:
Originally Posted by tourtelot View Post
"Shotguns" are notorious for comb-filtering indoors. That's why movie dialog recordists have always put them aside for hypers or cardioids. The one exception to that rule, for me at least, was the Sanken CS3e which performed pretty well on interiors as long as there was a bit of space around them.

D.
But outdoors then shotguns get used in the film world more than anything else.
Old 2 days ago
  #10
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ebeowulf17 View Post
For the "dialogue and interior interviews," how many people do you expect to record at a time? Are you wanting one mic per person? Are we talking booms, camera mount, fixed mic stands?

I feel like the interview/dialogue requirements may pull in very different directions than what's ideal for ensemble music recording, depending on all the specifics.

Shotguns for music, esp indoors, seems risky. Haven't tried it myself, but from what I hear, I think there's a high risk of phasey, comb filtering effects in that scenario.

My first thought was MS. Mid mic could be used as tighter mono source for recording individual speakers, while MS combo would work well for music.

Cardioid mid matrixes to super cardioid XY
Super or hyper will matrix to hyper XY or beyond

But, if you need to record more than one speaker, this may not be the right rig for that.
Thanks, yeah I was expecting to be warned off shotguns, I may be able to get some more mics and place them on stage, I don't trust the quality of their pics or mixer, I could perhaps get a selection of different cheapish mics to place onstage. Anything in particular anyone would suggest for each instrument that I may be able to get hold of without too much trouble?
Old 2 days ago
  #11
Gear Addict
 

What instruments?
Budget?
Planning to rent or buy these extra mics?
Will you be multi tracking or need to mix on the fly?

I've had great luck doing live jazz in not so great environments using the following basic formula:
Use the best pair of condensers you can muster as stereo drum overheads - smooth off axis response is critical here, because the unavoidable bleed is going to give a sense of space, depth, and dimension that's missing from the remaining mics. I was using KM140s I think, or maybe KM84s. SM81 or KSM137/141 might be good budget alternatives. Everything else, except maybe piano, gets close mic'd with tight dynamics (57, 421, RE20, etc, depending on availability.) The individual channels don't sound quite as good as you'd like, cause they're all a little tight and boxy from close micing but when you bring up the roomy overheads, it sets a nice, open soundstage for everything else.

Don't get me wrong - this "system" won't sound as good as studio tracks or even a live acoustic gig in a really nice venue without PA, but I did tons of gigs like this in school and it worked well for me, better than anything else I tried.
Old 1 day ago
  #12
I've done many live shows in tiny clubs. Usually it's a simple setup. I use a pair of transformerless AKG 414TL's for overheads on drums, an RE-20 for kick. Percussion setups get a pair of AKG 460's.

Guitar amps get another 414. Keyboards are taken direct via Jensen DI boxes. Other stuff is close miced like horns. I use an Alesis HD24XR. The console is a small Soundcraft Delta 16x4x2. That will monitor all 24 tracks. I add an 8 channel mic pre to fill it out. Stands, cables and a couple of bar stools and I'm GTG.

Mixes are panned to follow the layout into another 24 track Delta console. Add a tiny amount of compression, EQ, Bricasti and Lexicon reverb and it's a record.
Old 1 day ago
  #13
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackjam View Post
Hi all, so hopefully someone can point me in the right direction here, Im going to need to record a jazz band playing in a small venue, I'll also be renting for dialogue and interior interviews and the budget is limited, so hopefully I can get good results for both with one set.
If someone hired me for that job, I'd want to know these things:

Instrumentation.

Stage plot.

Does anyone talk or sing onstage?

Interviews -- how many people at once and where?

Interviews -- mics on stands/boom or single handheld (a la Dick Clark)?

Interviews -- interviewer on or off camera? If off-camera, interviewer to be included or edited out?

I'd also want photos of the recording areas, and mic lists from the local rental outfits.
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
GuySonic / Remote Possibilities in Acoustic Music and Location Recording
3
MrVelvet / Remote Possibilities in Acoustic Music and Location Recording
7

Forum Jump
Forum Jump