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Best Solution for immediate delivery of files?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #1
Gear Maniac
 

Best Solution for immediate delivery of files?

What is the best and easiest email delivery of a 1/2 hour performance of an mo3 on site? Is it an iPad with cellular or can I use my cell as a hotspot? Currently I go into a recorder (Nagra VI$. Normally I would get the file from the Nagra and convert to mp3 and email it, but WiFi is not available. I don’t want and can’t deal with limits on hotspot data where they slow it down. I will be recording 50 groups over 3 days and client wants their file in their email when they get off stage. I was thinking of going line out into a duet (or something) and record on an iPad with cellular using Apogee’s Maestro software....but are there any other easy (and free) options to do this??Thanks.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #2
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tourtelot's Avatar
Wow! What's the hurry? Sounds like a made-up emergency (the worst kind).

D.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #3
Are you recording more than two mics? If not, then I'd rent/borrow something to generate the mp3s on site. If you are, then you either tell them "sorry", or you figure out a way to generate a stereo mix right then right there.
And I'd charge more for the processing. Maybe hire an assistant to do the copying and emailing.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #4
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Is the 'client' one of the 50 groups or just someone with a dangerous sense of self-importance ? " In my inbox when I walk offstage" indeed Sounds more like a pathological fear of any editing taking place if you ask me....don't feed this ego, it's dangerous Or simply narcissistic control fiends of the worst kind. Just because something can be done...doesn't mean it should, or will, be done.

Go the other way and live stream it on Facebook, that way they can even watch themselves before they walk offstage ! Reminds me of the chorus of that old Steely Dan song "Showbizness Kids making movies of themselves, you know they don't give a fu** about anybody else" .....

I'm suggesting some alpha-male has grabbed you by the short and curlies on this score, caught you unawares and in a panic you've agreed.....?

I hope you're getting payment in advance for this gig...'cos you're handing over your labour=product=intellectual property as they come offstage, so you have no "goods" to withhold if (at the end, at payment time) they renege and decide that they don't feel like paying you after all ?

Finally....if you're busting a blood vessel in perpetual file deliveries at the end of each set, how on earth are you preparing adequately for the next act/set of players who will take the stage ? Let me guess : "not my problem" they reply to you....!

When do you get to eat, go to the bathroom ? This sort of file transfer should be left to the end of each day's proceedings (it's a music festival, or brass band competitions, or similar, yes ?) when you can do them as a batch process and upload them to a single repository (eg Soundcloud account)....rather than diverting and distracting you from necessary preparations between acts during the days.

Best Solution For Immediate Delivery of Files ? Don't. Just say No

Last edited by studer58; 2 weeks ago at 01:17 PM..
Old 2 weeks ago
  #5
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tourtelot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMetzinger View Post
Maybe hire an assistant to do the copying and emailing.
That's it! Perfect. Tell them they can have files lickity-split if they hire an assistant every day. $450/day.

Problem solved.

D.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #6
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JCBigler's Avatar
MP3 files don't take up much space. And aren't there some 2 and four track recorders that record straight to mp3 format? Like the Zooms, Tascams and Sony recorders?

What about recording on one of those to an SD card, and then just giving the SD card to the client when they walk off stage?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #7
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bgood's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by HelenaBzg View Post
What is the best and easiest email delivery of a 1/2 hour performance of an mo3 on site? Is it an iPad with cellular or can I use my cell as a hotspot? Currently I go into a recorder (Nagra VI$. Normally I would get the file from the Nagra and convert to mp3 and email it, but WiFi is not available. I don’t want and can’t deal with limits on hotspot data where they slow it down. I will be recording 50 groups over 3 days and client wants their file in their email when they get off stage. I was thinking of going line out into a duet (or something) and record on an iPad with cellular using Apogee’s Maestro software....but are there any other easy (and free) options to do this??Thanks.
Do you have to do this for each of the fifty groups?

If there isn’t WiFi how can the client even check his email the minute he walks off stage?

This is weird

Can you just have the client bring a computer with him if he’s such a weirdo and just send him the file right from the nagra?

Or, bring a computer with you and a bunch of cheap little usb thumb drives so you can transfer the nagra dumps right there? Assuming you have enough time to do it between setups... that actually would be classy service
Old 2 weeks ago
  #8
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Yannick's Avatar
 

Easy.

a. A ZoomF8 can record mp3 stereo downmix to the second SF card. Hand over the SD card and charge it.

b. buy a small usb stick. Put a mp3 version of the mixdown of the concert on the stick. Give the stick & charge it.

In any case a or b. As you basically hand over the files right after the concert, make sure you get paid BETWEEN the end of the concert & handing over the files !!!!

That should give you an extra minute or 2 to do the transfer
Old 2 weeks ago
  #9
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are we talking about speech or music? who owns the copyright on the performance? do performers agree with giving away recordings without listening back? how do those recordings sound at all? raw tracks or heavily treated? - from what i got to read so far, the request for immediate delivery seems hilarious and frankly, i can hardly imagine any scenario where this would make sense: i've been turning down similar requests...


p.s. best solution for immediated delivery is still feeding signals through a codec and transmit via telephone lines in real time.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #10
Lives for gear
In my experience, with both amateur and professional musicians alike, immediately after a performance very few if any musicians want to hear back their playing.

They are all too aware of their mistakes, and when they come off the stage they can usually tell you exactly which movement or bars or runs of notes they either forgot or made a mess of....and they usually want to go and have a drink or a meal (and forget about it)....or they want to go and watch the other musicians in the festival (and forget about it).

They definitely do not want to immediately play back their own performance......perhaps even not for a week or so !! A recording session is an entirely different scenario, and we are not talking about that here....

This might seem like excessive or overly precious or self- critical behaviour....but it is not, it's entirely natural and predictable.

So for this reason alone the "immediate possession of the incriminating evidence" is coming perhaps from an overly pompous musical director, who wants to show all the participants that he has total and complete control over the recordings, and is able to give them out to the players immediately (when in truth the players just want to forget about it.....for at least a day or two !)

Someone's huge ego is being given full rein here, to be seen to dispense largesse via instantaneous concert recordings.

If he actually asked the musicians what they wanted (and remember that for them a performance is a temporally immediate and transient event, between themselves and the audience....while a recording preserves that, on ice), they will often jokingly say :"Oh, could you just edit out the bum notes and send me the best parts" I've been told exactly this on several occasions after recording concerts.

What's that refrain from the Jackson Browne song 'These Days': "Please don't confront me with my failures, I have not forgotten them"

In other words, a wise person allows some time to pass between the concert recording and delivery of those files, because the recorded truth can be painful, merciless and without sympathy....and you can verify this via simple questioning of the musicians: 'How long after the concert did you actually wait before listening to the playback' ?

For the musicians it will often be several days to a few weeks, for a conductor/manager or festival director (who has less direct personal investment in actual instrument playing) it might be much sooner...
Old 2 weeks ago
  #11
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tourtelot View Post
Wow! What's the hurry? Sounds like a made-up emergency (the worst kind).

D.
Half of me says tell the a-hole to go eff himself, the other other half wants to find a way to solve it.

Without wifi, the email part of the deal won't happen. But if the real issue is the performers' quick access to the recording, there may be an alternative.

With live recordings, I routinely send all my individual tracks to a PT mix track that goes down live, and there's a redundant clone of that mix track that goes to a second, independent drive. I don't know if that second drive could be a flash drive, but I've done it with an iPod (same basic thing, right?) so why not?

Have the client supply you with a bucket of flash drives and that $450 assistant and you might be in business.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #12
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Plush's Avatar
Just make a cd and give it to them. Later on, you can send them the the hi-res file.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #13
Gear Nut
 
ronmac's Avatar
I would want IP clearance from each act before handing anything over to "client", regardless of time line for delivery.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #14
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The "letter of the law" from the OP's client requires a person dedicated to just doing that dub and upload--maybe recording a split of the live mix to a 2nd computer, then quickly cutting and pasting the file into an upload during the turnaround. If it was me I'd figure that during the turnarounds I'd be way too busy getting ready for the next act to be doing that work. If the help or the money to hire another assistant isn't forthcoming then the player(s) have to wait. Sorry.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #15
Laptop might not have a CD burner. I sometimes buy some 8gb USB drives in bulk and give those to clients if they need a physical copy of something that won't fit on a disc. Probably would work here too. Charge them an extra $100 for the convenience.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #16
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tourtelot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plush View Post
Just make a cd and give it to them. Later on, you can send them the the hi-res file.
That's what we do in a one-off concert situation, but it takes time to burn CDs and on a festival day, I would imagine that getting ready for the next performance would be the first order of business. We do make and upload .mp3 files to festival Dropboxes but it happens when we have the time, often after arriving for the next day's show but in that down time before rehearsals. A 24-hour window seems reasonable for such a thing.

D.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #17
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bgood View Post
Do you have to do this for each of the fifty groups?

If there isn’t WiFi how can the client even check his email the minute he walks off stage?

This is weird

Can you just have the client bring a computer with him if he’s such a weirdo and just send him the file right from the nagra?

Or, bring a computer with you and a bunch of cheap little usb thumb drives so you can transfer the nagra dumps right there? Assuming you have enough time to do it between setups... that actually would be classy service
Yes, I have to do it for all 50 groups. The client has cellular service so he doesn’t need Wi-Fi to receive it.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #18
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 View Post
Is the 'client' one of the 50 groups or just someone with a dangerous sense of self-importance ? " In my inbox when I walk offstage" indeed Sounds more like a pathological fear of any editing taking place if you ask me....don't feed this ego, it's dangerous Or simply narcissistic control fiends of the worst kind. Just because something can be done...doesn't mean it should, or will, be done.

Go the other way and live stream it on Facebook, that way they can even watch themselves before they walk offstage ! Reminds me of the chorus of that old Steely Dan song "Showbizness Kids making movies of themselves, you know they don't give a fu** about anybody else" .....

I'm suggesting some alpha-male has grabbed you by the short and curlies on this score, caught you unawares and in a panic you've agreed.....?

I hope you're getting payment in advance for this gig...'cos you're handing over your labour=product=intellectual property as they come offstage, so you have no "goods" to withhold if (at the end, at payment time) they renege and decide that they don't feel like paying you after all ?

Finally....if you're busting a blood vessel in perpetual file deliveries at the end of each set, how on earth are you preparing adequately for the next act/set of players who will take the stage ? Let me guess : "not my problem" they reply to you....!

When do you get to eat, go to the bathroom ? This sort of file transfer should be left to the end of each day's proceedings (it's a music festival, or brass band competitions, or similar, yes ?) when you can do them as a batch process and upload them to a single repository (eg Soundcloud account)....rather than diverting and distracting you from necessary preparations between acts during the days.

Best Solution For Immediate Delivery of Files ? Don't. Just say No
Actually, Facebook Live would be okay actually because I have cellular service, but, how do I get my audio into the phone on the live video versus the iPhone?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #19
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JCBigler View Post
MP3 files don't take up much space. And aren't there some 2 and four track recorders that record straight to mp3 format? Like the Zooms, Tascams and Sony recorders?

What about recording on one of those to an SD card, and then just giving the SD card to the client when they walk off stage?
Well, will they accept my microphones? Still, I have a delivery issue because no WiFi
Old 2 weeks ago
  #20
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bgood View Post
Do you have to do this for each of the fifty groups?

If there isn’t WiFi how can the client even check his email the minute he walks off stage?

This is weird

Can you just have the client bring a computer with him if he’s such a weirdo and just send him the file right from the nagra?

Or, bring a computer with you and a bunch of cheap little usb thumb drives so you can transfer the nagra dumps right there? Assuming you have enough time to do it between setups... that actually would be classy service
They want it emailed (physical media is not desired by them).
Old 2 weeks ago
  #21
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plush View Post
Just make a cd and give it to them. Later on, you can send them the the hi-res file.

Yes, we used to do CDs but they don’t want physical media anymore. Btw, this is for music education. They perform each year at snuffed festival and the director wants them right away usually because they are looking to gloat over a good rating or complain they got screwed by virtue of what they hear on playback. It’s no processing, just straight record.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #22
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bgood's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by HelenaBzg View Post
Yes, I have to do it for all 50 groups. The client has cellular service so he doesn’t need Wi-Fi to receive it.
Are you certain there isn’t WiFi at the venue? It’d be a bit of stretch to ask for this service (without paying extra for it)...

I’m thinking bring a laptop with an interface and run a split from your recorder into it and burn the laptop capture for king weirdo client.

So, it’s mildly interesting if HE has internet access via cellular... figure out your per g/b rate that your provider will rape you for and charge him that plus 20%. Or tell him to arrange WiFi at the venue and you’ll be nice enough to bring the gear to do smite transfers (for a fee to cover the cost of the assistant you’ll probably need to do the work).

If he’s got a Hard On for email delivery, tell to arrange WiFi, pay for you to arrange another solution of STFU

At some point we have to charge for weird value added nonsense.... particularly when it’s truly stupid and way outside normal practices

If it’s that important to him, he’ll pay. Is this weirdness in the contract you have signed with him? If not, let him suck a Weiner
Old 2 weeks ago
  #23
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bgood's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by HelenaBzg View Post
They want it emailed (physical media is not desired by them).
Tell them to pay up for either setting up WiFi at the venue or paying you an ungodly per minute rate for you to use your cellular phone as a hot spot

It’s not your problem that they’ve decided they don’t want physical media AND to play a venue with no network
Old 2 weeks ago
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HelenaBzg View Post
Yes, we used to do CDs but they don’t want physical media anymore. Btw, this is for music education. They perform each year at snuffed festival and the director wants them right away usually because they are looking to gloat over a good rating or complain they got screwed by virtue of what they hear on playback. It’s no processing, just straight record.
Madness. I knew there was a "pandering to ego" factor embedded in there somewhere, and the target bullseye for that is painted on the Director's forehead. He wants to look good in front of the kids...the dispenser of instant largesse !

When the students sit for a written or practical exam, do they get results immediately ? Didn't think so...why is this any different ?

Ideally, you'd want to be upstreaming/uploading the performance as it is being played, to prevent double-handling of the material later (when you should be setting up for the next bunch of performers !) ...but this probably won't work, since a live (ie real-time) performance isn't 'a file' that the uploading medium can absorb.

In other words, I suspect the performance has to be uploaded after it's concluded, not during.

You need a paid assistant to allow this to happen, otherwise you're going to be neglecting your set-up duties for the next band due on.

You realize that you're aiding and abetting grumpy student protests and challenges... to the rating/scoring they've received only moments before ?

If I were a judge/adjudicator there, I'd be very peeved that such "challenge evidence material" to my scoring decisions was being released so prematurely...while I still had several hours of judging ahead of me on a given day.

I'm glad it's you and not I in this position, but you clearly perceive you have no power to refuse the alpha male's request...so carry on (ideally with an assistant to do this for you, while you attend to your core-duties)
Old 2 weeks ago
  #25
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JCBigler's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by HelenaBzg View Post
Well, will they accept my microphones? Still, I have a delivery issue because no WiFi
Most of these recorders have at least one of two models that have two XLR inputs, a couple have four.

But like others have said, you have a data flow problem. At the very minimum it will take a few minutes, probably 10 or so, to copy the file to your email and then send it. There's no way in hell you are going to be able to email a mp3 file to the directors as soon as he walks off stage.

And it shouldn't be on you to use your cell phone service and your data (which may be limited) to upload that. If the festival wants them emailed as soon after the performance as possible, then they need to sporing for a hard wired ethernet connection that you can use to upload to email.

But again, it's going to take a few minutes to stop the recording, and copy it to the email service and upload it. And that's hoping that the director's email service doesn't filter out the media file because it's too large, or suspicious, or whatever.

You could burn a live CD, but it would still take a couple minutes ti finalize the disc after the recording has ended. That's probably the quickest and easiest method to do this. Could hand them a CD withing 2 to 3 minutes after the performance. I think emailing an mp3 file would still take longer.

You need to have a serious talk with the contest organizers and get them to understand that what they want is just no feasible in the amount of time they are allocating.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCBigler View Post
Most of these recorders have at least one of two models that have two XLR inputs, a couple have four.

But like others have said, you have a data flow problem. At the very minimum it will take a few minutes, probably 10 or so, to copy the file to your email and then send it. There's no way in hell you are going to be able to email a mp3 file to the directors as soon as he walks off stage.

And it shouldn't be on you to use your cell phone service and your data (which may be limited) to upload that. If the festival wants them emailed as soon after the performance as possible, then they need to sporing for a hard wired ethernet connection that you can use to upload to email.

But again, it's going to take a few minutes to stop the recording, and copy it to the email service and upload it. And that's hoping that the director's email service doesn't filter out the media file because it's too large, or suspicious, or whatever.

You could burn a live CD, but it would still take a couple minutes ti finalize the disc after the recording has ended. That's probably the quickest and easiest method to do this. Could hand them a CD withing 2 to 3 minutes after the performance. I think emailing an mp3 file would still take longer.

You need to have a serious talk with the contest organizers and get them to understand that what they want is just no feasible in the amount of time they are allocating.
Recording directly to a laptop running Reaper allows you to write the audio to 2 recording drives simultaneously...usually done for safety/security reasons. You could record to both the internal laptop drive and a USB thumb drive, then give away the USB to the players... or to your assistant to upload.

However, I'd delay this until the day's performances are all finished, and the judges are safely distanced from "kids" and their disgruntled opinions....and you have some spare time for uploading via the host venue's network.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #27
Gear Maniac
 

Thank you all for the feedback.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #28
And finally, if the director isn't the person paying you, have him talk to the person who is.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #29
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 View Post
Recording directly to a laptop running Reaper allows you to write the audio to 2 recording drives simultaneously...
Same deal with PT if you create redundant tracks. Doesn't have to be a laptop.
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