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Mid-Side Mic for Nature Recording (all-in-one) Condenser Microphones
Old 3 weeks ago
  #31
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whippoorwill's Avatar
oooh a figure 8 fight, I'll go - the sennheiser mkh30 bass switch turns the bass boost off.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #32
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jimjazzdad's Avatar
Well, thanks to a fellow Gearslutz, I have tried both the Schoeps MK8 and the Sennheiser MKH30 as "S" mic in MS pairs and damned if I heard any difference in mid-side symmetry between those capsules. Maybe that's because the MKH30 MS pair was arranged side-by-side "à la Rolo 46" thus perfectly mimicking the MK8 asymmetry...

(I'm assuming the CCM8 capsule has the same characteristics as the MK8?)

Last edited by jimjazzdad; 2 weeks ago at 12:35 PM..
Old 2 weeks ago
  #33
Gear Nut
 

MS combo mics generally have higher noise floor than separates, particularly on the side capsule.

I never tried the Shure VP88 but it gets rave reviews. Here's a nature example: YouTube

The Pearl MS mics are mostly special order. They're lower noise than the Shure on paper, but paper specs aren't always reliable. The other issue is the 28mm diameter. I don't think there's a slip-on windjammer that fits. Rycote does make a mini windjammer for the VP88.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #34
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John Willett's Avatar
 

Exclamation

Quote:
Originally Posted by whippoorwill View Post
oooh a figure 8 fight, I'll go - the sennheiser mkh30 bass switch turns the bass boost off.
I would say that this is an incorrect description of the MKH 30.

The symmetrical MKH microphones have a tailored electrical response that is the converse of the lightly damped capsule response to give a flat overall frequency response.

What you said implies that the microphone has a response different to what it has.

The bass switch changes the electrical response to give a clean bass roll-off.

There are several papers on line which explain all this.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #35
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John Willett's Avatar
 

Exclamation

Quote:
Originally Posted by jscomposer View Post
MS combo mics generally have higher noise floor than separates, particularly on the side capsule.
This is because most people make a figure-8 from back-to-back cardioids, rather than having a single diaphragm.

The single diaphragm capacitor fig-8s are:-
Sennheiser MKH 30 - truly symmetrical with active front plate
Neumann KK 120 - truly symmetrical with passive front plate
Schoeps MK8, CCM8, etc. - no front plate which means that the rear lobe has a slightly different plot (shows in the 16kHz response)
MBHO KA 800 - no front plate which means that the rear lobe has a slightly different plot
Ambient ATE 208 "Emesser" - no front plate which means that the rear lobe has a slightly different plot

These are the only single diaphragm figure-8 microphones I know of.

If you compare the Schoeps and Neumann polar-patterns you will see that the Schoeps has a much nicer front response than the Neumann and that the rear anomolies on the Neumann are mirrored on the front because of the front plate.

Personally, I have a pair of the MKH 30 and also an Ambient ATE208.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Willett View Post
Personally, I have a pair of the MKH 30 and also an Ambient ATE208.
John, how do you like the Emesser? As I noted on a related thread, I've been considering one to clip onto my MKH 8060 so I can quickly alternate between interviews and capturing ambient sounds or music (in the context of shooting video using a separate audio recorder). I already have a Rycote blimp for the 8060. I also have an MKH 8050 that could work but it is of course a much smaller mic and am not sure it's long enough to clip the Emesser to it, and for outdoor interviews the 8060 is likely the better choice.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #37
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John Willett's Avatar
 

Smile

Quote:
Originally Posted by bradh View Post
John, how do you like the Emesser? As I noted on a related thread, I've been considering one to clip onto my MKH 8060 so I can quickly alternate between interviews and capturing ambient sounds or music (in the context of shooting video using a separate audio recorder). I already have a Rycote blimp for the 8060. I also have an MKH 8050 that could work but it is of course a much smaller mic and am not sure it's long enough to clip the Emesser to it, and for outdoor interviews the 8060 is likely the better choice.
It's a nice and relatively inexpensive single-diaphragm fig-8.

I got it so I can use it with my MKH 8040 where I have to have a tiny rig and was inexpensive enough until Sennheiser bring out the, very much delayed, 8030.

I have not actually used it very much as I tend to mostly use my MKH 30.

But I think it is the most inexpensive single-diaphragm fig-8. It is an OEM bade for Ambient by MBHO, and I think the specs are pretty much identical to the MBHO.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Willett View Post

But I think it is the most inexpensive single-diaphragm fig-8. It is an OEM bade for Ambient by MBHO, and I think the specs are pretty much identical to the MBHO.
Thanks. It seems like a reasonable (and certainly cost-effective) solution for my audio-for-video (short documentary) needs, where I typically have very little setup time and need to be able to move quickly from interviews to capturing ambient sound or music.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #39
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Willett View Post
But I think it is the most inexpensive single-diaphragm fig-8.
Sometimes - and it will depend on where you are - the single-diaphragm AKG CK94 is cheaper even with the SE300B (that's certainly the case in the UK at the moment), and to my ears sounds nicer/quieter: Suso Ramallo posted some nature recording comparisons MS by Suso Ramallo | Free Listening on SoundCloud

Cheers,

Roland
Old 2 weeks ago
  #40
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by norfolksoundman9 View Post
Sometimes - and it will depend on where you are - the single-diaphragm AKG CK94 is cheaper even with the SE300B (that's certainly the case in the UK at the moment), and to my ears sounds nicer/quieter: Suso Ramallo posted some nature recording comparisons MS by Suso Ramallo | Free Listening on SoundCloud

Cheers,

Roland
I was going to mention the CK94 if no-one else did. I was also under the impression it was single diaphragm, and I think it sounds good, although I haven't had a chance to compare it to any of the others.

That said, it's probably a moot point for the thread starter, who said cost is no object and recordings will often take place in a rainforest. Seems like the Sennheiser is the obvious choice in this situation.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ebeowulf17 View Post
That said, it's probably a moot point for the thread starter, who said cost is no object and recordings will often take place in a rainforest. Seems like the Sennheiser is the obvious choice in this situation.
I agree: there's no contest with that use and budget!

R
Old 2 weeks ago
  #42
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John Willett's Avatar
 

Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ebeowulf17 View Post
That said, it's probably a moot point for the thread starter, who said cost is no object and recordings will often take place in a rainforest. Seems like the Sennheiser is the obvious choice in this situation.
This is true - for the OP a Sennheiser MKH 40/30 or 50/30 rig would definitely be the best option.
Old 1 week ago
  #43
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolo 46 View Post
Be a Pro, do it properly
MKH 30/40
Full Rycote
Dont arse about with toys....
Agreed. So I highly recommend a Cinela mount for MS. It's the best.
Quieter than the Cyclone in terms of handling noise which is essential for a huge setup like the MKH40+30.
The Cyclone is a heavy beast too.

I had a Rycote before, the Cinela is a different league.
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