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Sound Devices Announces MixPre-10M "For Musicians" Recorders, Players & Tape Machines
Old 2nd June 2018
  #181
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 View Post
So it appears to be not like a 16 track tape machine, where you could go to take 4 of a guitar track and then 'drop in' a repair overdub, for a 10 second segment, for example ?

In fact you're not 'dropping in' ie destructively at all...you're just adding sequentially new takes at each pass ?
We are talking about something different: the 10M does, of course, have punching in/out, as per the manual pp. 45-6.

Cheers,

Roland
Old 2nd June 2018
  #182
Lives for gear
Fantastic! Works for me! I love that about digital recording. Track management used to be such a pain....Thx for clarification
Old 2nd June 2018
  #183
Gear Head
 
melele's Avatar
 

@studer58 that is a good question and I need to test this unless Dominic gets there first. So if you set up cue in and out points on an existing track, do an overdub, then dump the tracks to DAW, are there two complete tracks, one pre-overdub and one post-overdub? Or does the post-overdub track contain only the overdubbed audio section? Could be a RTFM question. I’ll post as soon as I find out.
Old 2nd June 2018
  #184
Gear Head
 

With cue points, you get to keep the original take and then get another 'insert' which is the punch-in.

So, single track, record for 30 seconds.
Go back, set Q-points as follows:
play start at 0:00
rec start at 0:10
rec stop at 0:20
play stop at 0:30
Do the punch in.........

Now you've got a 30 second file, which is the original take, and a smaller 10 second file, which is the punch in.
There's a bit of a job to do, to put that into your DAW in the right place.

At the moment, I can't work out (a) how you would know in a complex project, which tracks had punch-ins and (b) where they go.

Dominic
Old 2nd June 2018
  #185
Gear Head
 

The Session.xml holds no data about the position of the files. Instead, the WAV files themselves have a timestamp embedded as to where they belong.

If you render the files as 'Wav All Isos', then of course the 10M builds what you need to put all the tracks into your DAW starting at 0:00. But that doesn't help you with the original takes or the punch-ins. (All files are preserved - the original takes, the punch-ins and the renders).

Dominic
Old 12th June 2018
  #186
Here for the gear
 
linkevich's Avatar
 

Hi all!
I need to opinion of our community.
Mixpre10 (T or M) is really professional device for classical music concerts recording?
Double price for Sound Devices vs Zoom F8...
Old 12th June 2018
  #187
Lives for gear
 
Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkevich View Post
Hi all!
I need to opinion of our community.
Mixpre10 (T or M) is really professional device for classical music concerts recording?
Double price for Sound Devices vs Zoom F8...
Not even in the same world, IMHO. On the MixPre the mic pres are great sounding and it works very well. I am using the MixPre 3. If you try it you will fall in love with it. I have a good friend who is using the MixPre 10M and he sent me a recording of him playing the guitar and it was like having him in the same room. Amazing piece of gear!
Old 12th June 2018
  #188
Here for the gear
 
linkevich's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
...Amazing piece of gear!
Thank you, Tom! I hope, preamps of Mixpre10 is better, than of Zoom H6, wich i use now.
Old 12th June 2018
  #189
Gear Head
 

It won't be just preamps but everything- except maybe power management.
Old 13th June 2018
  #190
Here for the gear
 
linkevich's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Issadore View Post
... except maybe power management.
Issadore, please, tell me, what you mean about the power management?
Old 13th June 2018
  #191
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Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
All the MixPres consume a lot of power. I had to shell out $65.00 for a proper battery pack for my MixPre 3. They eat batteries. On my first gig with the unit it went through the internal batteries in less than 35 minutes. I guess for all the quality they need to use a lot of power. Everything is cool now and it makes beautiful recordings. I am in the process of updating to the latest firmware and that should be done today.

Power management in the MixPres is something that almost every post on the WWW talks about.
Old 13th June 2018
  #192
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
On my first gig with the unit it went through the internal batteries in less than 35 minutes.
Hi Tom,

By internal battery, you mean the 4 x AA sled as supplied and, with 35 mins only, evidently alkaline batteries: with 4 x Eneloop Pros (2500mAh) I am getting many times that (3 hours plus, usually: depends on usage).

Having been concerned initially about battery life (and trying different options), after a year's use I now find myself almost always powering my Mixpre-3 with this 4 x Ni-MH AA option (with 2 spare sets to hand) rather than any of the alternatives: the 4 x AA sled is so easy to change, it offers a robust solution and keeps the diminutive size of the recorder. Obviously, if one is doing, say, 4-hour or more unbroken recordings then this is not a solution, nor is it so relevant to the larger 10M/10T recorders!

Cheers,

Roland
Old 13th June 2018
  #193
Gear Maniac
 

Thread Starter
FYI, the Musicians' Plug-in is now available for all existing MixPre recorders (MixPre 3, 6, and 10T), and Sound Devices is also selling "M" versions of the MixPre 3 and 6 to new users (with the plugin already installed).

Plugin can be purchased and downloaded from Sound Devices website at Sound Devices Store – Defining Production Audio

Video with installation instructions: YouTube
Old 13th June 2018
  #194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
All the MixPres consume a lot of power. I had to shell out $65.00 for a proper battery pack for my MixPre 3. They eat batteries. On my first gig with the unit it went through the internal batteries in less than 35 minutes. I guess for all the quality they need to use a lot of power. Everything is cool now and it makes beautiful recordings. I am in the process of updating to the latest firmware and that should be done today.

Power management in the MixPres is something that almost every post on the WWW talks about.
According to this detailed info from Sound Devices, alkaline AAs are not recommended, in particular due to their high internal resistance:
Sound Devices - MixPre-3 & MixPre-6 Maximizing Battery Runtime
Old 13th June 2018
  #195
Lives for gear
 
celticrogues's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
All the MixPres consume a lot of power. I had to shell out $65.00 for a proper battery pack for my MixPre 3. They eat batteries. On my first gig with the unit it went through the internal batteries in less than 35 minutes. I guess for all the quality they need to use a lot of power. Everything is cool now and it makes beautiful recordings. I am in the process of updating to the latest firmware and that should be done today.

Power management in the MixPres is something that almost every post on the WWW talks about.
It’s true that it gets talked about a lot but I think a lot of that is from people trying to be cheap and not using professional power options with the MixPre’s. AA batteries are not a professional solution to power a recorder IMO.

I run my MixPres (I have a -3, a -6, and a -10T) from the same batteries that power my other recorders - Remote Audio Smart Batteries, or NP1’s, or the Anker USB Powerbank that Sound Devices recommends. Have not yet had a situation where I run out of power, and usually a single battery gets me through a full 8-10 hour day.

-Mike
Old 13th June 2018
  #196
Gear Maniac
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradh View Post

Video with installation instructions: YouTube
I just purchased and downloaded the plugin and everything seems to be working smoothly. You definitely have to watch the youtube video linked above to figure out how installation works; it's not intuitive.

You're not downloading a plugin; the plugin is actually already installed on your MixPre if you've updated to the latest firmware. All you're downloading is a license file that unlocks the plugin and makes it available. You transfer the license file to your MixPre's SD card and then you go to the System menu on the MixPre, find "Plugins" and choose the "Apply Plugins" option. It will apply the license, restart the device, and now when you choose to start a new project it'll ask whether you want it to be a music project or a "sound" project. The "sound" projects are what you normally get without the plugin; the "music" projects use the plugin.

I look forward to trying it out!
Old 13th June 2018
  #197
Gear Maniac
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by celticrogues View Post

I run my MixPres (I have a -3, a -6, and a -10T) from the same batteries that power my other recorders - Remote Audio Smart Batteries, or NP1’s, or the Anker USB Powerbank that Sound Devices recommends.
The Anker USB Powerbank (Anker PowerCore+ 20100 USB-C) provides power via the MixPre's USB C connection, which is a very weak point: mine has disconnected about 6 times already and I've only had my MixPre a few weeks! It unseats very easily. If you're going to use this, I'd recommend having at least the 4 AA battery sled installed as well so you recording isn't interrupted by the USB C cable slipping out if you happen to tug the recorder slightly.
Old 13th June 2018
  #198
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by celticrogues View Post
AA batteries are not a professional solution to power a recorder IMO.

I run my MixPres (I have a -3, a -6, and a -10T) from the same batteries that power my other recorders - Remote Audio Smart Batteries, or NP1’s, or the Anker USB Powerbank that Sound Devices recommends.
-Mike
Mike: there is nothing intrinsically 'unprofessional' about decent Ni-MH AA batteries in a Mixpre recorder, especially in the Mixpre-3: the 4 x AA sled is more robust than the USB external battery you suggest. It all comes down to how long you need to record, and what your use is: I'm usually recording in the rough and tumble of the field, where a robust power connection and weight matter, not (in my particular case) long duration.

Cheers,

Roland
Old 13th June 2018
  #199
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bradh View Post
I look forward to trying it out!
Have installed it on my Mixpre-3 and have been putting it through its paces, uploading a 7-track project from my DAW (as a polywav of course, via Wave Agent), for overdubbing: pretty straightforward despite the sketchy manual (similar to that for the 10M of course). It is nice to see that when turned off and on it resumes in the mode last used.

Anyway, it simplifies my life (both in terms of clobber and syncing) for those on location overdubs, such as overdubbing a fiddle part on a train this weekend...

Cheers,

Roland
Old 13th June 2018
  #200
Lives for gear
 
celticrogues's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bradh View Post
The Anker USB Powerbank (Anker PowerCore+ 20100 USB-C) provides power via the MixPre's USB C connection, which is a very weak point: mine has disconnected about 6 times already and I've only had my MixPre a few weeks! It unseats very easily. If you're going to use this, I'd recommend having at least the 4 AA battery sled installed as well so you recording isn't interrupted by the USB C cable slipping out if you happen to tug the recorder slightly.
Yes, very true. It is important to have a backup power source attached as well. Thats why I like the USB power instead of one of the Hirose add-on adapters available; so you can have a backup power source attached as well.

I simply loop the USB-C cable around one of the front pegs on the MixPre's to secure it before plugging it in. It has been solid for me through many days of (sometimes literal) run-and-gun use in a sound bag.

Quote:
Originally Posted by norfolksoundman9 View Post
Mike: there is nothing intrinsically 'unprofessional' about decent Ni-MH AA batteries in a Mixpre recorder, especially in the Mixpre-3: the 4 x AA sled is more robust than the USB external battery you suggest. It all comes down to how long you need to record, and what your use is: I'm usually recording in the rough and tumble of the field, where a robust power connection and weight matter, not (in my particular case) long duration.

Cheers,

Roland
Fair point. I am more likely to record for several hours at a time, and thus need a more robust power solution. But you're right, different uses for the recorder may requite different power solutions.

-Mike
Old 13th June 2018
  #201
Gear Maniac
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by celticrogues View Post
I simply loop the USB-C cable around one of the front pegs on the MixPre's to secure it before plugging it in.
Obvious solution, but I didn't think of it. Thank you! I'll try that from now on. I often have mine plugged into the wall (I bought the adapter) and it keeps unplugging itself, but shouldn't if I wrap it around the peg.
Old 13th June 2018
  #202
Here for the gear
 

Old 14th June 2018
  #203
Gear Maniac
 

Thread Starter
I've been playing around with the plugin on my MixPre 6. The jury's still out on how much I'll actually use it instead of a DAW...I have 27 inches of screen and conventional controls for the DAW, compared with the MixPre's barely 1 inch by 1 inch screen with touch and knob controls. The Wingman app helps, but still it feels like a pretty cumbersome interface for anything beyond basic recording and playback; I haven't tried doing any overdubs yet.

The way to get a manual for the plugin seems to be to download the manual for the M-series MixPres -- the MixPre 3M, 6M, or 10M. There is a handy quick-start guide at the beginning that's helpful; at first I couldn't figure out how to enable phantom power on a track because touching it didn't work (you use touch in normal mode on the MixPre); instead you have to use the headphone knob to tab between settings and then when you finally reach Phantom at the end you press in the knob to select it. The manual explained that, sort of.

One thing that puzzles me: in a DAW if you have 17 takes of a song and there are two you think are keepers, you can pretty easily label or color-code them as such. I don't see any way to do that in the Musician plug-in; is each take supposed to be a separate project, and is there a way to mark them in any way? I have to admit I haven't had much time to get through the manual, but I know some of you have been using the 10M for a while and could probably answer this easily.
Old 14th June 2018
  #204
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bradh View Post
The way to get a manual for the plugin seems to be to download the manual for the M-series MixPres -- the MixPre 3M, 6M, or 10M.
No need to do this: there is a Musician plugin manual, clearly signposted on the Musican plugin page: http://cdn.sounddevices.com/download...ugin-UG_en.pdf

Cheers,

Roland
Old 14th June 2018
  #205
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bradh View Post
One thing that puzzles me: in a DAW if you have 17 takes of a song and there are two you think are keepers, you can pretty easily label or color-code them as such. I don't see any way to do that in the Musician plug-in; is each take supposed to be a separate project, and is there a way to mark them in any way? I have to admit I haven't had much time to get through the manual, but I know some of you have been using the 10M for a while and could probably answer this easily.
Dominic's post above (no. 178) covers some of this, I think.

Cheers,

Roland
Old 14th June 2018
  #206
Gear Maniac
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by norfolksoundman9 View Post
No need to do this: there is a Musician plugin manual, clearly signposted on the Musican plugin page: http://cdn.sounddevices.com/download...ugin-UG_en.pdf
Ah, much better, thanks! I went to the "Support" and "Documentation" page but didn't see anything there; somehow missed this. This actually looks like a useful manual and will likely answer most of my questions.
Old 14th June 2018
  #207
Gear Nut
 

Monitoring while overdubbing

I am sure Mixpre-10M users have already worked this out, but it took me a bit of time with the Musician plugin on my Mixpre-3 to work out how to feed musicians a backing track (with their mics mixed in for monitoring, of course), while I just monitor the input of the tracks being recorded (i.e. without the backing track) - for overdubbing that is.

The answer, of course, is to use the stereo out for the musicians' mix/monitor (feeding a headphone amp with multiple outputs) while using solo on the relevant (input) channels to feed just these to the headphone out on the Mixpre: as would be expected, solo has no impact on the stereo out.

Cheers,

Roland
Old 14th June 2018
  #208
Gear Nut
 

Can you transfer a recording made as an Audio project into a Music project internally in the MixPre3 with plugin (i.e., for use as a bed track) or would you have to download it first to computer and then import it?
Old 14th June 2018
  #209
Lives for gear
I don't get why the software fix for the older units is $100-...... That doesn't seem fair, unless I'm missing something.....I'd be really angry if my older unit was de-valued like that....Is that really so?
Old 14th June 2018
  #210
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ardis View Post
I don't get why the software fix for the older units is $100-...... That doesn't seem fair, unless I'm missing something.....I'd be really angry if my older unit was de-valued like that....Is that really so?
You are missing something! The $99 isn't for a fix and doesn't devalue the non-M Mixpre recorder: the original recorders have various different - and important - functions missing from the M series. The plugin leaves this original functionality intact. You can simply choose which mode to use the Mixpre in: e.g. for film sound/field recording etc. or for music modes.

As I have said before in this thread, I have occasional use for overdubbing on location, where a laptop and DAW isn't as portable or as robust as I would like, and other options - such as a Zoom R8 - have poorer audio quality than required. But equally, the Mixpre-M series isn't what I want for my main use (above all I'd miss the MS modes and metering).

So, now I - and others with similar needs - have the best of both worlds. Of course a lower price than $99 would have been welcome, but I did not hesitate for a moment before buying.

If you look at SD's product pages you will see comparison tables between the Mixpre series models and their M counterparts: e.g. Sound Devices - MixPre-6 vs MixPre-6M

Cheers,

Roland
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