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Video cameras Condenser Microphones
Old 1 week ago
  #91
A couple of errors though.
The PAL version of the GH3 still has the 30 minute record limitation.
Like other Panasonic cameras the GH3 was marketed as a stills and video camera. It was one of the first really good quality mirrorless video cameras though.
Howver that was a few years ago. The GH3 was superceded by the GH4, which was quite a step up.
The GH4 has now been replaced by the GH5 and GH5s. Again, another step up.
I wouldn’t buy a GH3 in 2018.
Old 1 week ago
  #92
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Picking up a GH3 for the sensor alone is a great deal at today's secondary Mkt prices. When packaged with any of the Atomos recorders and the Lumix 12-35 mm2.8 lens you have a small investment in gear that can deliver excellent fixed shots on most any decently lit stage for as long as you keep them powered up.
Live music capture requires more than one camera and apparently works best when the contribution of multiple camera clips are compatible and are easy to digitally sync in post production. With a pair of G3/Atomos rigs for fixed locations, and a new GH5 with35/100MM2.8 lens and Atomos Ninja V recorder for maned isolation shots of leads I should be able to get good live performance videos.
The ability to balance fixed and moving captures with comparable clips is my preferred protocol for obvious reasons. The advanced differences between the GH3 and GH5 are relatively insignificant if all you are using is the sensor and lens of the camera.
Hugh
Old 1 week ago
  #93
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For $300-$400, a GH3 is still worth considering. Paired with a great lens, it might be a better option for someone on a budget than a more expensive body with a meh lens. As a low profile still camera, don't shoot fast moving subjects, don't expect to crop much and stay below 1600 ISO, IME.
Old 1 week ago
  #94
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Yannick's Avatar
 

IMO the GX85 is a much better low cost option than a used GH3.
Take care not to have a GX80/85 model with the 29 min limit !

You can always attach an external recorder, but then suddenly, the P4K becomes a cheap option...

The GX85 actually holds up pretty well next to a GH5, especially when you shoot in 4K for 1080p max delivery.
Old 1 week ago
  #95
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I'm about to record a classical concert this upcoming weekend using a pair of Sony FDR-AX100 cameras and a Mevo camera. The Sony FDR-AX100 is a prosumer camcorder. The Mevo is a story unto itself that'll have to be described in another thread.

I had shopped the MFT (micro 4/3rds) mirrorless DSLR options pretty hard during my search, and had even bought a Blackmagic HyperDeck Shuttle 2 for external recording onto an SSD. I was leaning toward getting the Panasonic GH3 or similar. Then I decided to put on my consultant hat and build a spreadsheet of my requirements. In short, the main considerations of long (3hr+) battery life with optional battery, long recording time on reasonably-priced media, good low-light capability, 18x or more optical zoom capability in HD, 4k capture option, slow power zoom, remote control via WiFi, and a few cost-conscious things led me to buy the Sony.

The other top contenders were the Canon XC10, Panasonic HC-WXF991K, and I *really* was hoping to make sense of getting the new Blackmagic Pocket Cinema 4k camera.

So far the Sony has been on stage as a reverse-angle camera at a classical piano concert last weekend. There are no contrast controls to soften super contrast-y image areas, so the shiny jet-black Steinway grand against the white keys was *really* strongly captured. It's either impressive or a problem depending on your perspective. Post production isn't done yet, so we'll see ...

Anybody want to buy a HyperDeck Shuttle 2?
Old 1 week ago
  #96
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king2070lplaya's Avatar
For that price, you can get a GX85, which is newer and looks significantly better than a GH3.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 2manyrocks View Post
For $300-$400, a GH3 is still worth considering. Paired with a great lens, it might be a better option for someone on a budget than a more expensive body with a meh lens. As a low profile still camera, don't shoot fast moving subjects, don't expect to crop much and stay below 1600 ISO, IME.
Old 1 week ago
  #97
For the record, I'm not advising anyone to get (or not get) a GH3 - obviously we're quite a few years on from that camera and there are much better options.

Also for the record, I'm in the US, so PAL is not really something I've ever really though about for my own use. I'm generally running 23.97 on the G3. I regularly shoot concerts in the 2 - 2.5 hour range with it, and even on single battery, it may be down one bar. I'd bet it could easily go twice as long as that on a single battery with a fresh charge.

What I am trying to delineate in my post are the drawbacks to using an "SLR-style" large-sensor camera vs. an actual camcorder vs. an action camera like the GoPro.

My understanding is OP is looking for a single-camera, one-man-band setup for live concert shooting. For that, my advice is to get a prosumer or professional camcorder with servo zoom, clean HDMI out, and dual XLR mic/line inputs. It will be a solution that will give you the most flexibility to cover a multitude of scenarios. Also, get a decent tripod that can go up to a height of six feet and add both a fluid head and a leveling base for best results.

If you're adding multiple cameras, now we're in a different bag of worms. I should say that I know guys who will clamp lots of GoPro's all over the place to get low-profile angles to cut in during post that they would not otherwise get. Obviously a different use than what we're talking about here.
Old 1 week ago
  #98
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king2070lplaya's Avatar
For a one cam solution, I’m seriously considering picking up an LX100, which can be hacked rather easily to record continuously. Same 4K as GH4, built in 24-70 equivalent lens.

One thing I see a lot of audio guys getting hung up on when jumping to video is learning how to best use the camera and picture settings. I was this guy, too, and in most ways (compared to true videographers) I still am. But for our uses, primarily concert recording, it’s worth investing a bit of time into learning manual camera control and videography basics. It goes a long way to be able to offer one camera, even better multi-camera, in addition to audio. And given that available quality-per-dollar is getting better and better, and expectations higher from clients, i think it’s worth the pursuit.

WRT sensor size, I think this is one place where m43 really offers a nice benefit; it’s bigger and generally better-looking (per dollar) than a 1”-or-smaller sensor camera, but not so big that your wide shot will suffer from shallow depth-of-field. If you’re manning a spot camera with a long telephoto lens, then yes you will need to account for it.
Old 1 week ago
  #99
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king2070lplaya's Avatar
I recorded 2/3s of this video with a GH4 and 1/3rd with a Canon 6D:

YouTube
Old 1 week ago
  #100
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya View Post
I recorded 2/3s of this video with a GH4 and 1/3rd with a Canon 6D:

YouTube
Well done. They intercut nicely.

Were you shooting both in 1080, or the GH4 in 4k and 6D in 1080?

Encouraging, as I have both cameras!
Old 1 week ago
  #101
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king2070lplaya's Avatar
GH4 was in 4K, 6D in 1080.

Each piece in the video was done with 1 camera and several takes edited together. The outer 2 with the GH4 and the middle with the 6D (the pieces recorded on different days when I had different cameras on hand).

Thanks for your kind words!

Quote:
Originally Posted by pieter k View Post
Well done. They intercut nicely.

Were you shooting both in 1080, or the GH4 in 4k and 6D in 1080?

Encouraging, as I have both cameras!
Old 1 week ago
  #102
Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya View Post
...for our uses, primarily concert recording, it’s worth investing a bit of time into learning manual camera control and videography basics. ...
And anyone wanting to shoot live concerts should read that sentence three times.

Few cameras are able to intelligently and correctly deal with the conditions of concerts in auto mode. Exposure and white balance especially are difficult for cameras to figure out in concert situations, with the huge contrasts of dark and light, and the multiple colours of light often in play. The operator needs to be able to get at least this deep into the camera's controls for good results.
Old 1 week ago
  #103
That’s where Blackmagic score, because their raw and Braw are capable of recovering shadows and highlights and fixing white balance better than the DSLR codecs.
I shoot raw and never worry about white balance. It’s good to get the exposure right, but a little under or over is easily fixed.
For the most part the BMD ‘pocket’ cameras have poor battery performance though.
Old 1 week ago
  #104
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king2070lplaya's Avatar
Here’s another one I did with 2 GH4’s, one with a Metabones Speedbooster and Canon 70-200 F4, and the other with a Lumix 12-35 2.8:

YouTube

YouTube

Somewhat low light...?

Last edited by king2070lplaya; 1 week ago at 01:09 AM..
Old 1 week ago
  #105
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya View Post
Here’s another one I did with 2 GH4’s, one with a Metabones Speedbooster and Canon 70-200 F4, and the other with a Lumix 12-35 2.8:

YouTube

YouTube

Somewhat low light...?
Somewhat!

Did you have the Canoned (!) camera on a fluid head or was that all hand held?

It's interesting that there's an audience, but that you were permitted to position yourself where you were. Obviously that was okay.

Nice work on all of these!
Old 1 week ago
  #106
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hbphotoav's Avatar
 

1x Sony Z7 into Atomos Ninja (HDMI); 2x Sony Z1 into AJA RGB-SDI converter-> Atomos Samurai recorders, directly to SSD via ProRes files. Bought all three cameras, converters and recorders (used, with long-run batteries and wall power adapters) for about what a single Sony A7 with a cinezoom would cost. Vinten, Miller, Manfrotto and O’Connor support. 2x Nikon D800 for backup. I learned on big Sony ENG cams... I still prefer that form factor, writ small, on a “real” tripod.

HB
Old 1 week ago
  #107
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Right. Don't expect any of the cameras to return decent results in auto mode. Especially in a concert situation, where you have high dynamic range to deal with.

But the basics are pretty simple. Here are some simple tips to get you going. Bear in mind that I am m4/3 centric, but the comments generally apply to all cameras.

1) Take a white balance reading beforehand and store it in your camera. GH5 can store up to 4 separate white balance settings. Other cameras have similar facilities. You'll need a white card to take your reading from.

2) Set your camera angle to 180 degrees. If you don't have a camera that can express shutter angle in degrees (like a GH4/GH5), all it means is that you should set your shutter speed to 2x the frame rate. So, if you're shooting at 24 frames per second, you'll want to set shutter speed at 1/48th sec or as close as you can get.

3) Don't make the mistake of using a slow, wide range zoom, then compensate for it with high ISO. You'll end up with more noise than you want. If you're going to be shooting in dark places, you want fast optics. The Voigtlander manual lenses are my choice, as they have maximum apertures of f/0.95 and very smoothly damped focus actions. They make a 10.5mm, 17.5mm, 25mm, and 42.5mm. In full frame terms, these equate to 21mm, 35mm, 50mm and 85mm respectively. If you need longer zooms, and you need lens speed, Panasonic, Olympus and Leica make a variety of m4/3 lenses (provided you're on m4/3).

4) Forget about autofocus. Not even the Sonys and Canons can be completely relied upon not to hunt and lose focus in marginal lighting conditions. Be deliberate, focus manually.

5) Forget about autoexposure. Always shoot in manual. In video, you really only have control over aperture and ISO. As I said before, shutter speed should be set to 180 degrees unless you're looking for a special effect. Concert hall lighting is difficult. Make good use of your zebra stripe function and be sure you don't blow your highlights.

6) If you're doing a real-time 2 channel mix, run a feed to your camera. If you have a Sony or GH5, use the XLR input accessory. This is the cleanest way to get audio into the camera. If your 2 channel mix is good enough, you might not have to bother with sync later on.

7) Consider investing in Tentacle Sync. Great product. Really simplifies your life.

8) Always bring a wireless lav in case you have to interview someone.

9) Always bring a couple of LED panels, even if you're working outside.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobAnderson View Post
And anyone wanting to shoot live concerts should read that sentence three times.

Few cameras are able to intelligently and correctly deal with the conditions of concerts in auto mode. Exposure and white balance especially are difficult for cameras to figure out in concert situations, with the huge contrasts of dark and light, and the multiple colours of light often in play. The operator needs to be able to get at least this deep into the camera's controls for good results.
Old 1 week ago
  #108
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Which LED panels do you like?
Old 1 week ago
  #109
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bwanajim View Post
Right. Don't expect any of the cameras to return decent results in auto mode. Especially in a concert situation, where you have high dynamic range to deal with.

But the basics are pretty simple. Here are some simple tips to get you going. Bear in mind that I am m4/3 centric, but the comments generally apply to all cameras.

...

9) Always bring a couple of LED panels, even if you're working outside.
There it is. The perfect primer.

The ultra-condensed truth is to learn to shoot in everything manual mode. Trust your eyes. Don't let the camera make the decisions for you.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 2manyrocks View Post
Which LED panels do you like?
I'm not a big lighting shooter, but I do have this kit, and it's hard to argue with the economy of it:

Buy Amaran HR672KIT-SSC Led Video Light | Aputure Store
Old 1 week ago
  #110
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How large of a group or area can you light with the Amaran?
Old 1 week ago
  #111
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2manyrocks View Post
How large of a group or area can you light with the Amaran?
I haven't tried to light anything like a larger group of subjects, but I'd guess not very large.

It may get you enough fill light to lift some shadows though. These are really meant more for studio photography, or close subjects in general; think lighting for an interview with the aforementioned lavs.

Unfortunately, if we're talking about large stage settings, large lights are what are required.

Aputure and other economy light companies do offer much brighter, non-panel lights, which you can use with diffusers, but everything gets a lot more complicated then, and even at the low end cost goes up dramatically. If/when battery power is still an option, you're looking at much more expensive batteries and plates, rather than the cheap Sony L batteries on the panels.
Old 1 week ago
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bwanajim View Post
3) Don't make the mistake of using a slow, wide range zoom, then compensate for it with high ISO. You'll end up with more noise than you want. If you're going to be shooting in dark places, you want fast optics. The Voigtlander manual lenses are my choice, as they have maximum apertures of f/0.95 and very smoothly damped focus actions. They make a 10.5mm, 17.5mm, 25mm, and 42.5mm. In full frame terms, these equate to 21mm, 35mm, 50mm and 85mm respectively. If you need longer zooms, and you need lens speed, Panasonic, Olympus and Leica make a variety of m4/3 lenses (provided you're on m4/3).
An excellent summary post on shooting concerts. I bought a couple of fast lenses, Leica 42 f1.2 and 12, f1.4 for the GH4, and am eyeing off the Voightlander 25 f0.95, but the big problem is that the focal plane is so miniscule, when wide open, that even half way back in the hall, only part of the ensemble will be sharp. Our concert lighting guys seem to be obsessed with dim'ish lighting on stage (not to mention weird colours against the orange timber), instead of turning those beautiful tungsten lights up. And its still hard not to get blown highlights trying to capture all the white piano keys against the hugely black Steinway and black clothing.

I have ordered the V-log profile for the GH4 and now the Inferno allows me to monitor log and get better focus than ever before. Its quite fun. But the comments I get are always about sound, which most video people seem to neglect.
Old 1 week ago
  #113
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Spearritt View Post
An excellent summary post on shooting concerts. I bought a couple of fast lenses, Leica 42 f1.2 and 12, f1.4 for the GH4, and am eyeing off the Voightlander 25 f0.95, but the big problem is that the focal plane is so miniscule, when wide open, that even half way back in the hall, only part of the ensemble will be sharp. Our concert lighting guys seem to be obsessed with dim'ish lighting on stage (not to mention weird colours against the orange timber), instead of turning those beautiful tungsten lights up. And its still hard not to get blown highlights trying to capture all the white piano keys against the hugely black Steinway and black clothing.

I have ordered the V-log profile for the GH4 and now the Inferno allows me to monitor log and get better focus than ever before. Its quite fun. But the comments I get are always about sound, which most video people seem to neglect.
I have a Sigma Contemporary 16mm f1.4 (32mm equivalent) that is fantastic in manual focus mode (it does af, but I use it in manual) and has great looking bokeh. Use it all the time these days. An affordable, quality alternative to the Voigtlanders (although those are nice too).
Old 1 week ago
  #114
Gear Maniac
 

The SLR Magic Cine lenses are also worth looking into. Veydra cine lenses are also great but the company is in crisis and it's not clear whether they'll come back. Most sources are sold out. Cine lenses generally have minimal focus breathing, which is a problem with many lenses designed for stills photography: the image zooms in or out very slightly when you focus. Not a problem for stills but can be noticeable in video. Cinema lenses have no or very little focus breathing and are also geared for using a follow focus (so you can focus manually without touching the lens itself).
Old 5 hours ago
  #115
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It's a bit of a long video, but here is a discussion of the Ninja V paired with the current mirrorless offerings from Fuji, Canon, Nikon and Leica followed by a discussion of dedicated video cameras. The video discusses the GH5 about 18:10 minutes into the video. FWIW and YMMV. YouTube
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