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DPA 4006 vs Schoeps MK2 - samples Condenser Microphones
Old 4 weeks ago
  #211
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Well the hammer hitting a string is only part of the story (and the spl generator !) Try doing that to a steel string in free, unenclosed air and see if you stand a chance of scaring an ant.

Put that same string in proximity of a sounding board and a lid and an enclosing body or chamber (same goes for a guitar on a smaller scale) and immediately you have multiple reflections off surfaces which lend amplitude to the hit (or pluck)

If we're talking inches away from several of these boundaries or cavities/resonating chambers and invoking an inverse square law for amplitude dissipation, then 130dB doesn't seem unrealistic.

It also seems like no place to put a microphone with any hope of generating a 'realistic' audio picture of a piano in a room or hall....but then we're talking raw, near-vertical transient spike percussion here, after all ...yes ?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #212
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boojum's Avatar
FWIW the DPA 4061 is designed to be attached to the structure of the inside of the piano. DPA says it can handle 144 dB and I believe them. I have used them and never have had one clip. I also doubt that I ever recorded anything near that loud.

Last edited by boojum; 4 weeks ago at 07:11 AM.. Reason: spelling
Old 4 weeks ago
  #213
Gear Maniac
 

Some years back, I had to record a starter gun shot to add the effect to an opera I was producing. It was in the same concert hall, same stage as the rest of the opera was recorded. All I could remember was that it was overloading the system with all the gain trim turned to as low as they go. I had no idea how loud the gun shot really was in terms of SPL in the hall but it was loud. However, I did stick a sound meter in front of my mouth and yelled at it; it was over 120dB. Say it was about 5 inches between the mic and my vocal box. My point is things can get loud quickly if the distance is short.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #214
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Plush's Avatar
None of it matters because sane people working on real productions don’t work the way that one needs 130dB+ capability.

Shouting at 120dB?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jnorman View Post
Here a great little article talking about Michael Bishop ands his use of ribbons:
Michael Bishop Uses Royer Microphones To Win 10th Grammy - ProSoundWeb
Yes, The Lark Ascending sounds absolutely beautiful on that recording.

But I miss the airy top end, open, deep bass of condensers on the full orchestra. All ribbons strike me as a bit "midrangy" as times and a bit veiled.

But for near field use and other applications, I understand where you are coming from. Ribbons on strings do sound silky and don't pick up as much "bow hair on metal string sound" as condensers do.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #216
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jnorman's Avatar
Shosty- I agree. Ribbons are the perfect near field tool for many instruments, but as you near the diffuse field, condensers really start to shine.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #217
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ISedlacek's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
I can't help - over the years I have tried so many possible microphones, wanted to get something yet better than Schoeps or the same good, but I always end at MK2 for acoustic instruments ... Simply perfect, full natural, detailed sound. Even other Schoeps capsules (I have MK21 and MK22) I don't almost use. Whatever I try and compare, MK2 sounds somehow always better. I tried some ribbons too ... The sound is good (especially Samar), but with soft, delicate acoustic instruments, the noise issue comes quickly on the surface.

Should you be interested, here is for example a recent recording on Schoeps MK2 (with Rens Hejnis mode) brought in the form of a video (with Forssell SMP-2 preamp and MADA-2 converter)



or a studio video (again MK2)

Old 3 weeks ago
  #218
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jimjazzdad's Avatar
Ivo, I would be interested to know how you recorded Autumn Dreams, including the 'Foley' recording of the footsteps. And lovely music too. Kudos!
Old 3 weeks ago
  #219
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ISedlacek's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimjazzdad View Post
Ivo, I would be interested to know how you recorded Autumn Dreams, including the 'Foley' recording of the footsteps. And lovely music too. Kudos!
Well - Schoeps MK2 AB position for both instruments (recorded separately -hang drum first and then violins to it ...). Footsteps - just Canon 5D camera mic
Old 3 weeks ago
  #220
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jimjazzdad's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ISedlacek View Post
Well - Schoeps MK2 AB position for both instruments (recorded separately -hang drum first and then violins to it ...). Footsteps - just Canon 5D camera mic
Thank you. But were the violin and handpan recorded 'open-air'? And if so, did you have blimps on them...or what?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #221
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ISedlacek's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimjazzdad View Post
Thank you. But were the violin and handpan recorded 'open-air'? And if so, did you have blimps on them...or what?
No, the music recorded only the studio ... nothing outside (the intention of the video was not a kind of live performance)
Old 3 weeks ago
  #222
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jimjazzdad's Avatar
Ah. I thought as much. Well done though - very nice, evocative video.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #223
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whippoorwill's Avatar
Very nice video and music Ivo, the violin attack detail is a tad much, and it could sit back a little, level-wise, compared to the hang.
These are minor notes (and what do I know?), this is excellent and relaxing stuff with some interesting digressions into strange tonalities. That is very refreshing in the context of relaxed music.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #224
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Plush's Avatar
Only the Schoeps MK2 could produce this sound. DPA would have sounded more metallic. Highly undesirable.

Thank you, Ivo.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #225
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Nice Ivo !
What is this violin ?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #226
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ISedlacek's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathieujm View Post
Nice Ivo !
What is this violin ?
Well, these are my special "astral" violins with 5 playing strings (combining violin and viola) and a number of sympathetic strings that give the instruments very impressive 3D sound with "reverb". I cannot pla a normal violin any more, feels like a small Chinese toy to me comparing to it + I have to "milk" it a lot to produce a sound + sounds very dry :D (although I studied it professionally, played my whole life and I own 2 very great violins



more info: http://www.ivosedlacek.com
Old 2 weeks ago
  #227
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jnorman's Avatar
Ivo - as usual, very nice work, and I assume you wrote that interesting little piece. If you don’t mind, I would be interested in hearing about what kind of reverb you used, type, settings, etc. it is an evocative sounding space. Thanks.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #228
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ISedlacek's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by jnorman View Post
Ivo - as usual, very nice work, and I assume you wrote that interesting little piece. If you don’t mind, I would be interested in hearing about what kind of reverb you used, type, settings, etc. it is an evocative sounding space. Thanks.
Thank you. Well, it is not really "written" - just improvised ... Reverb - Lexicon Random Hall about 3,5 sec.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #229
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plush View Post
Only the Schoeps MK2 could produce this sound. DPA would have sounded more metallic. Highly undesirable.

Thank you, Ivo.
I don't know why the 4006 would produce a highly undesirable sound, just use the trapezium grids or use a good tone control and your ears to decide where and how much to cut.
Old 1 week ago
  #230
Gear Maniac
 

Love it. What I notice is the beautiful capturing of the timbral complexity of the instruments, especially the violin.
Old 1 week ago
  #231
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tourtelot's Avatar
Funny that after all these years, I am currently in love with the 4006 mics with the free-field grids and the 40mm APE for large ensembles. I have the Mk2 Schoeps as well and , right now, really dig the sound of the DPAs. Just the prettiest girl in the room right now. Could go back to the Schoeps at any moment.

BTW, anyone heard the Naxos Rachmaninoff All-night Vigil, Op.37.

Engineered and mastered by a man named Keith Johnson. Nice job. Is Keith on the blog? I'd love to hear the story of this recording.

Check it out if you can.

D.
Old 1 week ago
  #232
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tourtelot's Avatar
Old 1 week ago
  #233
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jnorman's Avatar
Thanks Doug - interesting article.
Old 1 day ago
  #234
Quote:
Originally Posted by tourtelot View Post
Funny that after all these years, I am currently in love with the 4006 mics with the free-field grids and the 40mm APE for large ensembles.
Something beautiful happens with the 40mm APEs, I totally agree and also like to use them a lot. The 50mm APEs, however, just don't work well for me, even though it is not such a big difference in size. Did you choose the smaller ones after auditioning both?

Best,
Dirk
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