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I got a call to do a remote recording both audio and video...but
Old 4 weeks ago
  #1
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Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 

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I got a call to do a remote recording both audio and video...but

I was out and the person calling left me a message but forgot to leave his call back number...I suppose he thought I had caller ID on my land line. I hope he calls back. The gig sounded interesting. FWIW
Old 4 weeks ago
  #2
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That has to make your butt itch!
Hugh
Old 4 weeks ago
  #3
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
I was out and the person calling left me a message but forgot to leave his call back number...I suppose he thought I had caller ID on my land line. I hope he calls back. The gig sounded interesting. FWIW
Meanwhile, you've enabled call-logging, right?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #4
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Remoteness's Avatar
I feel your pain that's why I have caller ID on my landline.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #5
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whats a Land Line !! just kiddiing .. hope they call back for you !! and what kind of person does not leave their phone number and email when looking for someoone to do work for them
Old 4 weeks ago
  #6
Gear Addict
If you get it right away, couldn't you
hit *69 to dial back the last caller?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7
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I did the *69 and got this message from my phone company "that feature is not currently available on your phone" NICE (Frontier Communications). The guy did email me and we are in touch so that makes this a "happy" ending. Now we have to come to an agreement on price...that maybe the hardest thing to do.

I wanted to get caller ID BUT Frontier does not offer it as a separate add on. They "bundle it" with a bunch of other "enhancements" and charge $13.00 a month for the "enhancements" most of which I would never use.

Thanks for all the good thoughts... much appreciated.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
I did the *69 and got this message from my phone company "that feature is not currently available on your phone" NICE (Frontier Communications). The guy did email me and we are in touch so that makes this a "happy" ending. Now we have to come to an agreement on price...that maybe the hardest thing to do.

I wanted to get caller ID BUT Frontier does not offer it as a separate add on. They "bundle it" with a bunch of other "enhancements" and charge $13.00 a month for the "enhancements" most of which I would never use.

Thanks for all the good thoughts... much appreciated.
good to hear !!! good luck with the Gig !!!
Old 4 weeks ago
  #9
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I gave him the estimate based on the following...

90+ miles round trip to the venue
3 persons (one audio engineer and two videographers)
Recording most of one day with rehearsal recordings and post production included in the estimate.

This is what I got back from him

Hi Tom,

Thanks for the update! Is there anyway to adjust the situation to get a cheaper package? Shortening the time, fewer videographers, etc. I’d like to know the full range of options before we proceed.

I look forward to working with you soon!



I think I am going to change the name of my company to "Tom's cut rate recording services" or maybe Walmart/Amazon Recording. One from column "A" two from Column "B". We do it YOUR way no matter the cost.



This is what I am tentatively sending him back.

I got your email.

Unfortunately, I cannot do any better on price. If this were in Oberlin it might be possible, but to drive 90+ miles round trip in uncertain weather conditions and produce a professional quality DVD and CD it is about as inexpensive as I can do it. Suggest you contact XXXX XXXX at Oberlin College. Maybe he has a couple of students who could do this cheaper. You could also contact the Oberlin Film Department to see if a couple of students may want to tape the concert for the experience. I understand that sometimes they can get credit for this type of work or you can work out something monetarily with them.

I would love to do this job for you but for the recording, the transportation and the post production this is what we charge. It is the same rate we would charge XXXX or the XXXXs, both of whom we have worked with in the past.

Thanks for thinking about us.



Old 4 weeks ago
  #10
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Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
This is what I am tentatively sending him back...
Seems to me your bullet points could use some rearranging. And you're making it awfully easy for the guy to get it cheaper without pointing out the downsides of doing so. So I attempted a little rewrite...

The rate we're charging you is the same as we've charged X and Y in the past.
Since that time, our costs of doing business have continually risen, but I'm still willing to give you their rate.

Exploring alternatives, you might be able to find some student-amateurs with hobbyist-level equipment through Oberlin College. That would be cheaper. But if you want the work done on professional gear they'd have to rent it, a significant line item, and they'd have to learn to use it for the first time in a pressure situation (most concerts don't have do-overs). Also, it's a 90+ mile round trip -- that costs the same regardless of the expertise of the passengers.

Someone like that might also be able to handle the post-production -- I'd ask to see samples of their past work -- but if they're going to be learning on the job, you might consider letting them learn on someone else's.

We would love to do this job for you. But this is what we have to charge.

Thanks,

Tom
Old 4 weeks ago
  #11
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I changed the email to reflect your suggestions. Thanks sooooooooooo much!

Our rates are low to begin with and then people want to pare them down even father. Not fun
Old 4 weeks ago
  #12
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Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Glad I could help. Now let's see if I actually did. :-)
Old 4 weeks ago
  #13
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Obviously I don't know all the specifics, but I don't understand why you wouldn't offer a cheaper product - one that you would acknowledge is more of an archival quality setup. Perhaps with just one or two static video camera shots and possibly simpler audio. Something a team of two or even one could accomplish.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #14
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Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
Glad I could help. Now let's see if I actually did. :-)

I got this back:

I fully understand, I’d like to go ahead and proceed with the $XXX.XX package. I just wanted a full list of options, so I understand that this package is our only option. If you’re still willing to take us on, I’d love to work with you!

Let me know! If so, could you send information on payment and contract terms?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
I got this back:

I fully understand, I’d like to go ahead and proceed with the $XXX.XX package. I just wanted a full list of options, so I understand that this package is our only option. If you’re still willing to take us on, I’d love to work with you!

Let me know! If so, could you send information on payment and contract terms?
so you have the job at your price !! nice ..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #16
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Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bixby View Post
Obviously I don't know all the specifics, but I don't understand why you wouldn't offer a cheaper product - one that you would acknowledge is more of an archival quality setup. Perhaps with just one or two static video camera shots and possibly simpler audio. Something a team of two or even one could accomplish.
Because once you start to compromise there is no end in sight. Been there done that. These types of clients want the whole enchilada but only want to pay for the wrapping. I have tried the other route that you suggested and it has never worked in my favor. They want a network quality production even at the cheapest rate and if you don't provide what they are expecting they get upset and start bad mouthing me and my company even though they wanted to go the cheapest route (but they never tell anyone that part of the story). Most people today are living in a WalMart world. They want quality but at bargain basement prices.

It is still a production and I still need to have the equipment (which I paid for) and my associates, who I pay, to do even the stripped down production and I still need to pay someone for the editing and post.

We recently needed an additional videographer for a shoot. She charged me for her time 1/2 of what we were charging for the whole concert. Videographers do not come cheap.

Two videographers plus an audio engineer is what we are providing. Plus my 22 years of experience doing this plus the professionalism we bring to the project. I think a lot of people today think we are going to show up with an IPad for video and a Stereo chip recorder and that will be what they are getting for their money. When you try and explain the quality you are bringing to the table their eyes glaze over and they stop listening.

In this case the person can find someone else to do the recording if they so chose. I called around and most other companies are charging 2 to 3 times as much as we are for the same services. One place was four times as expensive for an audio video shoot.

FWIW
Old 3 weeks ago
  #17
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fred2bern's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
I called around and most other companies are charging 2 to 3 times as much as we are for the same services. One place was four times as expensive for an audio video shoot.
FWIW
Maybe you should think about it...
If these companies know that you are 3 times cheaper, they'll write exactly what you wrote upper, thinking about your offer...
Old 3 weeks ago
  #18
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
I called around and most other companies are charging 2 to 3 times as much as we are for the same services. One place was four times as expensive for an audio video shoot.
Asking simply out of curiosity: did you pose as someone when making your inquiries, or were the quotes for a more generic gig, e.g., x hours, 2 cams, multitrack audio, etc.? Just wondering how you got informative quotes up front...
Old 3 weeks ago
  #19
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Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrReid View Post
Asking simply out of curiosity: did you pose as someone when making your inquiries, or were the quotes for a more generic gig, e.g., x hours, 2 cams, multitrack audio, etc.? Just wondering how you got informative quotes up front...
Very good question. When I get those kinds of calls the very first thing I do is ask for all the person's contact information, mostly because I'm a slob about that kind of thing. Sometimes at that point the person abruptly hangs up.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
Very good question. When I get those kinds of calls the very first thing I do is ask for all the person's contact information, mostly because I'm a slob about that kind of thing. Sometimes at that point the person abruptly hangs up.
I wish you would Stop Hanging up on Me !!!
Old 3 weeks ago
  #21
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Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrReid View Post
Asking simply out of curiosity: did you pose as someone when making your inquiries, or were the quotes for a more generic gig, e.g., x hours, 2 cams, multitrack audio, etc.? Just wondering how you got informative quotes up front...
I called and gave them the information exactly as I had been given it and asked for a quote. Most wanted more information before giving me an exact quote so I told them to ball park it. I don't believe in subterfuge but I had to get some information and this seemed like a good way to proceed.

When I get these types of calls the first thing I ask is for a contact person's name and/or email or phone number. Many times they don't give me that information or hang up when I ask them for a contact person. It is pretty typical for us to get one or two of these a month. Mostly for our video production side of the business.

I think the correct name for this type of inquiry is "shopping around"

FWIW
Old 3 weeks ago
  #22
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jwh1192's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
I called and gave them the information exactly as I had been given it and asked for a quote. Most wanted more information before giving me an exact quote so I told them to ball park it. I don't believe in subterfuge but I had to get some information and this seemed like a good way to proceed.

When I get these types of calls the first thing I ask is for a contact person's name and/or email or phone number. Many times they don't give me that information or hang up when I ask them for a contact person. It is pretty typical for us to get one or two of these a month. Mostly for our video production side of the business.

I think the correct name for this type of inquiry is "shopping around"

FWIW
shopping around .. or "Getting Several Quotes" from Competitors !!! we are going through the "bidding process" for a show right now .. due to some regular companies not wnating to do a few smaller jobs .. ie: we do not need a 53' Expando truck for this Job .. or not needing a Full Audio Recording Truck for this one .. it is really nice to have all the Toys in the B-Unit at your fingertips but not for this .. the smaller jobs are always the hardest ..

cheers john
Old 1 week ago
  #23
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Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
OK so today is the gig. The weather forecast is calling for severe thunderstorms right at the time the concert starts. <OH JOY!> The client has requested another camera to be on him for the entire time (we wants to use this as a "promo piece" for his conducting skills). We are going to use a fixed camera with no operator. We are going to record the rehearsals and the concert. I will let you know how it goes. Hopefully the client does not add anything else.

FWIW
Old 1 week ago
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
The client has requested another camera to be on him for the entire time (we wants to use this as a "promo piece" for his conducting skills).
That's an additional, billable, item...outside the scope of the original quote. It could well end up being the most 'valuable' footage of the gig....
Old 1 week ago
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 View Post
That's an additional, billable, item...outside the scope of the original quote. It could well end up being the most 'valuable' footage of the gig....
Knock...
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Old 1 week ago
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
OK so today is the gig. The weather forecast is calling for severe thunderstorms right at the time the concert starts. <OH JOY!> The client has requested another camera to be on him for the entire time (we wants to use this as a "promo piece" for his conducting skills). We are going to use a fixed camera with no operator. We are going to record the rehearsals and the concert. I will let you know how it goes. Hopefully the client does not add anything else.

FWIW
we are all pulling for you for a good gig .. Break a Leg !!! and good weather !!
Old 1 week ago
  #27
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Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
OK so here is what happened.

On Saturday night I started passing a kidney stone...not fun so I was in some pain during the gig.

We got to the church early and had a very easy load in (one trip from my vehicle with my dolly, up a ramp and into the church)

Set up went well. No one from the ensemble was there. The rehearsal was suppose to start at 2 pm. We were set. The rehearsal started at 2:15 pm. There was a placement problem with the camera on the conductor so we were unable to video him during the rehearsal. We fixed the problem after the rehearsal. The rehearsal ended at 4:00 pm. There was suppose to be a pre-concert lecture at 4:30 pm which never happened. Concert started at 5 pm and was part of a church Vesper service. We were told the whole service was suppose to be one hour and seven minutes. In reality it was one hour and thirty seven minutes. Thankfully all of our gear had enough memory to accommodate the extra time. The conductor and person who hired us said afterwards that he was not told about all the "extras" done as part of the Vesper service and that is why there was a discrepancy. The audio sounded good in the headphone but I have not listened to it in my studio. The video looked good on the camera's 7" HD Monitors but have not seen the video on our color corrected monitors.

One big problem was the organ. It was way to loud and drowned out the singers and the instrumentalist during the rehearsals. The tracker action organ was tuned to the room and sounded FANTASTIC but the organist liked to play loud. I talked to the conductor and the church's organist (not the one who was playing) and they talked to the organist and during the concert he was much quieter and the blend was much better.

I used a Rode NT-4 on a very tall light stand for the concert. It was fed into two Tascam chip recorders running at 48 kHz and 24 bits. I was going to bring my two channel Focusrite preamp but there was no space for it in the Highlander.

I will let you know how the whole concert turned out once I have had a chance to view the videos and listen to the audio. Thanks for all the great comments and suggestions.

As to the weather. There was a tornado warning before the concert and it rained hard during the concert with one big clap of thunder just before a piece. When I got home (30 miles west of the gig) my house and driveway were covered with leaves and we had a lot of rain on our way home. OH JOY!
Old 1 week ago
  #28
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So, all told, a "pretty standard gig" then, with the usual conflagration of predictables, 'known unknowns', curve balls and timing idiosyncracies As always, you survive them, and live to tell the tale !

I still harbour this suspicion that it was really "all about the conductor' though....
Old 1 week ago
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 View Post
So, all told, a "pretty standard gig" then, with the usual conflagration of predictables, 'known unknowns', curve balls and timing idiosyncracies As always, you survive them, and live to tell the tale !

I still harbour this suspicion that it was really "all about the conductor' though....
BINGO!!!
Old 1 week ago
  #30
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Hope you're feeling better Tom. Kidney stones are no fun!
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