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Sonnox vs Waves Rens Dynamics Plugins
Old 12th September 2011
  #1
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Sonnox vs Waves Rens

Which plugins do you guys prefer? I'm trying to mix these vocals and I have a major problem with the S's. I also wanted to see which mix you guys think is better. This first mix has Sonnox Dynamics, Sonnox EQ, Sonnox SuprEsser, Sonnox Inflator, and Sonnox Reverb.



This next mix has Waves RenVox, RenComp, Ren EQ, Sonnox SuprEsser (only de-esser I have), and Sonnox Reverb (only reverb I have).




Neither of these mixes have a limiter on the Master. Do you guys have any advice of what I should do for the S's? I'm already using the SuprEsser and it's getting around 5-8 attenuation, and the S's are still hissing pretty bad!

Any advice on the mix overall? Are the vocals muddy? Too trebly? I hope you guys can help me out. Thanks.
Old 12th September 2011
  #2
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LunchboxHo's Avatar
 

You know, I find the SuprEssr a bit less transparent than seems to be commonly felt, but this could be a lack of skill on my part. Have you tried it, combined with some precision notching? Maybe a stooopid suggestion..... But always works for me with truly tough sibilance. Also, Village People has a De-Essr I've used which is really destructive but can be useful for problem tracks.... All IMHO. Hope it helps. I feel your pain, though -- sibilance taming is a skill I've yet to convincingly master
Old 12th September 2011
  #3
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well to me the bottom mix vocals sounded abit warmer. Well I find that best deesing is when you manually duck ssss'es with volume automation. Its all about your skills (I don't mean u suck I mean u just need to practice just like myself). In general the mix lacks of separation and depth. Don't forget that main thing is hugely dependant on your source material. I noticed if vocals are recorded well I can raise way more air without adding too much sibilance. Send me over your multitrack if u want to I could try to do my own rough mix and if u will like it I could tell exactly what I did
Old 12th September 2011
  #4
Here for the gear
 

In my opinion, the vocals in the first mix are the weakest link of the track. The second example sounds a bit warmer, has more clarity, and is beginning to stand on it's own nicely.

If I were you, I would go ahead and remix the instruments behind the second vocal example (or if you have another vocal example that you like even more). See where you're at after the remix and do your best to diagnose a next step.
Old 12th September 2011
  #5
Gear Head
 

Don't be afraid to use 2 deessers! I've seen it done by major mixing engineers and have done it myself. Also where is your deesser in the chain? Try it first before everything then squash the **** out of your S's so they're almost completely out. You can go back after and boost some high end to add clarity without worrying about those S's. This is a technique I learned from an engineer who mixed a bunch of main steam music.
Old 13th September 2011
  #6
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E.rOk.stA's Avatar
 

I think what Ramil said is a good starting point. You could do 1 of these or a little of all of these.

1. Is re-recording the vox an option? If so, try tilting the mike to the side a little, it's called "off axis". This reduces sibilance sometimes. Or, you may need to back off the pop filter. Sometimes air hitting it (if it's metal) exaggerates the s's. If you can pull it off, tilt your head to the side slightly every time you say something with an S.

2. Use an EQ first in the chain like the RenEQ or Sonnox EQ where you have a graphic so you can see the cuts and boosts you're making. Now take one of the points, put it to a narrow Q and boost it +12db. Sweep it up from 4k to 8k. Find where your S's are hangin' out. It may be more than 1 spot. Keep the narrow Q and cut that frequency by 2db or so.

3. Go in and manually duck the volumes of every S. This will sound the most natural.

4. Use Spitfish, a free VST de-esser or just keep playing with the de-essers you already like.

I liked mix #2 better BTW.
Old 13th September 2011
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ramil View Post
well to me the bottom mix vocals sounded abit warmer. Well I find that best deesing is when you manually duck ssss'es with volume automation. Its all about your skills (I don't mean u suck I mean u just need to practice just like myself). In general the mix lacks of separation and depth. Don't forget that main thing is hugely dependant on your source material. I noticed if vocals are recorded well I can raise way more air without adding too much sibilance. Send me over your multitrack if u want to I could try to do my own rough mix and if u will like it I could tell exactly what I did
Do you have the plug ins that I mentioned? If so, I would love to send you the vocals and the beat for you to mix (using the same plug ins I have). This way, I can see exactly what you did and understand how to get to that point myself.

On another note, how do you manually duck the S's? Do I automate the volume of the troubling S's down a few dBs?
Old 13th September 2011
  #8
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ramil's Avatar
 

i have access to same plugins at uni studios so there shouldn't be a problem as long u got mac (I believe same seetings wouldnt be recaled on windows based maschines). Yes, I literally by using volume automation turn down the level of fader (depending on material might be a few dB or might be 5 or 6dB..) I am not a pro but I recon I could share some techniques that I've learned so far with you so we improve both. I'm workin on PT if ur session isn't a PT just email me a link with wav files 24bit 48khz. waiting for your email
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