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Microphone Effects HELP!!!!!! Condenser Microphones
Old 26th November 2009
  #1
Gear Nut
 

Microphone Effects HELP!!!!!!

Please somebody please help me. Its driving me mad trying to figure out how to record properly. I record my music at a friends, and the mixing alone makes me want to kill myself.Ive got a few questions. What microphone effects does jay z and nas and the likes use,I dont understand how they can record at one studio, and just pick up where they left off at another, clearly the program,mic,setup is going to be way different. My friend uses podfarm and acid 6.0 to record with,podfarm has thousands of vocal effects to choose from but I sware each and everyone of them are dull,very dead sounding,no life behind the actual effect. Once i find one mic effect that does sound like it has life and rich sounding it has to much echo or mix to it. There has to be some sort of universal microphone effect that is just the default sound of you through the mic, i cant seem to find one.Out of all the mic effects ive pritty much just got it down to two effects, one is called Blues Vocal which projects your voice pretty well, with the tiniest bit of echo. I use that effect when im recording to a track or beat that is very plain ,a track that doesnt have a million sounds everywhere. For the more ambient type track I use an effect called Vintage vocal which to me magnifys my voice the same as blues vocal but has an ambient type echo to it for the tracks that have more sounds going on. But even these effects arent coming out 100%,as a matter of not even close to that. What do most 1 vocal track rappers rap through? What effect? Please someone break down some **** for me.
Old 26th November 2009
  #2
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piccazzo's Avatar
 

Search , read , practice and learn everything about mixing.

There´s no short and easy answer.
If you cant do the time don´t do the grime.
Old 26th November 2009
  #3
Gear Nut
 
pistolgrip's Avatar
i'd have to agree with piccazzo. but a few things to get u set in the right direction: compression, EQ, panning, reverb.

good luck!
Old 26th November 2009
  #4
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phillysoulman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JaeAudio View Post
Please somebody please help me. Its driving me mad trying to figure out how to record properly. I record my music at a friends, and the mixing alone makes me want to kill myself.Ive got a few questions. What microphone effects does jay z and nas and the likes use,I dont understand how they can record at one studio, and just pick up where they left off at another, clearly the program,mic,setup is going to be way different. My friend uses podfarm and acid 6.0 to record with,podfarm has thousands of vocal effects to choose from but I sware each and everyone of them are dull,very dead sounding,no life behind the actual effect. Once i find one mic effect that does sound like it has life and rich sounding it has to much echo or mix to it. There has to be some sort of universal microphone effect that is just the default sound of you through the mic, i cant seem to find one.Out of all the mic effects ive pritty much just got it down to two effects, one is called Blues Vocal which projects your voice pretty well, with the tiniest bit of echo. I use that effect when im recording to a track or beat that is very plain ,a track that doesnt have a million sounds everywhere. For the more ambient type track I use an effect called Vintage vocal which to me magnifys my voice the same as blues vocal but has an ambient type echo to it for the tracks that have more sounds going on. But even these effects arent coming out 100%,as a matter of not even close to that. What do most 1 vocal track rappers rap through? What effect? Please someone break down some **** for me.
First of all,when you record your vocals,record them DRY which means without any effects.
Then,later when you mix your stuff,then you apply your effects to taste.

Its gonna take a very long time to grasp this stuff,but with perserverance and tenacity,you might get it.

And btw,please learn to spell correctly while you are at it.
Old 26th November 2009
  #5
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillysoulman View Post
First of all,when you record your vocals,record them DRY which means without any effects.
Then,later when you mix your stuff,then you apply your effects to taste.

Its gonna take a very long time to grasp this stuff,but with perserverance and tenacity,you might get it.

And btw,please learn to spell correctly while you are at it.
The only time I use effects while tracking is when I monitor the vox. If there's too much bass, I EQ it so the singer can listen to his/her voice, or reverb for added confidence, but never would I record these changes.
Old 27th November 2009
  #6
Gear Nut
 

I might of spelled two words tops wrong? I know how to mix thats my not my concern. Im just wondering about MICROPHONE EFFECTS and how they differ.What are rappers rapping through? Like I said I record on podfarm and you have to choose an effect before recording, Ive never tried recording without it, and I dont think my dude would want to try.Obviously amongst proffesional studios there must be an effect rappers use that all sound the same , or why even record at different studios? What microphone effect you think jay-z is using in this video,because im looking for either the same effect or something similar.
YouTube - Jay Z Making "99 problems"
Again I know how to mix and what not, Im just concerned with the effects you actually record through(not the ones you add afterwards)
Check out the mixes I have on on my page, lemme know what can be done.
Jae on MySpace Music - Free Streaming MP3s, Pictures & Music Videos
Get back to me ASAP im working on a very important album.
Old 27th November 2009
  #7
Positive that Jay-z just raps, listens to his voice and that's it.
Old 27th November 2009
  #8
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sleeper1400's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JaeAudio View Post
I might of spelled two words tops wrong? I know how to mix thats my not my concern. Im just wondering about MICROPHONE EFFECTS and how they differ.What are rappers rapping through? Like I said I record on podfarm and you have to choose an effect before recording, Ive never tried recording without it, and I dont think my dude would want to try.Obviously amongst proffesional studios there must be an effect rappers use that all sound the same , or why even record at different studios? What microphone effect you think jay-z is using in this video,because im looking for either the same effect or something similar.
YouTube - Jay Z Making "99 problems"
Again I know how to mix and what not, Im just concerned with the effects you actually record through(not the ones you add afterwards)
Check out the mixes I have on on my page, lemme know what can be done.
Jae on MySpace Music - Free Streaming MP3s, Pictures & Music Videos
Get back to me ASAP im working on a very important album.
look, you dont know how to mix, i can tell just by the things your saying.

but thats o.k. because your trying to learn.

id recommend doing some reading,

Amazon.com: The Mixing Engineer's Handbook, Second Edition (9781598632514): Bobby Owsinski: Books

this is a terrific book that you will find yourself going back to for years.

also, the DAW your using, whichever it is, go buy a book on that too.
youtube is a good resource for free vids with tips on your software as well.

when u say "microphone effects"

what u mean in engineer talk are
time based effects, and dynamic based effects.

time based efx are exactly what they mean, they affect time.
reverb and delay, chorus and flanging etc..

dynamic based efx deal with the volume.
compression limiting EQ and gating.

those subjects are coverd in the above book i linked.
once you spend some time learning about those effects, you will be able to tell what jay z,jimmy hendrix, or anybody is doing with "microphone efx"

hope that helps.
Old 27th November 2009
  #9
That book really helped me understand engineering and mixing. Highly Recommended.
Old 27th November 2009
  #10
Gear Nut
 

what u mean in engineer talk are
time based effects, and dynamic based effects.

time based efx are exactly what they mean, they affect time.
reverb and delay, chorus and flanging etc..

dynamic based efx deal with the volume.
compression limiting EQ and gating.

________________________________________

Those are all effects you use aferward you record im talking actual microphone effects.


where it says trench+sandiego........at the top...thats a long list of microphone effects you RECORD through...for example you pick trench+sandiego....you go in the booth start talking and it sounds like that...or you scroll down that list and pick from 10000 other effects and they all sound like something else..i was wondering on most setups do you pick an effect like this then go and record....and if so what do you think jay z is using in that video....

My questions APPPLY to the mix.....but not the actual MIXING EFFECTS....MIC EFFECTS
Old 27th November 2009
  #11
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phillysoulman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JaeAudio View Post
what u mean in engineer talk are
time based effects, and dynamic based effects.

time based efx are exactly what they mean, they affect time.
reverb and delay, chorus and flanging etc..

dynamic based efx deal with the volume.
compression limiting EQ and gating.

________________________________________

Those are all effects you use aferward you record im talking actual microphone effects.


where it says trench+sandiego........at the top...thats a long list of microphone effects you RECORD through...for example you pick trench+sandiego....you go in the booth start talking and it sounds like that...or you scroll down that list and pick from 10000 other effects and they all sound like something else..i was wondering on most setups do you pick an effect like this then go and record....and if so what do you think jay z is using in that video....

My questions APPPLY to the mix.....but not the actual MIXING EFFECTS....MIC EFFECTS
Brother,let me just say it plain....
You havent got a clue.
Please just go and buy every book and video you can get a hold of and take about two years to read and absorb everything and then holla back.
Otherwise,forget about it.
Old 27th November 2009
  #12
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillysoulman View Post
Brother,let me just say it plain....
You havent got a clue.
Please just go and buy every book and video you can get a hold of and take about two years to read and absorb everything and then holla back.
Otherwise,forget about it.
I've been on Phillys back about him being harsh, but I gotta give him the +1 here... You really sound like you have no clue what you're doing neither with the recording nor the mixing. Let me be clear that I'm not saying that to down you, it's to help you see that you might need to learn a lot more before you're able to get the results you want. The info on how to get the results you're after is accessible in the books recommended and hours of practice - not in telling you to use XXYY effect on your vocals.
Old 27th November 2009
  #13
Gear Head
 

The bottom line is the quality of the components, the microphone, a/d converters, mic pre, compresser etc. The effects would have a very minor effect compared to the rest. In other words, you can't add effects to a $10 microphone to make it sound like a $5000 mic. Can you sound good with a $10 mic, certainly!
Old 27th November 2009
  #14
Gear Nut
 

holy ****............i have people that can do all that for me.....i guess everyone whos on these forums dont know how to answer questions directly.......if i ask one question someone answers with something else that has nothing to do with what im asking....jesus ...
NEVERMIND SINCE NOONE ON HERE KNOWS HOW TO BE INFORMATIVE...
Old 27th November 2009
  #15
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phillysoulman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JaeAudio View Post
holy ****............i have people that can do all that for me.....i guess everyone whos on these forums dont know how to answer questions directly.......if i ask one question someone answers with something else that has nothing to do with what im asking....jesus ...
NEVERMIND SINCE NOONE ON HERE KNOWS HOW TO BE INFORMATIVE...
I WAS being informative,bro.
Old 27th November 2009
  #16
Lives for gear
 
phillysoulman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by T. Gundersen View Post
I've been on Phillys back about him being harsh, but I gotta give him the +1 here... You really sound like you have no clue what you're doing neither with the recording nor the mixing. Let me be clear that I'm not saying that to down you, it's to help you see that you might need to learn a lot more before you're able to get the results you want. The info on how to get the results you're after is accessible in the books recommended and hours of practice - not in telling you to use XXYY effect on your vocals.
I only am harsh when stupid and ascenine questions are posted.
Otherwise,Im a teddy bear...ask those who know me well and they can attest to that.
Old 27th November 2009
  #17
Gear Nut
 

philly you have AIM or nething?
Old 27th November 2009
  #18
Gear Nut
 

no question is stupid.
Old 27th November 2009
  #19
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DivineMusic's Avatar
 

JaeAudio, you dont know how to mix.. simple as that.. sorry, thats just how it is...
there is not special plugin or special effect thats used.... strictly a quality front end and converters....nothing more nothing less...

when mixing add some eq, compression, reverb delay etc and mixdown.... its that simple.

its time for you to learn what your doing...
Old 27th November 2009
  #20
Quote:
Originally Posted by JaeAudio View Post
holy ****............i have people that can do all that for me.....i guess everyone whos on these forums dont know how to answer questions directly.......if i ask one question someone answers with something else that has nothing to do with what im asking....jesus ...
NEVERMIND SINCE NOONE ON HERE KNOWS HOW TO BE INFORMATIVE...
That's the problem, you come here, thinking that we'll tell you all the answers, when really, you need to find them for yourself by reading books, by trying out gear etc. This is not a recording 101 section. This is not a beginner section, and you will have to read books to learn what's going on.

I will give you a hint of what you may be looking for:

1. Mic preamp
2. LDC Condenser Microphone
3. Acoustic Treated Room
4. Parametric EQ
5. Compressor
6. De-Esser
7. Mic Technique and Mic Placement
8. AD/DA conversion

Go on google, and search for these things. As much as we can give you the right tools, you'll only be as good as the guy tweaking them, hence you. You need to comprehend what each of these things do before you think of recording vox. If you don't want to take the time to learn, go to a studio that will point you in the right direction, hence to the mic in the booth.
Old 27th November 2009
  #21
Lives for gear
 
phillysoulman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JaeAudio View Post
no question is stupid.
wanna bet??
Old 27th November 2009
  #22
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phillysoulman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JaeAudio View Post
philly you have AIM or nething?
whats nething?
Old 27th November 2009
  #23
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DivineMusic's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by phillysoulman View Post
whats nething?
LMFAO heh
Old 27th November 2009
  #24
Gear Maniac
 
Blake Eiseman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by JaeAudio View Post
what u mean in engineer talk are
time based effects, and dynamic based effects.

time based efx are exactly what they mean, they affect time.
reverb and delay, chorus and flanging etc..

dynamic based efx deal with the volume.
compression limiting EQ and gating.

________________________________________

Those are all effects you use aferward you record im talking actual microphone effects.


where it says trench+sandiego........at the top...thats a long list of microphone effects you RECORD through...for example you pick trench+sandiego....you go in the booth start talking and it sounds like that...or you scroll down that list and pick from 10000 other effects and they all sound like something else..i was wondering on most setups do you pick an effect like this then go and record....and if so what do you think jay z is using in that video....

My questions APPPLY to the mix.....but not the actual MIXING EFFECTS....MIC EFFECTS
I'll try to answer your question because I think you are getting confused by marketing speak created by a company that sold you a piece of equipment.

I've never heard the term "Mic effect" before, and the screenshot you showed looks like Line 6. Is it software that came with a Line 6 audio interface? If so, they are feeding you a line of bulls**t... basically you are scrolling through a series of "effects" that are supposed to emulate high end studio gear, microphones, mic preamps, compressors, etc.

For example, in your screenshot, it shows a picture of a piece of equipment which looks strangely familiar to most experienced engineers... it's a Neve EQ, probably "supposed" to sound like a 1073. The fact that it's labeled "Vintage UK" is another clue that it's supposed to be a Neve emulation. The compressor next to it looks like an LA2A.

So basically, for you to ask what setting Jay Z is using, it's no surprise you are getting lashed out at by other people on this board, because the fact is, he's not using any "setting." I can guarantee he's not using a Line 6 interface with software settings emulating high end audio gear, he's using the actual gear. I've only been to Jay's studio once, and very briefly, but I can tell you it is VERY well equipped... with many different choices for microphones, mic preamps, EQs, and compressors.

Hope this helps answer your questions, and also maybe will help you understand why people responded to your question the way they did.
Old 27th November 2009
  #25
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake Eiseman View Post
I'll try to answer your question because I think you are getting confused by marketing speak created by a company that sold you a piece of equipment.

I've never heard the term "Mic effect" before, and the screenshot you showed looks like Line 6. Is it software that came with a Line 6 audio interface? If so, they are feeding you a line of bulls**t... basically you are scrolling through a series of "effects" that are supposed to emulate high end studio gear, microphones, mic preamps, compressors, etc.

For example, in your screenshot, it shows a picture of a piece of equipment which looks strangely familiar to most experienced engineers... it's a Neve EQ, probably "supposed" to sound like a 1073. The fact that it's labeled "Vintage UK" is another clue that it's supposed to be a Neve emulation. The compressor next to it looks like an LA2A.

So basically, for you to ask what setting Jay Z is using, it's no surprise you are getting lashed out at by other people on this board, because the fact is, he's not using any "setting." I can guarantee he's not using a Line 6 interface with software settings emulating high end audio gear, he's using the actual gear. I've only been to Jay's studio once, and very briefly, but I can tell you it is VERY well equipped... with many different choices for microphones, mic preamps, EQs, and compressors.

Hope this helps answer your questions, and also maybe will help you understand why people responded to your question the way they did.
If you actualy read what I was saying, I simply asked what people THOUGHT it was Jay-Z was using effect wise through his mic.
All i wish to do is get something similiar, im not dumb enough to think that most setups would give me the exact same results as a Jay-Z setup. I was just asking those of you who ARE expierienced, what you think it COULD be that he uses, thats all. Also I all truly was trying to get out of my post was other efficient ways to make my vocals sound somewhat as clear as MAYBE a Jay-Z setup,but more or less anything close to it.That would be with or without using Line6 Pod Farm. Im not sure of other ways to record because this is the only setup ive ever recorded with.Anyways I do understand EQ,Compression and what not thats what other people werent understanding, nowhere in my post did I talk about not knowing how to make mixes.
Old 27th November 2009
  #26
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Storyville's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by JaeAudio View Post
I do understand EQ,Compression and what not thats what other people werent understanding, nowhere in my post did I talk about not knowing how to make mixes.
All due respect - I think you understand the basics of eq and compression. Do you use the eq for phase correction? Formant sculpting? Tone balancing? Resonance removal? Do you use the compressor for ASDR shaping? Glue? Special effects? Ambiance definition?

99 Problems are relatively basic in vocal processing. Sounds like there's a little eq used in there to do some tone adjustment - give the vocals that more old school sort of texture. Some pretty hard compression. And delay and reverb. Nothing out of the ordinary. Just good engineering.
Old 27th November 2009
  #27
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minor_glitch's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JaeAudio View Post
If you actualy read what I was saying, I simply asked what people THOUGHT it was Jay-Z was using effect wise through his mic.
Usually the terminology someone uses is a testament to their actual knowledge about a subject, and sad to say, your jargon is gibberish.

What people are trying to say is that there is no such thing as effects going through a mic like you describe it.

You don't want to record yourself with a bunch of effects.
What you want to do is record yourself raw (or slightly compressed and eq'ed but lets not complicate things), THEN when you have those recorded files in front of you in your editing software you'll want to apply those effects and adjust them and all that good stuff. I don't know if your software works that way but real DAWs do.
But yeah, you don't do it all at once. It's a lengthy, detailed process that takes a lot of practice.

You don't plug in a microphone, choose some effect settings and hit record. Just doesn't work that way.

And no offense but even if you may think you understand compression and eq, it never hurts to dig deeper. There's a lot to know! Pros never stop learning.
Old 27th November 2009
  #28
Gear Nut
 

Another ignorant poster. Minor Glitch do I have to post screenshots,adding EQ and compressiong is not rocket science. My little sister could make a mix. When I record i usually record two main vocal tracks pan them left and right,add Track EQ(to mess with later) effect to whatever instrumental,add compression and then EQ afterwards. I guess when I smoke to much and post on forums,some people get real ANAL and and try to argue stupid ****. Also I record Acid Pro 6.0 which is a REAL DAW, I guess you failed to read that also.
Old 27th November 2009
  #29
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Storyville View Post
Please somebody please help me. Its driving me mad trying to figure out how to record properly. I record my music at a friends, and the mixing alone makes me want to kill myself.Ive got a few questions.

Don't be too hard on yourself. Experience and proper facilities are crucial parts of pro engineering.


What microphone effects does jay z and nas and the likes use,I dont understand how they can record at one studio, and just pick up where they left off at another, clearly the program,mic,setup is going to be way different.

Microphone effect is a strange term. To answer the question, the mix engineer gets all the tracks from different studios and makes them sound congruent.

My friend uses podfarm and acid 6.0 to record with,podfarm has thousands of vocal effects to choose from but I sware each and everyone of them are dull,very dead sounding,no life behind the actual effect.

I've never used podfarm. However, if the effects sound dull and lifeless - they probably are. Good Ear-Honesty.

Once i find one mic effect that does sound like it has life and rich sounding it has to much echo or mix to it. There has to be some sort of universal microphone effect that is just the default sound of you through the mic, i cant seem to find one.

You through the mic is the NO effect. You use it by not putting anything on the vocal track.

Out of all the mic effects ive pritty much just got it down to two effects, one is called Blues Vocal which projects your voice pretty well, with the tiniest bit of echo. I use that effect when im recording to a track or beat that is very plain ,a track that doesnt have a million sounds everywhere. For the more ambient type track I use an effect called Vintage vocal which to me magnifys my voice the same as blues vocal but has an ambient type echo to it for the tracks that have more sounds going on. But even these effects arent coming out 100%,as a matter of not even close to that.

I'll bet my bottom dollar that these effects are actually multiple effects rolled into one. Blues Vocal is a combination of eq, compression, distortion and echo. Vintage Vocal is yet another combination of the same components. This means that these effects are getting CLOSE to something that works well for your voice - but ultimately they were programed without your specific voice in mind, so you might need something with a bit more control.


What do most 1 vocal track rappers rap through? What effect? Please someone break down some **** for me.

Most rappers track through a little bit of compression. But outside of that, most effect is done in the mix phase of the production. Unfortunately, the breakdown really requires years and years of understanding. And before you go on saying "I know how to mix" understand that there are people who have been engineering on this forum longer than you have been alive. Some of whom have already commented on your post. Your question is extremely broad. What you are really asking is "What's the best way to approach my own voice?" And since none of us know your voice, we can't really help. My genuine suggestion is to buy some time at a pro facility and ask the engineer to take time and show you how they track and mix your voice. When you have more specific questions, experiment, and if you need help come on down to the Hip Hop forum. Welcome to Gearslutz.
WOW.....thank you, maybe you should be that engineer?
Old 27th November 2009
  #30
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Storyville's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by JaeAudio View Post
WOW.....thank you, maybe you should be that engineer?

I'd say sure, except that Phillysoulman - one of the guys you were pretty disrespectful to on this thread is the owner of the studio that I work for.

I teach recording seminars from time to time, so I'm pretty used to hearing questions that aren't quite phrased in common engineering lingo - so I was able to follow what you were asking. But your terminology is a little off base, and that's why people are getting confused.

Unfortunately, without an apology, I wouldn't take you on as a client - because saying things like "my little sister could do a mix," is brutally insulting.

Honestly, in the four years of being on this forum, and the 1,500+ posts, not to mention my little fiasco with a guy named "Tha Wiizard" I don't think I've ever felt personally insulted. Until this thread. I was so shocked that you could disrespect so many people who were only trying to offer you good advice that I deleted my post because I didn't feel that you deserved the help.

I'm about the easiest going guy in the world, and I know your intent isn't to be pissing people off. But I love mixing, and I've worked for years learning how to do it. It's 3am on Thanksgiving, and I'm printing stems for God's sake. If you want my help, I'm more than willing, but you gotta check the ego at the door.
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