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Is this a Real Bass?
Old 19th November 2009
  #1
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skiroy's Avatar
Is this a Real Bass?

I never listen to the radio but I switched it on an heard Lil John and Ushers,Lovers and friends. After paying attention to the Bassline I always thought it was a keyboard bass and a 808 short kick,but I think I hear fret slides in there. Anyone know what is being done on this bassline. Some of it sounds like a keyboard cause some of the notes sustain to long and consistent but then there are techniques that sound like there are string bends and slides. It doesnt sound like a pitch wheel but I could be wrong. It might just be a good patch.

What yall think.
Old 19th November 2009
  #2
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phillysoulman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by skiroy View Post
I never listen to the radio but I switched it on an heard Lil John and Ushers,Lovers and friends. After paying attention to the Bassline I always thought it was a keyboard bass and a 808 short kick,but I think I hear fret slides in there. Anyone know what is being done on this bassline. Some of it sounds like a keyboard cause some of the notes sustain to long and consistent but then there are techniques that sound like there are string bends and slides. It doesnt sound like a pitch wheel but I could be wrong. It might just be a good patch.

What yall think.
I dont think.
Without you posting a snippet,there is no answer.
Old 19th November 2009
  #3
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piccazzo's Avatar
 

I think i need to hear it to give an opinion.

And NO i wont google it.
Old 19th November 2009
  #4
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Hmmm. . .

It's either a synth, with some really convincing bass technique emulation. You can do those slides with a mono synth that has fingered portamento (glide).

Or if it is a real bass, it has a synth LPF filter on it with frequency tracking, becuase it stays pretty much pure sine, even when it goes up to the high notes. And then compressed heavily.

My guess is a real bass into something like the sherman filter bank 2 where it has pitch tracking, but it's hard to say for sure.

It's funny to hear Luda at the end saying Ursher the way I'm used to hearing it (Er-shur)
Old 19th November 2009
  #5
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Exmun's Avatar
 

Real Bass. You can't do that with a synth.
Old 20th November 2009
  #6
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PinnacleProdUK's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exmun View Post
Real Bass. You can't do that with a synth.
You can!

You can achieve sounds like that out of trilogy or Basis for Kontakt if you know what you are doing!
Old 20th November 2009
  #7
It could just be real bass. They have the money for it, and youre recording into programs that can manipulate the pants off of anything. Listen to most modern rock records, that's all real bass usually.
Old 20th November 2009
  #8
Old 20th November 2009
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exmun View Post
Real Bass. You can't do that with a synth.
thumbsupThat's a real bass. I would try a Fender Jazz Bass direct injected through a great preamp and compressor combo.
Old 20th November 2009
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanC View Post
Hmmm. . .

It's either a synth, with some really convincing bass technique emulation. You can do those slides with a mono synth that has fingered portamento (glide).

Or if it is a real bass, it has a synth LPF filter on it with frequency tracking, becuase it stays pretty much pure sine, even when it goes up to the high notes. And then compressed heavily.

My guess is a real bass into something like the sherman filter bank 2 where it has pitch tracking, but it's hard to say for sure.

It's funny to hear Luda at the end saying Ursher the way I'm used to hearing it (Er-shur)
Could be layered with a sine bass or compressed so hard that sounds like a synth, some compressors can be that "gooey". Depending upon how you strike the bass "low B string", you could get very close to this sound from the get go.
Old 20th November 2009
  #11
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PeeWeeGee's Avatar
 

Definitely NOT sold that it is a real bass. I think the original bass line was played on a synth, but is blended with a credible library (like Pettinhouse or BASiS) to add a bit of the live action feel. I've fooled guitarists and bassists by adding fret noise and detunes in the right places. (However, I own and play - poorly- a guitar and bass. So I know what I am shooting for.)

It you listen to some Jam & Lewis, you'll hear a lot of similar technique.

PWG
Old 20th November 2009
  #12
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It has more of a synth/sine bass sound, and more of actual bass type playing technique. It could definitely be achieved with either. But if it is a real bass I don't see how you get this sound without a LPF with frequency tracking. DI and fixed eq and comp can get you a dub tone, but not all the way to a dead sine on every note (even the high notes in that little fill he does).

My guess:

Roland V-Bass V-Bass System :: Overview

with the midi out into something like an ATC-1. or maybe just one of the onboard patches where the LPF has frequency tracking.
Old 20th November 2009
  #13
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myles_4u2's Avatar
 

It could definitely be either. There's nothing spectacular in the performance that couldnt be done with a good bass VI and some light programming. I would say its probably a real bass processed through some kind of pedal or plugin.
Old 21st November 2009
  #14
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47radAR's Avatar
 

It's a sine bass. Very similar to ones I use from time to time. Sounds like the "legato retrigger" (which gives retriggers the tone or sample with each note pressed instead of continuing the loop) is set to "ON", which gives a very slightly grainy sound to the note to note transition.
Old 21st November 2009
  #15
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skiroy's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trell Blaze View Post
It's a sine bass. Very similar to ones I use from time to time. Sounds like the "legato retrigger" (which gives retriggers the tone or sample with each note pressed instead of continuing the loop) is set to "ON", which gives a very slightly grainy sound to the note to note transition.
What do you use and how do explain the slides. Are you saying that its a loop with a slide in it and its just being played so the slide part in the loop is not being played unless its wanted,by letting the loop play to the end?
Old 21st November 2009
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skiroy View Post
What do you use and how do explain the slides. Are you saying that its a loop with a slide in it and its just being played so the slide part in the loop is not being played unless its wanted,by letting the loop play to the end?
That's what glide/portamento does. The fingered/legato mode is the easiest to use, meaning that when you hit one note and hold it down, then hit another note without releasing the first one the synth will slide from the first note to the sencond.

For me if a synth doesn't have it, I won't use it much.
Old 21st November 2009
  #17
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skiroy's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanC View Post
That's what glide/portamento does. The fingered/legato mode is the easiest to use, meaning that when you hit one note and hold it down, then hit another note without releasing the first one the synth will slide from the first note to the sencond.

For me if a synth doesn't have it, I won't use it much.
I have heard synth bass patches do this but not one that the slide sounds like a bass guitar slide. Where can I find some samplers with these kind of bass patches. I looked up BASIS but I can find it who makes it? And does Triology have these kind of patches?
Old 22nd November 2009
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skiroy View Post
I have heard synth bass patches do this but not one that the slide sounds like a bass guitar slide. Where can I find some samplers with these kind of bass patches. I looked up BASIS but I can find it who makes it? And does Triology have these kind of patches?
There is no sampled bass that slide and move like that. It's a real bass. Authenic is always better than mimicking. Trilogy or Scarbee might work but be prepared for the steep learning process.
Old 22nd November 2009
  #19
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Lrmusic's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trell Blaze View Post
It's a sine bass. Very similar to ones I use from time to time. Sounds like the "legato retrigger" (which gives retriggers the tone or sample with each note pressed instead of continuing the loop) is set to "ON", which gives a very slightly grainy sound to the note to note transition.
yep
Old 22nd November 2009
  #20
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47radAR's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanC View Post
That's what glide/portamento does. The fingered/legato mode is the easiest to use, meaning that when you hit one note and hold it down, then hit another note without releasing the first one the synth will slide from the first note to the sencond.

For me if a synth doesn't have it, I won't use it much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by skiroy View Post
I have heard synth bass patches do this but not one that the slide sounds like a bass guitar slide. Where can I find some samplers with these kind of bass patches. I looked up BASIS but I can find it who makes it? And does Triology have these kind of patches?
There was absolutely nothing "realistic" about the slide in that particular song. It sounded just like it was...a synth bass slide.

Skiroy = What I meant when I referred to a loop: If I you were to sample a synth sound that has a sustain and you wanted that sample to sustain as long as you hold the key, you would have to find a loop point within the sample. That means, instead of just playing out ending where the sample naturally ends it will continually loop back around between the 2 selected loop points as long as you hold the key down (if you you have it set to do so).
Old 22nd November 2009
  #21
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47radAR's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by skiroy View Post
What do you use and how do explain the slides. Are you saying that its a loop with a slide in it and its just being played so the slide part in the loop is not being played unless its wanted,by letting the loop play to the end?
The slides are performed by simply sliding your finger or hand up or down the keybaord - in the case of the slide in the song you posted, you would slide up then back down. The texture of the slide is determined not only by your legato/glide/portamento settings but also your timing, slide speed, and start/end notes.
Old 22nd November 2009
  #22
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Lookin at the album credits for Lovers and Friends on the cd booklet it says that the bass was done by Lamarquis Jerfferson and the guitar was done by Craig Love. Usually when listed like this on a cd, it means that the bass was done live like previously stated. You fellas give software to much credit. Nothing in software sounds better than a real musician playing bass and guitar. It also pays to buy cds too, don't you think.
Old 23rd November 2009
  #23
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PinnacleProdUK's Avatar
 

it could be done with a Moog Bass Guitar (providing this is now released0 as this has infinate sustain

Moog Unveils Badass Guitar with Infinite Sustain | Listening Post
Old 23rd November 2009
  #24
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Blast9's Avatar
EDIT - look what I just found! - very interesting:

YouTube - LaMarquis Jefferson with Variax Bass 700

Don't bother reading what I wrote below :-)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeyMike View Post
Lookin at the album credits for Lovers and Friends on the cd booklet it says that the bass was done by Lamarquis Jerfferson and the guitar was done by Craig Love. Usually when listed like this on a cd, it means that the bass was done live like previously stated. You fellas give software to much credit. Nothing in software sounds better than a real musician playing bass and guitar. It also pays to buy cds too, don't you think.
I'm still not convinced it is real bass - check out the sound at around 3.49/3.50 - sounds like a sine wave (but its all guesses on my part!)

However... It could be a filtered bass put through some ADSR, but that really sounds like a sine wave sound which maybe is triggered by the original bass line? Maybe he had an Akai Deep Impact synth pedal or maybe he uses a hex pickup on his bass.

There are bass players in the urban scene who also play bass lines on a keyboard for specific songs.

Last edited by Blast9; 23rd November 2009 at 02:30 PM.. Reason: ooh look!
Old 24th November 2009
  #25
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47radAR's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blast9 View Post
EDIT - look what I just found! - very interesting:

YouTube - LaMarquis Jefferson with Variax Bass 700

Don't bother reading what I wrote below :-)



I'm still not convinced it is real bass - check out the sound at around 3.49/3.50 - sounds like a sine wave (but its all guesses on my part!)

However... It could be a filtered bass put through some ADSR, but that really sounds like a sine wave sound which maybe is triggered by the original bass line? Maybe he had an Akai Deep Impact synth pedal or maybe he uses a hex pickup on his bass.

There are bass players in the urban scene who also play bass lines on a keyboard for specific songs.
Yea I was gonna say no matter who played it or how, it's still a synth sound.

The slides and all could've been pulled off just the same with a midi keyboard.
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