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Foul language
Old 3rd August 2005
  #1
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heathen's Avatar
 

Foul language

What do people think of foul language in rap,purely as a form of angst and expression,or do people think it should be left out.I mean some rappers say some rotten things,is this all meant to be part of it or an evolution of sorts.I personally don't mind foul language if its taken into context,but some stuff I would say is a bit farout.I'm writing this because at the moment I'm producing the second album for a rapper friend (Poet Laureate),we've got a distro deal and was just wondering what other people think about this topic.Oh yeah there is plenty of foul language in it (the album).
Old 3rd August 2005
  #2
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Telecastr's Avatar
 

I feel that regardless of the style of music, filling your lyrics with a bunch of profanity is taking the easy way out. It doesn't take any talent to "craft" song lyrics with a bunch of foul language. It takes a much better lyric writer to not use all the profanity, but still get the same point with the same amount of expression and attitude.
Old 3rd August 2005
  #3
Tape Op
 
Larry Crane's Avatar
 

I feel that if the 'foul language' is able to express something then it's totally valid. I've been in bands that used a small degree of profanity, and usually it reflected the way we spoke. I think in many cases it't the same with rap, or (obviously) the song is a fictionalization where the language is part of what's going on.

To condemn the art for the language is usually not looking deep enough at what's going on! Just my perception.
Old 3rd August 2005
  #4
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e-cue's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Telecastr
I feel that regardless of the style of music, filling your lyrics with a bunch of profanity is taking the easy way out. It doesn't take any talent to "craft" song lyrics with a bunch of foul language. It takes a much better lyric writer to not use all the profanity, but still get the same point with the same amount of expression and attitude.
Agreed, but it should also be noted that in rap it's a common 'cop out' for rappers to fill in the blanks of their cadences. Next time you listen to a rap song on the radio, listed for the mutes and question if it was there to fill out of line, or to get some point across. Personally, I like "Can I get a What What" better than "Can I get a **** You"...
Old 3rd August 2005
  #5
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I think profanity is excessive in rap, but the ones that I see cursing for no apparent reason are the ones USUALLY with the least talent.
Old 3rd August 2005
  #6
Gear Nut
 

i dont really care about the profanity in the rhymes. it's how it's used that matters. when someone is just cursing just to do it i usually get bored real quick with it. if they work it in and make it work then i'm more prone to enjoy it. the real problem are rappers who release these tracks where they spend more time saying a terrible chorus over and over again and hardly rap at all. i'm usually more offended by that.
Old 3rd August 2005
  #7
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meteor's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by elder rookie
... the real problem are rappers who release these tracks where they spend more time saying a terrible chorus over and over again and hardly rap at all...
couldn't agree more. all show no flow gets under my skin.

cheers,
Old 3rd August 2005
  #8
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defjamm's Avatar
 

it depends on the mc, some curse a lot but still have ill rhymes and metaphors going on, like ludacris or jadakiss and styles p from the lox/d-block, or ill bill and necro from psycho logical. i hate people saying, that when you curse you don't have lyrical skills, it totally depends on the rest of the words and the context.
when you say the same things with the same words in every song it becomes boring sure.
Old 3rd August 2005
  #9
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it is what it is. I really hate hearing the "N" word. Most low end Rappers use it as a crutch instead of saying something else. I edited a clean verison for fat joe one time and he said the "N" word in 3 verses more than any other rapper alive and he's puerto rican.

I will say speed metal, punk rock and alot of other forms of music say a lot worse than rap music.
Old 3rd August 2005
  #10
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I was at the Guggenheim museum in NYC a few years back and i walked into a room and there was this huge "painting" in the back...all black but textured.

As I walk closer...it really started to smell. As I got really close I noticed it was made up of thousands and thousands of dead flies...

In the same way, sometimes profanity is used to get a reaction out of the listener.
Old 3rd August 2005
  #11
no ssl yet
Guest
cue

I think can I get a **** you wouldnt drive a dance floor the same if it was what what on the original version. I think it is excessive, but some songs wouldnt have the same impact without it.

As an example the first thing that comes to mind

LUDA's "Move bitch get out the way, get out the way bitch get out the way. WHO among us has not felt that way on the interstate when someone is going 45 or they cut u off in traffic.

In Jigga's case when he does the song its anti gold digger and a bunch of guys can relate to Can I get a **** you in that case

Hell I grew up on Richard Pryor who was an absolute genious. He was funny without profanity, but with it he was able to express what everyone felt but was afraid to say.


SOME, I repeat SOME of rap does the same thing. But I cant stand songs that remind you of a kid that just learned a curse word so he uses it in his every sentence.
Old 3rd August 2005
  #12
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lucey's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by no ssl yet
Hell I grew up on Richard Pryor who was an absolute genious. He was funny without profanity, but with it he was able to express what everyone felt but was afraid to say.


SOME, I repeat SOME of rap does the same thing. But I cant stand songs that remind you of a kid that just learned a curse word so he uses it in his every sentence.
Right fuggin' On ...


I actually think we need more foul laguage when it's the right way to make a passionate point. A word is a tool to make a point, at best.
Old 3rd August 2005
  #13
Gear Maniac
 
whosyourdaddy00's Avatar
 

i don't see profaine language as "bad" or "wrong" it's just words for expression....how indivduals choose to incorporate it is purely their choice. it's pretty easy to spot good talent with or without it. so i don't see anything wrong...it just gets old after hearing 4 out of the thousands of words in our language used over and over and over and over and over and over again.

let them show their own ass and i say let the people decide if they like it or not. no doubt some will.
Old 3rd August 2005
  #14
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octatonic's Avatar
As with all things, sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't.

My favourite example was a band in Sydney (called Greg Brady Overdrive I believe)
that used the word "****" as a noun, verb, adjective and adverb all within a single sentence.
That was an achievement.
They also did a version of Achey-breakey Heart with the following lyrics

Don't touch my dick,
My achey-breakey dick
I just dont think it would understand
For if you touch my dick
My achey breakey dick
It migh just blow off in your hand

JR
Old 3rd August 2005
  #15
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Gregg Sartiano's Avatar
 

If you do a CD for major distro, you'll have to make the clean version for Wal-Mart. AFAIK, they may/may not sell a not-clean version, and, regardless, since a typical Wal-Mart stocks about 750 titles (actual statistic), you're competing for shelf space as it is.
Old 4th August 2005
  #16
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XHipHop's Avatar
Imagine the Sopranos or any gangster movie without curses...
Old 4th August 2005
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XHipHop
Imagine the Sopranos or any gangster movie without curses...
wow. great analogy!!! Even Arnold, the cali mayor, curses in his movies.
Old 4th August 2005
  #18
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heathen's Avatar
 

These are a great mix of replies,I think your all right,as long as the swearing fits the song I think it should be there too,the world is a tough place and these words are used all the time in reality,usually to drive a point home.Yes watching the Soprano's was great and I even was a little shocked upon hearing the [email protected]$% word on tv,but then felt relieved I'm not the only person who says it.The N word does offend me as it is probably used too often,a little un-cool,but very relevant,as I guess the ghetto's are where this form of musical expression originated,and people use tough words and are angry about being treated differently.I'm not a huge Rap/Hiphop fan,but have recently produced 2 rap albums (big learning curve for a rocker) and really like the music I've produced for this guy and some of the music he has brought around as refference from various rap artists,I am now becoming a fan.The first album should appear around Sydney in September or October.Breaking up with his girlfriend prompted a whole heap angst and some of the songs are a bit disrespectful of women but hey I've heard the female rappers dish it out at the guys too.I guess everything is fair if taken in context, and people don't get the wrong idea and start thinking some stuff is real when it's not.Anyway I'm still interested in more comments keep em coming.
Old 4th August 2005
  #19
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beatzz's Avatar
 

As a sidenote, i have to add that I was surprised that all the rock/alt songs that i have listened to do not have the F word. I'm sure there are some that do, but not even close to the majority that rap do.

However i don't feel that it is out of place for rappers to swear if they want to. I just find it annoying when it's done without any musical or artistic taste.
Old 4th August 2005
  #20
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Charlie-O's Avatar
 

Sometimes to get the ear of the people, you have to speak the language. I just wish that once artist had the attention of the people, they would take the time to put thought into what they were saying. (not for everyone) I guesss then it might make it hard to sell records, or even get the label to release it, or get seagrams gin to sponsor you......etc
Old 4th August 2005
  #21
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XHipHop's Avatar
You have to admit, what Dre did with the Chronic and with Doggystyle was genius. They just had alternate lyrics for the parts with curses for the radio and for clean versions. There were no missing spaces on the radio like you hear today.

50 did that for in the club (with that ecstacy/drug line in the hook) but hasn't done it since and his songs sound rediculous on the radio.
Old 4th August 2005
  #22
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heathen's Avatar
 

I can remember doing a rock album and there was 1 f%&$ in there which needed to be there and the guys made me edit it out,I don't know why but a lot of rockers freak at swearing in songs,I guess maybe thats why I started this thread.I like swearing in songs now it does'nt bother me now if its creative.
Old 5th August 2005
  #23
Gear Nut
 

let the rapper rap and the engineer, engineer.
play your role!
Old 6th August 2005
  #24
things that are not allowed, are considered cool by some.
.....

but the whole censor thing, ridiculously bleeping words that discribe part of the human anatomy is just stupid and offensive to me.

I am here, and I say whatever I want to say
have sex with and how I want to
my thoughts, state of mind, and expression are free
it is such a short distance from censoring art and culture of so called offensive words to the censoring of political content:

bleeping content because it is offensive is just another form of oppression

and often the same people that think it is cool to use a lot of meaningless swearwords, are agreeing on the sensorship: "yeah some things shouldn't be allowed, otherwise it would be a big mess"
IMO they are full of crap. I think regardless of whatever rules society puts on us, a man is still responsible ANY of his actions. an idiot is still an idiot, even when doing cool illegal things.

hurting people or groups of people is not good, and people who do that should be sued AFTER the offence. In this part of the world it works well: you can say pretty much anything, even on prime time television. But are people doing that? Of course not. If there is a message and the swearwords are there to express them, IMO that is fine.

stike
Old 6th August 2005
  #25
Gear Maniac
 

cussing is okay but the music must drive a message...

unfortunately i feel it is going the other way... because hip hop is no longer (or very rarely) driver of feelings of frustration and opression a message of truth, a description of what a big part of the lower class and foreign population (europe) go through in fascist societies that claim freedom and equality...

its all about ice this ice that bentleys crystal and jacob the jewler...

And the fact that kids are now listening to that stuff is pretty alarming (I have a 10 year old niece that listen s to 50 pence...It scares me) but music is music and if kids can watch arnold kill 500 arabs in 30 minutes i think it would be hypocritical to stop them from buying and listening to what they want i.e the explicit lyrics label suks
Old 6th August 2005
  #26
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bunnerabb's Avatar
Sometimes it's accurate, useful and what should be said. Sometimes, it's called shock value.

Turn on any jiveass TeeVee show for the video version.

And it's getting bloody old. If you got something to say and profanity nails it, lay yer flow. If it's just trying the fit the most "mother****ers" in, sorry. You ran outta ideas, G.

YMMV
Old 6th August 2005
  #27
IMO a guy singing/rapping about how much cash he has is just sad
a person like 50 cents is there where he is, against all odds
I respect that. not what he is singing about. that is just crap to sell records

so, yes, there is what is wrong. it is not expression anymore.
just a product.
who cares about knowledge, and stuff like that.
powder in the nose, champange in the throat, 19" rims on the car

a product of an environment?

rappers could do better. that is all I'm saying.
50 cents made a few things that I consider "real"
the guy in my building next door is a rapper.
no compromise no prisoners guy
real stuff.
lotsa shock value
he doesn't rap about how much money he has
why should he?

I say the explicit lyrics tag is just a label to show how cool and tough you are
WRONG LABEL
Old 7th August 2005
  #28
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heathen's Avatar
 

A lot of good and relevant points everyone,interesting reading.And no one has sworn yet haha,cool.
Old 7th August 2005
  #29
you can't swear on this forum
&%((###%% !
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