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Who else mixes with Dre Virtual Instrument Plugins
Old 2nd August 2005
  #1
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Who else mixes "WITH" Dr. Dre?

Some of my favorite hip hop references are mixes that say "mixed by Dr. Dre." I don't know, something tells me someone else was in the room suggesting gear to patch and turning knobs. Does anyone have an inside scoop of who else's ears are in the room on Dre productions? ("2001" and 50 Cent's "Get Rich....." in particular?)
Old 2nd August 2005
  #2
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Why so?
Old 2nd August 2005
  #3
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools
Why so?
I like to be educated to the fullest of my abilities about things I consider reference. Is it that hard to understand why I'd like to know who mixed the recordings that I've listened to on hundreds of systems, hundreds of times with the most critical of my listening attention? Trying to find out the answer to this question is like trying to find out where the mob boss lives. Just thought I'd throw it out there incase someone has insight. IS IT YOU PAULTOOLS?
Old 2nd August 2005
  #4
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Ok, fine... but what leads you to think it is not Dre?
Old 2nd August 2005
  #5
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools
Ok, fine... but what leads you to think it is not Dre?
No offense to him, but I find it hard to believe that you improve that much in the period of time from his previous record to the 2001 level mixes. Who elses mixes was he practicing on to get that good and why haven't we heard those mixes?

Also I know first hand that it's common practice within his camp to have "ghost" talent around and his name (and publishing in some cases) is credited with the final product. I figured the job of mixing is treated with the same mentality.
Old 2nd August 2005
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EngineEars
No offense to him, but I find it hard to believe that you improve that much in the period of time from his previous record to the 2001 level mixes. Who elses mixes was he practicing on to get that good and why haven't we heard those mixes?

Also I know first hand that it's common practice within his camp to have "ghost" talent around and his name (and publishing in some cases) is credited with the final product. I figured the job of mixing is treated with the same mentality.
Sounds to me like you are making many assumptions here.
Are you aware that many top engineers have guys that come in and prep for them?
Is that what you are asking? Who is his assistant? Or are you implying that Dre does not know the gear or how to use it? If so, you are mistaken.
I think there's a guy around here- Tommy D that used to work for him.
Old 2nd August 2005
  #7
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools
Sounds to me like you are making many assumptions here.
Sounds like to me you got your feelings hurt with my remarks. If you are a Dre fan don't be offended I to am a fan of the sonics of the final product also. If it's principal thing then you should retort with actual first hand facts to resolve this. I don't assume things I've seen Man. I am asking if anyone knows something further that I don't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools
Are you aware that many top engineers have guys that come in and prep for them?
There's nothing wrong with that either, if that's the apprentice type relationship a mixer has the good fortune to afford, great for both parties involved. But a mixer in that position usually does that as his main staple for years. I happen to be a fan of producers that also mix, there are very few percentage of them that are on that list and a much less that are my main reference CD. There's plenty of people that are good at what they do, but the mixes that make my reference list all happen to be done by 15 plus year veteran mixers. Yes Dre has been in studio since the early 80's but he does many other things also, all of my other ref mixers specifically mix for a living. Is that a coincidence? If the Dre tracks on my ref are done by Andre Young, his assistant and Brian Gardner's two mix massage, then I am very wrong and would like to know it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools
Or are you implying that Dre does not know the gear or how to use it?
Notice! Not once yet have I said the Andre Young doesn't have talent or doesn't know gear, I just find it really really hard to believe that a club hopping ear plug-less/hip hop artist/beat maker/producer who has toured with really ear splitting wedges blaring and spent any amount of time in a control room listening to mains at "hip hop" SPL has the hearing left to pull of the finesse it takes to pull of those mixes. We are allowed to have opinions aren't we? You call it assuming, I call it common sense, correct me if I'm wrong is my attitude. What's the point of forums like this again? Until someone (perhaps a former employee or assistant) with some real knowledge of what goes on has anything of value to say about this topic you are wasting everyone's time. If you do know something just say it.

Old 2nd August 2005
  #8
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What are you talking about???

Dre has been mixing hits since the '90's man! He is more than 15 years into this business. What qualifies a person in your mind to be a mixer? Practicing other people's mixes???? That's hilarious!!!
How do you like the mix of Still DRE? Listen to that mix... along with the lyrics!
FWIW, I worked with Dre as early as 1993, and he knew EXACTLY what he was doing. As far as me contributing to this discussion, I agree it is a waste of time.

Good luck.
Old 2nd August 2005
  #9
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[Dre has been mixing hits since the '90's man]

Yes, indeed. He is one the most talented producers in the business today. I just finished working on 4 cuts from the new Burt Bacharach CD. They are collaborations between Burt and Dre. Trust me - I worked on the tracks from the get go - and know exactly what is on there. Dre has his sh*t together big time. He has a brilliant musician/writer working with him in the studio named Mike Elizondo, but it's definitely a collaboration, and Dre knows what he wants to hear.
Old 2nd August 2005
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Perlman
I just finished working on 4 cuts from the new Burt Bacharach CD. They are collaborations between Burt and Dre.
Holy smoke! Now THAT should be interesing. Can you tell us more?

Andi

www.doorknocker.ch
Old 2nd August 2005
  #11
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools
What are you talking about???
Which part?

Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools
What qualifies a person in your mind to be a mixer?
This thread is not about what it takes to be a mixer, it's about finding out if a person with a lot of talent, fame, money, and power, who doesn't only mix records for a living is actually one of my favorite mixers or not, it's as simple as that.

"MY" other favorites do mostly mix only and that doesn't mean I don't admire engineers that only track, engineers that are A&R's, engineers that produce or mixers that also have VH1 "Behind the Music" episodes about them. Once again you are not reading all of the information presented.

I never disqualified Dre. as a mix engineer I just had a hard time believing he was the sole audio specialist at mixdown on that record, based on the previous CD's he is listed as mixer and other things I've seen first hand. When I hear a CD performed, engineered and mixed by Cody Chestnutt I don't have a hard time believing Cody mixed that record. I do about "2001." Big deal, why is that so absurd and so personally offensive to you? I've complemented his work and said I'm a fan I just want to know who else had a hand in it, if anyone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools
How do you like the mix of Still DRE?
I love it but I didn't love the mixes on "The Chronic" and certainly didn't like any on "Dr. Dre....The Aftermath."

Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools
FWIW, I worked with Dre as early as 1993, and he knew EXACTLY what he was doing.
Why didn't you just post that sentence in the first post and move on? For the record I never said the man didn't know what he was doing.
Old 2nd August 2005
  #12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Perlman
[Dre has been mixing hits since the '90's man]

Yes, indeed. He is one the most talented producers in the business today. I just finished working on 4 cuts from the new Burt Bacharach CD. They are collaborations between Burt and Dre. T.
heard about that a while back... im really looking forward to hearing those tunes!!
Old 2nd August 2005
  #13
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A lot of the mojo is in the mastering, for a quick reference check out that track on "the games"s cd.. love it or leave it? something like that.. then check out the same track on the end of fiftys cd.. mastered by uhmm Brian Big Bass Gardner.
Old 2nd August 2005
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juicemaster1500
A lot of the mojo is in the mastering, for a quick reference check out that track on "the games"s cd.. love it or leave it? something like that.. then check out the same track on the end of fiftys cd.. mastered by uhmm Brian Big Bass Gardner.
"Hate it or Love it"


Thats strange that Game and 50's CD had different ME's since it was basically the same group of people that worked on both.(I ASSume)
Old 2nd August 2005
  #15
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Engine Ears,

I don't know if you mix for a living or not, but I do.
I certainly hope that my mixes have improved over the years due do my personal advances as well as my accesss to better gear and studios.
For example, the original Chronic album was largely tracked and mixed on an SSL 4056 E series console, not exactly known for its punch or warmth. Yet, that signature Dre sound is there. Most 'Top-Gun" mixers have prep guys that set up the gear and patches, clean up any stray audio in the tracks, etc.. and even get basic levels. Sometimes you will see this person credited as "mix engineer". I have been credited as such when I would spend hours getting everything setup and even EQed to MY liking, to have the mixer come in at the end of the evening to modify what I'd done, get his own levels and rides and do his drops.

Dre has a crew of engineers that he works with. It's no big secret. There is an article from EQ magazine from a few years ago that maps out the roles of Dre's staff. Everyone is credited for their contribution, including "Vito", Mike E, Big Bass Brian, and even Scott Storch. Why don't you look that up, and while you are at it, find the issue of Scratch Magazine from about 6 months ago. It gives an excellent glimpse of behind-the-scenes Dre.

What offends me is this insinuation that someone else "mixes for Dre" as you named this thread when you began it, and the suggestion that he puts his name on other people's work. I think it is irresponsible to post somthing like that in a public forum, unless YOU PERSONALLY did a mix 'for Dre" and did not receive credit for it. For some reason, I doubt that is the case.
Old 2nd August 2005
  #16
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Old 2nd August 2005
  #17
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools
I don't know if you mix for a living or not, but I do.
As a matter a fact I make my living producing, tracking and mixing. I'm glad that we are each other's peers.


Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools
What offends me is this insinuation that someone else "mixes for Dre" as you named this thread when you began it, and the suggestion that he puts his name on other people's work. I think it is irresponsible to post somthing like that in a public forum, unless YOU PERSONALLY did a mix 'for Dre" and did not receive credit for it. For some reason, I doubt that is the case.
A response that you so eloquently displayed is all that I was looking for. Thank you. I thought part of the reason for this forum was to bring light of what goes on with the gear and who's using it. And while it wasn't a mix that I did, I do have negative first hand dealings that I'm affected by. I'm sorry to spill the beans, I guess that was poor form although I didn't think it was before I did it. It's hard to know when it's OK to reveal what's behind the curtain and when it's not. Thank you also for bring that to my attention!
Old 2nd August 2005
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EngineEars
As a matter a fact I make my living producing, tracking and mixing. I'm glad that we are each other's peers.




A response that you so eloquently displayed is all that I was looking for. Thank you. I thought part of the reason for this forum was to bring light what goes on with the gear and who's using it. And while it wasn't a mix that I did, I do have negative first hand dealings that I'm affected by. I'm sorry to spill the beans, I guess that was poor form although I didn't think it was before I did it. It's hard to know when it's OK to reveal what's behind the curtain and when it's not. Thank you also for bring that to my attention!
I am confused (as usual). I thought you were asking what is behind the curtain. Are you now implying that you are revealing what is behind the curtain?
Old 2nd August 2005
  #19
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No worries, ears... PM me if you can't find those articles.

If I may further clarify another point....

There are a lot of "ghosts" in this industry. It is nothing new, and it not necessarily unethical unless taken to the extreme (Milli Vanilli comes to mind).
Hypothetically, you are a new producer with lots of talent but no name/track record. Somehow, you wind up in the studio next to a "Big Name Producer" who hears your beats and wants to use one for his artist. He insists on receiving 50% of the publishing even if he uses the beat as you gave it to him as a condition of the deal. That is a good business deal for BOTH parties and is common practice throughout the industry.

Consider a pop starlette who breaks into the indusrty with a huge debut album of tracks written and produced by someone else. How often is every song on the 2nd album co-written/co-produced by the artist??? (wink wink) Did that artist get a sudden blessing of talent as a songwriter/producer, or a 'first-hand" education in music business economics 101?? And if you are a songwriter that has the opportunity to "co-write" the song with the artist, then if you are smart you do it and keep your mouth shut all the way to the bank.
Old 2nd August 2005
  #20
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Paul are you Warren G?(Dre's cousin)

There's been plenty of times Dre's name is brought up on some lawsuit of using a sample that he hasn't cleared...so anything is possible imo
Old 2nd August 2005
  #21
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike O
I am confused (as usual). I thought you were asking what is behind the curtain. Are you now implying that you are revealing what is behind the curtain?
I only know what's behind curtain #1 not #2 and #3.

Old 2nd August 2005
  #22
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Hip hop/ Rap was literally BORN of samples... only they were referred to as BREAKS and were manually scratched in by a skilled DJ. The Emulator then came along with the infamous "James Brown" disc and BILLIONS of dollars later here we are.

Dre makes beats using samples as well as live musicians. People whose music Dre samples sue Dre because the judgement is COLLECTABLE in his case if the sample was not cleared prior to release.

Some labels release songs with uncleared samples as a calculated risk. Sometimes they get burned.

"I know Warren G, I served with him... Warren G is a friend of mine. I am no Warren G" to paraphrase a famous political quote, LOL
Old 2nd August 2005
  #23
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I thought Warren G was Dre's half Brother...
Old 2nd August 2005
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools
Hip hop/ Rap was literally BORN of samples...

I like to think of that like the 2nd era of hip hop. The first era hip hop were records like run-dmc which all drum bassed w/ hits and such.

the 2nd era with u refer too was ruled by producer Marley Marl and them james brown samples.
Old 2nd August 2005
  #25
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Hip Hop was born of a few essentials, mainly a MC, a mic, a DJ and some break records. No samples or drum machines... they were not invented yet.
Old 2nd August 2005
  #26
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i dont know why its so hard to believe that dre actually mixes the tracks that he says he does. yea, he has a staff of musicians and engineers, but that doesnt necesarily mean that those engineers are the ones turning the knobs on final mixes. engineers can do alot besides mix.

you have to remember that dre practically created the mainstream hip hop sound. he started so long ago that he probably didnt even think to have major studios mix his tracks, or he was too broke when he started to afford it. a few years later its his sound that the entire west coast is worshiping. i dont find it hard to believe that hes still mixing to this day. his tracks have always had absolutely banging drums, at levels that most engineers wouldnt advise against, and they still come out perfect.

dre created it, i think he knows how to do it.
Old 3rd August 2005
  #27
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A FAIR QUESTION

I think Engine Ears asked a fair question and caught alot of flack over nothing. Hell Dre doesnt do all of the production he takes credit for, so why should someone assume he does the mixes???
Old 3rd August 2005
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by no ssl yet
Dre doesn't do all of the production he takes credit for
Care to elaborate?
Old 3rd August 2005
  #29
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NOPE

I dont care to elaborate Paul, I think it would be pointless in an internet forum. I'll only say that I dont look at Dre as the "God " of hip hop like some cats do. I understand that at a certain level of sucess, you have the right to stamp your name on the work because you have the money to do so and also because your name is on the marquee. I dont know what your beef is. I just thought the man had a reasonable post. I honestly dont care what Andre Young does. It doesnt feed me. I concentrate on that which I control. Dre's camp produces some nice stuff (sometimes). But when I want hot material, I make it. (And YOU know this). so while I admire some of his work, I realize some of it isnt all that great. He does however always provide a basic level of professionalism.
Old 3rd August 2005
  #30
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I can believe that Dre mixes, for the simple fact that I've worked with producers who knew how to mix. And mix very well at that.

When I was 18 I got the chance to mix a track down for Tone from the Trackmasters. Not because he didn't know how to but he gave me a chance to see what I could do and he was pretty pleased.

So I can believe that Dre, Pharrel, Timbaland, and most producers who have a very good understanding of music, have the ability to mix.
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