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If you were tracking HipHop/RnB what outboard could you not live without Condenser Microphones
Old 24th November 2002
  #61
jon
Capitol Studios Paris
 
jon's Avatar
 

No idea on the Studers, but I've been using Prism ADA converters lately and they've been blowing me away...sound great...a real step up in naturalness from the Apogees.

Jon
Old 25th November 2002
  #62
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Wiggy Neve Slut's Avatar
 

a friend of mine is building twelve MCI dual preamps/eq based on the 400. He bought a console and took out all the original parts. Made new 19" boxes and motherboards. ALL parts is the originals!!

Neve sucks....!! ( i cant beleive i said that! lolololo)

The 400 series are way cool. The preamps are kinda FAAT as you say but in a more 70's west coast USA vibe compared to neve esque` which is what most preople are prolly looking for. The Eq is gentle and sweet and pretty phase coherent, its definately not surgical but nice for addding bit here or ther or doing some gentle cutting... i do tend to think of it as ab additive EQ rather than a subtractive one. Great for tracking cos its pretty gentle andkind whilst being hard to **** things up cos its so nice and musical sounding.

The main problem with racking MCI modules is that the transformers where most of the sound lies, are not on the channel strips themselves they are acutally located on the main frame console chasis. So make sure your mate pulls the transformers from the desk too and rewires them. This can often be laborious and cost a fair bit in tech time so by the time people have pulled the modules and racked them up with a BIG **** OFF PSU (cos they need stax of juice to get them singing!) they are LARGE and expensive and most people cant be bothered with that cos they sometimes end up being just as expensive as the more comon names that get mentioned around here... but they are different. If you have the room i would just use a complete desk as a front end and not bother racking them.. but that is a luxury for most. Also there is extensive circutiry to oversome like faders, aux sends, busses, pan etc. they are complete chanel strips and not strictly PRE/EQ like API or neves etc.

I still think these desks are 'sleepers' and for the $$ are great cos they are able to provide studios, engineers a desk that is VERY good and usaeable for not much $$and the remainder of ya $$ can be spent on other stuff like comps, different pres and EQ and Fx and mics...

By the way that desk USED to be mine..... i sold it to a friend a few months ago and its happily being witha small 001 system and it sounds fantastic.. yes... even with 001!!!

if ya got any more questions just holler!!!

PEACE
Wiggy
Old 8th January 2004
  #63
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theproduca's Avatar
 

I do a lot of HIPHOP. It depends to me. if it's for an album or a demo. Of course without saying you can use the lesser gear for a demo. I'm using a combination of things for recording vocals. I have a TLM103, C3000B(for doubles), C1 and a SE5500. My preamp list is...Millennia Media TD-1 (HV-3 Preamp), UA M-610, Focusrite ISA220 w A-D card for going digital into PT (Digi 001) and an Avalon M5/VT747 combo (sounds better than a 737). I use a Panasonic WZAD96 8 channel converter to pipe vocal lightpipe if I want to get another A-D flavor. I really liked the Rosetta, but I don't have it any longer. Looking at a PSX100 because it has a bit more flexibility A-D-D-A. I mix out to a Aphex 204 for the Bottom and clarity then to the Avalon 747 again for beef. Then it's just a matter of which converter (ISA220 or WZAD96) I will use before I get to the Alesis Masterlink. Being I record and monitor through 2 WRDA7 Digitla consoles, things get a bit sterile. I figured that since I didn't want to invest in the highend mics, using a combo of GOOD mics along with GOOD preamp, I could get a different flavor at all times. Not sure if this helps, but it's what I do. I'm NEW here, so take it easy on me. RaJ.................Out................
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If you were tracking HipHop/RnB what outboard could you not live without-mar1.jpg  
Old 7th September 2004
  #64
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STARSKI's Avatar
 

So No SSL what did you end up doing? I wanna know.
Old 23rd October 2004
  #65
Gear Addict
 
jebjerome's Avatar
 

Yeah, just reading this thread makes me feel like I've been through a major life-changing drama. Please let us know what the final decision was.
Old 24th October 2004
  #66
no ssl yet 
Guest
Didnt know there was interest in this thread (its so old)

Good to see folks are still reading the old stuff (its where I hunt for tips all the time when I'm around these parts)

Well guys I'll tell you what i ended up with and when I make it to the studio later I'll take some pics (but they'll be camera phone pics)

I'm still on a mix plus system with a few dsp farms
Rosetta 800 for conversion on 1st 8 channels
adat xt for conversion on 2nd 8chs these only go to ffx though (which reminds me I need to get that studer unit I totally forgot)

Folcrom for summing
Distressor w mod
Tube Tech CL-1B
SSL G384 comp
2 amek CIBs
Adesigns MP-2
NTI EQ3
Kurzweil Rumor
Spatializer retro
Behringer Edison
3 dbx 160xts
SPL transient designer
line 6 mod pro
SE gemini mic
Neuman TLM 103
Avalon 747

and for speakers mackie 8's, Ns10s, Emes mini owl, and a pair of minimus 7s

woulda added some api EQ but the URS EQ is kickass to me
I want a pair of 1176's some ssl Gseries channels, and maybe some neve channels before I start thinking ffx (probably a 2016, eventide H3000 and some TC delays along with something from lexicon, or some really good 480L samples) and then I'll go to HD and more I/O. The only thing I may be leaving out is something like my coleman monitor unit for speaker switching/volume. Overall I like the system I got though I'd like some pultecs and some other stuff it'll have to wait.
Old 29th November 2004
  #67
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nukmusic's Avatar
 

Quote:
I'll take some pics (but they'll be camera phone pics)
lets see em?[
Old 20th March 2005
  #68
Lives for gear
 
STARSKI's Avatar
 

hey yeah were still waiting for those pictures!!!
Old 1st January 2007
  #69
Lives for gear
 
tengu's Avatar
Bump.
Old 1st January 2007
  #70
no ssl yet 
Guest
Damn somebody bumped THIS thread up.

I didn't know u guys read this far back.

It's kinda hard to take pics since I'm not totally set up right now (and DAMN UPS has my ptools in disarray)

Only thing different is I went to HD accel/rosetta 800, and right now, I don't have enough I/O to hook up some of my extras (mod pro,spatializer, rumor etc....)

I'm in Philly with some of the gear, but my damn patchbay rack is in New Orleans.

It's a bitch being without your patchbay, and it's worse being in a new city where you don't know folk to drum up business. I swear Hurricane Katrina DESTROYED my plans for the last 2 years. But at least I walked out with my health since some weren't so fortunate.
Old 1st January 2007
  #71
Lives for gear
 
Stitch333's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by no ssl yet View Post
Damn somebody bumped THIS thread up.

I didn't know u guys read this far back.

It's kinda hard to take pics since I'm not totally set up right now (and DAMN UPS has my ptools in disarray)

Only thing different is I went to HD accel/rosetta 800, and right now, I don't have enough I/O to hook up some of my extras (mod pro,spatializer, rumor etc....)

I'm in Philly with some of the gear, but my damn patchbay rack is in New Orleans.

It's a bitch being without your patchbay, and it's worse being in a new city where you don't know folk to drum up business. I swear Hurricane Katrina DESTROYED my plans for the last 2 years. But at least I walked out with my health since some weren't so fortunate.
If yer in Philly, theres only a couple of spots to drum up the real work:
Larry Golds 'The Studio' at 7th and Callowhill
Indre is the big rock stu...they moved out to overbrook and downsized
Elm Street Studios was set up by one of the Hooters out west (?) of the city
Judgement is out in Conshehoken (Joe Niccolo mighta moved the API by now tho)
MilkBoy is a small but tight stu in Ardmore-D&R, some cool outboard & good mics

Heres the real gem tho-Theres an artist on every corner in Philly. Get the Citypaper and a bunch of studio info cards made up and find the MANY open mic nights and start hittin the clubs. If you have even a lil skill in the stu and a good resume, you should be able to drum up buisness real quick....

good luck in the illadelph my dude
Old 2nd January 2007
  #72
Lives for gear
 
tengu's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by no ssl yet View Post
Damn somebody bumped THIS thread up.

I didn't know u guys read this far back.

It's kinda hard to take pics since I'm not totally set up right now (and DAMN UPS has my ptools in disarray)
I thought you would think I was referring to the photos no ssl

I was actually bumping the thread cause I thought it was a great topic and wanted to see where everyone was at with their outboard for hiphop in 2007.

What are the key pieces that people are favouring?

Has anyone tried the Daking channel strips for tracking?
Old 2nd January 2007
  #73
no ssl yet 
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by tengu View Post
I thought you would think I was referring to the photos no ssl

I was actually bumping the thread cause I thought it was a great topic and wanted to see where everyone was at with their outboard for hiphop in 2007.

What are the key pieces that people are favouring?

Has anyone tried the Daking channel strips for tracking?
Ok cool, I've pretty much stayed with the same stuff.

Man honestly it will make for a much more boring forum, but if you track a C12, 4060, or U47 through an API channel strip or, 1073/1084 pre or Pacifica, and only use 1176/LA2A for comp,

You can't go wrong much. (And I know the mics are very different.)
Old 2nd January 2007
  #74
Lives for gear
 
andrewj's Avatar
Okay here comes my Recommendation:

Get at least one pair of SSL channelstrips

One G-Style Compressor (I use the Alan Smart C2, others prefer the original!!!)

and an Avalon Preamp for the silkier recordings

Also I woulld take a Peluso 2247 for a good price / performance rate! Exchange it with a Sony C800G or a vintage Neumann

These are the most important things IMO

I would also recommend: BAE 1272 Mic Pre, Distressor, Fatso, Ted Fletcher P10 with one of the most versatile Limiters Compressors available and SSL Duende if you want 32 tracks of nice SSL sound!
Old 2nd January 2007
  #75
Here for the gear
 

SPX90 & Orban parametric EQ & FATMAN Comp
Old 2nd January 2007
  #76
Lives for gear
 
emkay's Avatar
 

rap/hip-hop production

Before joining GS and just lurking around, I learned about specific requirements and recommendations regarding vocals, drums,guitars etc., all in the creation of "music". I also learned that apparently "rap" and "hip hop" must be a very special entity unto itself with it's own requirements. I learned this when reading very specific posts and threads asking for gear recommendations for "rap" and "hip hop". Wow! I had no idea that the recording of this genre of music required special attention and special gear! So i did my own research and have come up with what I think would be the perfect list.---I hope this helps-------

-a recording space "tuned" using the "Hummer SWX 56 Spectrum Maximizer"
-a well placed "Sonic State Laser 9,000,000 XXL Holy Trinity Auto Mix Console"
-a "Hormone Electrix Galvinizer DBDB 433 Decompression Omni-Sexual Limiter"
-a "Sunny VFX Larynx Stimulator XL Diaghragm Mic with external Omnipresent Omnipotent Variable Patterns Wind Powered Power Supply,BUT!! Make sure you get this mic in the Solid Gold Version with the platinum jewel studded popscreen on the atomic clock regulated hydraulic lifter.

If you can't make hit records with this gear "wish list", you're just wasting your time and money and you may as well be recording your "intricate" beats on ****ty SSL or API or even "God help me!!"------Neve!!......best of luck----I need a drink!!
Old 3rd January 2007
  #77
Lives for gear
 
tengu's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by emkay View Post
Before joining GS and just lurking around, I learned about specific requirements and recommendations regarding vocals, drums,guitars etc., all in the creation of "music". I also learned that apparently "rap" and "hip hop" must be a very special entity unto itself with it's own requirements. I learned this when reading very specific posts and threads asking for gear recommendations for "rap" and "hip hop". Wow! I had no idea that the recording of this genre of music required special attention and special gear! So i did my own research and have come up with what I think would be the perfect list.---I hope this helps-------

-a recording space "tuned" using the "Hummer SWX 56 Spectrum Maximizer"
-a well placed "Sonic State Laser 9,000,000 XXL Holy Trinity Auto Mix Console"
-a "Hormone Electrix Galvinizer DBDB 433 Decompression Omni-Sexual Limiter"
-a "Sunny VFX Larynx Stimulator XL Diaghragm Mic with external Omnipresent Omnipotent Variable Patterns Wind Powered Power Supply,BUT!! Make sure you get this mic in the Solid Gold Version with the platinum jewel studded popscreen on the atomic clock regulated hydraulic lifter.

If you can't make hit records with this gear "wish list", you're just wasting your time and money and you may as well be recording your "intricate" beats on ****ty SSL or API or even "God help me!!"------Neve!!......best of luck----I need a drink!!
Dealing with samples from vinyl is a slightly different kettle of fish that may/may not require diffferent needs.

This is why we have this forum.

andrewj, you recommend the Alan Smart. Good for glue is my guess.

Have you ever use the Drawmer 1968 on this mixbuss?

What are you using the Fatso for at the moment?

I might get a chance to try one soon.

Would you recommend to someone with limited hardware such as myself getting an Alan smart and some eq's before the duende?
Old 3rd January 2007
  #78
Lives for gear
 
emkay's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tengu View Post
Dealing with samples from vinyl is a slightly different kettle of fish that may/may not require diffferent needs.

This is why we have this forum.

andrewj, you recommend the Alan Smart. Good for glue is my guess.

Have you ever use the Drawmer 1968 on this mixbuss?

What are you using the Fatso for at the moment?

I might get a chance to try one soon.

Would you recommend to someone with limited hardware such as myself getting an Alan smart and some eq's before the duende?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dealing with samples from vinyl is a slightly different kettle of fish that may/may not require diffferent needs.

This is why we have this forum.------So this forum is all about turntables and A/D converters? I didn't know that.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
andrewj, you recommend the Alan Smart. Good for glue is my guess.------Depends on what you want it to stick to, or what you want to stick together..
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Have you ever use the Drawmer 1968 on this mixbuss?-------yes
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What are you using the Fatso for at the moment?--------going in at the frontend for effect and/or compression, and depemding what I want to accomplish at the back end, either compress or give it that "analogue" vibe. or both
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I might get a chance to try one soon.-------that's great! hope it works for you!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Would you recommend to someone with limited hardware such as myself getting an Alan smart and some eq's before the duende?--------well, are you asking if you should place a hardware compressor and eq before the duende in the audio chain? Seems redundant. Or--if you have limited hardware because of limited funds, you may find that purchasing an Alan Smart and a comparable hardware eq may be beyond your budget--so--a Duende would probably be the answer....
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Old 3rd January 2007
  #79
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poncival's Avatar
Tracking Hip Hop
Sony C-800 (G or not) or Neumann U-87 or Neumann U-47 (M-49, 149, Tele 251 etc)
Neve 1073- Vocals, instruments
Urei 1176 (d) Vocals, instruments
Distressor (stock) Vocals, instruments
Digi SYNC I/O etc SMPTE
AKAI MPC-3000 (60, 2000 etc, "your favorite") AKAI clock is "the one" supposedly
Korg Triton etc...
Good vocal room (small and non-invasive, your closet might be "the one" etc.)

All instruments and Vocals can be tracked through this setup and be "world class"
You might need a bunch of 1073's unless you want to do it 1 track at a time out of the MPC, which is not unusual, as long as record label personnel aren't there sighing away while you do it.

Mixing R&B
SSL 4000 G etc (6000, 9000 etc)
Pultec EQH2 (EQP1A, Lang etc for some high end sweetening on lead vocals)
GML 8200 EQ (for overall mix shape and balance)
SRS BAP-02 (for the ultra width that you can't get with an Aphex or a BBE)
Lexicon 480L (300,224,PCM91 etc) for the "sparse" verbs
Lexicon PCM42s (TC2290, "pro tools" etc) for the TEMPO DELAYS
Send automation to the TEMPO DELAYS (crucial) (done in Pro Tools where necessary)
Auratones with Bryston 3B, and some good mains... (mackie?! fuuck )
Auto Tune, Vocalign, Pitch n Time, Waves C4, Renaissance EQ2/4, Embiggenizer, etc

Typical
Old 3rd January 2007
  #80
Lives for gear
 
tengu's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by emkay View Post
So this forum is all about turntables and A/D converters?
No.

Andrewj, have you ever used a Drawmer 1968 on the mixbuss?

How does it compare to the Smart C2?
Old 3rd January 2007
  #81
Lives for gear
 
emkay's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by poncival View Post
Tracking Hip Hop
Sony C-800 (G or not) or Neumann U-87 or Neumann U-47 (M-49, 149, Tele 251 etc)
Neve 1073- Vocals, instruments
Urei 1176 (d) Vocals, instruments
Distressor (stock) Vocals, instruments
Digi SYNC I/O etc SMPTE
AKAI MPC-3000 (60, 2000 etc, "your favorite") AKAI clock is "the one" supposedly
Korg Triton etc...
Good vocal room (small and non-invasive, your closet might be "the one" etc.)

All instruments and Vocals can be tracked through this setup and be "world class"
You might need a bunch of 1073's unless you want to do it 1 track at a time out of the MPC, which is not unusual, as long as record label personnel aren't there sighing away while you do it.

Mixing R&B
SSL 4000 G etc (6000, 9000 etc)
Pultec EQH2 (EQP1A, Lang etc for some high end sweetening on lead vocals)
GML 8200 EQ (for overall mix shape and balance)
SRS BAP-02 (for the ultra width that you can't get with an Aphex or a BBE)
Lexicon 480L (300,224,PCM91 etc) for the "sparse" verbs
Lexicon PCM42s (TC2290, "pro tools" etc) for the TEMPO DELAYS
Send automation to the TEMPO DELAYS (crucial) (done in Pro Tools where necessary)
Auratones with Bryston 3B, and some good mains... (mackie?! fuuck )
Auto Tune, Vocalign, Pitch n Time, Waves C4, Renaissance EQ2/4, Embiggenizer, etc

Typical




Congrats! Visited your website. What a great vibe your studio has. Played Mesa and Tempe area many times from late eighties to early nineties, had no idea there were studios like yours there! Not sure if you guys were there yet in those days. Anyways, great place.....peace....
Old 3rd January 2007
  #82
Lives for gear
 
poncival's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by emkay View Post
Congrats! Visited your website. What a great vibe your studio has. Played Mesa and Tempe area many times from late eighties to early nineties, had no idea there were studios like yours there! Not sure if you guys were there yet in those days. Anyways, great place.....peace....
Thanks! Love your signature by the way, I think I will change mine to one of my favorite quotes: "nobody wins when you get to the end before the click!!"
Old 3rd January 2007
  #83
Lives for gear
 
emkay's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by poncival View Post
Thanks! Love your signature by the way, I think I will change mine to one of my favorite quotes: "nobody wins when you get to the end before the click!!"

That is a great one too! Another one of my faves that you might like--
-"Is there no beginning to your talent?"
You know, there are benefits from all those years of touring and/or session work! The music, the women, the quotes and jokes!.........peace....
Old 3rd January 2007
  #84
Lives for gear
 
andrewj's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by tengu View Post
Dealing with samples from vinyl is a slightly different kettle of fish that may/may not require diffferent needs.

This is why we have this forum.

andrewj, you recommend the Alan Smart. Good for glue is my guess.

Have you ever use the Drawmer 1968 on this mixbuss?

What are you using the Fatso for at the moment?

I might get a chance to try one soon.

Would you recommend to someone with limited hardware such as myself getting an Alan smart and some eq's before the duende?
Sorry, got the flu yesterday, so I was in bed for a long time!

Actually I would recommend to start with an Alan Smart and an EQ when you are on a budget! Acutally I must admit I have no hardware EQ at the moment (Just the one in the Ted Fletcher P10 channel strip which is okay, but nothing more that okay!). Perhaps something like The SSL Alpha Channels or the BAE 1073 will add nicely to your setup and give you what you need!

Drawmer 1968 is a nice tool, but will give you a different flavor! I took the Alan Smart instead of that one!

Fatso is not in my studio, you can see what I actually own in my signature. I thought about the Fatso for the mix buss or as an add on for single tracks. At all I must say I heard it on mixx buss and liked it a lot, but preferred the Smart. It is way more transparent and elegant in my opinion (Unless you press the crush button and let the C2 begin to squash you signal like hell!). The smart is more versatile. I am sure I will add a pair of distressors or a Fatso in the future, but they will not replace the Smart!

Tony Belmont recommended the Alan Smart to me and I must admit this is one of the best buys I have realised.
Old 3rd January 2007
  #85
Lives for gear
 
andrewj's Avatar
BTW: If you just want and EQ here is a tip I got from some friends: Try the DAV BG No. 3. Transparent and elegant!

Of course the SSL and Avalon stuff will be a good choice for RnB
Old 3rd January 2007
  #86
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emkay's Avatar
 

delusional?

Are some of you guys here kidding!!?? This IS some kind of joke right? Here's the REAL deal and if someone tells you otherwise AND you believe it, then it's obvious that you've already "bought the bridge!"---

1. A truly great musician can usually cover ALL or most styles of music, because of his or her EARS!!
2. A truly great engineer/mixer/masterer can usually cover ALL or most styles of music,because of his or her EARS!
3. A truly great gear manufacturer that has created a "Staple" or "Classic" has done so because the gear has become universally accepted because it was created by someone with great EARS and TALENT!!
4. If you ACTUALLY have been "duped" into thinking or even worse,ACTUALLY believe that a "Smart" or "API" or "Avalon" or "Sony 800" or "Neumann u87-67-47-" or "SSL" or ANY other piece of high end gear that's probably in ANY credible studio, NO MATTER what style of music being recorded , is especially great for Rap or Hip Hop ,well that's cool! But to limit yourself into thinking so uni-dimensionally, well. that's just plain sad!!

By the way, for any of you who think I don't understand the genre. let's just say when I show up to a session with my kit, my drums and my laptop with Logic Pro to perform live and then programme embellishments or vice versa, and am asked, where the hell did I learn how to play those "beats" for real, I just smile and tell them, "I learned from listening to Dre"......I pack up and chuckle to myself-----it's ALL music!! Open up and learn some of it!!.......peace?
Old 3rd January 2007
  #87
Lives for gear
 
andrewj's Avatar
EMKAY, good points, but one question:

If the used tool is not as important as all the bridgebuyers here think, why are some tools used on most HipHop/RnB productions?

BTW I heard great mixes done with other tools by real good engineers, but they did not sound like the records mixed in the other studios.

Your right that most tools used in the big HipHop/RnB productions are also used in other music styles. Perhaps because of there quality?

I think TENGU is interested in some recommendations of nice equipment, and not in the posts you made here?
Old 3rd January 2007
  #88
Lives for gear
 
emkay's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewj View Post
EMKAY, good points, but one question:

If the used tool is not as important as all the bridgebuyers here think, why are some tools used on most HipHop/RnB productions?........I don't know, either hype or quality, make your choice YMMV

BTW I heard great mixes done with other tools by real good engineers, but they did not sound like the records mixed in the other studios........what does this mean, makes no sense?

Your right that most tools used in the big HipHop/RnB productions are also used in other music styles. Perhaps because of there quality? ......AND that most tools used in big pop/rock/whatever productions are also used in Hip Hop /Rap AND obviously because of quality AND sometimes just plain hype!

I think TENGU is interested in some recommendations of nice equipment, and not in the posts you made here?
........he probably is AND has he hired you to represent him?




Just trying to keep it real my man. It's only music and no one has to get defensive unless they suffer from a persecution complex....in that case there's always meds or therapy......rock on....peace?
Old 4th January 2007
  #89
no ssl yet 
Guest
I agree, it's a mistake to say "this outboard is best for hip hop".


The same things that are great for one genre are usually great for all genres.

It's because they are great pieces.

LOL there is no "Genre specific" outboard gear.

If you have the dough 1073/1084, API 550a, LA2A, 1176, dbx 160,Pultec EQP-1A will never fail as long as you are working in a genre that requires color and tone.

I haven't worked in every genre, but I have NEVER worked in one where color and tone were bad things.

a 480L is a classic reverb.

It's not a classic "rap" verb.tutt
Old 4th January 2007
  #90
Gear Nut
 

ssl go and buy the hummer, screw protolls hd cards, just load up on uad and powercore cards with one them duo 2 processors...than come pick me up..
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