The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
Roland MV 8800 vs. Akai MPC X ...? Drum Machines & Samplers
View Poll Results: Roland MV 8800 vs. Akai Mpc X
Roland MV 8800
18 Votes - 58.06%
Akai Mpc X
13 Votes - 41.94%
Voters: 31. You may not vote on this poll

Old 14th May 2018
  #31
Here for the gear
 
truzenzuzix's Avatar
 

My Choice: Roland MV 8800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Know1 View Post
I would describe the 4000 as pristine. The MV CAN be clean but it’s real easy to get gritty.
Funny enough I'm also currently trialling a MV against a 4k because I got sick of the computer and I want that hardware sampler sound (software samplers sound like plastic to me).

I love almost everything about the MV but the default sound just isn't as "big" out the gate as the 4K. MV is warm but very polite and airy. 4K is crisp and cold but also huge and punchy. I'm running them both straight into Behringer Truth powered studio monitors using TRS cables.

I haven't had much time on the units yet so maybe I'm missing something? Any tips on getting some grit / aggro / punch out of the MV?
Old 14th May 2018
  #32
Lives for gear
 
Muser's Avatar
try setting the MV Hi Pass filter on the given sample, dial in the Resonance to around 9 and then sweep it up till the lows in the sample start to knock.
Old 14th May 2018
  #33
Here for the gear
 

forget the MPC X, the 4K, the MV and get an MPC1000 and put JJOS02XL on it. It's like on STEROIDS. It's blown me away with the number of really advanced of features, ease of workflow and its rock solid too. I have a Z4 and it keeps crashing. You even can do Instrument mode with JJOS, so with FX's its way better than the Z4/Z8. Loads of replaceable parts via mpcstuff.com too. I took my beat up 1000 and turned it into a mean, clean, uber fast sampling machine. I use the SPDIF I/O for low noise too

Love MPC1000 +JJOS so much, I'm thinking about getting another one. You will not regret it.

MPC1000 JJ OS
www.mpcstuff.com

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AOZyiPUsaM



S
Old 14th May 2018
  #34
Lives for gear
 
Will The Weirdo's Avatar
My Choice: Akai Mpc X
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZooshMcD View Post
forget the MPC X, the 4K, the MV and get an MPC1000 and put JJOS02XL on it.
Does that OS upgrade add more midi outs, CV control, or make the tiny screen bigger with rock solid USB midi? Nope, lol.

IMHO while the OS upgrade may make the MPC 1000 a better sampler for you, most of us use the MPC as the control center of a larger system, a task the MPC 1000 fails at next to the larger MPC's.
Old 14th May 2018
  #35
Lives for gear
 
Will The Weirdo's Avatar
My Choice: Akai Mpc X
Quote:
Originally Posted by truzenzuzix View Post
I'm running them both straight into Behringer Truth powered studio monitors using TRS cables.
That's like buying a Ferrari but only driving it in 25MPH school zones, lol.
Old 14th May 2018
  #36
Lives for gear
 
ILL GREEN's Avatar
My Choice: Roland MV 8800
Eh, the MV and JJOS are almost identical in features. Either one is a good choice.
Old 15th May 2018
  #37
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by simplecomplex1 View Post
Yo! I'm in the market for a new machine. I currently have the Maschine Studio but I feel it lacking in terms of creating drum sequences with the legendary "mpc swing." I want that old school analog vibe but I also want to be able to edit freely using a mouse,

I used to own the mpc 2000xl, mpc 1000, 2500 & renaissance. Also used to own the Roland MV 8000.

SO the question is should I purchase the Roland MV 8800 for overall editing, tracking & mixing/mastering ..and maybe a mpc 1000 or 2000xl for drum sequencing?

OR should i shell out a couple grand (in payments haha) for the Akai Mpc X ??

Hip Hop is the form!
I'll be 100% honest...

....your question is one that would only be asked by someone who doesn't really understand any of what you are talking about.

If you knew how to use all of the machines you've owned in the past you wouldn't be looking to "buy" "Classic MPC swing" via machines that don't provide it, nor would you be looking for "Old school Analog" from 100% digital devices.

Here's some free advice that could be of great benefit should you choose to take it,

PICK A METHOD AND TOOLS FOR MUSIC CREATION AND STICK TO IT....COMMIT!

You can write a hit on ANY of the devices you mentioned, you CAN'T write a hit chasing phantom "Shortcuts"

By the number of pieces you've owned, and your level of understanding, it's clear you've done more shopping than learning.

STOP!

Take whatever you've got, and stop playing "gearslutz hopscotch" go write a record, learn your gear inside out.

You'll find once you know what you are doing on one piece of gear, that you'll be able to pick up another in no time, but by that point, you'll also understand THAT IT DOESN'T MATTER.

And for your information, a lot of hip-hop, HIGH-LEVEL hip-hop, ISN'T EVEN QUANTIZED, these guys provide their OWN "mythical swing"

These guys PLAY their MPC's like Ace Frehley or Johnny Thunders would PLAY their guitars, they are musicians, they don't rely on gear for their sound....or groove.

It seems as though you like Machine, I wouldn't touch that thing with YOUR fingers, but it is not up to me, it's up to YOU to decide what works best for your needs

(Most of my dislike of Machine comes from its inherent obsolescence, being a software dependent device, an MPC will always be worth something, an out of date machine is just garbage, BUT again...if it works best for YOU go with it)

I could explain MPC swing, and why people find the 60 and the 3000 to be somewhat different, but I don't have the energy, (suffice it to say it has something to do with MIDI jitter on the sequencers of the two oldest MPC's and about delayed 1/8 1/16/ or 1/32 notes, the amount of delay being expressed as a ratio and "MIDI jitter" introducing an iota of randomness to the delay ratios, while keeping in mind that the ratio is expressing degrees of a triplet, thus 66% becomes a full "Shuffle" and anything lower being on the early side of the triplet and higher on the late side, see? sounds like fun doesn't it?). just know that if you learn to PLAY your parts like Dre, Dilla ect. ect. NONE of that ****z matters.

Stop shopping, get ROCKING
Old 15th May 2018
  #38
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Will The Weirdo View Post
Does that OS upgrade add more midi outs, CV control, or make the tiny screen bigger with rock solid USB midi? Nope, lol.

IMHO while the OS upgrade may make the MPC 1000 a better sampler for you, most of us use the MPC as the control center of a larger system, a task the MPC 1000 fails at next to the larger MPC's.
The fact that you don't realize YOU CAN have CV control on an MPC 1000 is indicative of just how seriously people should be taking your advice.

And the fact that you consider screen size an essential consideration while making music pretty much nails the coffin shut on your credibility.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I'll go back to programming six analog modular drum voices (CV control only) with my MPC1000.....while watching the hockey game, (My TV screen is big, I like THAT)

USB? Don't kids use that to charge their toys or something?
Old 16th May 2018
  #39
Lives for gear
 
tdot's Avatar
My Choice: Roland MV 8800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tnevz View Post
It might just be my perception since I haven’t had the mv in a while, but the 4K feels like it has a good swing to it and more of a grimey feel to the audio. The MV just felt pretty sterile sounding, although it definitely had a vibe to it.
Maybe it’s just that I can push the levels more on the mpc and have less degradation, because it’s 96khz? I dunno.
I might be totally wrong about the sound difference.
I sure didn’t get to compare them side by side.

Glad you have both , maybe you can post some level matched samples of a drum loop or something!
I was thinking about picking up another MV in part to compare the two, and it’s just a piece of history and a cool machine.
Plus there’s a bunch available on eBay right now so the prices have dropped a whole lot.

Agreed, that the MV workflow makes more sense if you’re coming from working with a daw.
I don't know - I still feel the 4K swing seems overly robotic. I think it also really depends what you did with them - at first loading samples I thought the 4K sounded very clean and sterile, but after pulling some samples off some dirty vinyl and working with them, it sounded very dirty - which only means what you put in is what you get out.

The prices have dropped, I think now is the time to buy. I got mine for just over $400 USD (with a massive shipping to Canada of course). I paid about the same for my 4K.

I probably could eventually post a level matched sample, I've actually been building things for the MV

I figured out how to get a CD PATA to SATA adapter working, and then a SATA to SD adapter working with it, so I can now just stick SD cards into the front of the MV. With a micro SD to SD adapter and a micro SD to USB adapter, I can just stick the same flash card into both the 4K and the MV to share samples between them. Only cost $20 and looks just like a CD rom drive so you can easily swap it out (though takes a bit of work to build).

I've also been looking at building an 8 out + MIDI in 2 / out 3 card for the mv, but that's a different story kinda required to compare fairly with the 4k, since I always use 8 out to my console.

The 4K with USB on the front was really ahead of its time - does the 2500 or the 5k even have a USB port on the front?? You can just jam in a flash drive, or a USB->SD drive, or a portable HDD ... I find it doesn't always work right (sometimes I have to restart the unit before it recognizes the drive, is there a better fix to this?), but it sure is an impressive feature.
Old 16th May 2018
  #40
Lives for gear
 
tdot's Avatar
My Choice: Roland MV 8800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Will The Weirdo View Post
I'm almost positive 36 Chambers was tracked and mixed on an old Peavey AMR console, that's far from high end, there's an old thread on GS about it.
There are videos on YouTube with him talking about this. 36 Chambers was started on the EPS (EPS16?) and then he switched to the ASR, so the entire album was pretty much those two units. I'm pretty sure they tracked/mixed in an actual studio.
Old 16th May 2018
  #41
Lives for gear
 
tdot's Avatar
My Choice: Roland MV 8800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Will The Weirdo View Post
with rock solid USB midi? Nope, lol.
I have a hard time believing that. Considering the state they released the X in, and the fact that firmware 2.1 update release notes says 'improvements to MIDI I/O including reducing jitter', I think they were more concerned with making a 'flashy cool unit' than making an actual production center. Unless someone like innerclock measures the MIDI timing and finds that it's great, I'm going to assume it's pretty poor (going from their track record, they've only seemed to get 3 of the MPCs right).

Since I found some actual numbers:

From http://innerclocksystems.com/New%20ICS%20Litmus.html

MPC 60 internal sync MIDI TX - Max. Jitter between 16ths: 1 sample (0.02ms)
MPC 3000 internal sync MIDI TX - Max. Jitter between 16ths: 1 sample (0.02ms)
MPC 4000 internal sync MIDI TX - Max. Jitter between 16ths: 3 samples (0.06ms)
MPC 2500 internal sync MIDI TX - Max. Jitter between 16ths: 44 samples (0.92ms)

From the MPC X 2.1 release notes

Improvements to MIDI I/O including reduced clock 'jitter' (from +/-11ms to +/- 5ms) and reduced potential for drift when sending MIDI Clock, MTC, and MIDI note out

+/- 5ms?

So, it's up to 83.3 times worse than the 4K?

Last edited by tdot; 16th May 2018 at 11:09 PM..
Old 16th May 2018
  #42
Gear Maniac
 

My Choice: Akai Mpc X
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdot View Post
There are videos on YouTube with him talking about this. 36 Chambers was started on the EPS (EPS16?) and then he switched to the ASR, so the entire album was pretty much those two units. I'm pretty sure they tracked/mixed in an actual studio.
I have the Wu Manual and he says Enter 36 = EPS. This was probably tracked and mixed on a 4000

Return= EPS16+
This was probably mixed on a 4000G

Wu Forever = ASR10
This was probably mixed on the 9000
Old 16th May 2018
  #43
Gear Maniac
 

My Choice: Akai Mpc X
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdot View Post
I have a hard time believing that. Considering the state they released the X in, and the fact that firmware 2.1 update release notes says 'improvements to MIDI I/O including reducing jitter', I think they were more concerned with making a 'flashy cool unit' than making an actual production center. Unless someone like innerclock measures the MIDI timing and finds that it's great, I'm going to assume it's pretty poor (going from their track record, they've only seemed to get 2 of the MPCs right).
I got to play with both the x (it’s pretty) and the Mpc software+ mpd232.

The timing and swing on the software feel a lot smoother. Running Groove Agent and Battery 4 as plug-ins are also smoother too. I’m sure the X will get better midi timing but I blew my money on an iMac pro in the meantime. One of my buddies on Elektronauts uses the software to sequence his analog keys and he says the software version is right with timing.
Old 16th May 2018
  #44
Lives for gear
 
tdot's Avatar
My Choice: Roland MV 8800
Quote:
Originally Posted by v00d00ppl View Post
I have the Wu Manual and he says Enter 36 = EPS. This was probably tracked and mixed on a 4000

Return= EPS16+
This was probably mixed on a 4000G

Wu Forever = ASR10
This was probably mixed on the 9000
According to him here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0TqJtaFRhc 'the first 100 Wu Tang songs were made on the ASR10'

According to this thread Who mixed Wu Tang - Enter the 36? half of 36 Chambers was made on the ASR10

Though, he could be exaggerating, and I don't know what he did, but 36 Chambers was definitely released a few years after the ASR10 was released, I'm sure it's very likely.

Anyway, I love my ASR as both my master keyboard and occasionally sampler and I will never replace it. It also doubles as a room heater
Old 17th May 2018
  #45
Lives for gear
 
atma's Avatar
 

My Choice: Roland MV 8800
Quote:
=tdot;13320391
The prices have dropped, I think now is the time to buy. I got mine for just over $400 USD (with a massive shipping to Canada of course). I paid about the same for my 4K.
What!? I usually see 4K's going for about 800-1000 still...
Old 17th May 2018
  #46
Lives for gear
 
tdot's Avatar
My Choice: Roland MV 8800
Quote:
Originally Posted by atma View Post
What!? I usually see 4K's going for about 800-1000 still...
Nah, check eBay and look at completed auctions. These days I have so much I can just stalk gear for months before buying - I don't really NEED anything

Some people WILL still pay $800 on some buy it now (and $1k+ for customized ones), but US only auctions for 4K's rarely go over $600 ($500 and $560 for the last two). It probably depends on the options too. Avoid international auctions - crazy Europeans will pay 2-3x for gear. I had to convince a US seller with a US only auction to ship to Canada to get the MV for $440, otherwise they go for ~600.

I got lucky with the 4K, found someone local on eBay with one where they said qlink 2 and 6 have jitter. Best offered 550 CAD (listed at 650) and they told me if I met up with them they'd take the 550 cash. They are jittery but I still haven't found use for more than 2 qlinks (I'm coming from the 2KXL) and can easily replace them if I feel like it. I've already completely stripped the unit, gave it a thorough clean, ultrasonic cleaned all buttons, maxed the ram for $20, found an 8 out card for $160. I'll probably put an SSD in the unit I keep. I actually completely stripped the MV8800 and rebuilt it as well. They both look almost flawless now. I've recently had a lot of time on my hands

Anyway, if you're either patient or American, you should be able to find a 4K for $600 easily.
Old 17th May 2018
  #47
Gear Head
 

My Choice: Akai Mpc X
Quote:
Originally Posted by truzenzuzix View Post
Any tips on getting some grit / aggro / punch out of the MV?
I mean it depends what you’re doing but it starts with your samples. A simple way to get gritty would be to use the MFX. You can do a lot with the filters in “quick edit” You can also layer samples and manipulate the way they are triggered in SMT.

It’s a beefy machine and very underrated.

I really like the tape delays and analog modeling. It can be very fun to play with.
Old 17th May 2018
  #48
Lives for gear
 
harry_seldon's Avatar
My Choice: Akai Mpc X
The MPC X is a modern DAW based production studio with a modern touch based UI and some clever engineering to provide a common DAW controller/stand-alone experience. MPC 2.2 is a DAW. It may not have all the features, but it is a complete DAW. I don't rap or do hip hop. I am using the MPC X strictly as a traditional recording studio. I actually look at my MPC X and imagine a redesign replacing the pads with motor fader channel strips.

Last edited by harry_seldon; 18th May 2018 at 07:27 AM..
Old 17th May 2018
  #49
Lives for gear
 
Muser's Avatar
last I knew, the MPC X & Live would only really allow you to edit at a resolution of 120 ppqn. it can record at 4 X that, but not when editing. if that's still true, that's about 4 X too low for me.
Old 17th May 2018
  #50
Lives for gear
 
Will The Weirdo's Avatar
My Choice: Akai Mpc X
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdot View Post
There are videos on YouTube with him talking about this. 36 Chambers was started on the EPS (EPS16?) and then he switched to the ASR, so the entire album was pretty much those two units. I'm pretty sure they tracked/mixed in an actual studio.
Yep, an actual studio that had an AMR 1600 console.

I never mentioned anything about the EPS or ASR in my post.... I'm not sure who you were actually responding to, lol.
Old 17th May 2018
  #51
Lives for gear
 
Will The Weirdo's Avatar
My Choice: Akai Mpc X
Quote:
Originally Posted by v00d00ppl View Post
I have the Wu Manual and he says Enter 36 = EPS. This was probably tracked and mixed on a 4000

Return= EPS16+
This was probably mixed on a 4000G

Wu Forever = ASR10
This was probably mixed on the 9000
They were SSL after 3 Chambers for sure, there was an old thread about it. 36 Chambers has that old AMR sound to it, no SSL punch IMHO.
Old 17th May 2018
  #52
Lives for gear
 
12tone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muser View Post
last I knew, the MPC X & Live would only really allow you to edit at a resolution of 120 ppqn. it can record at 4 X that, but not when editing. if that's still true, that's about 4 X too low for me.
You can always double or quadruple the tempo for greater resolution.
Old 17th May 2018
  #53
Lives for gear
 
superstupid's Avatar
 

My Choice: Akai Mpc X
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muser View Post
last I knew, the MPC X & Live would only really allow you to edit at a resolution of 120 ppqn. it can record at 4 X that, but not when editing. if that's still true, that's about 4 X too low for me.
isn‘t it 960?
Old 18th May 2018
  #54
My Choice: Roland MV 8800
Quote:
Originally Posted by atma View Post
Really? The converters on the MPC4000 are 24 bit / 96 kHz—the MV8800 is 16 bit / 44.1 kHz. .
The MV`s internal processing is 24 bit
Old 18th May 2018
  #55
Lives for gear
 
Muser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by superstupid View Post
isn‘t it 960?
from what I picked up, unless it was originally wrong or it changed, the MPC Live editing resolution drops to 120ppqn when editing. what I mean is, when you nudged an existing note, the smallest amount you could move it was 120ppqn. it seemed to be an editing / screen / knob thing. if there were some reason I had to choose as why that would have been, it would probably be because they assumed the user might get frustrated about having to turn a knob so much in order to get courser shifts in note position, and that would be the default desire and expectation. so they chose a courser grained editing resolution.

if they had some kind of shift function to change resolution, that would be a solution to any single general default behavior.
they may have changed it now. I hope they have done.
Old 18th May 2018
  #56
Lives for gear
 
Muser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
You can always double or quadruple the tempo for greater resolution.
sure but I don't think that should be needed for a general editing case.
they recorded at a higher resolution in any case. I'm talking about a behavior in the Live.
someone might chime in an say it was corrected or addressed in a software update.
Old 18th May 2018
  #57
Lives for gear
 
superstupid's Avatar
 

My Choice: Akai Mpc X
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muser View Post
from what I picked up, unless it was originally wrong or it changed, the MPC Live editing resolution drops to 120ppqn when editing. what I mean is, when you nudged an existing note, the smallest amount you could move it was 120ppqn. it seemed to be an editing / screen / knob thing. if there were some reason I had to choose as why that would have been, it would probably be because they assumed the user might get frustrated about having to turn a knob so much in order to get courser shifts in note position, and that would be the default desire and expectation. so they chose a courser grained editing resolution.

if they had some kind of shift function to change resolution, that would be a solution to any single general default behavior.
they may have changed it now. I hope they have done.
wasn’t aware of any changes. i remember that it‘s possible to change the resolution from 96 to 960 in the preferences.
Old 18th May 2018
  #58
Lives for gear
 
Muser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by superstupid View Post
wasn’t aware of any changes. i remember that it‘s possible to change the resolution from 96 to 960 in the preferences.
well if you switched something to 96ppqn then any 120ppqn editing constraint would be higher than any 96ppqn maximum. so I'm not sure what would happen under those conditions. I'm still not totally sure what the facts of the matter are, but to me 120ppqn minimum position editing resolution is too small. especially as it would contradict the units own existing highest possible recording resolution. I also wouldn't think some onscreen option to change those resolutions should be too difficult to implement. assuming they still exist.
Old 18th May 2018
  #59
Lives for gear
 
atma's Avatar
 

My Choice: Roland MV 8800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caramel View Post
The MV`s internal processing is 24 bit
Right, but that's fairly typical—my Akai S1000 from 1988 uses internal 24-bit processing.
Old 19th May 2018
  #60
Here for the gear
My Choice and Currently Have:

My Choice: Roland MV 8800
My Choice and Currently Have:
• Roland MC-909 samplinggroovebox® with Roland SRX-05 Card
• Roland MV-8800 Production Studio w/ Roland MV8-OP1(Audio I/O Expansion Card Module),

Roland MV-8800 vs. (NuKai...oops) AKAI MPC X ...? -> Looks nice for New MPC Users, but why buy a gears that my current Hardware's has all the features I need. Also on my current - *Roland MV-8800 Production Studio* - I'm still discovering new features! -- This Monster is Loaded, a ahead of its time!!!!!

[F.Y.I.]:
***The Roland MV-8000 and Roland MV-8800 can read 24-bit .WAV Files! - It's just not documented in the Roland Users Manual....it can't make 24-bit .WAV Files Either.***

The AKAI MPC X touch screen cool, but as with today technology just add the Android Tablet to new hardware's (It's Touchscreen too with Apps...LOL) or not.

Last edited by djflexmk2; 26th May 2018 at 01:45 PM.. Reason: Fix Spellings
Topic:
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump