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How do YOU compress your drums w/ heavy 808's/ sub bass? Dynamics Processors (HW)
Old 1st July 2018
  #61
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Mercado_Negro's Avatar
Don't use too much compression, enhance it instead. A good use of distorsion to enhance the tone and make it cut through small sound systems, two transient designers for the attack and sustain to enhance the punch and long notes and something like LoAir from Waves to make it rumble can do wonders.

Do not apply these processes in the same track. Blend them in using parallel processing. Finally you can put them all in a bus and add a touch of compression to glue them and make more coherent.

[EDIT] I recently mixed this song using everything I suggested above. It was released a couple of days ago. Just for reference:

YouTube
Old 1st July 2018
  #62
+1 for starting off with a good 808 sample. It helps a hell of a lot.

Usually I sum all drums, apart from the 808. I just leave that alone and treat it as a bass.

Something like Little Labs VOG or Waves RBass on a bus connected to the 808 can work wonders to add some more depth and ‘ooomph’ as it were.

Sometimes I’ll add either the Black Box HG-2 or the Thermionic Culture Vulture to make it cut through the mix a bit more.
Old 3rd July 2018
  #63
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mercado_Negro View Post
Don't use too much compression, enhance it instead. A good use of distorsion to enhance the tone and make it cut through small sound systems, two transient designers for the attack and sustain to enhance the punch and long notes and something like LoAir from Waves to make it rumble can do wonders.

Do not apply these processes in the same track. Blend them in using parallel processing. Finally you can put them all in a bus and add a touch of compression to glue them and make more coherent.

[EDIT] I recently mixed this song using everything I suggested above. It was released a couple of days ago. Just for reference:

YouTube
really dope mix!

yea I noticed using compression alot just ultimately begins to suck out the beef in a kick distortion is nice. I use the decapitator. Do you use that one? if you do what presets do you usually use for 808 and kicks?
Old 3rd July 2018
  #64
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArcticAudio View Post
+1 for starting off with a good 808 sample. It helps a hell of a lot.

Usually I sum all drums, apart from the 808. I just leave that alone and treat it as a bass.

Something like Little Labs VOG or Waves RBass on a bus connected to the 808 can work wonders to add some more depth and ‘ooomph’ as it were.

Sometimes I’ll add either the Black Box HG-2 or the Thermionic Culture Vulture to make it cut through the mix a bit more.
sometimes with certain 808s I get stuck trying to figure out if this a good 808 or not lol

when you choose your 808s what are some key give aways that lets you know its a bad 808 sample?
Old 3rd July 2018
  #65
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Mercado_Negro's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by varun213 View Post
really dope mix!

yea I noticed using compression alot just ultimately begins to suck out the beef in a kick distortion is nice. I use the decapitator. Do you use that one? if you do what presets do you usually use for 808 and kicks?
I used the UAD TS Overdrive in that song but I've used the Decapitator before in other songs. I don't use presets, I just tweak things til they sound good to me.
Old 3rd July 2018
  #66
It is all about headroom and gain staging.

I use no compression and make sure there is tons of headroom.

That is the old school way of doing things.

MikeK
Old 5th July 2018
  #67
Quote:
Originally Posted by varun213 View Post
sometimes with certain 808s I get stuck trying to figure out if this a good 808 or not lol

when you choose your 808s what are some key give aways that lets you know its a bad 808 sample?
That’s a good question, but the answer’s hard to put into words! Let me have a go though:

If it’s clicky at the beginning and end (unintentionally); and if it sounds thin and low quality audio is one of the biggest things.
Old 6th July 2018
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolfog09 View Post
I use no compression and make sure there is tons of headroom.

That is the old school way of doing things.

MikeK
hey bro I have a song I produced and a friend of mine mixed and mastered it. I feel he compressed this song too much to where its not squashed but it definitely sounds obnoxious to me. If you can take a listen for a second could you use your ears and tell me what you think real quick? it would help us a ton in future mixes!!!

For Da City (Prod by SpaceNTime) by SpaceNTime | Space NTime | Free Listening on SoundCloud
Old 7th July 2018
  #69
Hi

I listened to the song. My advice for doing a good mix would be to get him to break the song into vocals drums etc. etc.

Then have those on 4 or more separate tracks.

Then work with him to change the sound before the final mix down.

What my end result is that I want each sound to pop from the other sounds thats how I judge success.

Try EQ plug ins, vintage ones, Effects on each track and even hardware.

I think that should take you a cut above the rest.

Mike
Old 7th July 2018
  #70
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by coolfog09 View Post
I listened to the song. My advice for doing a good mix would be to get him to break the song into vocals drums etc. etc.

Then have those on 4 or more separate tracks.

Then work with him to change the sound before the final mix down.

What my end result is that I want each sound to pop from the other sounds thats how I judge success.

Try EQ plug ins, vintage ones, Effects on each track and even hardware.

I think that should take you a cut above the rest.

Mike
yea he does that..I am the one who mixed the beat and he blends the vocals and mixes it in. Most hip hop records are done this way nowadays since its so recycled you know? but from that mix did you notice any flaws of anything?
Old 18th July 2018
  #71
Gear Head
 

all of the above are great techniques for dealing with bass/bassdrum "problems" but what you really want is to not have a problem to begin with. so, either build your kit, tune it and get it working and then look for a bass that matches and gets in there on its own just because of its tone or, the other way around; sit there and make a mono bass, getting it to move your room the way you want and then build a kit and tracks around that, avoiding the bass' freq range or at least its low hz's with dynamic eqs. i never highpass the other tracks, just the frequencies that are arguing. if i use a compression bus for the drums, i let only the upper harmonic range of the sub in. lots of compression plugins have options for this and sidechaining, but im always trying to keep latency down so i perfer to have the sub on a seperate track and another hipass filtered version with the drums. sometimes, if i have phasing issues between the two and the tracks allow it, ill put the highpassed copy in the sides and the raw sub dead mono mid and look for a good crossover point. for bigger projects, ill spend a day making kits and corresponding basses, so later when im composing, im not wasting time tweaking. alot of good engineering is good preparation and knowing, without a doubt, that something works. bass is fundemental in rap, so thats where i usually start, but remember, no two sounds are alike. all of what ive said is just a guideline. with live bass or projects im mixing where i cant replace sounds, the above obviously doesnt apply although that depends on your sneakiness hmm, little messy. point is, start with good sounds. pretend youre tracking.
Old 18th July 2018
  #72
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Awesome Advice in this thread. I’m not new to this site, but I had to create account to comment for all the helpful comments. Respect family
Old 19th July 2018
  #73
Lives for gear
Use Propellerheads ReBirth RB-338. The trick is getting it to run on anything later than Windows 98. Forgot how I did it. But you'll also need a driver to bridge 32bit ReWire apps to 64bit apps.
Old 19th July 2018
  #74
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kcorstel View Post
all of the above are great techniques for dealing with bass/bassdrum "problems" but what you really want is to not have a problem to begin with. so, either build your kit, tune it and get it working and then look for a bass that matches and gets in there on its own just because of its tone or, the other way around; sit there and make a mono bass, getting it to move your room the way you want and then build a kit and tracks around that, avoiding the bass' freq range or at least its low hz's with dynamic eqs. i never highpass the other tracks, just the frequencies that are arguing. if i use a compression bus for the drums, i let only the upper harmonic range of the sub in. lots of compression plugins have options for this and sidechaining, but im always trying to keep latency down so i perfer to have the sub on a seperate track and another hipass filtered version with the drums. sometimes, if i have phasing issues between the two and the tracks allow it, ill put the highpassed copy in the sides and the raw sub dead mono mid and look for a good crossover point. for bigger projects, ill spend a day making kits and corresponding basses, so later when im composing, im not wasting time tweaking. alot of good engineering is good preparation and knowing, without a doubt, that something works. bass is fundemental in rap, so thats where i usually start, but remember, no two sounds are alike. all of what ive said is just a guideline. with live bass or projects im mixing where i cant replace sounds, the above obviously doesnt apply although that depends on your sneakiness hmm, little messy. point is, start with good sounds. pretend youre tracking.
this is what ive come to realize to save you all the time. It takes a bit of experience though.

how do you make your own drumkits ? Do you combine old samples? or do you synthesize kicks from scratch
Old 16th August 2018
  #75
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by varun213 View Post
this is what ive come to realize to save you all the time. It takes a bit of experience though.

how do you make your own drumkits ? Do you combine old samples? or do you synthesize kicks from scratch
both and more. i recorded me hitting a pipe (with a stick damn it) and that makes its way somehow into most of my snares. sometimes ill add a little noise or hiss to just an attack..oh i always have a sample of the noise floor the drums came from, but thats just being safe and ill rarely need to use it.

"need to" kinda has alot to do with "how"...layers, transient control, crossfades but how tends to vary, and sometimes i dont do anything at all. the goal isnt to do a bunch of work, its to make it funky. how doesnt matter imo.

you know who does drums well, the alchemist. well, whoever mixes his stuff. try to filter out the individual elements and check out where he puts them in the frequency range and look at their levels. actually, do that with any drums that really appeal to you and try find more songs done by the same engineer. find his pattern. and then, steal that ill add, steal anything thats not nailed down, always. im joking but im not. itll become yours anyway, audio techniques are slutty that way. either way, definitely examine work you enjoy and find out why. youll be surprised, like hihats tend to be mostly bottom and low mids the way i like them but i spent years tweaking the top all frustrated, filtering out the bottom then bringing it back up with a compressor...but its mistakes like that, that youll learn the most from. examine the mistakes youre already making. think them through each step. theyre yours and maybe theyre not really mistakes as they are unexposed potential. sorry, bet youd like a step by step you dont want that, trust me.
Old 23rd August 2018
  #76
Gear Head
 

No matter what the compressor I usually go light and slow in any thing I want transient. U can side chain so both will play well but what I do is use what I call the cock back technoque when I make the beat basically on pad with the kick one synced to the 808 . The 808 will have some degree of attack shave off slightly so it won't phase the kick and I can sprinke extra kicks without the 808
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