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Best sounding sampler plug-in Drum Machines & Samplers
Old 11th May 2018
  #31
Gear Maniac
 
rootberg's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by miscend View Post
Tal Sampler sounds really good. It emulates a couple of vintage samplers. And will read your Akai banks.
It sounds good, but it does not load Akai Banks. Only SF2 and SFZ as of now.
Old 11th May 2018
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rootberg View Post
It sounds good, but it does not load Akai Banks. Only SF2 and SFZ as of now.
My bad. I thought it did because it has some of the Hollowsun Akai libraries included. Nevertheless having an Akai import feature would be a great addition.
Old 14th May 2018
  #33
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midiquestions's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by miscend View Post
Tal Sampler sounds really good. It emulates a couple of vintage samplers.
I like the sound of TAL Sampler a lot. However, I will never spend the money to get past the demo version because of its ability to play only four samples per instance. I get the thing of "load and go" to focus on results over endless tweaking, but that is really crippled IMO. I'd be happy to pay for the same item that could load more samples.
Old 14th May 2018
  #34
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Yeah, the Tal sampler is a great concept, but I find it essentially unusable because of its limitations (and horrific GUI). It also doesn't exactly capture the actual nuances of said samplers, but of course one cannot expect perfect replication..
Old 14th May 2018
  #35
Deleted 86c3d96
Guest
I have a Motif ES6 sitting in a closet

I have never sampled on it. Frankly, I have owned it for 12 years, and have hardly used it. Now, you got me curious. I think what soured me on it was the whole mLAN debacle.
Old 14th May 2018
  #36
Here for the gear
 

silly topic, the plugin sound is flavoured by the AD/DA converters in your audio interface, the recording resolution and the sampling rate!
Old 14th May 2018
  #37
Gear Addict
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZooshMcD View Post
silly topic, the plugin sound is flavoured by the AD/DA converters in your audio interface, the recording resolution and the sampling rate!
Not that silly Zoosh. There are differences on how a sampler (sampleplayer) plugin handles audio and some of them (like the mentioned TAL sampler) even kind of emulate the sound of a specific machine / chipset.

peace
Old 17th May 2018
  #38
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tdot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by atma View Post
Gotcha—yeah, if something is sourced from vinyl it's superfluous. I think really the best coloration for vinyl samples is honestly just whatever your choice of vintage sampler imparts upon it from the preamps/bit & sample decimation/pitch shifting interpolation. Even then, I'm very careful not to overdo anything, as vinyl in general has such limited bandwidth and dynamic range.

On a random side-note I was actually thinking about this the other day, because if you do some simple calculations based on an average S/N ratio of vinyl, you'll find its about the equivalent of 12 bit! I think this is possibly one reason 12 bit samplers tend to sound so good with vinyl, perhaps because you're not actually losing much information in that conversion, but instead it's taking some of that analog noise-floor and giving it a harder edge or crunch.. who knows..
Actually, being 12 bit has little to do with the sound of the older samplers. A 'perfect' 12 bit implementation should sound just as 'clean' as a 24 bit implementation - with a much higher noise floor. Granted, the fact that those 12 bit 80s converters were far from ideal probably does have a bit to do with the sound - and why most of the older units had real analog filters, as they weren't able to build such things into the DACs.

Most of the sound comes from the 'interesting' ways they had to come up with to achieve transposition of the samples, as it wasn't a simple matter back then. As far as I know, the S950 uses some technique varying the actual converter clocks based on transposition value (which also varies the filter cutoff from the clock, to 'prevent aliasing', I believe the filters on it actually take a clock as an input), and the SP12/Emax use 'linear drop sampling' to interpolate samples (almost like using Paint to resize an image all blocky). That's also why they had a maximum pitch range ... also, the SP12 (like the Ensoniq ESQ, another unit I've seen with the same technique) multiplexed the converter, using a single converter for all channels of output ... also, I believe it uses one of its output DACs with a comparator to 'build' an ADC for recording the samples. Back then, those things weren't cheap

All of these techniques were what really messed up the sound of these units

I'm surprised nobody has done a great job at recreating them, making an SP12/Emax sounding software sampler should be trivial (it DID run on an 3mhz 80s CPU)
Old 3rd July 2018
  #39
re sampler

I would maybe look at recycle. I think it is kick ass for what it does. Then take advantage of cheap Waves plug ins and then add a few you want to customize the sound.

MikeK
Old 15th December 2018
  #40
Gear Head
 

a couple years ago i had a scare and had to check and well, all the daw's have thier own specific sound. (not to add to the contraversy, but windows sounds more raw then apple to my ears but i wouldnt dare say that without parenthesis.)

i compared reaper, sonar, abelton and the harrison on windows by playing the same drumloop through them and recording off the main outputs with another ad. lynx -->apollo

to my ears, reaper sounded the most similar to the original sample, abelton the least. (rounded freq responce, limited dynamics) that and other nuances made me believe abelton is made with the hobbist in mind but i didnt go deep into its settings and i know repear took some tweaking before things sounded right.

the same applies to samplers. all of them are different BUT, the native ones that come with your daw, sound like the daw unless they specify it adds color or something. so simpler in abelton, if thats your malfunction, should be your best bet. in reaper the rs5k manager and a couple other scripts put you 10ft above the rest but its not as plug and play as the rest and takes some work.

in general, theres two audio markets going on that you need to be aware of. 90% of whats coming out everyday is for these "i can make a beat too!" "producers" to take thier money. theres seasonal trends, with plugins and tutorials, youtube videos ect, pushing the advertising.
you also need to know that the materials used to make audio components have gone down in quality or arent used anymore. things like copper or tin. we used to say you should pay no less then 100$ per converter. now id say you need 300$ if not more. and dont get me started on the differences between. i will say internal cards are better then outboard. dont use usb bus powered interfaces. theres a reason theyre affordable.
Old 16th December 2018
  #41
DAH
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kcorstel View Post
a couple years ago i had a scare and had to check and well, all the daw's have thier own specific sound. (not to add to the contraversy, but windows sounds more raw then apple to my ears but i wouldnt dare say that without parenthesis.)

i compared reaper, sonar, abelton and the harrison on windows by playing the same drumloop through them and recording off the main outputs with another ad. lynx -->apollo

to my ears, reaper sounded the most similar to the original sample, abelton the least. (rounded freq responce, limited dynamics) that and other nuances made me believe abelton is made with the hobbist in mind but i didnt go deep into its settings and i know repear took some tweaking before things sounded right.

the same applies to samplers. all of them are different BUT, the native ones that come with your daw, sound like the daw unless they specify it adds color or something. so simpler in abelton, if thats your malfunction, should be your best bet. in reaper the rs5k manager and a couple other scripts put you 10ft above the rest but its not as plug and play as the rest and takes some work.

in general, theres two audio markets going on that you need to be aware of. 90% of whats coming out everyday is for these "i can make a beat too!" "producers" to take thier money. theres seasonal trends, with plugins and tutorials, youtube videos ect, pushing the advertising.
you also need to know that the materials used to make audio components have gone down in quality or arent used anymore. things like copper or tin. we used to say you should pay no less then 100$ per converter. now id say you need 300$ if not more. and dont get me started on the differences between. i will say internal cards are better then outboard. dont use usb bus powered interfaces. theres a reason theyre affordable.
was the AD on a different or the same system?
Old 16th December 2018
  #42
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3rd Degree View Post
I am just talking on the sample. I find it is unnecessary as the record has saturation, and this is compounded by eqing the sample (with hardware) as well as layering. I am not saying I wouldn't ever use saturation, I am just saying I typically don't, and don't find it to be a go to. I use it on all sorts of other sources however.

Depending on the source, even recorded vinyl can be too clean.

It often pays to find a few good saturator/filter vsts.


Often the subtle effects works wonders as the effects might just mildly compress audio, color the highs. Once you get comfortable, you will get a feel on what you can get away with.
Old 16th December 2018
  #43
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kcorstel View Post
a couple years ago i had a scare and had to check and well, all the daw's have thier own specific sound. (not to add to the contraversy, but windows sounds more raw then apple to my ears but i wouldnt dare say that without parenthesis.)

i compared reaper, sonar, abelton and the harrison on windows by playing the same drumloop through them and recording off the main outputs with another ad. lynx -->apollo

to my ears, reaper sounded the most similar to the original sample, abelton the least. (rounded freq responce, limited dynamics) that and other nuances made me believe abelton is made with the hobbist in mind but i didnt go deep into its settings and i know repear took some tweaking before things sounded right.

the same applies to samplers. all of them are different BUT, the native ones that come with your daw, sound like the daw unless they specify it adds color or something. so simpler in abelton, if thats your malfunction, should be your best bet. in reaper the rs5k manager and a couple other scripts put you 10ft above the rest but its not as plug and play as the rest and takes some work.

in general, theres two audio markets going on that you need to be aware of. 90% of whats coming out everyday is for these "i can make a beat too!" "producers" to take thier money. theres seasonal trends, with plugins and tutorials, youtube videos ect, pushing the advertising.
you also need to know that the materials used to make audio components have gone down in quality or arent used anymore. things like copper or tin. we used to say you should pay no less then 100$ per converter. now id say you need 300$ if not more. and dont get me started on the differences between. i will say internal cards are better then outboard. dont use usb bus powered interfaces. theres a reason theyre affordable.

DAWS should all sound the same.

Keep in mind Ableton might be autowarping your audio and depending on the setting might be coloring your audio. If doing an audio comparison, turn off warping.

Also due to different panning laws, some DAWS will sound louder than others. Still the same sound just louder/quieter. If doing an audio comparison this must be accounted for. DAWS can be about 0-6 db louder/quieter. In Reaper you can change pan law to various settings. I think Live is hard coded at -3db. If you set Reaper to -3db does it sound the same as Live.
Old 25th December 2018
  #44
re sampler

I have used NI Kontakt a few years back. It has some cool features. In 2018 I got Halion 6 when it was on sale.

Here is a video I made yesterday. I have just had the chance to look more closely at it.

YouTube
Old 25th December 2018
  #45
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No mention of Serato Sample yet despite the hype. For serato users: Does serato color the material at all or is it digitally clean?
Old 26th March 2019
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midiquestions View Post
I like the sound of TAL Sampler a lot. However, I will never spend the money to get past the demo version because of its ability to play only four samples per instance. I get the thing of "load and go" to focus on results over endless tweaking, but that is really crippled IMO. I'd be happy to pay for the same item that could load more samples.
Digging up a thread. Just wanted to mention it can load 4 layers and multiple samples spread across the keyboard on each layer.

Still limited but in a good way I think, I treat it like hardware and record out of it.
Old 29th March 2019
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eklo View Post
Digging up a thread. Just wanted to mention it can load 4 layers and multiple samples spread across the keyboard on each layer.

Still limited but in a good way I think, I treat it like hardware and record out of it.
It is only 4-voice polyphonic, one voice per layer. That is insanely limited.
Old 8th April 2019
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midiquestions View Post
It is only 4-voice polyphonic, one voice per layer. That is insanely limited.
I don't think that is correct - it is up to 12 voice polyphonic and the layers don't reduce polyphony, i.e. if you have a sample on each of the 4 layers then that is still one voice.
Old 14th April 2019
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tedmanzie View Post
I don't think that is correct - it is up to 12 voice polyphonic and the layers don't reduce polyphony, i.e. if you have a sample on each of the 4 layers then that is still one voice.
from the manual:

"TAL-Sampler has four layers and can play four samples simultaneously."

"Every layer has its own mapping and every layer can only play one sample at once."
Old 14th April 2019
  #50
Gear Guru
 
Muser's Avatar
generally layers in samplers are subordinate to keymap zones and each layer usually has one playable sample slot. even though they might all sound at the same time on the same note, that can often eat voice polyphony. but maybe yamaha had a technique to combine those to perform as one voice and then output to an independent DAC before summing. in any case, if it plays two samples in any two of the layers, it should probably play four as well. how that impacts overall polyphony might be trickier to test for.
Old 14th April 2019
  #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midiquestions View Post
from the manual:

"TAL-Sampler has four layers and can play four samples simultaneously."

"Every layer has its own mapping and every layer can only play one sample at once."
Yes, that's what I described - it's how a lot of Akai samplers worked, my 4000 does the same thing, 4 layers, one sample per layer. On one keygroup. What do you think it should do? I think it's a pretty sophisticated sampler plugin, not insanely limited
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