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need to recreate this particular 90s boom bap bass
Old 6th June 2017
  #1
Here for the gear
 

need to recreate this particular 90s boom bap bass

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1GpGozZY2k

i tried time and time again but i just cant get it to sound exactly like it!i need a real pro to help me recreate it with as much fidelity and as faithfully as possible.somebody that "speaks" in frequencies like i speak in english.

ive tried everything so far.tried modifying sampled basses to make it sound like this,tried modifying a basic sine wave,compression,downsampling,all types of eq-ing,even layering...came close but...it just isnt the same.

i want a carbon copy...and also,i would like to understand exactly what nick wiz does to the bass to make it sound like this.at the end of the day is a very basic and common 90s boom bap bass but...theres something special about how he does it that always makes it stand out just a little bit from the rest.theres a lot of "boomines" to it without feeling over saturated in the low end department (there is no low/mid "harmonics" that come about when dealing with such low frequencies)...the initial punch is so commanding,the sustained notes are soft and warm,i dont know how to describe it but it is just so clean.it literally has ALL of the good stuff and none of the bad.its perfect!everything about it pleases the ear.
and its not about how its eq'd to cater to the drums and the sample in this particular track.forget that.this is just an all around all purpose bass that would work with everything!

somebody please help me get from a basic sine wave to THIS.(while keeping in mind that i dont have an sp1200,vintage analog compressors etc at my disposal)...so ,basically,i'd like to get as close as i can in DAW.that would be the goal.

i know forums frown upon people asking to be "spoon fed" but thats exactly what i need.i did my experimentation,i tried for years and years to achieve this particular sound to no avail.now im asking for somebody who really knows whats up to go in their daw,whip up a bass like this and give me the "exact coordinates" to input.which sound font was used to achieve it,what was done to the sine,eq,compression...the whole 9

it would be GREATLY appreciated!thank you in advance
Old 6th June 2017
  #2
DAH
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This is one-shot bass guitar notes played from sampler and filtered.
Old 6th June 2017
  #3
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like i said...could be sine wave,could be soundfont(one shot in this case).
what im looking for is WHICH one shot would be closer to this and HOW to filter it.i tried everything i could already.the closest i came was from the abraham laboriel (basslegends vol2)one shots,filtered compressed and layered with some 808s....was close but not close enough.
Old 6th June 2017
  #4
DAH
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coreconcept View Post
like i said...could be sine wave,could be soundfont(one shot in this case).
what im looking for is WHICH one shot would be closer to this and HOW to filter it.i tried everything i could already.the closest i came was from the abraham laboriel (basslegends vol2)one shots,filtered compressed and layered with some 808s....was close but not close enough.
Sine one shot cannot be different. And you cannot filter it. Yep, I have checked it at home, it's sines. So just play with sine presets. Hint: watch ADSR settings, sharp attack and abrupt release may generate low-end transients, which will muddy up the bass. I even dare to say that is (and now was) your problem.
Old 7th June 2017
  #5
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thank you for your input ,i truly appreciate it.but i think we are not quite understanding each other here.i have been making great sounding boom bap basses for over a decade.i got my own presets and personal library that is MORE than adequate for any kind of track that i need.i have been fiddling with attacks,decays,releases etc for 10 years.i dont really have a problem with making low frequency traditional 90s boom bap bass sound good...but i want THIS exact bass.i wanna straight up bite it (unapologetically)...all the fiddling ive been doing so far has not been successful .so i dont think fiddling with it some more is gonna help.thats why i decided to come here.there is a certain subtle nuance in this particular bass in this particular song that eludes me.or maybe im just hearing something that isnt there.or maybe its the way the bass interacts with this particular sample and drums(maybe if i heard it dry i would see it differently).or maybe its the sp1200 thats really giving it that extra subtle flavor that i cant quite put my finger on...will keep tryin tho'
Old 7th June 2017
  #6
Gear Head
 

Have you tried low-passing that record to try to isolate the bass, then pick one spot where there aren't vocals/other instruments in the song, then turn that to a one-shot sample? Results are decent. See attached mp3. You can use that as your foundation and play with all the mixing/ASDR you want on it from there to tweak. (mp3 was played using the one-shot from this method on midi).
Attached Files

Bass.mp3 (207.1 KB, 1895 views)

Old 8th June 2017
  #7
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MPC Bass Multisamples - Virtual Bass Guitar For the Akai MPC

eq cut everything out and leave everything below 200hz
Old 12th June 2017
  #8
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@ nob i S
thank you.yes i tried isolating the bass and then tweak it.but it inevitably loses "something"...theres some kind of "softness" to the original bass that gets lost when i cut out the highs and mids.and it gains that gritty dirt/noise and nasty reverberation (which is actually great for more uptempo les refined early 90s boom bap).but i need more smoothness here.(but i didnt spend much time on this technique...i will try again)
@ robis18
thanks man...those are some nice one shots...didnt have the JJOS2-2XL yet!
Old 12th June 2017
  #9
Gear Addict
 

First of all start at the source... Find the Sample he chopped, filtered and flipped (I wouldn't be surprise if it was off a Roy Arey's record he snatched the vibes from, or an Upright Bass a la Ron Carter)...

Once you find it do some Bit Crushing with Decimort (the SP, EPS or ASR preset should be a good starting point) and mess with the Resonant Filter (I'm sure when he sampled it, he clipped the convertors)...

If you don't have a plugin that has a lowpass filter that sounds an SP1200... You can always buy a used Moogerfooger MF-101 for cheap, as it has the same Filter Chip as Outputs 1/2 on the SP...

It's honestly it's not that difficult to reproduce... Your biggest issue will be Tuning the sample bc the SP tuning function is mos def not precise... and a lotta producers from that period played/adjusted the Pitch/Filter while recording Basslines...

Hope this helps...
Old 12th June 2017
  #10
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i have no idea what the sample was.thought maybe the sample nick used for the melody might have had a bass break or riff in it(checked around..."who sampled" etc but no dice).but now that i think about it...that nice initial "thump" might be from a vigorous E string pluck on a upright bass.

secondly,an MF101 would be hard to find here in south east asia (scratch that...EVERYTHING is hard to find here)...especially when it comes to vintage gear,forget about it.

i tried many different bitcrushing plug ins and vsts that have "sp1200 presets" over the years.
never tried decimort (checked the price tag...quite expensive).how would you say it performs compared to all the free options out there?is it a you get what you pay for type deal?or neither of them TRULY come close to the real thing?
Old 12th June 2017
  #11
DAH
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its sine
Old 14th June 2017
  #12
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Sjeff's Avatar
 

A sine indeed, probably the one from the "Tone program" off the Akai S950. But the sound you are looking for is the saturation from reel to reel tape. That's what Nick Wiz used on all his productions in the 90's and cellar sounds compilations
Old 14th June 2017
  #13
DAH
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sjeff View Post
A sine indeed, probably the one from the "Tone program" off the Akai S950. But the sound you are looking for is the saturation from reel to reel tape. That's what Nick Wiz used on all his productions in the 90's and cellar sounds compilations
Its not saturated, check the harmonics, it is rather fluttered a bit which may create some phatness.
Old 14th June 2017
  #14
I would say this boomy kick is as important as the bass itself, it makes the transients and makes it feel as it feels. When there's no kick it sounds just like a sine, nothing special about it (at 1:00).
Old 14th June 2017
  #15
DAH
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cyjanopan View Post
I would say this boomy kick is as important as the bass itself, it makes the transients and makes it feel as it feels. When there's no kick it sounds just like a sine, nothing special about it (at 1:00).
Btw the kick is very typical for the mid-90s boom bap Pete Rock style ****.
Old 14th June 2017
  #16
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Sjeff's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DAH View Post
Its not saturated, check the harmonics, it is rather fluttered a bit which may create some phatness.
Agree to disagree, how can you check the harmonics from only the bass when there's a sample on top of it? You can definitely hear the bite the bass has in this track.. And not only this track, but almost every Nick Wiz track.
His whole style is drenched in tape!

Look his instagram to see what he uses for these Cellar Sounds compilations.
A SP1200, S950, a TASCAM multitrack reel to reel, DAT tapes and a tascam mixer
Old 14th June 2017
  #17
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DAH is right. point blank.

Its a 'relative pure" sine. There is one overtone at the doubled rootfrequency which is about -24dB lower than the root.
Other than that nothing but the rest of the instruments (Kick Snare, LowPassed vibes sample) in the low/mid range.

There are two bassnotes in the below 50Hz range that I had to see first before I really heard them (I don't have a sub here). They are part of the bassline sequence and havn't anything to do with hamonics/overtones.

peace
Old 23rd November 2019
  #18
Gear Head
 
MFSAKA's Avatar
Nick tells me when we talk last time he uses default Akai S950 sine tone for baselines + low octave organ from ASR10.

And God no! Sensei never use any compressor on the instrumental. Only EQ! Basically he has only one DBX comp unit for tracking vocals!

And Nick NEVER layer Bass Instruments! Cuz Tascam M2516 don't have phase flip switch!!!
Basically all secret of his sound it's his talent for gathering well sounded together sounds in arrangement, SP1200+950, rack outboard units and that vintage console. I try to create same sound from 2009 year and nothing in DAW (NOTHING) can give you that EXACT sound!
Only re-sampled through real SP sounds and mixing in that console give's me same exact vibe and Nick himself appreciate and like my last joint's.

In VST world nothing can give's you that Teac 25 series EQ flavor and most important - crosstalk of channels, and summing amplifier color. And off course preamp's! When i work only digital i can't achieve same exact saturation that Teac's pre's do to the sound.

In 2018 i buy my console and learn how to use it. Do a lot video call's with Mr. Loizides DA MAN!
He help's me a lot...A LOT! Maybe he just like my stylo, maybe he helps because i draw a lot art's for him and Cellar Sounds. No matter - Nick's DA MAN for me! Period!

He use very strange EQ sweeps for some sounds so you may never find out what exact frequency he pick for beat elements.
Plus no Tascam VST emulation.

All that bitcrusher's VST - is ****. SP use fixed 12 bit and 26.040 hz samplerate!!!
And main part of the sound it's no interpolation pitching with dropdown samples when you tune!

So for now better find the guys who have SP and ask him re-sample yo stuff!

But soon new SP clones with exact same sound will be available
Google Low_hiss Sp Clone and Isla Instruments SP2400
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