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powercore 6000
Old 1st October 2008
  #1
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🎧 15 years
powercore 6000

TC Electronic | PowerCore6000

WOW
Old 1st October 2008
  #2
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tobymusic's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Sorry, but I think this is stupid.

Either TC still sells the System 6000 in high quantities, or they must be plain blind.

MD3 is way old, still there is no MD4 available for PoCo, same goes for VSS-3. Where is VSS-4?? Unless they port over the latest algorithms from the System 6000, i can`t take them seriously any more.

Toby
Old 1st October 2008
  #3
iWS
Gear Head
 
🎧 15 years
Mmm

Was excited for a minute before I realised its just a X8 packaged with all the TC 6000 plugs.

Shame still no VSS 4 - I'd love to ditch my M 4000 for in the box recall and multiple instances.

Guess thats why they don't

W
Old 1st October 2008 | Show parent
  #4
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🎧 15 years
no M 4000 algorithms
same power as X8

if they dont drop prices dramatically this is no serious answer to UAD-2
Old 1st October 2008 | Show parent
  #5
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macgee's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by lllubi View Post
no M 4000 algorithms
same power as X8

if they dont drop prices dramatically this is no serious answer to UAD-2
this product is not a direct competitor to UAD, not by a long shot. they fill very different requirements. i own the X8 as it has the types of things i wanted but the UAD is more about the emulations which i don't feel the need to go DSP for.

Are the DSP in the Powercore System 6000 the same as the DSP in the X8 ?
Old 1st October 2008 | Show parent
  #6
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jamwerks's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Where's the beef?


Unfortunately, seems it's just a repackage of an X8 with all the already available software (except for the new delay, but those aren't lacking anymore).

Will there be upgrades to the M4000 and M6000? That what I'd like to know.........
Old 1st October 2008 | Show parent
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamwerks View Post
Where's the beef?


Unfortunately, seems it's just a repackage of an X8 with all the already available software (except for the new delay, but those aren't lacking anymore).

Will there be upgrades to the M4000 and M6000? That what I'd like to know.........
ok, after checking it more closely, it appears it's using the Freescale DSP as opposed to the Motorola DSP so it appears to be a different beast completely. this certainly means that the new algo's will work with it!
Old 1st October 2008 | Show parent
  #8
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by macleodgrant View Post
this product is not a direct competitor to UAD, not by a long shot. they fill very different requirements. i own the X8 as it has the types of things i wanted but the UAD is more about the emulations which i don't feel the need to go DSP for.

Are the DSP in the Powercore System 6000 the same as the DSP in the X8 ?
unfortunately it seems like beeing X8 with bundled software and a misleading name
VSS4 in a plug was just wishfull thinking
TC Electronic | PowerCore Comparison
Old 1st October 2008 | Show parent
  #9
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macgee's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by lllubi View Post
unfortunately it seems like beeing X8 with bundled software and a misleading name
VSS4 in a plug was just wishfull thinking
TC Electronic | PowerCore Comparison
cool, i see, so they're the same DSP. i would be so irritated if the VSS4 was released and would only run on the PoCo System 6000 cos i just recently bought the X8...

i searched on the internet and found Freescale DSP to be Motorola

why are they advertising it differently? just because of the included plugins????
it's silly or very clever marketing
Old 1st October 2008 | Show parent
  #10
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tobymusic's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I think the reason is that Motorola sold or separated the DSP section from the company and called it "Freescale". Still the same chips AFAIK.

Toby
Old 1st October 2008 | Show parent
  #11
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SonOfSteven's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
ok so actualy nothing new
Old 1st October 2008 | Show parent
  #12
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jbuzz's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
did someone heard anything about pricing?
Old 1st October 2008 | Show parent
  #13
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Flouvio's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by tobymusic View Post
Sorry, but I think this is stupid.

Either TC still sells the System 6000 in high quantities, or they must be plain blind.

MD3 is way old, still there is no MD4 available for PoCo, same goes for VSS-3. Where is VSS-4?? Unless they port over the latest algorithms from the System 6000, i can`t take them seriously any more.

Toby
Ok call me biased, since I'm a native dane, but I think the plugins, that come along with this solution are excellent.
I know that the plugz are "way old", but they're still top of the range. Please name me one non-TC, algorithmic based reverb for the DAW, that without doubt will outperform the "way old" VSS3. And is MD3 sounding so bad that it's not still among the top tools for in-the-box mastering?

Ok, if engineers have a whish to use retro-sound-coloration from well marketed emulations, this is probably not their weapon of choice. But saying that the TC plugins included are not up to date, is like saying, for instance, that most of the Sonnox plugins aren't either. Last time I looked, they also were in use on a lot of DAWs, that I know of.

Saying that - of course everyone wants "da new sh*t", but this would also mean that TC would have to say goodbye to the System6000 concept and their prime development platform.
F
Old 1st October 2008 | Show parent
  #14
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macgee's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flouvio View Post
Ok call me biased, since I'm a native dane, but I think the plugins, that come along with this solution are excellent.
I know that the plugz are "way old", but they're still top of the range. Please name me one non-TC, algorithmic based reverb for the DAW, that without doubt will outperform the "way old" VSS3. And is MD3 sounding so bad that it's not still among the top tools for in-the-box mastering?

Ok, if engineers have a whish to use retro-sound-coloration from well marketed emulations, this is probably not their weapon of choice. But saying that the TC plugins included are not up to date, is like saying, for instance, that most of the Sonnox plugins aren't either. Last time I looked, they also were in use on a lot of DAWs, that I know of.

Saying that - of course everyone wants "da new sh*t", but this would also mean that TC would have to say goodbye to the System6000 concept and their prime development platform.
F

while i agree with you, i have to say that if TC want to badge a unit Powercore 6000 then they should offer (at a price) the up to date algo's.
Old 2nd October 2008 | Show parent
  #15
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elambo's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by macleodgrant View Post
why are they advertising it differently? just because of the included plugins????
it's silly or very clever marketing
I think it's great marketing. For many people, this will appear to be a System6000 which is able to work directly in your DAW. On the surface, it's pretty damn appealing. Most of us realize that it's not the same.

btw - I love MD3. Don't care when it was authored. It's the last step in many of my sessions. And VSS3 is still a very good reverb.
Old 2nd October 2008 | Show parent
  #16
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elambo's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by macleodgrant View Post
while i agree with you, i have to say that if TC want to badge a unit Powercore 6000 then they should offer (at a price) the up to date algo's.
And I agree with that, but offering TC's current algorithms on the PoCo platform would undermine the Sys6000 and they may sell less of them. I think they'd sell a lot more PoCos, but they seem to prefer to keep their best stuff exclusively on the 6000.
Old 2nd October 2008
  #17
Gear Addict
 
🎧 15 years
From what I gather, you kind of want those 'verbs if you're going PoCo anyway, so it depends how the package prices against buying individually. (The Sonnox edition seems to be a great deal in throwing in the Oxford eq and dynamics for only $100 more, for example.)

But relabeling and calling the Motorola chips Freescale is a bit of a scam, especially when they still call them Motorola in the newish X-8 and Freescale got spun off in 2004.

What I was really hoping to see in the AES announcements was X-8 power in a PCIe card.

Bear
Old 2nd October 2008 | Show parent
  #18
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jamwerks's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I can't see TC not announcing a new reverb algorithm (VSS5 or 6?) at AES, after the appearence of Bricasti and the PCM 96. They may keep the M6000 and just replace the M4000 with a new dual-stereo unit to compete with the PCM 96's dual-stereo capabilities. Or would that replacement to the M4000 be the Powercore 6000? They might conceivably announce that the new P6000 will also include the yet unannounced algorithm and have dual-stereo capabilities.

Well after seeing that my crystal ball fell and broke......
Old 4th October 2008 | Show parent
  #19
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🎧 15 years
pricing on this thing will be the tell-all. if it's anything like the bargain that sonnox edition x8 is, then those who haven't yet bought one are in for a treat. my x8 is something like serial no. 11, but i don't mind; i like the poco's synths and stuff like "character", etc. -- it's not just a comp/lim/eq in my rig. for me it's a great weight off the shoulders of the computer's cpu, but this edition with all the 6000 power is a nice package, depending again on the price.

seen a lot of price drops on tc stuff this year (see nova musik). this one should be priced pretty aggressively (one would hope).
Old 4th October 2008 | Show parent
  #20
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macgee's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by vixapphire View Post
pricing on this thing will be the tell-all. if it's anything like the bargain that sonnox edition x8 is, then those who haven't yet bought one are in for a treat. my x8 is something like serial no. 11, but i don't mind; i like the poco's synths and stuff like "character", etc. -- it's not just a comp/lim/eq in my rig. for me it's a great weight off the shoulders of the computer's cpu, but this edition with all the 6000 power is a nice package, depending again on the price.

seen a lot of price drops on tc stuff this year (see nova musik). this one should be priced pretty aggressively (one would hope).
i agree, this X8 is a huge weight off my computer and the quality of the plugins is incredible.

i'm hoping the VSS4 will be released for it at some point. considering what VSS3 i can only imagine that VSS4 will be nothing less than astounding
Old 4th October 2008
  #21
Gear Nut
 
🎧 10 years
Suggested Retail Price 2999.99 euros or $4130 U.S. at current exchange rates

-Gk
Old 4th October 2008 | Show parent
  #22
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
i bet when MD4 does finally come out for powercore, it'll be only for this new powercore6k thing. then we'll have to pony up.
Old 4th October 2008 | Show parent
  #23
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🎧 15 years
I have a real 6000 and I also have the MD3 algo on a PoCo. And of course, I've compared them using all digital I/O on the 6000 to the same computer as the was PoCo housed in.

Not the same. Hardware 6000 is definitely better. Asked TC about it at the last AES show, and they confirmed that, though no one had to confirm it for me to hear the difference.

Sorry to be a groove buster. The PoCo 6000 algos may be close, but no cigar.
Old 4th October 2008 | Show parent
  #24
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Max headroom's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote from TC 's site :

The 7 pristine algorithms included with PowerCore 6000 are ported 1:1 from System 6000. Due to the fact that PowerCore 6000 and System 6000 share DSP/Ram hardware design, the algorithms are not emulations: they are the real thing.


Are they lying to us ? Is it legal to write this down , and then say that they are not the same ???


Cheers


Max
Old 4th October 2008 | Show parent
  #25
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elambo's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Max headroom View Post
Quote from TC 's site :

The 7 pristine algorithms included with PowerCore 6000 are ported 1:1 from System 6000. Due to the fact that PowerCore 6000 and System 6000 share DSP/Ram hardware design, the algorithms are not emulations: they are the real thing.


Are they lying to us?
Someone is.
Old 4th October 2008 | Show parent
  #26
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianT View Post
I have a real 6000 and I also have the MD3 algo on a PoCo. And of course, I've compared them using all digital I/O on the 6000 to the same computer as the was PoCo housed in.

Not the same. Hardware 6000 is definitely better. Asked TC about it at the last AES show, and they confirmed that, though no one had to confirm it for me to hear the difference.

Sorry to be a groove buster. The PoCo 6000 algos may be close, but no cigar.
you are likely correct: anyone who would think there would be complete 1-to-1 identity of quality would probably be smoking even better stuff than the TC guys setting the price (if the post above with the Euro and (exchange-rated) US pricing is accurate) of the PoCo6000.

Maybe they do something different on the x8/6000 b/c it's got twice the DSP power, though? Remains to be seen.
Old 4th October 2008 | Show parent
  #27
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joris de man's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Yawn...

Eventhough I have been interested in a Poco for a while, esp. for these particular algorithms, I can't believe TC can't get their act together driver wise.

They've been promising Vista drivers for over a year, and now that there finally here, it is Vista 32 only? WTF? Vista 32 drivers are nearly identical to Xp32 drivers anyway, surely writing some 64 bit drivers can't be that hard?
Every other manufacturer can....

Thing is, the plug-ins won't even have to be 64 bit for a while anyway, as it will take a while for 64 bit versions of all the DAW's to come out.

So we're really only talking driver updates.tutt

Cheers,

Joe
Old 4th October 2008 | Show parent
  #28
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elambo's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by vixapphire View Post
anyone who would think there would be complete 1-to-1 identity of quality would probably be smoking even better stuff than the TC guys..
It seems that everyone who owns both the SYS6000 and the PoCo say that the SYS6000 sounds a little better, so certainly not all of them are smoking crack, but I'm 110% certain that this statement by TC is entirely true:

"The 7 pristine algorithms included with PowerCore 6000 are ported 1:1 from System 6000. Due to the fact that PowerCore 6000 and System 6000 share DSP/Ram hardware design, the algorithms are not emulations: they are the real thing."

So it's not exactly CrAzY to believe that they should sound the same. Considering the price difference, it won't matter to a lot of people if the PoCo algorithms lose a little something in the translation.
Old 5th October 2008 | Show parent
  #29
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
I agree, but the price difference is most likely what gives rise to peoples' suspicions about the qualitative differences. sometimes info like that creates bias enough for people to "hear" differences that aren't actually there, too.
Old 5th October 2008 | Show parent
  #30
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elambo's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by vixapphire View Post
I agree, but the price difference is most likely what gives rise to peoples' suspicions about the qualitative differences. sometimes info like that creates bias enough for people to "hear" differences that aren't actually there, too.
Good point. I'd be curious to see how a true blind test between these two boxes would turn out.
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