Neumann announces V 402 state-of-the art dual channel microphone preamplifier - Page 3 - Gearslutz
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Neumann announces V 402 state-of-the art dual channel microphone preamplifier
Old 8th August 2020
  #61
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Yeah, they did refer all work on danner modules out to this other company in Germany for a long time, and starting a long long time ago...name not coming to mind at the moment.
Old 8th August 2020
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toledo3 View Post
Yeah, they did refer all work on danner modules out to this other company in Germany for a long time, and starting a long long time ago...name not coming to mind at the moment.
Geithain?
Old 9th August 2020
  #63
Gear Nut
 

i havent even tested all their old preamps
v476 on the list

dont need a sennheiser preamp cashcow
Old 9th August 2020
  #64
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I’d like to hear from someone who has actually heard this thing.
Old 9th August 2020
  #65
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I’d like to hear from someone who has actually heard this thing.
Which one? I've lost sense of the subject: are we talking Neumann, or Gordon? Or DAD? Or Camden?
Old 10th August 2020
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
Which one? I've lost sense of the subject: are we talking Neumann, or Gordon? Or DAD? Or Camden?
For real. Has ANYONE heard the Neumann yet?? All I’ve heard is people piss all over it.
Old 10th August 2020
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blaugruen7 View Post
Geithain?
hmm, maybe but I almost don’t think so... I have it written down somewhere. I’ll try to find that.
Old 10th August 2020
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
For real. Has ANYONE heard the Neumann yet?? All I’ve heard is people piss all over it.
yeah, it is disappointing that the mods didn’t see fit to trim all of that out of what is a product release thread. Topics may naturally weave in and out of side topics, but it feels like it actually does break rules for a manufacturer to come in and slag the product the thread is about, after a spammy post about their product. Not exactly taking the high road.

I mean it is literally still pre-release and another manufacturer is wading in and calling out what they think is lacking in specs and such? Really? How about, I don’t know...asking Neumann for the specs you want? Waiting?
Old 10th August 2020
  #69
Quote:
Originally Posted by toledo3 View Post
yeah, it is disappointing that the mods didn’t see fit to trim all of that out of what is a product release thread. Topics may naturally weave in and out of side topics, but it feels like it actually does break rules for a manufacturer to come in and slag the product the thread is about, after a spammy post about their product. Not exactly taking the high road.

I mean it is literally still pre-release and another manufacturer is wading in and calling out what they think is lacking in specs and such? Really? How about, I don’t know...asking Neumann for the specs you want? Waiting?
I completely disagree with that opinion. He was called out as "cheap" so he answered, appropriately. As this thread lacks data (because it's in the New Products forum but has yet to land in anyone's hands), there's little to discuss beyond specs and specs are boring. And the comparisons have already begun, without Neumann even being in the mix of those comparisons. The main fuel for these distractions has come from other forum members, not from that manufacturer, though it's not surprising given the lack of tangible data about the subject of this thread.

It would be best, for everyone, to post this type of thread once the product is actually available.
Old 10th August 2020
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
I completely disagree with that opinion. He was called out as "cheap" so he answered, appropriately. As this thread lacks data (because it's in the New Products forum but has yet to land in anyone's hands), there's little to discuss beyond specs and specs are boring. And the comparisons have already begun, without Neumann even being in the mix of those comparisons. The main fuel for these distractions has come from other forum members, not from that manufacturer, though it's not surprising given the lack of tangible data about the subject of this thread.

It would be best, for everyone, to post this type of thread once the product is actually available.
This is the internet, potential users are discussing stuff...does every single negative comment need to go answered, combatted against? People just have opinions.

Camden used it as a way to start putting in digs on the product this thread is about. Totally uncalled for to take it there. OK...Defend your product if need be, but to start ripping on the neumann preamp for no reason, *with fairly flimsy reasoning to boot - not substantive*, and as a competing manufacturer? Not really professional and more than that, shows a lack of integrity.
Old 10th August 2020
  #71
Quote:
Originally Posted by toledo3 View Post
This is the internet, potential users are discussing stuff...does every single negative comment need to go answered, combatted against? People just have opinions.

Camden used it as a way to start putting in digs on the product this thread is about. Totally uncalled for to take it there. OK...Defend your product if need be, but to start ripping on the neumann preamp for no reason, *with fairly flimsy reasoning to boot - not substantive*, and as a competing manufacturer? Not really professional and more than that, shows a lack of integrity.
Where did they "rip" Neumann? Words matter, and "start ripping on neumann" and "put in digs" aren't accurate. You, on the other hand, are indeed "ripping" and "digging" Camden. This was their response to someone's previous attempt to negatively spin their activities:

"I'm sorry but I cannot understand how that is in anyway questioning their design or criticizing their brand. In fact, I did the opposite - I think very highly of Neumann so to see them omit an important spec like THD and EIN is rather surprising."

They "ripped" them by calling out the omission of THD/EIN, and then complimented the marquee? That would be an odd and highly ineffective method of "ripping." Also, comparing specs (all we have to go on at this point) is about as substantive as it gets. You clearly viewed their approach differently. Two opposite opinions, and yet neither of us actually knows Camden's intent.

But here we are, distracting further from the Neumann (which, again, has very little substantive data to discuss). And shedding more light on Camden. I'd never heard of them, but because of the heavy pushback and belittling from some GS members I decided to look them up -- people do seem to be very impressed by them. And they're inexpensive. I guess that can feel threatening to owners of competing products.
Old 11th August 2020
  #72
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That is just a gaslighting comment from them you quoted after dissing the Neumann product. A withering compliment.

Maybe their product is as cheap as the shots they are taking, sounds like plenty think it is. I don’t know, that is not what I am commenting on.

And...Yes, as your post states, they over took this thread to drive attention to themselves. I don’t find it threatening in any way, just annoying and short sighted.
Old 11th August 2020
  #73
Quote:
Originally Posted by toledo3 View Post
Maybe their product is as cheap as the shots they are taking, sounds like plenty think it is. I don’t know, that is not what I am commenting on.
??? You've just provided the perfect example of withering, but without the compliment. And where are these "plenty" of people who think it's an inferior product?
Old 11th August 2020
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
??? You've just provided the perfect example of withering, but without the compliment. And where are these "plenty" of people who think it's an inferior product?
Let’s just disagree to disagree on this one.
Old 12th August 2020
  #75
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ARIEL's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
??? You've just provided the perfect example of withering, but without the compliment. And where are these "plenty" of people who think it's an inferior product?
Sadly Elmbo a few seem to be lacking in comprehension and then resort to conflating something that Cranborn mentioned as an omitted spec as a rip which was not a rip... We all know how internet folk put out claims on something being bad or cheap can potentially go viral and have a negative effect on a company therefore all manufacturers have the right to step in and address those claims/attacks.
Old 12th August 2020
  #76
Old 12th August 2020
  #77
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I suspect I may be the only person here who has actually laid hands on the V402 and thus might have a valid basis for opinion.....

I've reviewed it for SOS, so I won't give the full monty here... Go buy the next issue of the magazine, please!

I can say, though, that I was, erm... pretty disappointed with it. If I was looking to invest £2.5k in a new preamp I definitely wouldn't be spending my money with Neumann for the V402. There are significantly more-capable, and as-capable-but-much-less-expensive, alternatives to pick from IMHO.

Of course, others may have different budgets, different priorities, and different ears, so YMMV as always. And clearly there will be those for whom the presence of a diamond lozenge always far outweighs any practical or technical deficiencies.... But this is just my personal opinion based on personal experience, lots of careful usage, and comprehensive measurements...

I would also add that, despite the familiar hate and wilful misunderstandings floating around here, I would actually feel very comfortable spending my money with Cranborne. Its Camden preamp is a genuine revelation and, in its new EC2 rack mount form, a very practical option for location recording too, if that's your thing.

Again, from first hand experience I have to say the Camden is an extremely impressive design -- both technically and sonically. And don't let the price fool you into underestimating it either! It easily outperforms some very high end gear for a fraction of the price!

Hope that brings some clarity to the debate...
Old 12th August 2020
  #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hugerr View Post

Hope that brings some clarity to the debate...
Yeah, your completely unsupported slagging, without delving into any detail or reasoning behind it at all, brings tons of clarity. Bringing up Camden also a very classy move. Really eager to buy the issue to read more of this level of insight.
Old 12th August 2020
  #79
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Originally Posted by toledo3 View Post
Interesting demo. To my ears, it sounded really gorgeous. That piece of music didn't disappoint either.
Old 12th August 2020
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dfghdhr View Post
Interesting demo. To my ears, it sounded really gorgeous. That piece of music didn't disappoint either.
Yep, I thought it was interesting to hear the results an obviously talented and thoughtful reviewer obtained with it. I thought the same, and my expectations were not even that high about it.

People will always shoot their mouths off one way or the other about things like this, but the proof is in the pudding.
Old 12th August 2020
  #81
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Originally Posted by toledo3 View Post
Yeah, your completely unsupported slagging, without delving into any detail or reasoning behind it at all, brings tons of clarity. Bringing up Camden also a very classy move. Really eager to buy the issue to read more of this level of insight.
I think you jumped in to the deep end a bit there. He said he didn’t want to share to much Cos it’s coming in an issue soon. Also point is he has actually used the unit, so can actually have an opinion ?

There’s a lot of anger going on here that feels unnecessary and just a load of guys shouting at each other.
Old 12th August 2020
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fredouli View Post
I think you jumped in to the deep end a bit there. He said he didn’t want to share to much Cos it’s coming in an issue soon. Also point is he has actually used the unit, so can actually have an opinion ?

There’s a lot of anger going on here that feels unnecessary and just a load of guys shouting at each other.
It doesn’t add any clarity at all to neg on the gear in this thread with no substantive reasoning provided, and then to throw MORE gas on the Camden thing, throw a match, and then leave. It is really bizarre to not even go into some general detail. I am sure all of the Camden users love it, and there will be plenty of “likes” about it, but from my perspective it is quite insufferable.

To each their own of course.
Old 12th August 2020
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toledo3 View Post
It doesn’t add any clarity at all to neg on the gear in this thread with no substantive reasoning provided, and then to throw MORE gas on the Camden thing, throw a match, and then leave. It is really bizarre to not even go into some general detail. I am sure all of the Camden users love it, and there will be plenty of “likes” about it, but from my perspective it is quite insufferable.

To each their own of course.
I guess all will be revealed in the SOS issue. Usually reviewers can’t say much before the issue drops, and they regularly tune in to these threads to say their initial impression before an issue is released, in my memory.

It also didn’t read to me like mr Camden pre amp came in here to peddle his wares.. it was brought up as a transparent alternative at about 10% of the cost, and he then commented, perhaps to his error, but not to the level of vitriol thrown at him since.

Just feels a shame to read 3 pages of anger.
Old 12th August 2020
  #84
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blaugruen7's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by dfghdhr View Post
Interesting demo. To my ears, it sounded really gorgeous. That piece of music didn't disappoint either.
in this video it sounds like it passes audio and you are able to make music with it and be happy.
Old 12th August 2020
  #85
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ionian's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by hugerr View Post

Hope that brings some clarity to the debate...
Nope, it just sounds like a friend called in a favor.
Old 12th August 2020
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hugerr View Post
I suspect I may be the only person here who has actually laid hands on the V402 and thus might have a valid basis for opinion.....

I've reviewed it for SOS, so I won't give the full monty here... Go buy the next issue of the magazine, please!

I can say, though, that I was, erm... pretty disappointed with it. If I was looking to invest £2.5k in a new preamp I definitely wouldn't be spending my money with Neumann for the V402. There are significantly more-capable, and as-capable-but-much-less-expensive, alternatives to pick from IMHO.

Of course, others may have different budgets, different priorities, and different ears, so YMMV as always. And clearly there will be those for whom the presence of a diamond lozenge always far outweighs any practical or technical deficiencies.... But this is just my personal opinion based on personal experience, lots of careful usage, and comprehensive measurements...

I would also add that, despite the familiar hate and wilful misunderstandings floating around here, I would actually feel very comfortable spending my money with Cranborne. Its Camden preamp is a genuine revelation and, in its new EC2 rack mount form, a very practical option for location recording too, if that's your thing.

Again, from first hand experience I have to say the Camden is an extremely impressive design -- both technically and sonically. And don't let the price fool you into underestimating it either! It easily outperforms some very high end gear for a fraction of the price!

Hope that brings some clarity to the debate...
It indeed brings some clarity to the table. It's completely clear that I will never ever buy any issue of the SOS magazine again. The vanilla reviews from your magazine never surpassed the status of a glorified product manual anyways.
If someone would want a mic pre-amp with generic 4558 and 2114/5532 op-amps like the invasive product from your buddy that you are shamelessly promoting here in a Neumann "New Product" thread, I would recommend to look on ebay into some 30 year old Yamaha or some Behringer pre amps . . same op-amps and more channels as well . . for about £40.

Some people her are "unterste Schublade" [תודה אבא for the translation]

Last edited by TobyToby; 13th August 2020 at 03:20 AM..
Old 12th August 2020
  #87
Deleted 8f585d5
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Astonishing levels of real ignorance, bigotry and hatred.

For any lurkers that might be interested, my review will be in the October edition of SOS.
Old 13th August 2020
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TobyToby View Post
It indeed brings some clarity to the table. It's completely clear that I will never ever buy any issue of the SOS magazine again or watch their youtube channel. The vanilla reviews from your magazine never surpassed the status of a glorified product manual anyways.
If someone would want a mic pre-amp with generic 4558 and 2114/5532 op-amps like the invasive product from your buddy that you are shamelessly promoting here in a Neumann "New Product" thread, I would recommend to look on ebay into some 30 year old Yamaha or some Behringer pre amps . . same op-amps and more channels as well . . for about £40.

Some people her are "unterste Schublade" [תודה אבא for the translation]
lmao, this times infinity. It is clear that the idea of journalistic ethics is entirely absent with this “reviewer”.
Old 13th August 2020
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hugerr View Post
Astonishing levels of real ignorance, bigotry and hatred.

For any lurkers that might be interested, my review will be in the October edition of SOS.
Bigotry? Wow.

You aren’t right on the other points either.

Neumann is a legendary company that has contributed as much to audio engineering as any company could ever hope to. When people wander into a discussion that is obviously going to attract people who are interested in the product, and use it as a stepping stone to put them down and build themselves up, it should really not be surprising at all that it gets a negative reaction, because it is extremely rude to do so.
Old 13th August 2020
  #90
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CupcakeKitten's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by hugerr View Post
Astonishing levels of real ignorance, bigotry and hatred.

For any lurkers that might be interested, my review will be in the October edition of SOS.
If you wanted to talk about your upcoming review, fair enough. But bringing the Camden into this after other users have already tried to re-direct this thread back a bit closer to it's purpose was a bad call on your part IMO. It doesn't reflect well on either you or SOS.

Truth be told you didn't really bring any clarity, just added fuel into the fire. I think many people came here to read about the Neumann, not get involved in yet another "high end" vs "low end" bickering match. Fvck knows there are plenty of them already, and i'm sure anyone here is welcome to make a new one if they fancied it, with spec comparisons and brand slamming and the likes, but a product release thread just isn't the space for that. For many it comes across tacky and in bad taste - or just outright plain rude. You've just contributed to it unfortunately.
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