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Plugin Alliance Release AMEK EQ 200
Old 7th September 2020
  #811
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Bouroki's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by simon.billington View Post
You do realise though, that their emulations do have to get approved and they have to pass the original developers high levels of scrutiny and A/B testing. In many cases they also employ null tests among other things. So while the beta testers have nothing concrete to compare emulations against, the original product developer does. So if it’s as obvious or as terrible as you say it is it wouldn’t have got the stamp of approval.

So not only would you have to intentionally program in crossover distortion, it would have been approved by the original designers with the golden ears. So it’s a little bit different to the examples you put forward. But to be honest, the reason why some of these other issues exist is MAYBE no-one has brought it up with them. You can only fix what you’re aware of.
You do wonder sometimes though whether there are conflicting interests/motives and whether people just want to close the deal and make some bucks. The Focusrite comp for example was unanimously voted in a blind test here as by far the worst among other focusrite emulations, even the ancient Midnight/Red series...
Old 7th September 2020
  #812
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by simon.billington View Post
Well supposedly it’s a hybrid and it’s under the Amek label. It just shares the same tech and heritage, but it’s not the same thing, So unless you know what they did for sure it’s really hard to make a fair assessment.

In this particular case the assessment most can make is how well it does the job it was designed to do. Otherwise I’d think you make a valid point.
Simon

I certainly don‘t have a spectral analyser built into my ears
but after what I heard I‘m pretty shure this is purely a gml 8200
model. The ‚hybrid‘ thing is just business propaganda
to prevent legal claims from gml.

Before we go deeper into the legal topic
I think plugin alliance should think twice
and think about the heritage of an audio legend,
George Massenburg
and then think about their own appearance in the industry.
Like they did with the ssl / focusrite models.
Using George Massenburg‘s name, expertise
as well as the original gml knobs could be a win/win
for everyone.

Cheers !

shaman
Old 4 weeks ago
  #813
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaman View Post
Simon
Using George Massenburg‘s name, expertise
as well as the original gml knobs could be a win/win
for everyone.
I would be surprised if they didn't try. It's business, so if it were a win/win, both parties would happily agree to work with each other. The fact it didn't happen suggest something went wrong and we can only speculate whether it was about the plugin quality, money split or yet something else.

Maybe it will happen similarly to bx_consoles, which only later became endorsed by SSL.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #814
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by random musican View Post
I would be surprised if they didn't try. It's business, so if it were a win/win, both parties would happily agree to work with each other. The fact it didn't happen suggest something went wrong and we can only speculate whether it was about the plugin quality, money split or yet something else.

Maybe it will happen similarly to bx_consoles, which only later became endorsed by SSL.
Well I really hope they do.
George Massenburg probably is not the one to blame.
They have a great product - but as it is - no purchase from my side.
And that AMEK label is a bad omen...
Old 4 weeks ago
  #815
Lives for gear
 
Eigenwert's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaman View Post
Now - after the dust of this thread has
settled I finally tried the Amek 200.

As much as I like Plugin Alliance
I still have mixed feelings about this plugin.

First - It sounds very good.

I owned the original gml 8200 and 8900 hardware for many years
and know the sound in and out.
This is a very close representation of one of the very best
analog EQs - made by George Massenburg - engineer extraordinaire -
and inventor of the parametric EQ.
What this EQ design does best is to carefully notch out resonances in the
sound while staying incredibly stable and punchy. The punch and integrity of this EQ is what every ssl design - including j series has been dreaming of.

This is a tracking, mixing and mastering EQ deluxe.

George Massenburg´s current design, the mdw EQ is even more precise
and the highend of it is out of this world. It was my main EQ as long as I was using
PT HDX and I happily sold my 8200 hardware. However times are changing and I switched to logic pro and miss this fabulous EQ. Sadly it looks GM has no plans to release mdw on native formats.

The Weiss EQ 1 is a different design - overally it sounds a tad softer
and the highend is more golden. GML has a silvery shimmer ( for those of you still into adjectives instead of numbers ). The Amek has the better interface and can be operated quicker.
I own the weiss and think about getting the Amek.

So here´s my rant.
Dear plugin alliance team.
The price of this plugin is o.k. - as many pointed out it must be seen as an advertisement for your subscription model. 250 bucks for the subscription, which one gets back as a plugin voucher - more than fair - we will probably see it for under 250 bucks next black friday sale. So far so good.

However it would be more than welcome that you do a cooperation with George Massenburg, the inventor of this EQ and re-release it under his brand name / maybe with even more precision. As you did with the ssl channels and focusrite. Would be more than fair. Please do not rip off George´s heritage.
He is one of our best guys in this business.
I like to buy this plugin - I would like to buy the model of the 8900 as well - but not under a bull**** name.
And please stop to mention Sontec. This is a gml 8200 clone
and has ZERO to do with Sontec.


Cheers !

shaman
Then what's the beef of @ gml with @ Universal Audio where he accused them of blacklisting GML upon his request for bringing their latest plugins to the UAD platform and then it turns out GML earlier stated elsewhere that they have "no plans" to release that stuff on UAD totally in conflict with their newer message. Being asked about it, @ gml turns silent. It's all in the thread about the new version of the Massenburg EQ here on GS and seems super strange.

And more importantly, @ gml totally is against supporting any native version of any plugin with the Massenburg name on it in the first place. So no matter what, there is absolutely no way to have the Massenburg name on a native plugin anyway.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #816
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eigenwert View Post
Then what's the beef of @ gml with @ Universal Audio where he accused them of blacklisting GML upon his request for bringing their latest plugins to the UAD platform and then it turns out GML earlier stated elsewhere that they have "no plans" to release that stuff on UAD totally in conflict with their newer message. Being asked about it, @ gml turns silent. It's all in the thread about the new version of the Massenburg EQ here on GS and seems super strange.

And more importantly, @ gml totally is against supporting any native version of any plugin with the Massenburg name on it in the first place. So no matter what, there is absolutely no way to have the Massenburg name on a native plugin anyway.
George can speak for himself if he wants to
so I won´t in his place.

I´m not shure if he has plans to release mdw in a native form...
however I would applaud him to do so.

When I spoke to him about the issue personally -
back in 2009 - he said that native plugin formats
have unsufficient copy protection and there´s no way he would
give out his crownjewel to be cracked...

All I know is, George is an honest person.
He is a perfectionist as well.
Like - I´m waiting for his mdw compressor
to be released since 2005...
Old 4 weeks ago
  #817
Lives for gear
 
Eigenwert's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaman View Post
George can speak for himself if he wants to
so I won´t in his place.

I´m not shure if he has plans to release mdw in a native form...
however I would applaud him to do so.

When I spoke to him about the issue personally -
back in 2009 - he said that native plugin formats
have unsufficient copy protection and there´s no way he would
give out his crownjewel to be cracked...

All I know is, George is an honest person.
He is a perfectionist as well.
Like - I´m waiting for his mdw compressor
to be released since 2005...
The UAD Version of his EQ is my favorite workhorse EQ. However I don't have a TDM System and no plans to buy one so the new Massenburg branded releases are out of reach, unfortunately. The Amek 200 therefor is very much welcome - even though having the Massenburg name on it seems not realistic at this time, given the fact there is no new GML outside of the TDM world right now while George surely would have enough options if he wanted to release a native plugin to do so.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #818
gml
Gear Nut
 
gml's Avatar
dear all,

MDW is in fact hard at work on a fully Native version of MDWEQ6 (VST3, AU, & etc).

UA has broken radio silence with us and informed us that they will support VST3 plugins (but not a DSP upgrade)

the work will, we hope, include comprehensive implementation of shareable “settings”.

we’ll keep everyone up-to-date as work continues

George
Old 4 weeks ago
  #819
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gml View Post
dear all,

MDW is in fact hard at work on a fully Native version of MDWEQ6 (VST3, AU, & etc).

UA has broken radio silence with us and informed us that they will support VST3 plugins (but not a DSP upgrade)

the work will, we hope, include comprehensive implementation of shareable “settings”.

we’ll keep everyone up-to-date as work continues

George
Dear George,

That‘s very good news !
Really looking forward to it !

Saving my money for the original.
Will you release the compressor native as well ?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #820
Lives for gear
 
Eigenwert's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by gml View Post
dear all,

MDW is in fact hard at work on a fully Native version of MDWEQ6 (VST3, AU, & etc).

UA has broken radio silence with us and informed us that they will support VST3 plugins (but not a DSP upgrade)

the work will, we hope, include comprehensive implementation of shareable “settings”.

we’ll keep everyone up-to-date as work continues

George
A fully native AU version of MDWEQ6 will be sooooo great! Excellent news.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #821
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaman View Post
Simon

I certainly don‘t have a spectral analyser built into my ears
but after what I heard I‘m pretty shure this is purely a gml 8200
model. The ‚hybrid‘ thing is just business propaganda
to prevent legal claims from gml.

Before we go deeper into the legal topic
I think plugin alliance should think twice
and think about the heritage of an audio legend,
George Massenburg
and then think about their own appearance in the industry.
Like they did with the ssl / focusrite models.
Using George Massenburg‘s name, expertise
as well as the original gml knobs could be a win/win
for everyone.

Cheers !

shaman
It’s a bit of a tough thing to call because the Plugin Alliance fellas also own Amek now. But in terms of branding I think they have an invested interest in wanting to promote all things Amek over Massenburg. That’s not to say Amek still doesn’t have its golden ears. Let’s also not forget that to a large degree quality is a subjective thing, not an absolute one, within acceptable parameters of course.

I certainly think there’s is more than one way to skin a cat and I believe it’s possible to have more than one good eq design. If it does it’s job well enough I’m personally not one for splitting hairs over the seemingly small details. In the greater scheme of things it really don’t matter to the art of music production.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #822
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by simon.billington View Post
It’s a bit of a tough thing to call because the Plugin Alliance fellas also own Amek now. But in terms of branding I think they have an invested interest in wanting to promote all things Amek over Massenburg.
what‘s next ?
universal audio buys neumann and makes it
a vegan ketchup brand ?

I‘m all in for vegan ketchup
but that logic is a bit weird...
Old 4 weeks ago
  #823
plx
Gear Addict
 

I think it's more likely that PA welcomes Heinz into their family than UAD becoming a ketchup brand.

You're expecting too much from a bx/PA plugin Shaman. These are for all intents and purposes 29$ plugins. Take it for what it is, and don't waste too much time on it.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #824
Gear Guru
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaman View Post
what‘s next ?
universal audio buys neumann and makes it
a vegan ketchup brand ?

I‘m all in for vegan ketchup
but that logic is a bit weird...
Isn’t ketchup vegan? Even though it’s made of a fruit....
Old 3 weeks ago
  #825
Lives for gear
 
Eigenwert's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ardis View Post
Isn’t ketchup vegan? Even though it’s made of a fruit....
American companies often use carbon filters made from bones when producing sugar and ketchup is high in sugar.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #826
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gml View Post
dear all,

MDW is in fact hard at work on a fully Native version of MDWEQ6 (VST3, AU, & etc).

UA has broken radio silence with us and informed us that they will support VST3 plugins (but not a DSP upgrade)

the work will, we hope, include comprehensive implementation of shareable “settings”.

we’ll keep everyone up-to-date as work continues

George
Hi George, great news!,

Is there an estimated release month?.

Thank you,
Daniel.
Old 1 week ago
  #827
Gear Nut
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eigenwert View Post
there is no such thing as an analogue linear phase EQ.
did u guys see that one dan worrall video where he made an analog linear phase eq by running sound forwards and then backwards through the same hw eq?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSyC...nel=DanWorrall
Old 1 week ago
  #828
plx
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirk Churlish View Post
did u guys see that one dan worrall video where he made an analog linear phase eq by running sound forwards and then backwards through the same hw eq?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSyC...nel=DanWorrall
Old 1 week ago
  #829
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirk Churlish View Post
did u guys see that one dan worrall video where he made an analog linear phase eq by running sound forwards and then backwards through the same hw eq?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSyC...nel=DanWorrall
That's just a conflation of terms of what we normally understand as "analog eq" (in particular, whatever this thing is, it does not have pre-ringing) and "analogue process that does equalization". Both can be called "analog eq", but that does not mean these two are the same.

In particular, when you run your track forward and backward, then the post-ringing in the backward run gets rendered as pre-ringing, just as the pre-ringing in the linear-phase digital filters.

So, is it possible to achieve linear-phase equalization using hardware? Yes.
Does such process have no pre-ringing as we would have expected from a standard analog eq? No.
Old 1 week ago
  #830
Gear Maniac
 
UltraByte's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by scalawag View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltraByte View Post
you can also get lkjb's free QRange and theOrange (trial) and see how they behave on similar settings when you set them to phase cancel each other in addition one of them cramps
Do they?

sorry i missed your post. down to -120db when i tried with cuts and +12db low/high shelves. its some time ago
AFAIR the cramping in QOrange got fixed.
but i dont think there wont be differences under any circumstances. You can get QRange into ripple on low cuts playing with latency and process mode settings. i cant remember having seen QOrange ripple. if anything it there was a slight hint at low resolution. and if you want to try cutting below 50-35 hz its hard to match oranges curves. it seemed very efficient. i actually liked it and may get it if theres any % on BF.
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