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Airwindows Tape. Just 'Tape'. Nothing else.
Old 1st February 2020
  #91
Lives for gear
 
b0se's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by swartzfeger View Post
Two separate bass/sub tracks fed bus 1, which then got sent off to bus 2.

Bus 1:
Sand3 Pre (bus preamp)
CraveEQ (for shaping)
True Iron (just because)
Omega TWK (for punishment)
Output Portal (for sound mangling)
TDR Kotelnikov (for massage and continued justified punishment)
Airwindows Tape (HELLO!)

Bus 2: (this is receiving the mangled sub/bass goodness)
Sand3 Pre
Newfangled Saturate (continued punishment, but different flavor than Omega)
Valhalla Delay (with a big bass freq cut)
Luxe (for demoing purposes, I liked it)
Kazrog Synth Warmer (this thing is chewy af)
Acustica Celestial MB (I love you @ zaphod )
Airwindows ToTape6 (I love you too, @ chrisj )

As @ Beatworld said -- Tape was on the bus with less bass freqs.

Not overthinking... is my strength and weakness, I don't RTFM, I don't parse and analyze and dissect. I try things, I hear, I listen.

Had I thought about it before hand... 'hey, you know you shouldn't put this on bus X because of headbump Y in plugin Z...' ... it would slow me down and get me out of my creative box. Others may find my seat-of-the-pants method too chaotic or undisciplined.

The 5 minutes I spent writing this is probably 4 more minutes than I've ever spent thinking about things while recording/writing/mixing, lol.

Which... none of the above can really help people because I can tell them WHY (and I can still be wrong, usually 51% of the time), they still need to DO and to LISTEN. :D



Bingo.
Mojolicious.

Try Gullfoss on you busses! Damn magic.
Old 1st February 2020
  #92
Here for the gear
Thanks for confirming swartzfeger. I tried Tape with a +2dB slam on electronic music and it worked magic, but the source synth wasn't overly bassy to begin with, and it all worked out great.

I used my full master chain of Console6, Hornet 31, Acceleration, ButterComp2, BussColors4 with Lush setting, and Tape - and in case someone hasn't used BussColors with the Lush setting, it adds blooming bass, so I had 2 sources adding bass - BussColors4 and Tape.
Old 1st February 2020
  #93
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by b0se View Post
Mojolicious.

Try Gullfoss on you busses! Damn magic.
b0se, maybe try a demo of Hornet ThirtyOne, I use that instead of Gullfoss. Way cheaper - I use it with the static setting and start at 30% strength.

Since you have Gullfoss, it would be cool to hear what you think of a comparison.
Old 1st February 2020
  #94
Lives for gear
 
noiseflaw's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by b0se View Post

Try Gullfoss on you busses! Damn magic.
Gullfoss isn't magic - it's witchcraft!

Gonna buy the Hornet plugin too though, its an incredibly useful eq tool.
Old 2nd February 2020
  #95
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beatworld View Post
Yep, the bump in ToTape6 is truly a Bump (bell) not a shelf.
The bump in ToTape6 is lower, bell shape centred around about 22hz.
The Tape shelf starts at around 150Hz.
Very different beasts.
That is what shows up in plugin dr. But I've found in practice that the actual response in the lows is not a simple 2-3db shelf raising the lows as a static EQ shelf would do. Maybe it's the interaction with music and the spiral distortion algo that is giving me a bass 'lift' but also a dip around 65hz when eq matching with and without Tape.

No doubt Tape boost lows. But I would disagree that the boost is a simple shelf. I suspect Spiral has something to do with that?

Tape boost lows in a way that makes sense to my ears and speakers. I can turn off boost elsewhere and get where I'm trying to go faster. I can see my workflow change a bit and mix into Tape knowing that the lows will be 'managed' by Tape a bit.
Old 2nd February 2020
  #96
Lives for gear
 
Beatworld's Avatar
Well it might not be a “simple shelf” in Tape but, whatever it is, in my experience, it changes a much wider range of low frequencies than the true bump in ToTape.

Is that a good or bad thing?
Depends on whether you like it
Old 2nd February 2020
  #97
Airwindows
 
chrisj's Avatar
So I've got an update

Tape.zip(382k)

This revises the input gain control so that, if you're attenuating, it'll pad like normal (no weird interaction with the interleaved filter anymore). This is the kind of thing I do as an update-in-place, but since the change is pretty significant, I'm keeping the original release available.

(so if you need the 'broken' version, it's at originalTape.zip.)

You should be using the current version (now at the original location, and in NewUpdates.zip) and I hope it'll be more flexible as it was intended to be
Old 3rd February 2020
  #98
Gear Head
 

Thanks for the update!

And/but... is an output control not going to happen, then?
Old 3rd February 2020
  #99
Airwindows
 
chrisj's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrelafosse View Post
Thanks for the update!

And/but... is an output control not going to happen, then?
Not on this one. ToTape6 has that, and stepped closer to Tape's sound (see its thread for a discussion on that). This one is targeted for a future purpose I have in mind and is being done my way, for integration into another project
Old 5th February 2020
  #100
Lives for gear
 
sirthought's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisj View Post
So I've got an update

Tape.zip(382k)

This revises the input gain control so that, if you're attenuating, it'll pad like normal (no weird interaction with the interleaved filter anymore). This is the kind of thing I do as an update-in-place, but since the change is pretty significant, I'm keeping the original release available.

(so if you need the 'broken' version, it's at originalTape.zip.)

You should be using the current version (now at the original location, and in NewUpdates.zip) and I hope it'll be more flexible as it was intended to be
Installed and the plugin looks the same. Seems to sound similar to my ears. So, there are no changes to the controls? Wasn't sure since you mentioned a new input gain control. Maybe that's behind the scenes.
Old 5th February 2020
  #101
Airwindows
 
chrisj's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by sirthought View Post
Installed and the plugin looks the same. Seems to sound similar to my ears. So, there are no changes to the controls? Wasn't sure since you mentioned a new input gain control. Maybe that's behind the scenes.
If you weren't attenuating with the input gain control, there won't be a change (bugfix-in-place is not for adding changes in functionality as a rule). If you were attenuating with it, it acts as a pretty significant bugfix, though I'm letting people also have access to the original build in case they started using the bug as a feature
Old 13th February 2020
  #102
There is a lot to like about this plugin. Love the saturation. However, the bottom end bump is way more extreme than anything I ever gotten with real tape; and that’s what I cut my engineering teeth on. You’d have to really mess with the EQ alignments to get this response.

Anyone else feeling the bottom end blossoms and bloats a bit too much? It makes it difficult to spread around liberally or—for me— to mix into on the 2-buss. I love the efficiency, though.
Old 13th February 2020
  #103
Lives for gear
 
Beatworld's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by robshrock View Post
.Anyone else feeling the bottom end blossoms and bloats a bit too much? It makes it difficult to spread around liberally or—for me— to mix into on the 2-buss. I love the efficiency, though.
yep, it's been discussed at some length.
Simple solution, try ToTape6 which has the same (if not, VERY similar) bottom end but also a slider to control the amount of Bump.
Problem solved.
Old 14th February 2020
  #104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beatworld View Post
yep, it's been discussed at some length.
Simple solution, try ToTape6 which has the same (if not, VERY similar) bottom end but also a slider to control the amount of Bump.
Problem solved.
Yeah, I tried ToTape6. Not the same thing... not close to my ears. Everything from the low mids up is way superior on Tape. Better than just about any other tape sim, and I pretty much have them all (VTR, Taupe, IK, Satin, etc.)—especially considering the CPU efficiency.

But the blown-out bottom end of Tape makes it mostly a no-go for me. Shame, really...

Chris, if you've got some specific future plan for Tape as is, I completely understand... but any chance of eventually giving us a Tape2 with a more realistic head bump (maybe even with a couple of variables a la tape speeds)? IRL, head bump was a subtle thing that we always tried to work around and compensate for, actually. The bottom currently is way over-the-top.

Cheers,
Rob
Old 14th February 2020
  #105
Gear Head
 

^^^^^^^

would love this, tape sounds nicer than tape6 to my ears. a simple headbump control and an output would have it all over my projects. i agree it sounds one of the best tape emulations so far.
Old 14th February 2020
  #106
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by robshrock View Post
Yeah, I tried ToTape6. Not the same thing... not close to my ears. Everything from the low mids up is way superior on Tape. Better than just about any other tape sim, and I pretty much have them all (VTR, Taupe, IK, Satin, etc.)—especially considering the CPU efficiency.

But the blown-out bottom end of Tape makes it mostly a no-go for me. Shame, really...
I believe the difference is that one use the Density algo and the other uses Spiral. I forget which is which. To me it would make more sense to to release another ToTape version that lets you choose which algo you use. But another version of Tape with headbump and output parameters would work just as well.
Old 14th February 2020
  #107
Gear Nut
Quote:
Originally Posted by robshrock View Post
Yeah, I tried ToTape6. Not the same thing... not close to my ears. Everything from the low mids up is way superior on Tape. Better than just about any other tape sim, and I pretty much have them all (VTR, Taupe, IK, Satin, etc.)—especially considering the CPU efficiency.

But the blown-out bottom end of Tape makes it mostly a no-go for me. Shame, really...

Chris, if you've got some specific future plan for Tape as is, I completely understand... but any chance of eventually giving us a Tape2 with a more realistic head bump (maybe even with a couple of variables a la tape speeds)? IRL, head bump was a subtle thing that we always tried to work around and compensate for, actually. The bottom currently is way over-the-top.

Cheers,
Rob
Sounds like Tape7 with Tape guts.

Tape6 Uses Mojo algorithm, Tape - Spiral.
Old 14th February 2020
  #108
Lives for gear
 
Beatworld's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by robshrock View Post
Yeah, I tried ToTape6. Not the same thing... not close to my ears. Everything from the low mids up is way superior on Tape. Better than just about any other tape sim, and I pretty much have them all (VTR, Taupe, IK, Satin, etc.)—especially considering the CPU efficiency.

But the blown-out bottom end of Tape makes it mostly a no-go for me. Shame, really...

Chris, if you've got some specific future plan for Tape as is, I completely understand... but any chance of eventually giving us a Tape2 with a more realistic head bump (maybe even with a couple of variables a la tape speeds)? IRL, head bump was a subtle thing that we always tried to work around and compensate for, actually. The bottom currently is way over-the-top.

Cheers,
Rob
Just to be certain, did you only download ToTape6 in the last few days ?

If you downloaded it a couple of weeks ago you should download it again because Chris swapped the bottom end and a couple of other things in an update which is still called ToTape6.

All Valid comments you’ve made, the request for a control for the bottom end in Tape has been a popular request but I don’t think Chris is going to do it as Tape is part of a bigger plan that it sounds like we will see in the future some time.

Last edited by Beatworld; 15th February 2020 at 12:30 AM.. Reason: Detail
Old 15th February 2020
  #109
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by alxgvr View Post
Sounds like Tape7 with Tape guts.

Tape6 Uses Mojo algorithm, Tape - Spiral.
I'll take your word for it. Why not a ToTape that lets you choose between Spiral, Density, or Mojo algos??
Old 15th February 2020
  #110
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beatworld View Post
Just to be certain, did you only download ToTape6 in the last few days ?

If you downloaded it a couple of weeks ago you should download it again because Chris swapped the bottom end and a couple of other things in an update which is still called ToTape6.

All Valid comments you’ve made, the request for a control for the bottom end in Tape has been a popular request but I don’t think Chris is going to do it as Tape is part of a bigger plan that it sounds like we will see in the future some time.
Yes, I have the current version of ToTape6. I greatly prefer Tape, with the exception of the overblown sub bottom end.
Old 15th February 2020
  #111
Gear Nut
Quote:
Originally Posted by profvonsok View Post
I'll take your word for it. Why not a ToTape that lets you choose between Spiral, Density, or Mojo algos??
I think every Airwindows saturation plugin must have this feature. Spiral and Density are both amaizing. I would prefer blending slider (not weird one Chris did in Channel7) between both.

Full left = 100% Spiral; Full right = 100% Density.
Not a big fan of Mojo.
Old 15th February 2020
  #112
Airwindows
 
chrisj's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by alxgvr View Post
I think every Airwindows saturation plugin must have this feature. Spiral and Density are both amaizing. I would prefer blending slider (not weird one Chris did in Channel7) between both.

Full left = 100% Spiral; Full right = 100% Density.
Not a big fan of Mojo.
Ummmm… the control in Channel7 does exactly that between 50% and 100%.
Old 15th February 2020
  #113
Lives for gear
 
b0se's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by robshrock View Post
Yeah, I tried ToTape6. Not the same thing... not close to my ears. Everything from the low mids up is way superior on Tape. Better than just about any other tape sim, and I pretty much have them all (VTR, Taupe, IK, Satin, etc.)—especially considering the CPU efficiency.

But the blown-out bottom end of Tape makes it mostly a no-go for me. Shame, really...

Chris, if you've got some specific future plan for Tape as is, I completely understand... but any chance of eventually giving us a Tape2 with a more realistic head bump (maybe even with a couple of variables a la tape speeds)? IRL, head bump was a subtle thing that we always tried to work around and compensate for, actually. The bottom currently is way over-the-top.

Cheers,
Rob
Aye, control of (or the ability to disable) the bump, plus an output gain () would let this plugin shine. I think it's the best sounding Tape from Chris, and one of the best full stop.

All the posts asking for such got a lot of support, but Chris seems against doing so. I don't really understand why, being the "People's Dev"

Regardless, he'll always get my support via Patreon.

Still holding out for AirwindowsDAW©
Old 15th February 2020
  #114
Gear Addict
 
Fergies Watch's Avatar
Going to try this out today thanks Chris
Old 15th February 2020
  #115
Lives for gear
 

I use this to make the master loud, +12 Slam and use a gain plugin to push the level. Very soft crushing ability at high levels of input and the bass is perfect for me.

Try it.

Only use case for me as without using it for pushing level the bass bloom is indeed too much.
Old 15th February 2020
  #116
Gear Nut
On distorted Bass guiar it sounds pretty similar to ADClip7.
Difference is subtle.
Old 26th February 2020
  #117
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by thenoodle View Post
Tape plugs ...developers and users throw them on a channel and like em or don't. Based on their personal microscoping/modeling/coding of the behavior of a tape recorder behavior ....direct measured to whatever test gear.

A guy wants to do 1977. Buys every tape plug and finds "I can't do 1977". Other guys respond, it's because of the room. Wrong. It's that you don't have talent. Wrong. It's because you're not the 1977 artist you're trying to emulate. Wrong.

In 1977....one initial overdub onto a commercial 2" multitrack, or one pass into a quarter/half-inch 2 track....pretty clean and non-intrusive. Which is where "2020 tape plug developers" live and breathe.

Ahhh....but that's not how real tape recorders "did" 1977.

Without repeating what I repeat on other threads....if you guys are looking for a little....very little....one-pass tape mojo....however you define it....cool...you're set with all these tape plugs.

But 1975-1979... the workflow now would be piping signals multiple times through plug x...out the daw with wires....into console...back into daw.....back through plug x......several times....not to mention through the plug at mix.....and of course then...on to a lathe (different topic).

Even if you forget the external console and wires (because you don't have them)......here's the problem......bottom line....

Tape plugs.....absolutely fall apart sonically when you run same-signal in 3-4-5 times through them. Ie....they sound terrible when you do that.....not 1977.

Coding doesn't really have that 1977 part of things figured out.

Just saying......if you're trying to figure out why your tape time traveling isn't working
Very late reply to this, but you can get surprisingly close with a good tape emu and judicious low passing of tracks to get the proper high end. Of course, to really do it you still need tracks that were recorded with mics for the rest of the sound, preferably at the same time for the tracking bleed. The analog compressors in nebula don’t hurt either.

Last edited by ziggysane; 26th February 2020 at 07:11 PM..
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