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Silo SoundLabs Releases Trident Audio Plug-ins
Old 11th February 2020
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by highvoltage View Post

Boasting about modelling accuracy and sharing a post in their blog called "Why I Don’t Care About Accurate Analog Modeling"

I'm genuinely interested now how this sounds.
This is a good question, about what seems like a contradiction. As much as any software modeling company boasts "accuracy," it's true that it will never BE the analog device, and there will always be someone there to point that out. Accuracy at a particular input voltage, across the range of input voltages continuously or in x.xdB increments? Did they really capture the saturation characteristics?

We're aware of the 'foibles' of touting accuracy. For those with intimate knowledge of Trident gear, who might even be able to A/B plug-in to hardware, the notion of accuracy is especially poignant (and we compel you to test that accuracy!). For those who want a great vintage EQ w/ character and quality that they can use on multiple tracks w/o worrying about CPU hoggery... there's a certain point where what matters is what the plug-in will do to enhance your music and your workflow!
Old 11th February 2020
  #32
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Big fan of the Trident heritage here, going back to my first "serious" band's first few releases, cut on what I recall as an 80c. It's a pleasure to see Trident reach for a stake in the digital age - the brand deserves to be as touted amongst the DSP emulation scene as any other brand IMO.

I'm Windows so will have to wait it out for now. My question meanwhile to either the devs or any mac guys - are these plugins non-linear? I don't see any drive controls.

Welcome to the table, folks at Silo!
Old 11th February 2020
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silo_SoundLabs View Post
We appreciate the feedback. We're a small company at the moment, and our focus has been delivering a rock solid product. If you're inclined to download and try them, other than the sonic quality, check the CPU usage when running a few instances - it's negligible.

Sorry the website is confusing. When we add product categories to the product menu, it should make more sense. Regarding the comment about the two participants who just joined this month and like the plug-ins - while that does look suspicious, I promise that we don't know who those people are. I'm certainly glad they like the plug-ins, though!
Step by step

I am a Windows user, so I will remain on hold until you publish the versions.
Old 11th February 2020
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SameOh View Post
Regarding the new users, I'm glad you have stepped in. I believe you.

Now, please hire a Graphic Designer. The plugins looks horrendous. I know it shouldn't matter, but one would not buy a meal if it looks like baby vomit, doesn't matter how taste it is.
Dramatic much?

I think they look good.
Old 12th February 2020
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlbionStudios View Post
Baby vomit? Seems harsh These guys definitely haven't followed other companies in terms of GUI design, I'll give you that. But I actually think they look pretty cool... every time I buy a "vintage" plug-in that has scratches/dents/coffee stains all over the graphics, I can't help but find it gimmicky. As a producer, it's all about the sound as far as I'm concerned!


It was part of the analogy. And a joke.

But ok, some people will like it and the company is free to do whatever they want and make a bet that people will like that or just not bother.

All I can say is that I have not downloaded the demo. Maybe because of the GUI. Because in normal conditions I would be pretty curious to try a Trident plugin.
Old 12th February 2020
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SameOh View Post


It was part of the analogy. And a joke.

But ok, some people will like it and the company is free to do whatever they want and make a bet that people will like that or just not bother.

All I can say is that I have not downloaded the demo. Maybe because of the GUI. Because in normal conditions I would be pretty curious to try a Trident plugin.
Might be worth the try then. I have owned some pretty ugly cars in my time, but they got where I needed to go.
Old 13th February 2020
  #37
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Silo_SoundLabs's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by StoneyBCN View Post
Big fan of the Trident heritage here, going back to my first "serious" band's first few releases, cut on what I recall as an 80c. It's a pleasure to see Trident reach for a stake in the digital age - the brand deserves to be as touted amongst the DSP emulation scene as any other brand IMO.

I'm Windows so will have to wait it out for now. My question meanwhile to either the devs or any mac guys - are these plugins non-linear? I don't see any drive controls.

Welcome to the table, folks at Silo!
Thank you for the welcoming thoughts. Our plug-ins are non-linear, and you will hear this as you increase signal level to the plug-in.

Our goal has always been sonic accuracy. This is a generalization, but a drive control in a plug-in model is a superimposed fix for a linear model. One of our 'golden ears' Trident testers (Charlie Waymire) said the high-end on plug-ins usually sucks when you push it, but instead, ours manages to sparkle. Another well-known producer/engineer (I want to ask his permission before quoting) said, "I do feel they [Silo] very much have the spirt of the Trident IC era sound."

We're hoping to get the Windows versions out today, tomorrow at the latest.
Old 14th February 2020
  #38
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Any news on the Windows installers?
Old 14th February 2020
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by highvoltage View Post
Any news on the Windows installers?
They should be up within several hours. [This afternoon PST]
Old 15th February 2020
  #40
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After they up? Im interested in this asd trident is my all time favorite desk and eq.
Old 17th February 2020
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silo_SoundLabs View Post
They should be up within several hours. [This afternoon PST]
Old 18th February 2020
  #42
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My apologies to those waiting for the Windows versions of the plug-ins. We ran into a little glitch where they were not displaying properly with 4k monitors. We're working diligently w/ Microsoft to resolve this. Our hope is to post on Tuesday, but I will definitely inform the forum as soon as they are up.

Thank you for your patience, and also for your impatience! We want to ensure that any plug-in we release is fully tested and rock solid.
Old 20th February 2020
  #43
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After being testing Silo Trident CB9066 EQ, i can say that this is an incredible plugin. i don't know how the real unit sounds but i`m really surprised on how it has improved a mix i`m working on. Color, depth and tone are great in this plugin!!...and something really important is the low cpu usage. Well done!!
Old 20th February 2020
  #44
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Old 20th February 2020
  #45
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I was excited about this, but literally lost interest due to the lack of demo. However, it made it go back and re evaluate softube and arturia trident and they are great. Maybe I'll try this when it come out and I'll change my mind. How long until the demos up?
Old 22nd February 2020
  #46
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Windows versions of the Trident 80B EQ and Trident CB9066 EQ plug-ins are now available for download (https://silosoundlabs.com/downloads/). Thank you for your patience, for those of you who have been asking about availability. These downloads will run as a 14-day trial (full featured), or a license can be purchased (single activation) from the website as well. Both require iLok License Manager, and can be activated for either Cloud or USB dongle.
Old 22nd February 2020
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silo_SoundLabs View Post
Windows versions of the Trident 80B EQ and Trident CB9066 EQ plug-ins are now available for download (https://silosoundlabs.com/downloads/). Thank you for your patience, for those of you who have been asking about availability. These downloads will run as a 14-day trial (full featured), or a license can be purchased (single activation) from the website as well. Both require iLok License Manager, and can be activated for either Cloud or USB dongle.
Nice! I ´ve always been a fan of the Trident sound!
Old 22nd February 2020
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StoneyBCN View Post
are these plugins non-linear? I don't see any drive controls
It's a very nice sounding EQ.don't hear any harmonics of any sort though.none when driving either models,and none when engaging the bands(band dependent saturation etc).somebody else with PD can check for sure,but i am relatively positive there aren't any contrary to what the developer said
Old 23rd February 2020
  #49
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These really fascinate me, 9066 especially. Razorsharp in clarity.
Old 23rd February 2020
  #50
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I've held off on demo-izing the 80b because I don't plan on spending that kinda cash anytime soon on a single analogue-emulating plugin (and that's the one I GAS for more here, tbh). I did however grab the 9066 demo and gave it a quick run. Some findings:

- Really nice set of parameters
- Very nice sound
- Low CPU indeed
- Horizontal panel is a good choice IMO

And:

- HF cramping, from what I can see
- Noise floor/possibly some harmonics, but doesn't seem to correspond to input level? (will try REALLY pushing with Airwindows BitShiftGain later)
- I don't mind the GUI-s overall, but the big green blob on the buttons seems really off
- GUI generally takes a pretty large amount of screen real-estate for a pretty simple EQ

Overall I'd pair it with something like SKnote AnyTesla for some additional drive character, and go with higher sample rates to beat the HF cramping (with the low CPU in mind as a bonus in this regard). But both of those thoughts detract from the price tag for me, so I'm going to wait and see if they offer up any kind of bundle deals or sales as things progress. I'm still pleased to see the Trident stamp on some good sounding software and will be patiently observing while this project hopefully keeps maturing.

Excited for the future, to say the least!
Old 26th February 2020
  #51
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Yep, i confirm HF cramping and no harmonics whatsoever.
Plus i have matched the curves with Crave EQ and the phase response was dead on with the lowest quality digital mode in Crave EQ. No wonder the low CPU usage.
It phase cancelled with crave eq to an almost unpercievable level.

Double blind tested it on various materials and only on one occassion i could pick one over the other, but then it turned out it was 0.1 db louder accidentally.

So to sum it up, i think this is a bog standard digital eq with trident curves and a very high price. A big no from me, but i might be deaf.
Old 26th February 2020
  #52
Deleted 4fa6934
Guest
man, when this thread dropped I was really excited but the no harmonics thing seems entirely antithetical to the advertisement of the launch. pretty strange, frankly.
Old 27th February 2020
  #53
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After trying CB9066 here are my thoughts.

Things I liked:
Very versatile EQ. Sound is rock solid, doesn't fall apart even with extreme boosts. Loved the curves, somehow it was very easy to get wanted shape of the sound. Very interesting behavior of the shelves, needed to double check in Plugin Doctor, very cool indeed.
CPU load is really impressive! Reaper would show 0.0% on pretty old Xeon CPU.
There are no harmonics, but I think it's a good thing since if I want saturation I can use many preamp emulations from Acustica Audio. Ofc they should add preamp emulation in later versions with the ability to turn it on/off.

Things I didn't like:
UI could definitely be much better, hardware like.
There is no Output Gain knob, which is unforgivable in 2020, there is no convenient way to A/B.
For that price I could just buy 1-2 Acustica Audio packs with EQs, Compressors and Pres, especially when CPU processing power is becoming increasingly cheaper. Sorry to say, but your one of the main selling point is becoming irrelevant. Imho price should be at least few times lower.
Old 27th February 2020
  #54
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...so another highly praised "anal-ogue",plain digital eq,with a stamp approval of authenticity ...and the cycle goes on
Old 27th February 2020
  #55
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Silo_SoundLabs's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 4fa6934 View Post
man, when this thread dropped I was really excited but the no harmonics thing seems entirely antithetical to the advertisement of the launch. pretty strange, frankly.
A few of you have said "no harmonics." I assume that you mean some form of harmonic distortion, or squaring off of the waveform. The plug-ins certainly produce harmonics.

The question is, perhaps, does the plug-in accurately model the original hardware. To this I will say that Joe Chiccarelli has both plug-ins, and wrote to us saying, "I do feel they very much have the spirit of the Trident IC era sound." I'm not disputing anyone's comments here - you hear what you hear, and people want different things from an EQ plug-in.

Regarding the price - there are less expensive plug-ins, and there are free plug-ins. We've gotten some great feedback on the Trident sound captured in these plug-ins, but understand that it's not for everyone. We're working on independent benchmarking of the number of instances of the plug-in, and will publish those numbers soon. Imagine, then, having a virtual Trident console, with EQ (and, coming soon - compressors) on every track, without maxing out the CPU. That's where the bang for the buck comes in. The low CPU overhead is a proprietary technology, patent applied for.
Old 27th February 2020
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 4fa6934 View Post
man, when this thread dropped I was really excited but the no harmonics thing seems entirely antithetical to the advertisement of the launch. pretty strange, frankly.
Maybe you are entering the volume too low? I still have to try it, but it occurs to me that it could be the cause.
Old 27th February 2020
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silo_SoundLabs View Post
A few of you have said "no harmonics." I assume that you mean some form of harmonic distortion, or squaring off of the waveform. The plug-ins certainly produce harmonics.
I've only tested 80b but it does not produce any harmonics at all. NONE.
I fed it a +20db sine wave, still nothing.
http://prntscr.com/r8lcfm

I'm not saying it should produce at all, but it's strange that you state that it does when in fact it does not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silo_SoundLabs View Post
Imagine, then, having a virtual Trident console, with EQ (and, coming soon - compressors) on every track, without maxing out the CPU. That's where the bang for the buck comes in. The low CPU overhead is a proprietary technology, patent applied for.
With the same number of bands and same digital phase response, and no latency, Crave EQ has the same super low CPU consumption as does Pro-Q and all the digital EQ's which btw have NO cramping near the nyquist frequency. I don't think it's an extraordinary feat for a plugin that does not emulate saturation and has no oversampling.

I don't want to be the a-hole here, anyone can demo them and decide.
Old 27th February 2020
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by highvoltage View Post
I've only tested 80b but it does not produce any harmonics at all. NONE.
I fed it a +20db sine wave, still nothing.
http://prntscr.com/r8lcfm

I'm not saying it should produce at all, but it's strange that you state that it does when in fact it does not.

With the same number of bands and same digital phase response, and no latency, Crave EQ has the same super low CPU consumption as does Pro-Q and all the digital EQ's which btw have NO cramping near the nyquist frequency. I don't think it's an extraordinary feat for a plugin that does not emulate saturation and has no oversampling.

I don't want to be the a-hole here, anyone can demo them and decide.
If you’re looking for harmonics to be produced by EQing a sine wave, in the way that you seem to be suggesting, you’re looking for an effect, not an EQ. The theoretical holy grail of an EQ is to add no distortion, while the practical holy grail is to add a certain amount of character while performing the functions that an EQ is designed to do. If you’re looking to turn a sine wave into a saxophone, our Trident EQ plug-ins are not the right tool.

Certain waveforms are more harmonics-rich than others – sine waves having no inherent harmonic content. Still, with that said, examining the graph that you sent there is a spike at 1kHz, the second harmonic to your 500Hz sine wave. What were you expecting to see?

When I said that our plug-ins produce harmonics, I meant that given a waveform with harmonic content, EQed to increase those harmonics, that boost or enhancement in harmonic content will be produced. Granted, that response may represent a misunderstanding of the basic statement of “no harmonics,” which suggests that the plug-ins are incapable of producing or reproducing that content. It seems that you’re looking for harmonic distortion, the absence of which is yet another holy grail in analog electronics.

The character inherent in various pieces of analog gear comes from several different behaviors, intrinsic to the physics of analog electronics. Harmonic distortion can be one, as are certain types of phase distortion. When pleasing to the ear, they are often labeled as “musical.” These characteristics are modeled in our Trident plug-ins, and increase or change according to signal level, in a similar if not identical way to the analog device.
Old 28th February 2020
  #59
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Taurean's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silo_SoundLabs View Post
If you’re looking for harmonics to be produced by EQing a sine wave, in the way that you seem to be suggesting, you’re looking for an effect, not an EQ. The theoretical holy grail of an EQ is to add no distortion, while the practical holy grail is to add a certain amount of character while performing the functions that an EQ is designed to do. If you’re looking to turn a sine wave into a saxophone, our Trident EQ plug-ins are not the right tool.

Certain waveforms are more harmonics-rich than others – sine waves having no inherent harmonic content. Still, with that said, examining the graph that you sent there is a spike at 1kHz, the second harmonic to your 500Hz sine wave. What were you expecting to see?

When I said that our plug-ins produce harmonics, I meant that given a waveform with harmonic content, EQed to increase those harmonics, that boost or enhancement in harmonic content will be produced. Granted, that response may represent a misunderstanding of the basic statement of “no harmonics,” which suggests that the plug-ins are incapable of producing or reproducing that content. It seems that you’re looking for harmonic distortion, the absence of which is yet another holy grail in analog electronics.

The character inherent in various pieces of analog gear comes from several different behaviors, intrinsic to the physics of analog electronics. Harmonic distortion can be one, as are certain types of phase distortion. When pleasing to the ear, they are often labeled as “musical.” These characteristics are modeled in our Trident plug-ins, and increase or change according to signal level, in a similar if not identical way to the analog device.
Old 28th February 2020
  #60
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highvoltage's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silo_SoundLabs View Post
If you’re looking for harmonics to be produced by EQing a sine wave, in the way that you seem to be suggesting, you’re looking for an effect, not an EQ.
I assume that i don't have to explain to a plugin developer why pure sines are used for testing harmonic content

Quote:
Certain waveforms are more harmonics-rich than others – sine waves having no inherent harmonic content. Still, with that said, examining the graph that you sent there is a spike at 1kHz, the second harmonic to your 500Hz sine wave. What were you expecting to see?

I was using mda testtone which doesn't produce the cleanest sine so that 1k harmonic was already in the test tone. I have made a new test-tone for the sake of clarity:
This is Trident 80b: https://prnt.sc/r8qvuv
Hammer DSP: https://prnt.sc/r8qvq9
PSP E27: https://prnt.sc/r8qwq0

Both other plugins add a very subtle harmonic content, and it's very clear from the test tone. I was expecting to see that kind of harmonic series since you have said : "Our plug-ins are non-linear, and you will hear this as you increase signal level to the plug-in."

Quote:
When I said that our plug-ins produce harmonics, I meant that given a waveform with harmonic content, EQed to increase those harmonics, that boost or enhancement in harmonic content will be produced. Granted, that response may represent a misunderstanding of the basic statement of “no harmonics,” which suggests that the plug-ins are incapable of producing or reproducing that content. It seems that you’re looking for harmonic distortion, the absence of which is yet another holy grail in analog electronics.
Ok, so you say it does not produce harmonic distortion. It will only boost or cut existing harmonic content - which is just what an EQ does in other words.

Quote:
The character inherent in various pieces of analog gear comes from several different behaviors, intrinsic to the physics of analog electronics. Harmonic distortion can be one, as are certain types of phase distortion. When pleasing to the ear, they are often labeled as “musical.” These characteristics are modeled in our Trident plug-ins, and increase or change according to signal level, in a similar if not identical way to the analog device.
So you DO say it models harmonic distortion (??!)
I really can't follow.

Again : I don't think that the plugins should add saturation if the original hardware is super clean.
I just pointed it out, that your plugin does not produce harmonic saturation because some people asked in the forum (and you said so).
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