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ValhallaDelay. Available Today. $50.
Old 8th May 2019
  #361
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I don't feel the BBD mode is too dark at all, I think it's perfect. The Past and Present modes were modelled meticulously on actual hardware BBDs by Sean and Don Gunn, and that bears out against the hardware BBDs I have owned (Boss DM2 and Blacet Time Machines).
Old 8th May 2019
  #362
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 691ca21 View Post
I don't feel the BBD mode is too dark at all, I think it's perfect. The Past and Present modes were modelled meticulously on actual hardware BBDs by Sean and Don Gunn, and that bears out against the hardware BBDs I have owned (Boss DM2 and Blacet Time Machines).
I initially thought they were too dark (I even reported is as a possible bug), but when Sean explained that their specimens were classic pedals and not rack units (which is what I have a bunch of), it all fell into place. Iow, I'm not selling my E1010, but for what it is, the VDelay is bang on. Perhaps a "Rack BBD" can be added in a v2? I'd love to get a virtual VRS23

r,
j,
Old 8th May 2019
  #363
I find the tape delay emulaltion on this to give me everything that I love about tape delays. It sounds incredibly good.
Old 8th May 2019
  #364
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Transistor View Post
I initially thought they were too dark (I even reported is as a possible bug), but when Sean explained that their specimens were classic pedals and not rack units (which is what I have a bunch of), it all fell into place. Iow, I'm not selling my E1010, but for what it is, the VDelay is bang on. Perhaps a "Rack BBD" can be added in a v2?
Currently looking for an E1010 and AD-202. These seem to be the "high end" BBDs of choice here in North America.

Quote:
I'd love to get a virtual VRS23
This probably won't happen. The Dynacord gear doesn't show up in the US that often, and I'd worry about how to get it repaired. Ibanez, Yamaha and Roland gear, OTOH, is much more common over here.

As Transistor mentioned, the BBD mode in ValhallaDelay was based on pedals. We were able to A/B with a DM-2 (in Past mode) and DMM 1100-TT (in Present mode), and get the frequency responses to match pretty much perfectly. I've certainly worked with darker BBD pedals, and didn't emulate these.

I'm interested in trying brighter rack BBD units, but the form factor doesn't necessarily result in brightness. The filtering of a BBD isn't based on the quality of the analog electronics - it is purely determined by the number of BBD stages and the clock rate. You can get a long delay out of a single MN3005, but it will be DARK. I was looking at a Roland DC-10 that a local store has ("as used by Yngvie Malmsteen!"), but read the user manual, that talked about having a bandwidth of 10 Hz to 1.5 kHz. That's MUCH darker than even the DM-2.
Old 8th May 2019
  #365
Here for the gear
 

Sean, do you need access to a unit like this one?

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/atta...1&d=1557337138
Attached Thumbnails
ValhallaDelay. Available Today. .-img-20190508-wa0005.jpg  
Old 8th May 2019
  #366
Quote:
Originally Posted by seancostello View Post
Currently looking for an E1010 and AD-202. These seem to be the "high end" BBDs of choice here in North America.
I have both -- much prefer the Yamaha, purely based on their sound. The AD is the "wild one", but the E is soooo lush. Let me know if you need some samples or impulses


Quote:
Originally Posted by seancostello View Post
This probably won't happen. The Dynacord gear doesn't show up in the US that often, and I'd worry about how to get it repaired.
That's very true. I am a true Dynacord slut (2x VRS, TAM-19, EC 280, PDD 14 (early digital), Echochord Super and Mini) and when they work they're insano-good. But they are prone to failure, especially the VRSes. My rev 2 is in pristine condition, but the rev 1 is still on the bench, aaaaalmost working (missing one delay line). It's full of tantalums that tend to short out and cause problems further down the line. I'll probably spend another six months tracking down that last fault...

Cheers,
j,
Old 8th May 2019
  #367
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seancostello View Post
Currently looking for an E1010 and AD-202. These seem to be the "high end" BBDs of choice here in North America.



This probably won't happen. The Dynacord gear doesn't show up in the US that often, and I'd worry about how to get it repaired. Ibanez, Yamaha and Roland gear, OTOH, is much more common over here.
I've got two VRS-23 units, both recapped and in great condition... where in the Pacific NW are you? Perhaps we could get you one on loan.
Old 8th May 2019
  #368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ErezW View Post
Sean, do you need access to a unit like this one?

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/atta...508-wa0005.jpg
I just picked up that Roland DC-10, which I think is pretty much identical to the Boss DM-100. It even has the same box. Thanks for your offer!

The DC-10/DM-100 is an interesting unit, due to a feature I haven't seen before: the FCF (Frequency Controlled Filter). Here's a quick explanation:

For most BBD pedals, the bandwidth is fixed at a fairly low cutoff frequency. This frequency is calculated to avoid aliasing at the lowest clock rate of the BBD.
The DC-10 and DM-100 have fixed cutoff frequencies within their circuits, but they also use a switched capacitor filter as a variable antialiasing filter. This filter, which Roland calls the FCF, tracks the clock rate of the BBD, such that shorter delay values can be much brighter than longer delays.

The FCF in the DC-10 can vary between 10 kHz (for the shortest delay) and 1.5 kHz (at the longest delay). Sweeping from a long delay time with lots of feedback to a short delay is lots of fun, as the oscillation really starts to kick in with all of those high frequencies.

I wonder if other "bright" BBD rack units are using a similar type of variable antialiasing filter, such that short delays can be much brighter than the "worst case scenario" of the fixed cutoff delays used in BBD pedals. Gotta do some more research into this.
Old 8th May 2019
  #369
Here for the gear
 

Exactly the reason I offered that unit... One of my favorite applications for that unit was not delay.. I really liked its filter so I would just set the "feedback" to 0, use the echo time as the "LPF frequency" and pass a signal (and then move it back in time in my DAW)...
Old 9th May 2019
  #370
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seancostello View Post
As Transistor mentioned, the BBD mode in ValhallaDelay was based on pedals. We were able to A/B with a DM-2 (in Past mode) and DMM 1100-TT (in Present mode), and get the frequency responses to match pretty much perfectly.
The plugin is much too dark compared to my Deluxe Memory Man 550-TT, which is the same pedal, with half the buckets and delay time. Do you think EH set the filter in a different place with the 1100-TT and 550-TT? Why would EH lower the low pass filter in the more expensive model?

IMHO the BBD mode sounds very low fi compared to my Diamond Memory Lane or Memory Man, and it really limits that mode needlessly. The top end just isn't there. You don't need to model more esoteric rack units, just listen to a better DMM apparently.

Anyway, my two cents. Again

Quote:
Originally Posted by dubguy99 View Post
I agree that the BBD is a little too dark, even on the 'future' setting but it's pretty easy to to brighten it up to taste with some generous EQ and saturation.
It's a steep low pass filter, there's nothing to really add back...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermetech Mastering View Post
I don't feel the BBD mode is too dark at all, I think it's perfect. The Past and Present modes were modelled meticulously on actual hardware BBDs by Sean and Don Gunn...
Respectfully disagree, see above. Both of my pedals are higher fidelity, neither are anything unusual. One is a DMM.

I mean it's just a delay plugin and I shouldn't get so worked up about it, actually my favorite delay plugin yet, but the BBD mode is daaaaark.

Last edited by doobedy; 9th May 2019 at 04:52 AM..
Old 9th May 2019
  #371
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doobedy View Post
The plugin is much too dark compared to my Deluxe Memory Man 550-TT, which is the same pedal, with half the buckets and delay time. Do you think EH set the filter in a different place with the 1100-TT and 550-TT?
Um, yes?

Quote:
Why would EH lower the low pass filter in the more expensive model?
It sounds better. Less aliasing.

Don't take my word for it. Here's a direct comparison between the 1100-TT and 550-TT:



The 1100-TT is significantly darker. The 550-TT is brighter with the same delay length. And has HUGE amounts of aliasing.

Why would EHX do this? Unclear. That 550-TT sounds, well, not great. At least in that video. The 1100-TT sounds fantastic. My 1100-TT is my favorite delay pedal, by far. I like the sound of some tape delays more than the 1100-TT, but tape delays weigh a ton, and break down a lot. The 1100-TT is compact, robust, has tap tempo, and sounds amazing.

Last edited by seancostello; 9th May 2019 at 05:33 AM..
Old 9th May 2019
  #372
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seancostello View Post
The 1100-TT is significantly darker. The 550-TT is brighter with the same delay length. And has HUGE amounts of aliasing.

Why would EHX do this? Unclear. That 550-TT sounds, well, not great. At least in that video. The 1100-TT sounds fantastic. My 1100-TT is my favorite delay pedal, by far. I like the sound of some tape delays more than the 1100-TT, but tape delays weigh a ton, and break down a lot. The 1100-TT is compact, robust, has tap tempo, and sounds amazing.
Fair enough...but still strange.

Ive owned the original "Tap Tempo" 1100ms version (with NOS Panasonic chips, not the Chinese Xvive chips in the 1100-TT), and swapped out the chips in my 550-TT to the same chips in the "Tap Tempo", and they sound about the same to me. Maybe it's the Xvive chips used in your TT version that get more filtering from EH. I honestly don't mind aliasing (in BBDs), I like how it stacks, but I see where you are coming from.

Either way, sorry to bog things down with guitar pedal minutiae, but I did want to defend the "dark" comments a little bit, because compared to pedals/racks other people might have experience with the low pass is definitely down there.

Out of curiousity, if you raised the filter Future mode would Valhalla Delay sound worse? Is there clock noise or aliasing hiding in the model like there would be in a real circuit?
Old 9th May 2019
  #373
ValhallaDSP
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doobedy View Post
Fair enough...but still strange.

Ive owned the original "Tap Tempo" 1100ms version (with NOS Panasonic chips, not the Chinese Xvive chips in the 1100-TT), and swapped out the chips in my 550-TT to the same chips in the "Tap Tempo", and they sound about the same to me. Maybe it's the Xvive chips used in your TT version that get more filtering from EH. I honestly don't mind aliasing (in BBDs), I like how it stacks, but I see where you are coming from.
BBD chips add a fair amount of filtering per stage. It's subtle, but it adds up, and it becomes more prominent with lower clock frequencies. I wonder if the 1100-TT was the original circuit (or the Deluxe Memory Man Tap Tempo w/Panasonic), and the 550-TT is that circuit with the MN3008 chips. The brightness might just be from different numbers of BBD stages. This would also explain the aliasing.

Quote:
Either way, sorry to bog things down with guitar pedal minutiae, but I did want to defend the "dark" comments a little bit, because compared to pedals/racks other people might have experience with the low pass is definitely down there.
Fair enough. We just based the BBD frequencies on the circuits we had familiarity with.

Quote:
Out of curiousity, if you raised the filter Future mode would Valhalla Delay sound worse? Is there clock noise or aliasing hiding in the model like there would be in a real circuit?
It would just sound brighter, and the noise would be more apparent. I deliberately didn't model the clock noise, because I HATE HATE HATE that sound. Also, having aliasing tied to the delay time works when you max out at 300 or 600 msec, but ValhallaDelay goes to 20000 msec. That would be some weird and ugly aliasing down there!

I'm not going to change the filter settings in any of the existing ValhallaDelay modes, because the plugin has been used in a lot of DAW projects for many months now, and I don't want updates to change the sound of existing projects. However, if you look at the track record of, say, ValhallaRoom or ValhallaVintageVerb, you'll see that the plugins can change over time, with the addition of new modes. So I'll look into an additional BBD mode in the future, with characteristics of rack and "higher end" BBD units.
Old 9th May 2019
  #374
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***

Last edited by drBill; 9th May 2019 at 06:28 AM.. Reason: Oops. Spoke too soon....
Old 9th May 2019
  #375
Quote:
Originally Posted by seancostello View Post
Here's a direct comparison between the 1100-TT and 550-TT:

So interesting to here these side by side. To my ears the 1100-TT has a much deeper feeling of the sound moving away backwards from the listener with each repeat, which is just how I want to use delays in a mix a lot of the time, to create front to back depth. Hmm, need to think about this a bit more, and probably start to integrate low pass filtering more actively in my mixing work.
Old 9th May 2019
  #376
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seancostello View Post
... I'll look into an additional BBD mode in the future, with characteristics of rack and "higher end" BBD units.
how about an ArcDev ET-301 mode?

(kidding... sort of.)
Old 9th May 2019
  #377
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The BBD mode does what I expected and I love it. My ancient Memory Man is brighter but it’s due to its “drive”- when I crank up the drive on Valhalla Delay, it gets very close to the sound from my hardware. The boost switch on my MM can be summoned with careful tweaking on the plugin.

Bright delays I would be reaching for the Digital mode. I must confess I usually don’t like bright delays, so that speaks to my comfort with the BBD mode as is.
Old 9th May 2019
  #378
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This is quite amazing Delay! As the time allows I'd like to write my first Gesrslutz review, something fun happened at the studio few days ago..

One question though... I've used the tape mode with somewhat old age and bit of wow and flutter, and today it sounded like I had automated the delay time parameter, which I did not,.. Is this normal behavior or have I encountered a bug? It sounded somewhat random and radical imo, fun sound but not usable.
Old 9th May 2019
  #379
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZenMaster View Post
This is quite amazing Delay! As the time allows I'd like to write my first Gesrslutz review, something fun happened at the studio few days ago..

One question though... I've used the tape mode with somewhat old age and bit of wow and flutter, and today it sounded like I had automated the delay time parameter, which I did not,.. Is this normal behavior or have I encountered a bug? It sounded somewhat random and radical imo, fun sound but not usable.
Yeah this is happening to me also. It's like the delay time is being reset or something. I keep hearing a pitch warble like the delay time knob is being moved.
I normally bounce out faster than real time but this glitch is making me wonder if I need to be checking all my tracks.

Something isn't quite right.
Old 9th May 2019
  #380
Quote:
Originally Posted by guavadude View Post
Yeah this is happening to me also. It's like the delay time is being reset or something. I keep hearing a pitch warble like the delay time knob is being moved.
I normally bounce out faster than real time but this glitch is making me wonder if I need to be checking all my tracks.

Something isn't quite right.
I was just dealing with this feature/bug? Last dozen mixes were grided to the artist so every bar was a different tempo. When VD ( unfortunate acronym ) is set to external sync it resets itself every bar. Very cool for some things, not cool for this application. Solution was to set the delay in milliseconds.
Old 9th May 2019
  #381
ValhallaDSP
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guavadude View Post
Yeah this is happening to me also. It's like the delay time is being reset or something. I keep hearing a pitch warble like the delay time knob is being moved.
I normally bounce out faster than real time but this glitch is making me wonder if I need to be checking all my tracks.

Something isn't quite right.
Are you taking about the tape splice? Every 10 to 30 seconds, depending on the delay time in the Tape mode, there will be a splice. The depth of the splice artifact is tied to Age.
Old 9th May 2019
  #382
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seancostello View Post
Are you taking about the tape splice? Every 10 to 30 seconds, depending on the delay time in the Tape mode, there will be a splice. The depth of the splice artifact is tied to Age.
Mmkay is it possible to have a switch for splicing effect? If that's what I was hearing.. The age contributes to the tone, but I'd rather not have the sound of delay time changing every now and then

And Sean, great job!
Old 9th May 2019
  #383
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guavadude View Post
Yeah this is happening to me also. It's like the delay time is being reset or something. I keep hearing a pitch warble like the delay time knob is being moved.
I normally bounce out faster than real time but this glitch is making me wonder if I need to be checking all my tracks.

Something isn't quite right.
It was there after using the freeze function in Reaper, so do check.
Old 9th May 2019
  #384
ValhallaDSP
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZenMaster View Post
Mmkay is it possible to have a switch for splicing effect? If that's what I was hearing.. The age contributes to the tone, but I'd rather not have the sound of delay time changing every now and then
Just turn the Age parameter below 50%. Or, use the HiFi mode, which is a tape model without splicing.

The splicing artifact is in there, because this is what tape echoes do. Honestly, the splicing artifact in ValhallaDelay's Tape Mode is WAY MORE SUBTLE than many of the tape echoes I have tried and own. Some of the tape echoes practically STOP when trying to get through that splice. My Univox does humorous levels of pitch bend every time it reaches the splice.

HiFi is a much tamer and more controllable tape echo model. It is a better tape model if you are expecting more "plugin-esque" behavior. The Tape mode is modeled more closely on real tape echoes, and has the quirks of real tape echoes.
Old 9th May 2019
  #385
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seancostello View Post
Just turn the Age parameter below 50%. Or, use the HiFi mode, which is a tape model without splicing.

The splicing artifact is in there, because this is what tape echoes do. Honestly, the splicing artifact in ValhallaDelay's Tape Mode is WAY MORE SUBTLE than many of the tape echoes I have tried and own. Some of the tape echoes practically STOP when trying to get through that splice. My Univox does humorous levels of pitch bend every time it reaches the splice.

HiFi is a much tamer and more controllable tape echo model. It is a better tape model if you are expecting more "plugin-esque" behavior. The Tape mode is modeled more closely on real tape echoes, and has the quirks of real tape echoes.
OK cool, will do! I haven't even tried other modes than tape yet, it delivered instantly and I'm in the middle of a project where we're moving fast, so I've had no time to check out all the offerings of VDelay.
Old 9th May 2019
  #386
Gear Addict
 

I personally like the splice effect. As I like to keep the wow and flutter a little lower. It's really cool on vocals in a breakdown to hear it in the background. I could see why someone wouldn't like it though. The hi-fi mode is great as well. I have been trying to pick my favorite mode and it is pretty much impossible.
Old 16th May 2019
  #387
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I like using 4k res on my monitors and really appreciate the ability to scale the GUI. I am wondering if it is possible to scale the text in the preset menu as well?
Old 16th May 2019
  #388
I’m quite addicted to this delay already and I’ve barely scratched the surface. It sounds amazing. I’m loving many aspects of it, including reverse delays etc.

very smooth and musical. Already using 3-4 different instances on auxes. Will pick up some of the 3rd party presets now.
Old 20th May 2019
  #389
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Any advice for settings emulating quirky early digital delay units like this one?

https://www.musictech.net/reviews/st...-digital-bd80/
Old 21st May 2019
  #390
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dublave View Post
Any advice for settings emulating quirky early digital delay units like this one?

https://www.musictech.net/reviews/st...-digital-bd80/
Well , looks like this hardware unit is a digital delay from a past era

What about :

-mode :digital
-era :past

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