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Warm Audio introduces the WA-251 Tube Condenser Microphone
Old 30th June 2019
  #181
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ric4001 View Post
Just picked up a WA251. Wonderfull sounding mic. I've never heard a real 251, but this has what I've read is the characteristic sound of the 251: the low end and strong midrange of the U47, coupled with some of the high end of the C12. Also have a WA47 and really like that too. These two mics have some of the lowest noise floors I've ever heard in a tube mic. Excellent engineering by Warm.

Only disappointment is the jewel light on the WA251 power supply doesn't work. The power supply works fine, but the jewel light doesn't. Warm needs to work on QC issues -- this should have never passed whatever inspection they do.
Its works. You just have to smack the right side and it will come on! I had one that i bought and sold and i remember seeing your comment prior to purchase.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #182
Just fired it up. Holy Moly.

Got the Wa-251 today, and am trying it out on vocals. (Mine) Holy crap. Super fine. HUGE. Tight top end, no nasty spitting, big bottom that looms HUGE with proximity. Very eq'able... (Carving it's hugeness)

I've worked with u47s and C12s (both vintage) and fell this is right in between them... sort of. Well, kind of like a vintage 251, but maybe less mid forward and more bottom/top forward if that makes any sense.

Can't wait to try it on guitar cabs and acoustic. Super pro Gotham cable is what you would expect in a 7K mic. Wood box is just gorgeous. Shock mount is less than a home run with wonky snap latches.. but once closed it holds the mic tight without sagging. Can see the day where it will quit though.

I recently returned a VERY popular mic that costs more than double this and am glad I did. So far on Vox... no contest. So far so good.

If this is what Warm can kick out for under 800 dollars... I will wait in line for a C12 should they make one.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #183
Lives for gear
 

Clips?
Chris
Old 4 weeks ago
  #184
Quote:
Originally Posted by chessparov2.0 View Post
Clips?
Chris
Funny, I answered this before, must not have posted. Anyway, yes, as soon was I meet my deadline I will post some samples.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #185
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Cool-Thanks!
Chris
Old 3 weeks ago
  #186
Quote:
Originally Posted by chessparov2.0 View Post
Clips?
Chris
I'm working on some samples in between mastering deadlines. Hope to post within the week.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #187
Lives for gear
 

Thanks!
Chris
Old 3 weeks ago
  #188
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wizards Machine View Post
Got the Wa-251 today, and am trying it out on vocals. (Mine) Holy crap. Super fine. HUGE. Tight top end, no nasty spitting, big bottom that looms HUGE with proximity. Very eq'able... (Carving it's hugeness)

I've worked with u47s and C12s (both vintage) and fell this is right in between them... sort of. Well, kind of like a vintage 251, but maybe less mid forward and more bottom/top forward if that makes any sense.

Can't wait to try it on guitar cabs and acoustic. Super pro Gotham cable is what you would expect in a 7K mic. Wood box is just gorgeous. Shock mount is less than a home run with wonky snap latches.. but once closed it holds the mic tight without sagging. Can see the day where it will quit though.

I recently returned a VERY popular mic that costs more than double this and am glad I did. So far on Vox... no contest. So far so good.

If this is what Warm can kick out for under 800 dollars... I will wait in line for a C12 should they make one.
Which mic did you return? Why would you not disclose that?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #189
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cdkelly View Post
I can make you a handmade baseline edition C12 along that same line of quality for not much more $.
Same quality for more $?

Terrible marketing, dude
Old 3 weeks ago
  #190
Gear Guru
 
drBill's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ox Han View Post
You’re not handcrafting anything. Your using sourced parts, not produced in USA, to build a clone of a German mic. Kudos!!! Gearslutz is turning into consumerslutz and snake oil pushers.

The WA 251 seems to use some quality parts. Things are mass produced to benefit from economies of scale (Econ 101) and playing the nationalistic card against things made in China is absurd.

You’re on a page about a warm 251 dropping plugs for your DIY creation based on a German mic. It may be great but it ain't made in USA. What capsule are you using and where was it made? How about the mic body? Tube? Circuit board?

Your using your American hands to assemble sourced parts built in other places. That’s what a Chinese person is doing for a job and they probably have more experience soldering and building than you do.

You wanna plug your mic? Cool, but do it on your own thread and be honest about what it is.
What you may not know is that Chad actually designed the WA251 for Warm, and he's "fixing" some of the things in that mic that couldn't be easily mass produced in China. I've spoken with him before, and he's a legit builder. Maybe cut him some slack??
Old 3 weeks ago
  #191
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by drBill View Post
What you may not know is that Chad actually designed the WA251 for Warm, and he's "fixing" some of the things in that mic that couldn't be easily mass produced in China. I've spoken with him before, and he's a legit builder. Maybe cut him some slack??
You’re right. I didn’t know that. Does it matter?
It still smacks of spam and false claims on a product release thread, which should be snagged by a moderator.

He probably builds a great mic, but doesn’t need to offer these mods and mic builds on a product release thread for which he’d be a competitor. It’s counter to why folks are coming onto the forums.
He could’ve sent a PM to whomever he was addressing.

And if he works for warm, I cant imagine warm are happy with him making these remarks that suggest the warm is a **** product because of where it’s made and his perception of quality control.

I think people should get called out for these types of posts no matter who they are and whom they know on this site.

Sorry not sorry.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #192
Gear Guru
 
drBill's Avatar
USED to work for Warm - and I never saw him saying the WA251 was a **** product. I'll let Chad comment further if he wants to get into a battle with you. I've got no skin in the game....
Old 3 weeks ago
  #193
Lives for gear
 

"Trollin', trollin' on the river".

Ox, please cut him some slack, Chad's a good guy.
We're all grownups, so no need to
Chris
Old 3 weeks ago
  #194
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cdkelly View Post
OK, dude. ... The quality overall would of course be much better due to everything being handcrafted, clean, thoroughly tested, higher end semiconductors and wire, etc, etc. I should have been more clear. but just to also clarify, no one handcrafting things with pride in the USA is going to compete, price wise, with stuff mass produced and barely tested in China...
Read it again. He thinks warm doesn’t test for QC and he can make it better with American mods. . ?️*????*☠️

Last edited by Ox Han; 3 weeks ago at 02:39 AM..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #195
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chessparov2.0 View Post
"Trollin', trollin' on the river".

Ox, please cut him some slack, Chad's a good guy.
We're all grownups, so no need to
Chris
Damn straight. Dude deserves every bit of troll

If Dave from AA or Peluso did this on a boutique mic thread, you’d lose your mind. But it’s fine for your buddies to do it on a warm thread
Old 3 weeks ago
  #196
Lives for gear
 
elambo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ox Han View Post
You’re right. I didn’t know that. Does it matter?
Of course not. Just make any accusations you'd like. No need to bother yourself with silliness like validity or knowledge of a situation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ox Han View Post
Sorry not sorry.
Gee, what a surprise.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #197
Gear Guru
 
drBill's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ox Han View Post
Read it again. He thinks warm doesn’t test for QC and his mic is better, and more expensive, due to it being “handcrafted” by a dude in ‘Merica and he because he did it with pride. ?️*????*☠️
I think he knows better because he designed it to begin with, and knows the compromises that went into it to mass produce it in China. Warm can't produce hand made mics, and no one expects them to. Chad can. If you believe that mass produced Chinese mics are superior, then you have that option available all over the place.

For hand crafted, custom tailored microphones, there are just a handful of guys worldwide that can pull it off - and Chad is one of them.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #198
Lives for gear
 

I never said mass produced Chinese mics are better than X. Chad said warm do little testing, which isn’t true.

And the fact he used to work for warm does not give the right to spam the thread, which is the whole point. How has he not been flagged by a moderator?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #199
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drBill View Post
If you believe that mass produced Chinese mics are superior, then you have that option available all over the place.
.
Where did I say that? Get that straw man outa here
Old 3 weeks ago
  #200
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cdkelly View Post
oh, I get by with a little help from my friends... ... to quote the Beatles. thanks guys.

I'm not bothering to respond directly to Ox Han because he just doesn't know anything about me, the work I do, the work I've done in the past, and really doesn't know much of anything about microphone manufacturing, as far as I can tell. I've tried to reach out directly to people in that situation before and usually get no response; it seems like people who feel they want to defend a given cause like that don't really want to discuss things honestly in private; but just to make a public declaration.. and that's fine; but I'm not going to bite. I will, privately, if he wants to; gladly. But I appreciate the kind words from some other good folks on the thread. He is right about one thing; that this wasn't a thread I just have jumped into and I should find a way to move it off of here. and I do apologize for that.

I went into pretty mind numbing detail on my signal art blog about what things aren't conducive to Asian mass production when it comes to microphone manufacturing, and that one in particular; so I wouldn't go into that here. But one other reason which is more of a generality has to do with how they are set up much more to favor SMT and mass efficiency over through-hole topology. The one microphone line I've seen out of China which actually did impress me was largely based around surface mount technology. That process is more automated, and there are 'board bath' techniques for getting the boards clean that are also low-manpower operations. Through-hole work is often relegated down to assembly places which are much more on the lower tier of good Asian mfg, and I just often don't see the type of work put into that to ensure clean boards and meticulous work. and those are the kinds of problems I've seen often, in addition to compromises made to allow the mics to be mass produced. and in my line of work over the past 2 decades plus, I really have had to look at and evaluate stuff done at over a dozen of these types of places in China... I know who does good work, so-so work, etc... but, again, not worth arguing about with the fellow...
I don’t need knowledge of mic manufacturing to call out your spamming.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #201
Lives for gear
 

Ox, you're a smart guy. You're aware that those "boutique guys" all have a deep love for audio, and have been around for a while. I have the greatest respect for them (and Chad).

Hey, the microphone world is better off with them!

Maybe even Klaus can mod my MXL V69me!
Chris
Old 3 weeks ago
  #202
Quote:
Originally Posted by cdkelly View Post
oh, I get by with a little help from my friends... ... to quote the Beatles. thanks guys.

..
Question for you: Will adding a vintage NOS RCA 6072 to the WA251 give me a different sound? The mic is on the darker side and I'd love to add a bit of edge before eq. Thoughts? suggestions? Thanks. And since the post was directed at me, I can say for myself I didn't;t think you were spamming at all.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #203
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chessparov2.0 View Post
Ox, you're a smart guy. You're aware that those "boutique guys" all have a deep love for audio, and have been around for a while. I have the greatest respect for them (and Chad).

Hey, the microphone world is better off with them!

Maybe even Klaus can mod my MXL V69me!
Chris
Thank you, Chessparaov. I do appreciate it. Klaus is amazing, btw.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #204
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wizards Machine View Post
Question for you: Will adding a vintage NOS RCA 6072 to the WA251 give me a different sound? The mic is on the darker side and I'd love to add a bit of edge before eq. Thoughts? suggestions? Thanks. And since the post was directed at me, I can say for myself I didn't;t think you were spamming at all.
Hi, thanks. happy to answer. The vintage RCA will sound different, probably a little nicer than the JJ; just be sure its a decently good/low noise tube and that the pins are cleaned. I've seen some RCA tubes that really had to be scrubbed good with the steel toothbrush to get cleaned up. I like JJ tubes, btw, just not a good choice for that particular mic. Just my personal opinion. My personal favorite is actually the TAD Germany 12AY7 Highgrade because its a new, reliable tube, and is exceptionally low noise and clear. A good choice also is a NOS JAN GE tube, it will give a softer and more vintage tone that people tend to like.


CK

Last edited by cdkelly; 3 weeks ago at 01:11 AM..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #205
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by drBill View Post
What you may not know is that Chad actually designed the WA251 for Warm

So its not the D-251 from Dany?

http://www.vintagemicrophonepcbkit.com/D-251.html
Old 3 weeks ago
  #206
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdkelly View Post
Hi, thanks. happy to answer. The vintage RCA will sound different, probably a little nicer than the JJ; just be sure its a decently good/low noise tube and that the pins are cleaned. I've seen some RCA tubes that really had to be scrubbed good with the steel toothbrush to get cleaned up. I like JJ tubes, btw, just not a good choice for that particular mic. Just my personal opinion. My personal favorite is actually the TAD Germany 12AY7 Highgrade because its a new, reliable tube, and is exceptionally low noise and clear. A good choice also is a NOS JAN GE tube, it will give a softer and more vintage tone that people tend to like.

The tube is actually not why the mic is dark. There is a two fold reason for that. The output capacitor is too high (they use a 3.8uF Solen 'Fastcap'), the value should actually be 3.2-3.3uF. The higher output cap gives a 'bump' in the low end but doesn't usefully extend the low freq. response, so I like to correct that with a NOS output cap that I prefer. The other reason (if by dark, you refer to a lack of openness in the very top end), there is one other component value that has to be tweaked and the high-z section has to be cleaned and somewhat better isolated. there is certainly much more to be said, but that's the most relevant reasons. thx.
CK
Is there a specific cap you would recommend. I'm getting this mic soon and hoping to do some mods. PIO cap and maybe a tc ck12 capsule.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #207
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mistaD View Post
Is there a specific cap you would recommend. I'm getting this mic soon and hoping to do some mods. PIO cap and maybe a tc ck12 capsule.
Those are good choices. It's hard to find a PIO cap in that value that will fit comfortably in there, unfortunately, because that body is slender and the tube is going alongside it. Be sure its no more than a 160v part (they get radically larger beyond that) and get good measurements before buying and make sure its going to fit. PIO would be ideal; but since I ran into those troubles myself, I wound up using a NOS polypropylene cap from Eastern Europe from my personal stash.

Tim Campbell is a good choice. Also check with Eric Heiserman, they are making the CK12's on request now if you'd feel more comfortable getting one made here stateside (which I do).

CK
Old 3 weeks ago
  #208
Lives for gear
 

Old 3 weeks ago
  #209
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IMHO I also agree that Tim C. & Eric H. are both top notch capsule sources. I have been favorably impressed, by trying them in person before.
Chris
Old 3 weeks ago
  #210
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chessparov2.0 View Post
IMHO I also agree that Tim C. & Eric H. are both top notch capsule sources. I have been favorably impressed, by trying them in person before.
Chris
Eric showed the Heiserman CK12 at Winter NAMM this year, next to an original AKG in a matched pair (I assume) of 414 EB's, the vintage black mics. Nobody could tell them apart sonically, I didn't know which was which. That was good enough for me, really. Price is about the same as the Tim Campbell but there's advantage in working with someone in the same country as you are, just more convenient I think.
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