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Zynaptiq Intensity
Old 19th June 2018
  #1
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Fleer's Avatar
Zynaptiq Intensity

Those magicians at Zynaptiq did it again. Check this out:
YouTube
Old 19th June 2018
  #2
Gear Head
 

Interesting video, thanks for sharing.
Old 20th June 2018
  #3
OMU
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I like it. Anybody knows how many activations per buy does Zynaptiq allow?
Old 20th June 2018
  #4
gonna check this out - I adore Wormhole...
Old 20th June 2018
  #5
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Fleer's Avatar
Don’t forget Adaptiverb. Heaven on earth.
Old 20th June 2018
  #6
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Results seems somewhat similar to those that can be achieved with Gullfoss, no?
Old 20th June 2018
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squeegee 303 View Post
Results seems somewhat similar to those that can be achieved with Gullfoss, no?
That's what I intially thought as well but Intensity is much more of a loudenator via compression than Gullfoss. That aspect can be turned down but it's pretty strong in the presets. Still exploring using it more subtly.
Old 20th June 2018
  #8
Gear Addict
 

just did a round of testing in more than a dozen mixes of different complexity
(including a few commercial mixes).

I did not find most presets usable and preferred starting from default
and tweaking away.

the bias curve settings require attention because the frequency spectrum
is affected greatly and low freq transients in particular may soften/diminish
very much.

In about half cases there were nasty artifacts dominating the sound.
In one quarter no significant clarity effect (when volume compensating because it does increase volume significantly and with every type
of tweak).
In one quarter however there was added clarity at compensated volume
and without easily audible artifacts.

I think it will certainly find its uses, depending on material,
but perhaps there is some hyperbole in the marketing.

I very much wish it had volume compensation built in, however. I spent
half of the time matching volumes.
Old 20th June 2018
  #9
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syra's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by consnyc View Post
I very much wish it had volume compensation built in, however. I spent
half of the time matching volumes.
This. If they want professionals to use it they have to address this issue. But I'm afraid it's all about impressing the kids these days...
Old 20th June 2018
  #10
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screentan's Avatar
 

It has <LVL COMP> on the Intensity dial but it didn't work properly for me so I volume matched by ear. Haven't read the manual yet though so I might be missing something.

Interested to see how this compares to Unfilter on the frequency spectrum side of things but that is more for cleaning mixes up.

Good intro price at $149 considering full price is $379

Update: After a quick play I have to say I quite like this. I prefer a blend of the Dry & Wet. It does alter the transients quite a lot though.

Cool feature: If you click on the Bias Curve selector box and hover over the curves while your audio is playing you hear what all the different curves sound like before selecting one.

Also watch out for preset 99 it nearly blew my head off!

Just on the Auto EQ side of things and not for loudness or Intensity I do like Hornet Thirty One which I just bought. Only 20 Euros. So check that one out too if you haven't already and don't disregard it for being so cheap.

Last edited by screentan; 20th June 2018 at 11:48 AM..
Old 20th June 2018
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syra View Post
This. If they want professionals to use it they have to address this issue. But I'm afraid it's all about impressing the kids these days...
That's certainly who the presets are geared towards. It just seems like something marketed to quickly slap on EDM/Dubstep to make things louder and brighter. It's a shame they didn't choose a more nuanced and well rounded set of presets. Not that Intensity's not capable of more, but that's not immediately obvious.

Last edited by profvonsok; 20th June 2018 at 06:25 AM..
Old 20th June 2018
  #12
Gear Nut
 

Noveltech

This plugin appears to be very similar to noveltech’s character sold by plugin alliance Noveltech Character - Plugin Alliance

A great plug btw
Old 20th June 2018
  #13
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Denis Goekdag's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by profvonsok View Post
There's definitely audible compression going on in the presets. I'm not sure why Zynaptiq is saying it's not a compressor. I would say it's not just a compressor but compression is part of the equation.
No, no traditional compressor. Bringing up the detail signal does reduce the dynamic range, but there's no modulation to that. What presets are you using with what sources? If there's already compression – or modulation in general – in your file, then bringing up the details may bring that up, too.

Also, the output "saturate" is a soft-knee saturating limiter – maybe that's what you're hearing? Some preset use that feature. YOu can switch that off in the top right. It's a great addition but not the main deal :-)
Old 20th June 2018
  #14
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Denis Goekdag's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squeegee 303 View Post
Results seems somewhat similar to those that can be achieved with Gullfoss, no?
Gullfoss would be more along the lines of our UNFILTER – an automatic EQ. Basically about frequency response.
Old 20th June 2018
  #15
Gear Maniac
 

Just bought it, and tried it on a mix. I'm impressed!

I tried it with a sinewave going through Pro-Q's analyzer, and this is what I observed. There's certainly compression there, but it's not simple compression. There's saturation, limiting, low and high harmonics being added. Infact as soon as you insert it you see a peak at 21 Khz being added. This is with the default settings, didn't tinker much with other settings.
Old 20th June 2018
  #16
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Denis Goekdag's Avatar
 

Interesting read here guys, thanks.

Level compensation. First off, the plugin does indeed have LEVEL compensation for the INTENSITY circuit. It is activated /deactivated using the LVL COMP button. That does not include the BIAS, Dry/Wet, or Saturate circuits. Especially the latter (which is used in some presets) can change levels, though it obviously caps out at 0dBFS.

With LVL COMP on, depending on what you throw at it and how high you go on the INTENSITY dial, you will find that levels stay very similar AND even LUFS stays similar – until you go past around 60% or so, then you'll start seeing changes.

Also, if your signal is very dynamic and noticeably below "normalised", you may see some general level increase.

And if your signal is already blasted and essentially white noise-ish, the amount of improvement you can get will be somewhat limited.

Note though that level compensation is not the same as subjective loudness compensation. The latter makes limited sense in this product – since its purpose is exactly to increase loudness while keeping levels similar. Why would you undo its main effect? It's very WYSIWYG

Presets. Since the process is kind of signal dependent, the presets can never quite make everybody happy. These are definitely geared towards going "hmm, maybe a little much" as opposed to "is it really doing anything?".

That said, what do you need presets for? Simply zero all controls, bring up intensity to taste, maybe play a little with BIAS and saturate...done.
Old 20th June 2018
  #17
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Denis Goekdag's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by consnyc View Post
<...>preferred starting from default
and tweaking away.
Absolutely this That's the intended procedure – and why the workflow is so streamlined. Zero everything out, gradually bring stuff up, done.

Quote:
Originally Posted by consnyc View Post
the bias curve settings require attention because the frequency spectrum
is affected greatly and low freq transients in particular may soften/diminish
very much.
That sounds to me like you're using it with LVL COMP on, in which case the level of transients (if dominant as in full mixes) will obviously change downwards RELATIVE to the details, in order to...well...compensate levels. Try switching LVL COMP off, and manually adjusting the levels.

Also, the softknee saturating limiter in the output – if driven hard – may shape transients in what I find to be a very smooth way. Switch it off if you want a more "white noise", hard type of transient.

Otherwise, transients are extremely clean with INTENSITY IMHO.


Quote:
Originally Posted by consnyc View Post
In about half cases there were nasty artifacts dominating the sound.
We're not seeing any nasty artifacts here, assuming reasonable input material and reasonable settings. I'd be very curious to hear what you mean, perhaps per email – it's rather rare but sometimes we do have a bug in our codel or an algorithm may react to a very specific combination of factors in an unforeseen way.

What are your settings, for what signal types? If you overdrive the output saturator by a bunch, then it can start distorting. If you slam the INTENSITY up all the way, in SOME cases, it may start coming apart – the range is large, to accommodate for different signal types. But then again, most things will do that if you dial everything up to max.

On full mixes, I typically end up around 0.2 or thereabouts.


Quote:
Originally Posted by consnyc View Post
In one quarter no significant clarity effect (when volume compensating because it does increase volume significantly and with every type
of tweak).
For one, if your signal is already well balanced, EQ'd and compressed, there's not a lot we can do on top of that.

And: making stuff louder at similar levels is one of the main points.

So assuming an already good signal, of course you're not going to hear a lot of change if you UNDO what the plugin does by LOUDNESS matching (as opposed to LEVEL matching - you can get a lot more loudness while touching peak levels not so much). So basically, you should LEVEL match – the loudness gain is part of the net benefit (and not a side effect that should be compensated for). Or am I maybe misunderstanding something?

In general, one bit of advice would be to not try to use INTENSITY in addition to all the usual tools with all their usual settings – start with using it INSTEAD of the other stuff, then gradually bring things back in. Basically, judge it in its own terms. It's a new kind of processor, a re-think will open it up much more.

HTH,
d
Old 20th June 2018
  #18
Gear Addict
Very interesting. Can you explain a bit more about the claim that it uses an algorithm like face recognition technology to highlight details? What is it looking for? Transients? Harmonics? etc
Old 20th June 2018
  #19
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Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by OMU View Post
I like it. Anybody knows how many activations per buy does Zynaptiq allow?
It would be great if they´d allow 2 activations in the future!

I hate to carry my iLok between Studio and laptop...
Old 20th June 2018
  #20
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Denis Goekdag's Avatar
 

By default, the software comes with 1 activation as most people actually *do* want to have their software on an iLok they carry around.

That said, personal preferences vary, as do workflows, so we're very relaxed about this kind of stuff. If you need an extra activation or two for your personal use, email us, we'll make it work for you. That's been our policy since day #1 BTW.
Old 20th June 2018
  #21
It's an interesting software. It reminds me of a very old plug-in called "Levels" (here: FFT tools vol 1 | Mdsp @ Smartelectronix) (which does not run on modern computers). I was wondering if it uses a sort of spectral compression (which has nothing to do with ordinary common audio compression) or spectral transformation, as – for example – in MTransformer (by Melda) or if it works like the parameters (Spectral) Compression and (Spectral) Flattening in MMorph (also by Melda). (All these softwares I mentioned divide the spectrum components by classifying them from the weakest to the loudest, then allow for rearranging their relative level in various ways.)

And does it need a physical iLok or just an iLok account?
Old 20th June 2018
  #22
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Denis Goekdag's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by X Composer View Post
It's an interesting software. It reminds me of <..>
Hi,

no, none of those "simple" things It's also not like the complex transform processing in OUR Morph plugin that Melda was...hmm, shall we say, heavily inspired by, even for the name

I'll try and explain a little more how it works.

Basically, INTENSITY uses something akin to facial recognition technology.

In facial recognition, the first issue to tackle is to separate the face from all the other pixels. "All the other pixels" include things like the exact density and positioning of facial hair, the skin tan level...basically, details. Secondly, you then analyse the face itself, for example in terms of vector relationships.

In INTENSITY, we change the balance between the "face" and the "other stuff", the latter being the detail stuff we try so hard to carve out when recording and mixing audio.

It's a "broad strokes" vs "details" analysis of sorts, combined with a proprietary frequency domain transform that has excellent time resolution while also having excellent frequency resolution (even though Mr Heisenberg says that that isn't possible ;-) ).

No hardware iLok required.

HTH,
Denis

Last edited by Denis Goekdag; 20th June 2018 at 03:04 PM.. Reason: added quote for better context
Old 20th June 2018
  #23
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denis Goekdag View Post
Absolutely this That's the intended procedure – and why the workflow is so streamlined. Zero everything out, gradually bring stuff up, done.



That sounds to me like you're using it with LVL COMP on, in which case the level of transients (if dominant as in full mixes) will obviously change downwards RELATIVE to the details, in order to...well...compensate levels. Try switching LVL COMP off, and manually adjusting the levels.

Also, the softknee saturating limiter in the output – if driven hard – may shape transients in what I find to be a very smooth way. Switch it off if you want a more "white noise", hard type of transient.

Otherwise, transients are extremely clean with INTENSITY IMHO.




We're not seeing any nasty artifacts here, assuming reasonable input material and reasonable settings. I'd be very curious to hear what you mean, perhaps per email – it's rather rare but sometimes we do have a bug in our codel or an algorithm may react to a very specific combination of factors in an unforeseen way.

What are your settings, for what signal types? If you overdrive the output saturator by a bunch, then it can start distorting. If you slam the INTENSITY up all the way, in SOME cases, it may start coming apart – the range is large, to accommodate for different signal types. But then again, most things will do that if you dial everything up to max.

On full mixes, I typically end up around 0.2 or thereabouts.



For one, if your signal is already well balanced, EQ'd and compressed, there's not a lot we can do on top of that.

And: making stuff louder at similar levels is one of the main points.

So assuming an already good signal, of course you're not going to hear a lot of change if you UNDO what the plugin does by LOUDNESS matching (as opposed to LEVEL matching - you can get a lot more loudness while touching peak levels not so much). So basically, you should LEVEL match – the loudness gain is part of the net benefit (and not a side effect that should be compensated for). Or am I maybe misunderstanding something?

In general, one bit of advice would be to not try to use INTENSITY in addition to all the usual tools with all their usual settings – start with using it INSTEAD of the other stuff, then gradually bring things back in. Basically, judge it in its own terms. It's a new kind of processor, a re-think will open it up much more.

HTH,
d
Denis thank you for your feedback and guidance for optimal use of the
plugin as well as expectations.

To clarify I was matching manually for very short term rms levels
not for my subjective perception of loudness.

Since perceived loudness may be at the core of what it is going
on here, I will redo my tests this time with an automatic level matching plugin
and report in this thread.

That should allow for, first a reproducible analysis, and second
all gain adjustment (based on mastering standards perceived loudness metrics) should still allow for any non-gain related increase in
perceived loudness to come thru.

I will also revisit the issue of distortion/artifacts in light
of lower settings that you recommend.
Old 20th June 2018
  #24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denis Goekdag View Post
Hi,

no, none of those "simple" things It's also not like the complex transform processing in OUR Morph plugin that Melda was...hmm, shall we say, heavily inspired by, even for the name

I'll try and explain a little more how it works.

Basically, INTENSITY uses something akin to facial recognition technology.

In facial recognition, the first issue to tackle is to separate the face from all the other pixels. "All the other pixels" include things like the exact density and positioning of facial hair, the skin tan level...basically, details. Secondly, you then analyse the face itself, for example in terms of vector relationships.

In INTENSITY, we change the balance between the "face" and the "other stuff", the latter being the detail stuff we try so hard to carve out when recording and mixing audio.

It's a "broad strokes" vs "details" analysis of sorts, combined with a proprietary frequency domain transform that has excellent time resolution while also having excellent frequency resolution (even though Mr Heisenberg says that that isn't possible ;-) ).

No hardware iLok required.

HTH,
Denis
Thank you very much for your clear explaination. I think I have seen something partly similar in the field of image sharpening software (nothing to do with audio, but the approach sounded similar to me, by separating broad, middle and tiny details, then allowing for enhancing each class in a different way). Very interesting! Watching attentively…
Old 20th June 2018
  #25
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Denis Goekdag's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by X Composer View Post
I think I have seen something partly similar in the field of image sharpening software (nothing to do with audio, but the approach sounded similar to me, by separating broad, middle and tiny details, then allowing for enhancing each class in a different way). Very interesting! Watching attentively…
Yes, for example our SIMPLIFYING BLUR works in a similar way:
zynaptiq: SIMPLIFYING BLUR
Old 20th June 2018
  #26
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Thanks very much Denis for your explanations and clarifications. It there any chance that an auto gain function that compensates for the entire plugin and not just the intensity section will be added in the future??
Old 20th June 2018
  #27
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Denis Goekdag's Avatar
 

There is one now, it's called LVL COMP. It compensates the *level* change for the main INTENSITY control (but not for BIAS, dry/wet and GAIN).

If you're asking about a LOUDNESS compensation (different thing entirely) – good question. We currently don't think that would complement the plugin conceptually (since adding loudness is one of the main uses), but we are definitely listening to feedback very closely – so I guess that means that yes, there's a chance, but no promises.
Old 20th June 2018
  #28
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brockorama's Avatar
 

How do you get an iLok trial code? I must be missing something obvious.
Old 20th June 2018
  #29
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by brockorama View Post
How do you get an iLok trial code? I must be missing something obvious.
You download the TRY version and follow the instructions. In short: when the iLok window pops up you press TRY, not ACTIVATE. Then there is the 30 days iLok licence in your resp. account.
Old 20th June 2018
  #30
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by brockorama View Post
How do you get an iLok trial code? I must be missing something obvious.
You have to follow in the install PDF in the trial. Basically you don't get a code. You activate the trial thru your DAW and it walks you thru the process. Just remember to hit TRY and not Activate. Activate does require a code.
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