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Black Rooster Audio releases the VEQ-1P Program EQ Equalizer Plugins
Old 12th May 2018
  #121
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basic's Avatar
 

Absolutely loving this on vocals. I record with a u87 ai and I sometimes find the mids a little strident. Cranking a bit of top and bottom on this eq really smooths things out. Great EQ.
Old 12th May 2018
  #122
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ROCKER STUDIOS's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmanic View Post
Extremely well in my opinion. It's completely source dependent which one I prefer and due to Purple being one of the pre-Ruby aqua plugins, it has some problems with the low frequency delay/softness thing that some of us has been reporting for years. So yeah.. if you want to EQ a kick or bass or anything with a bit of important energy below 200Hz I wouldn't reach for purple.

This is by far the best algorithmic pultec plugin in my opinion.
Interesting I never noticed a softness in the low end on purple always seem very 3D to me but it sounds like this is a good plugin to check out
Old 12th May 2018
  #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROCKER STUDIOS View Post
Interesting I never noticed a softness in the low end on purple always seem very 3D to me but it sounds like this is a good plugin to check out
Just put any sharp kickdrum through it.. then use a limiter or heavy compression, increase gain and there you can hear the "delay".

In case you want it amplified to truly hear what's going on, put multiple instances of purple on a sharp short kick drum.
Old 12th May 2018
  #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmanic View Post
Extremely well in my opinion. It's completely source dependent which one I prefer and due to Purple being one of the pre-Ruby aqua plugins, it has some problems with the low frequency delay/softness thing that some of us has been reporting for years. So yeah.. if you want to EQ a kick or bass or anything with a bit of important energy below 200Hz I wouldn't reach for purple.

This is by far the best algorithmic pultec plugin in my opinion.
I very nearly went with Purple over BRA. It was a close call but I'm glad I chose BRA if the older Acqua plugins have this LF delay issue. Why are Acustica still selling them with this issue especially as they are not cheap? I just bought SAND and was interested in some of the other pre Ruby ones but feel a bit bummed out now. Sorry for going a bit OT here.
Old 12th May 2018
  #125
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Tried to buy the plugin said I do not have an account signed up for an account says I already have an account said I lost my password says I don't have an account signed up for an account says I already have an account I'm over it and there's no contact information on their website I'm way over it was going to buy it
Old 12th May 2018
  #126
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Lesha's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ROCKER STUDIOS View Post
Tried to buy the plugin said I do not have an account signed up for an account says I already have an account said I lost my password says I don't have an account signed up for an account says I already have an account I'm over it and there's no contact information on their website I'm way over it was going to buy it
https://blackroosteraudio.com/support.html
Old 13th May 2018
  #127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by screentan View Post
I very nearly went with Purple over BRA. It was a close call but I'm glad I chose BRA if the older Acqua plugins have this LF delay issue. Why are Acustica still selling them with this issue especially as they are not cheap? I just bought SAND and was interested in some of the other pre Ruby ones but feel a bit bummed out now. Sorry for going a bit OT here.
Ruby, Azure, Pink 2 and Diamond EQ doesn't have this bug. They are updating all the plugins.
Old 13th May 2018
  #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by profvonsok View Post
Yes, but they sold these plugs for years knowing they had this problem. Whenever someone brought it up it was dismissed as a non issue. And now it will likely be several more months before these customers who paid premium prices for flawed plugins will get their's fixed. Interesting business model.
I agree with you. For years I've been reporting the delay bug and the ringing bug. All I got were answers telling me that I couldn't properly gain stage my mixes and assumptions of me not being able to properly use the almighty Acqua technology. The plugins clearly rang when driven, and the ring just got lower in amplitude when going into them with lower volumes. The ring simply got quieter and more difficult to hear, but never really got away. Imagine any other company selling plugs which have a constant beep going on, and imagine them telling you "it's low in volume so it shouldn't bother you". The problem is that most of those answers came from users. It ain't got issues with the company, personally I got issues with each and every guy on the forum defending them, protecting and feeding the cult that generated around Acqua technology. AA itself is great and they are really doing great research in the field, but I feel like none of their work should've gone commercial until like this year. Unfortunately many bandwagoners kept asking for more and investing lots of money in broken pieces of software, and they're to blame in my opinion.
Old 13th May 2018
  #129
Every single thread becomes an Acustica discussion.
Old 13th May 2018
  #130
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Jerrick's Avatar
 

This thing sounds killer. Used it earlier today on my parallel drum comp and it brought out some great depth and low end of the kit, and some nice air to the top end.

I need to pop it on the mix and see how it compared with the e27 that I normally use for some final adjustments.
Old 13th May 2018
  #131
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Oni.'s Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerrick View Post
This thing sounds killer. Used it earlier today on my parallel drum comp and it brought out some great depth and low end of the kit, and some nice air to the top end.

I need to pop it on the mix and see how it compared with the e27 that I normally use for some final adjustments.
Two different beasts IMHO. The E27 being a lot sharper and (optionally) cleaner. I'd never use anything so broad and coloured in my mastering sessions.
Old 13th May 2018
  #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oni. View Post
I agree with you. For years I've been reporting the delay bug and the ringing bug. All I got were answers telling me that I couldn't properly gain stage my mixes and assumptions of me not being able to properly use the almighty Acqua technology. The plugins clearly rang when driven, and the ring just got lower in amplitude when going into them with lower volumes. The ring simply got quieter and more difficult to hear, but never really got away. Imagine any other company selling plugs which have a constant beep going on, and imagine them telling you "it's low in volume so it shouldn't bother you". The problem is that most of those answers came from users. It ain't got issues with the company, personally I got issues with each and every guy on the forum defending them, protecting and feeding the cult that generated around Acqua technology. AA itself is great and they are really doing great research in the field, but I feel like none of their work should've gone commercial until like this year. Unfortunately many bandwagoners kept asking for more and investing lots of money in broken pieces of software, and they're to blame in my opinion.
There is no ring. Totally different things. The echo bug is real and well documented.

The plugins used to ring only when hit hard. Keep your gain stage correct and there is no "quiter ring". Doesn't make any sense, that is insane.
Old 13th May 2018
  #133
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Jerrick's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oni. View Post
Two different beasts IMHO. The E27 being a lot sharper and (optionally) cleaner. I'd never use anything so broad and coloured in my mastering sessions.
True, but a pultec on the mixbus is something I always hear about, a bit of lows, a bit of highs. I've just always used other eqs to do the same thing.

Not for mastering but just mixing into.
Old 16th May 2018
  #134
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bgood's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by profvonsok View Post
Yes, but they sold these plugs for years knowing they had this problem. Whenever someone brought it up it was dismissed as a non issue. And now it will likely be several more months before these customers who paid premium prices for flawed plugins will get their's fixed. Interesting business model.
It’s crazy to me that so many people here spend that kind of money on a company who charges a lot for plugins that it seems they release better versions of once they update their “core” or whatever the f/// it’s called...

Goofy...

If it works for you, great! But, what an amateur hour of a dev with that sort of price point... uad prices, HealthKit design
Old 17th May 2018
  #135
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ROCKER STUDIOS's Avatar
I got it// very nice sounding plugin good job BRA
Old 17th May 2018
  #136
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The Warmth's Avatar
 

Reaaaaally good for fat snares
Old 17th May 2018
  #137
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StoneyBCN's Avatar
 

To add to the comments on "box tone", non-linearities and harmonics.

You will get predominantly even-order harmonics when running at nominal input levels. A 1khz sine at 0dbfs will produce 2nd harmonic (2kHz) at -54dbfs, and a 4th harmonic (3kHz) at -90dbfs. At this input level, it's barely clipping/waveshaping at all. In fact the harmonics are actually boosting the signal by about 0.3db.

At around +12dbfs, odd-order harmonics creep in really quickly and eventually the even-order harmonics start expanding in frequency while attenuating down to a flat line. Negative polarity has quite a hard corner where it clips, positive pole saturation is a bit softer but kicks in a bit earlier.

There's almost no phase shift/group delay at 600-700hz. As frequency drops, phase shifts quite a lot, with an HPF kicking in around 20hz. A 1hz sine is down by about -20db. 0hz/DC is blocked completely. Going upwards, again a ton of phase shift and a very gentle LPF kicking in around 16khz. By 44100hz, the signal is down by about -8db.

The noise floor is about -136dbfs or so.

Haven't found any dynamic envelopes or anything out of the ordinary in the box tone. The harmonics seem to come before the filters, but I could be mistaken (hard to measure the extremes).

So I'm supposing it goes like this:

- HPF below 20hz
- LPF around 16khz
- tube-shaped waveshaper for 2nd harmonic
- DC filter
- 24bit noise floor

It's nothing revolutionary in that regard. At the risk of sounding disrespectful, it's not difficult to match that using DAW utilities, or something like Airwindows. But it's the quality of the DSP, the math, the aliasing techniques, the noise floor, things like that, which put BRA ahead most of its commercial competitors IMO. They are generally really on-point with handling digital audio well, which many developers are still overlooking.

Also those qualities found in the box tone are all generally great ways to condition digital audio, and all done to very high standard. It's definitely staying on my mix bus for the foreseeable future

Sorry to nerd out. I just don't like the concept of "magic" when discussing audio. Normal service will resume now
Old 17th May 2018
  #138
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.. yeah, sorry to burst your bubble but I really don't think it's "that simple".

It's interesting how in these times of easily available analysis tools we suddenly get a lot of "experts" once again (last time this happened was when the VSTplugin Analyzer was discovered by the masses).

I've had people try to analyze Pro-L algorithms and tell how simple they are and how they work.. yet I know what goes on behind the scenes and can with 100% certainty say that you can NOT analyze a complex non-linear system in a simple manner. It just doesn't work like that. You can make a simple system do and sound exactly like a complex system in an extremely simplified test environment. As soon as you add complexity to the input signal, all the simple theories and trying to match things goes out the window.

You can try your own speculations yourself. Just create your own waveshape, add a few filters (you can try to match them in various ways) and combine these elemnts in various ways.. then try to match the tone of the plugin in question (with complex audio material).

1) If you think you "nailed it" or "got close" I have news for you: Critical listening skills are lacking

2) If you notice "damn, I'm not getting anywhere close to this thing" then you'll know that your method is perhaps way oversimplified (spoiler alert: it is).

Sorry to also nerd out and go against your position but this is how I see it. Sure, there's no "magic" per say but please don't simplify things just because that's how you'd like it to be. There's nothing simple here as far as I can tell. Yeah, you can simplify terms and pretty much call everything "a waveshaper" if you so desire but I suspect your meaning and motives were simply to counter what others perceive as "magic".

Final edit: There are very real reasons for why the majority of companies haven't been doing complex analogue modeling since basically forever.. only now in the past few years has there been enough knowledge gathered and shared across various platforms (AES papers for instance etc) that the knowledge required is getting easier to come by and a lot of new talented individuals are entering the scene. As far as I know, the actual modeling itself isn't usually the tricky part.. it's condensing it into a system that uses as little CPU power as possible and knowing which parts can be left out to minimize the loss of fidelity. The latter part especially is not at all a simple thing to do in a highly non-linear system.

Anyhow, these are just my layman specualtions on these things. Probably equally misguided as the point I'm going against.
Old 17th May 2018
  #139
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StoneyBCN's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bmanic View Post
.. yeah, sorry to burst your bubble but I really don't think it's "that simple".

It's interesting how in these times of easily available analysis tools we suddenly get a lot of "experts" once again (last time this happened was when the VSTplugin Analyzer was discovered by the masses).

I've had people try to analyze Pro-L algorithms and tell how simple they are and how they work.. yet I know what goes on behind the scenes and can with 100% certainty say that you can NOT analyze a complex non-linear system in a simple manner. It just doesn't work like that. You can make a simple system do and sound exactly like a complex system in an extremely simplified test environment. As soon as you add complexity to the input signal, all the simple theories and trying to match things goes out the window.

You can try your own speculations yourself. Just create your own waveshape, add a few filters (you can try to match them in various ways) and combine these elemnts in various ways.. then try to match the tone of the plugin in question (with complex audio material).

1) If you think you "nailed it" or "got close" I have news for you: Critical listening skills are lacking

2) If you notice "damn, I'm not getting anywhere close to this thing" then you'll know that your method is perhaps way oversimplified (spoiler alert: it is).

Sorry to also nerd out and go against your position but this is how I see it. Sure, there's no "magic" per say but please don't simplify things just because that's how you'd like it to be. There's nothing simple here as far as I can tell. Yeah, you can simplify terms and pretty much call everything "a waveshaper" if you so desire but I suspect your meaning and motives were simply to counter what others perceive as "magic".

Final edit: There are very real reasons for why the majority of companies haven't been doing complex analogue modeling since basically forever.. only now in the past few years has there been enough knowledge gathered and shared across various platforms (AES papers for instance etc) that the knowledge required is getting easier to come by and a lot of new talented individuals are entering the scene. As far as I know, the actual modeling itself isn't usually the tricky part.. it's condensing it into a system that uses as little CPU power as possible and knowing which parts can be left out to minimize the loss of fidelity. The latter part especially is not at all a simple thing to do in a highly non-linear system.

Anyhow, these are just my layman specualtions on these things. Probably equally misguided as the point I'm going against.
Thanks for the insight. I mean it genuinely, as I've noticed many of your posts in the past and learned from some of them. It's nice to get a direct response from someone with a knowledge level that I respect. I'd actually say that you don't need to attempt to be so humble - I'm sure that you know your stuff. However, I sense an edge of aggression bordering on disrespectful that I don't appreciate or feel is necessary, but hey ho. I know you are just making a point.

I make no claims on being an expert as such, but I'm also not quite as amatuer as you seem to suggest - essentially I agree with your points, actually.

It's my belief (purely subjective) that something as simple as a HPF can range wildly in quality, even when performing a supposedly "identical" function. My post is pointing to BRA as a leading example of carefully implemented processing, taking care of the audio instead of decimating it around the edges. They seem to be very attentive at all the background stuff that we don't really hear directly - the kinds of things you mentioned in your post. Which, of course, I only know very little about at this stage in my journey...

So, if you care to go any deeper into your points whether they directly counter mine or not, it might be a decent opportunity for some of us to learn something.

Moving on, I'll dismiss any personal comments this time.
Old 19th May 2018
  #140
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Sorry, didn't mean to come off aggressive. I'm Finnish so I'm always sort of directly to the point.. never was good at being subtle or politically correct. If I think somebody is wrong or missing the point, that's what I'll say.. without adding pretty words or beating around the subject. Yes, I do have plenty to learn on the human interaction level, that's for sure (at least that's what my wife keeps telling me).

Anyhow, the point I was trying to make is that it is very easy to fall into a mindset where everything is built like LEGO bricks and simply combining them would yield a specific result. I recognize this mindset because I myself held it for a long time. However, when it comes to complex systems, this kind of thinking usually very quickly leads to dead-ends and actually doesn't match up with the reality of the situation. Like I said above, simple tests can yield identical results but as soon as the incoming audio signal is complex in nature the output can differ quite a bit.

I don't have any clue as to how the black rooster audio DSP secrets work but having done some digging myself with various test scenarios I do not think the stuff under the hood is quite as simple as one might assume. A quick way to test this, though it requires a bit of critical listening, is to check how the EQ curves sound when the plugin is driven quite hard vs how they sound when you drive the plugin with a very weak signal (for instance using Airwindows BitShiftGain set to -6 or even -7, which translates to -36dB and -42dB of gain). It should be quite obvious how different these two scenarios sound. Now do this test with "simple" signal like an 808 kick (and make sure it has some of that clicky attack to get any use from the high frequency bell too) and then compare that to a "complex" signal like a handclap + ride or crash.. or just quick sine pitch sweep, a "twiup!" sound.. and combine that with a crash or ride.

I can't quite explain what I'm hearing but usually when a plugin is of complex nature, all of these test scenarios will have a very unique sound to them.. whereas if I repeat this test using a simple waveshaper with a custom curve (in my case I usually use Image-Line waveshaper built into FL Studio or Melda MWavesShaper) there seems to be a similar "finger print" to all of the sounds, no matter how the gain staging is done or the complexity of the sound itself.

It is entirely possible that it's placebo only though. Lately I've ran into quite a few scenarios where I've failed miserably in ABX tests yet my brain refuses to believe that there isn't a difference.
Old 19th May 2018
  #141
m03
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m03's Avatar
Was the discount not through the end of May? Wanted to pick this up today, but it's listing at the $89 price now.
Old 20th May 2018
  #142
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Aux13's Avatar
Few days ago was 49$ (bought it). Maybe something with Softube release ....
Old 28th May 2018
  #143
Gear Head
 

Issue with my registered copy locking me out and not recognizing serial # this morning... was in a session - suddenly drums sounded weird - very annoying. Anyone else experience this? Logic 10.4.1
Old 29th May 2018
  #144
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Aux13's Avatar
No, VEQ-1P works fine here. (Reaper)
Old 29th May 2018
  #145
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galaydees's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by greenroom View Post
Issue with my registered copy locking me out and not recognizing serial # this morning... was in a session - suddenly drums sounded weird - very annoying. Anyone else experience this? Logic 10.4.1
Yep. Logic. Computer sleeps. Br auths go bye bye.

That’s usually the trigger.

They know.
Old 22nd June 2018
  #146
Here for the gear
Black Rooster Audio is offering a 50% SUMMER SALE discount on every plugin and bundle until the 15th of July 2018. Use the 2018SUMMERSALE voucher code when checking out on our website
Old 22nd June 2018
  #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2cynikal View Post
Black Rooster Audio is offering a 50% SUMMER SALE discount on every plugin and bundle until the 15th of July 2018. Use the 2018SUMMERSALE voucher code when checking out on our website
Thinking about picking up the VEQ-5 to go with the VEQ-1P which I bought during the intro special. It actually would have been a bit cheaper to wait and just buy the VEQ bundle now. So if you missed the intro special now's your chance to score them at an even better price.
Old 22nd June 2018
  #148
Gear Guru
I use the 73 pre on literally everything. Lovely and you guys do great things. Very generous freebies also....
Old 20th November 2018
  #149
Black Friday coupon makes this beast cost 27$
Insane!
Old 20th November 2018
  #150
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EvgenyStudio View Post
Black Friday coupon makes this beast cost 27$
Insane!
I've been wanting them to have a full EQP-1 for some time now.
Can't believe I just discovered it today, just by going through their website. I totally missed the release announcement.
Thanks for sharing, I am going to try it very very soon.
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