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Balance Mastering Analog Magpha EQ Plugin Equalizer Plugins
Old 13th April 2018
  #31
Gear Head
 

it looks great on the graph.
i wonder how would it sound, waiting for the aax.
Old 13th April 2018
  #32
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balancemastering's Avatar
 

Again, thanks everyone for positive and negative feedback. All is appreciated.

My overall sense is that the GUI is a real dealbreaker for a lot of people. So I will look to address this ASAP.

Specifically (depending on time constraints):
  • Optional smaller knobs
  • Optional larger text
  • Optional knob markers

After that I would be happy to look at the idea of adding shelves, either as new extra bands or switchable from the first and last bands. Although this might have to wait until after the next plugin is released, which is scheduled soon. We're a small business, so we need to be reimbursed for the (large amount of) time/research we've invested so far into Magpha. So we hope to cover our costs with the profits of this and the next plugin, all going well.)
Old 13th April 2018
  #33
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stinkyfingers's Avatar
 

Analog phase response ? YouTube

Last edited by stinkyfingers; 13th April 2018 at 12:54 PM..
Old 13th April 2018
  #34
OMU
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+1

I'm sure nobody needs another 'Analog Obsession' kind of developer although this is beginning to sound too familiar already: amateurish GUI, good sound, too busy to release new (also half baked) stuff before fixing the previous incomplete plugins, premium prices...

I honestly hope I'm wrong.
Old 13th April 2018
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OMU View Post
+1

I'm sure nobody needs another 'Analog Obsession' kind of developer although this is beginning to sound too familiar already: amateurish GUI, good sound, too busy to release new (also half baked) stuff before fixing the previous incomplete plugins, premium prices...

I honestly hope I'm wrong.
The Gui is intentional. Its a design choice rather than a real issue. They also seem to be considering to make the changes suggested to suit others which is again purely aesthetics or implementing shelves not a part of the original idea. Plus no bugs or crash issues here.

This is more akin to Kush Audio where he develops plugins based on his mindset and workflow such his Novatron compressor where people where demanding for him to label his attack and release times with conventional values but he was adamant he wanted the user to use their ears. Similar concept here.

Different story honestly. Using everyday so far with 0 technical issues.
Old 13th April 2018
  #36
OMU
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I can only wish them to become as clever and successful as Kush is, but IMO that intentional design is just, as I said, amateurish and difficult to work with. If they change it with something proper it's a sure buy for me.

And another request, if I may, since it could also make for a great mixing eq, it would be great if we could have an option to double the gain to +/- 18db.
Old 14th April 2018
  #37
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balancemastering's Avatar
 

Just like to clarify what I meant in my last post, maybe the wording could have been better.

I am committed to updating Magpha straight away. What I meant was that first up would be the GUI issues, then later, extra functionality. Extra functionality might happen to be after the next plugin (or might not!). Next plugin is practically finished, but I didn't want to release two plugins at once. (Plus any design updates here will carry straight over to the next plugin.)

Yes, the GUI is an intentional design choice and a lot of people already really appreciate how it can improve their sound.

However, I understand everyone achieves their sound in different ways, and I want to accommodate that by adding GUI options to suit those workflows. This is first priority.

Thanks again to all who've posted,
John.

Last edited by balancemastering; 14th April 2018 at 10:45 AM..
Old 14th April 2018
  #38
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DrAudioBot's Avatar
What really irritates me is the 4 digits (and even 6 digits for Q factor) after the comma.
Old 14th April 2018
  #39
OMU
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Couldn't resist and bought it. I really, really like the sound of this eq.

I noticed there's a free plugin on Balance Mastering website which has better knobs than the paid one. Those 'leds' clearly help visually to identify the parameter's position. I hope at least something similar to be implemented here.

And one thing, although the archive says v1.0.1 full, the GUI of the plugin says still 1.0.0.
Old 14th April 2018
  #40
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by profvonsok View Post
The majority of responses have been along the lines of "sounds great but please fix the GUI". Business 101 is "Listen to what your customers are telling you". You might give that a try.
It’s weird, your angry admonition of the developer almost makes it seem like you didn’t read the post of his that you quoted—the post in which he says he is going to change the GUI to accommodate people’s requests.
Old 14th April 2018
  #41
Gear Nut
Quote:
Originally Posted by profvonsok View Post
The majority of responses have been along the lines of "sounds great but please fix the GUI". Business 101 is "Listen to what your customers are telling you". You might give that a try.
Seems like you misread what was typed. GUI is priority. Functionality (shelves) later. They are "giving it a try".
Old 16th April 2018
  #42
OMU
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Another GUI related issue.

I was working in Reaper and at some point this happened:
Attached Thumbnails
Balance Mastering Analog Magpha EQ Plugin-screen-shot-2018-04-16-06.12.56.jpg  
Old 16th April 2018
  #43
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balancemastering's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by OMU View Post
Another GUI related issue.

I was working in Reaper and at some point this happened:
Thanks, yes we've been informed of this issue and a fix should be included in the next release (any day now).
Old 16th April 2018
  #44
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Oni.'s Avatar
What people don't seem to understand is that the GUI is a big, big part of an audio plugin's value. It's very superficial to consider it a pure matter of aesthetics. An user interface is responsible of the way we communicate with the plugin, and should be intuitive, precise, responsive, and offer deep hands-on control of the signal processing that's being applied. It really bothers me when people seem to understate the importance of the demand for a good interface, assuming all the userbase wants is a vintage-looking 3D model of some kind of esoteric bread toaster to fiddle with.
Old 16th April 2018
  #45
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Quickly tried the demo and this does indeed have some very interesting curves. Especially at very wide Q settings the slope looks pretty unique in it's shape. I was not able to duplicate the sonic results with anything else though I did manage to get to about -60dBFS cancellation with Pro-Q2 in various situations.. still, the sound is different.

Not sure I buy all the marketing blurb though.

The GUI is really bad though. It's way too dark and while I understand the concept it's a massive waste of space with those large knobs that do nothing. The word that comes to mind is "pretentious".. it tries to be something different but just doesn't work. I can sort of understand the philosophy but it makes no sense then to have very precise Q and Hz readings down to 3 decimals (and those decimals are annoying and most likely not meant to be there).

EDIT: ... and literally less than 10 minutes later an update is posted. GUI is better but still a bit too dark in my opinion. I'm having a hard time getting used to it. Especially the Stereo-M-S switches below the last row of knobs are so dark that when I get some sunlight into my living room, I can hardly see them (my monitor is at 300 NITS so not super bright, I admit.. but still).

I also very much dislike that this is severely limited in what "frequency slots" it can EQ.. while still having the possibility of doing super narrow Q. It's like mimicking hardware with none of the software benefits. The only case where the various superb hardware mastering EQs fail miserably is when you want to tame a very precise annoying resonance.. this is where software always trumps the hardware, unless that resonance magically happens to be _exactly_ at a corner frequency of a filter band, which is very rare.

.. then you have this software EQ that has the same limitation for absolutely no reason at all (unless it's a technical one, based on some convolution or FFT bin trickery). If there is indeed a reason why I can't precisely set the filter frequency then it should be disclosed instead of trying to weave it all into a rather strange philosophy of some sort. I don't believe for a second there are benefits for having only a few select ranges. Neither do any hardware builders. If they could have freely choosable frequencies with 100% accurate recall with otherworldly switches, they'd all do it. The only reason hardware is limited to certain frequency choices (mastering hardware in particular) it's due to recallability.. aka technical reasons.

In short: I want to be able to EQ the exact frequency I need. If I need 2982Hz, that's what I want. Not 2981 or 2983.. I want 2982. :-)

Anyhow, I'll keep an eye on this one for sure. Let's see how it evolves.

Thanks for making a usable demo!! Easy to test and verify if it's worth purchasing. That alone is rare these days. Well done on that front!

Cheers!
bM
Old 16th April 2018
  #46
Gear Head
 
balancemastering's Avatar
 

Update v1.1.0 – GUI options



Hi all, thanks for your patience.

v1.1.0 is now available

- Optional smaller, more compact user interface.
- Optional knob markers for extra visual feedback.
- Option to truncate textbox values to 2 decimal places.
- Fix issue where sometimes default JUCE widget controls display.

See the 'Settings' page just below the main bypass button for the GUI options.
Old 16th April 2018
  #47
OMU
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Changes are welcome.

An option to fine tune the frequency (with shift pressed, like everybody else is doing), or when entering manually the values, would solve the problem bmanic raises. I would still like to also have the option to drag values, not only knobs.
Old 16th April 2018
  #48
Gear Head
 
balancemastering's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bmanic View Post
Quickly tried the demo and this does indeed have some very interesting curves. ...
Hi Bm, hope you're well and thanks again for beta testing some of my older plugins. Not sure why you weren't on the list for this one! Will add for next time.

I think we posted at the same time?

Many of the things you noted are now GUI options in v1.1.0 (see screenshot in that post)


Re: Super narrow Q...

Obviously steps are a hindrance if you need notching at some precise frequency e.g. 50Hz hum etc. However, Magpha was not designed as a narrow notching tool. It's a broad tone shaper, so that's why -9 to 9dB and narrowest of 7Q. For super narrow Q notching I don't use Magpha, I use other EQs.

TBH I try to avoid super narrow notching if I can, since I don't like the sound of high-Q filters in general since they ring long e.g. try a very narrow Q allpass and hear how it colours the audio. Although like anything, this can be (ab)used for effect.

Re: stepped controls...

So personally I like to work with steps, even in software. The reason is, I can get to better results quicker when I'm forced to decide between two neighbouring steps (that sound audibly different).

But I am considering adding is a modifier key fine-tune offset. So if you say hold the ALT and click/drag you can explore the region between steps.

TLDR:
Super narrow Q's? No, for the above reasons.
Fine-tune for steps? I'll look into it
Old 16th April 2018
  #49
Gear Head
 
balancemastering's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by OMU View Post
An option to fine tune the frequency (with shift pressed, like everybody else is doing)
Again, posted at same time! I was already considering this as a fine tuning option so as mentioned above, I'll look into this.

Cheers, John.
Old 16th April 2018
  #50
Lives for gear
 

Hehe yeah, we posted at the same time. See my edit for further comments on the new version (will download it asap, once I've eaten some dinner).

I can see why you like the steps but these really should be optional. What I meant with the Q is that you already have a super narrow Q, at least what I consider super narrow if this is a hardware emulation. I wouldn't use more narrow either, your plugin is definitely narrow enough.

That's where the lack of precise frequencies is becomes obvious though. At this narrow Q I can clearly hear the EQ "missing" resonances that I want to tame. Especially in the bass.

It's especially troublesome as very few of the frequency selections actually fall within real musical intervals which means you often land between strong harmonic series, places where you'd actually want to control the magnitude.

I can see your reasoning for the various steps apply very well with wide bells but as the plugin allows for really narrow Q too it needs to be able to accommodate that scenario as well. Perhaps allow fine tuning with a modifier key?

Why am I pushing the agenda with the narrow Q? Because it sounds fabulous. Overall I'm really starting to fall for how this thing in general sounds. Not sure how or why the bell shape you have sounds so cool but it does, seemingly irrespective of the Q value. It just shapes beautifully and is really intuitive to use, shape wise.. just need more control over the frequency.

Anyhow, this could become quite special with a little refinement.

Cheers!
bM
Old 16th April 2018
  #51
Lives for gear
Now we're cooking with gas more people on board with what I've been hearing! I'll be off GS working for a couple days but looking forward to checking out the update. Thanks
Old 16th April 2018
  #52
OMU
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmanic View Post
it sounds fabulous.
Exactly my thoughts. That phase response does indeed make a clear difference.

I also wish the GUI to be perfect so I can use it everywhere and have all the options I need in a workhorse eq (including filters, shelves and everything else already mentioned). OTOH, I'm sure that won't happen, not the way I want and am used to have them, anyway, but I'll gladly take any improvement.
Old 16th April 2018
  #53
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I'm not so sure it's the phase response. There are other EQs out there that match the phase response very well.

If you take a close look you'll see the actual shape of the bell is quite different to what we may be used to. I suspect that's the main part of the charm.

EDIT: Also, you can disrupt the phase response at will.. this EQ will still sound good (just try it.. add an all pass filter of choice after it and try to disrupt the response).
Old 17th April 2018
  #54
OMU
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I don't know about that, I just quickly tried to match settings with another eq and bells look pretty much identical with the default 0.7 Q on both. Maybe the wide bells take a different shape, but I was not going crazy with that until now, and to me nothing sounds like Magpha.

I assumed it's the phase response, since this is the closest thing I've heard that, to me, sounds similar to Acustica stuff, especially eq, and Balance Mastering says it's the thing they've worked to get right. No idea what's really happening under its hood but I'm happy to have a tool capable of deliver this kind of sound at relatively little CPU cost.
Attached Thumbnails
Balance Mastering Analog Magpha EQ Plugin-magpha.png   Balance Mastering Analog Magpha EQ Plugin-equilibrium.png  

Last edited by OMU; 17th April 2018 at 12:24 PM..
Old 18th April 2018
  #55
Bought. Didn't have time to test it against each and every one of the 30+ other EQs I have but I was looking for a sculpting tool that opened up the mix whilst at the same time making it sound "calmer". Magpha sounded very classy and effortless, and I'm not sure I need to know whether the bell shapes or phase responses are the main factor at play here. Maybe both?

What I found interesting in terms of the GUI was that I used broader Qs and less boost than usual-had I had a visual display those moves would have barely registered on the graph.

Used it on channels and subgroups as well as the 2-buss. Performed flawlessly. Look forward to the promised new plug-in. A clean mastering compressor along the lines of Kotelnikov maybe?
Old 18th April 2018
  #56
Gear Head
 
balancemastering's Avatar
 

Update v1.2.0 – GUI & non-stepped



Hi all,

We've taken a lot of the feedback on board to improve usability (and still fit with the original idea). Here's the new look, a bit more tactile but still minimal.

v1.2.0 is now available

- Optional non-stepped, continuous knobs/textbox values (in settings)
- Improved user interface:
- More tactile buttons & knobs.
- More usable in low light conditions.

New users:
Balance Analog Magpha EQ plugin. — Balance Mastering

Existing users (demo or purchase), please check your email for the direct link.
Old 18th April 2018
  #57
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JP__'s Avatar
 

I like the new look. The only thing I maybe would change is the labeling for the stereo/m/s switch. Here its maybe a good idea to use the symbol for stereo instead of the written word "stereo": https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...0px-Stereo.png

Would look more even or balanced then to me.
Old 18th April 2018
  #58
OMU
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OMU's Avatar
 

Wow. Good job! Now give me a button in settings with +/-18db
Old 18th April 2018
  #59
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thermos's Avatar
Also really digging the phase response of this thing, has a calming sound to it. Wondering why you didn't include shelves?
Old 18th April 2018
  #60
Gear Head
 
balancemastering's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by thermos View Post
Also really digging the phase response of this thing, has a calming sound to it. Wondering why you didn't include shelves?
Hi Thermos, thanks yes hoping to add shelves if it can fit with the existing code.
Topic:
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