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Soundtheory announces Gullfoss plug-in at NAMM 2018 Equalizer Plugins
Old 12th February 2018
  #181
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by assessor View Post
I like this plugin very much!

I don't like that you will offer only 1 offline license. Many people have a studio computer that is offline. And then they have a laptop that many times will be unable to connect to wifi.

I hope you will reconsider your decision and offer 2 offline installations!
When early access is over you will be able to receive two offline activations.

Andreas
Old 12th February 2018
  #182
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jimmydeluxe's Avatar
Great plugin! Mind-blowing. Do agree about request of individual bypass of components–would be quite helpful.

I'm getting "authorize" then "internal error!" though after restarting my machine in a different day/session. I'm having to reinstall the plugin every time. not a huge deal, but annoying

emailed support just wanted to note here for others that might be having the same issue

osx 10.12.16 imac 4ghz 2013 ableton 10
Old 12th February 2018
  #183
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmydeluxe View Post
I'm getting "authorize" then "internal error!" though after restarting my machine in a different day/session. I'm having to reinstall the plugin every time. not a huge deal, but annoying

emailed support just wanted to note here for others that might be having the same issue
Thank you for the report. We believe we have isolated the issue and will release a fix soon.

Andreas
Old 12th February 2018
  #184
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by atell View Post
When early access is over you will be able to receive two offline activations.

Andreas
Very good!
Old 12th February 2018
  #185
Here for the gear
 

Dear developer. First of all please don’t take hard what I’ll trying to figure out. It’s just interest. On one of the russian forums a dispute arose over this development. Now we have two parts of this war. The first think that this is a hoax. They say that plugin has already known algorithm which corrects the signal from pink noise. They say it is usual MatchEQ. They believe that information about a unique signal recognition system is simply skilful advertising. They can not find an answer for two major questions: 1 - how plugin knows what exactly should be corrected? 2 - from which model of sounding the algorithm is repelled by introducing corrections into the sound?

My knowledge is not enough to answer questions and myself, although I very much like your development, I would like to understand how it is arranged! Thank u!
Old 12th February 2018
  #186
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ibananov2015 View Post
Dear developer. First of all please don’t take hard what I’ll trying to figure out. It’s just interest. On one of the russian forums a dispute arose over this development. Now we have two parts of this war. The first think that this is a hoax. They say that plugin has already known algorithm which corrects the signal from pink noise. They say it is usual MatchEQ.
Well, it's obviously very easy to make such claims without providing any sort of proof. If what they say is true it should be very simple to replicate the results with established plugins or with a simple algorithmic prototype. I strongly suspect that they cannot do it. At least I would not know a simple way to replicate the results.

But they are not entirely wrong. The processing of Gullfoss in certain cases is comparable to approaching something similar to pink noise. But then again it is vastly more complex than that and the reason for that is that pink noise happens to sound good for the same reason the output of Gullfoss sounds good: It maximises the information that reaches the brain through the auditory system.

Quote:
They believe that information about a unique signal recognition system is simply skilful advertising. They can not find an answer for two major questions: 1 - how plugin knows what exactly should be corrected? 2 - from which model of sounding the algorithm is repelled by introducing corrections into the sound?
So to summarise, they lack the imagination to understand how it works and therefore conclude that it cannot possibly work as described?

We do not model sound, we model perception. Our computational auditory perception model allows us to understand the grouping of information into audible elements across channels, time and frequency. We preserve the information in each audible element but change the balance so that more information of the individual elements can reach the higher cognitive levels of the brain.

We have tried to make Gullfoss very simple. This simplicity however does in no way reflect its inner workings.

Regards,

Andreas Tell
Soundtheory
Old 12th February 2018
  #187
Lives for gear
 

I'm finding myself using this on every mix lately - I can always find a way to open things out a little more. Very much looking forward to what's next..
Old 12th February 2018
  #188
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Loopy C's Avatar
 

As a user of several 'similar' categories of processors, there is no doubt as seen in the end result that Gullfoss is operating from unique principles.

I ran several batches of the same files through different processors to give myself some reference...included were sonible's 'smartEQ Live', Zynaptiq's 'Unfilter', 'Soothe', and some experiments with various dynamic eq's, 'match eq's and pink noise references.

The results were very informative and very DIFFERENT between processors and methods...a simple comparison using the Gullfoss demo easily exposes this...making such forum debates about process unnecessary.

My instinct is that there is indeed some sort of accounting to how close frequencies are interacting/masking (thus the separate 'Tame' and 'Recover')?

In several cases, the other processors would encounter particular sections of denser, low frequencies 'clusters' and create an obvious amplitude bump/peak. Gullfoss, on the other hand, maintained a much more even output in amplitude across these same sections. So that alone tells you it is doing some unique 'thinking' when encountering clusters of frequencies that is beyond additive/subtractive 'matching'.

Of course as the developer has stated, they are using advanced perceptual modeling so I think we can safely take his word for it given the obvious difference in handling the same frequencies in test files compared to the other processors I tried.

There is also most certainly something that strikes my ears as a pleasing soundstage improvement beyond the basic frequency balancing (but connected to the frequency processing)...which pink noise/matching eq would not even take into account.

Anyway, all that to say I think Gullfoss is definitely unique in my comparisons, and a useful addition to the current specialized spectral balancing tools I own ;-) I will not stop using the others where appropriate, but certainly Gullfoss is going to the top of my list of go-to's to consistently and predictably balance spectral information in files and mixing applications, ESPECIALLY in unattended large batch pre/post processing workflows ;-)
Old 13th February 2018
  #189
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skycutter's Avatar
 

Still no luck here

Mac OSX 10.12.6 / Ableton 10.01
Old 13th February 2018
  #190
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Squawk's Avatar
Trying to demo this. Cubase Pro 9.5.10, OSX 10.13.3.

Installed, but will not load. i'm getting an error when inserting on a track.
Attached Thumbnails
Soundtheory announces Gullfoss plug-in at NAMM 2018-screen-shot-2018-02-12-8.29.22-pm.png   Soundtheory announces Gullfoss plug-in at NAMM 2018-screen-shot-2018-02-12-8.29.09-pm.png  
Old 13th February 2018
  #191
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by skycutter View Post
Still no luck here

Mac OSX 10.12.6 / Ableton 10.01
What exactly fails? Did you send a report?

Andreas
Old 13th February 2018
  #192
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kosi's Avatar
Hi Andreas,
one question: why do we have an extra Bias controller, when we already have Recover and Tame as independent controllers ? The manual says: it works in borderline cases. Can you explain a bit more ?
The plugin works extremely good on musical sources, but I have my problems with vocals. They start to sound processed, in my actual case in "s" heavy passages.
Old 13th February 2018
  #193
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kosi View Post
Hi Andreas,
one question: why do we have an extra Bias controller, when we already have Recover and Tame as independent controllers ? The manual says: it works in borderline cases. Can you explain a bit more ?
Tame and Recover control how much processing happens while Bias controls when either Tame or Recover are applied. If you observe the Tame and Recover meters you will notice that changing Bias will move from more taming to more recovering, while keeping the strength of each process approximately the same.

Quote:
The plugin works extremely good on musical sources, but I have my problems with vocals. They start to sound processed, in my actual case in "s" heavy passages.
It's hard to tell what is going on there without knowing your source material and your settings. But try to play with bias a bit until the sibilance is not processed as much or lower your processing settings. If you need assistance feel free to contact me so that we can look into your particular example together.

Andreas
Old 13th February 2018
  #194
OMU
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OMU's Avatar
 

With all due respect, this idea with always being online is, to me, stupid.

Plugins should process audio, not connect to the internet.
Old 13th February 2018
  #195
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by OMU View Post
With all due respect, this idea with always being online is, to me, stupid.

Plugins should process audio, not connect to the internet.
Please understand that this currently the only way we can handle activations during the early access phase. When we're ready you will receive offline activations that work without internet connection. And in addition you will receive a flexible online activation that you can take anywhere you need it but only use one at a time.

Our ultimate goal is to give the user the most comfortable and convenient way to use our plugins. We just need a bit of time to get there. And we are also investigating ways of authorising Gullfoss with a dongle.

Regards,

Andreas
Old 13th February 2018
  #196
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mamm7215's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by atell View Post
Please understand that this currently the only way we can handle activations during the early access phase. When we're ready you will receive offline activations that work without internet connection. And in addition you will receive a flexible online activation that you can take anywhere you need it but only use one at a time.

Our ultimate goal is to give the user the most comfortable and convenient way to use our plugins. We just need a bit of time to get there. And we are also investigating ways of authorising Gullfoss with a dongle.

Regards,

Andreas
I’m grateful for your input and candor, Andreas. I can’t wait until you port it to PC. You have a customer waiting in me. Any eta on that?
Regards,
Michael.
Old 13th February 2018
  #197
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mamm7215 View Post
I’m grateful for your input and candor, Andreas. I can’t wait until you port it to PC. You have a customer waiting in me. Any eta on that?
Regards,
Michael.
Also, Andreas, do you have an approximate ETA on the end of the trial period price and the end of the online requirement to use (which if I understand correctly -- will coinicide)? And by your reference to a dongle, will that be a REQUIREMENT or just another OPTION?

Thanks!
Old 13th February 2018
  #198
Gear Addict
 
Dom & Roland's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by atell View Post
Please understand that this currently the only way we can handle activations during the early access phase. When we're ready you will receive offline activations that work without internet connection. And in addition you will receive a flexible online activation that you can take anywhere you need it but only use one at a time.

Our ultimate goal is to give the user the most comfortable and convenient way to use our plugins. We just need a bit of time to get there. And we are also investigating ways of authorising Gullfoss with a dongle.

Regards,

Andreas
Please don't use a dongle unless it's ilok
I have stopped using the few plugin alliance plug ins i bought like hg2 as trying to keep track of a usb key as well as my ilok key is a bloody nightmare especially travelling a lot.
Old 13th February 2018
  #199
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b0se's Avatar
^ Agreed.
Old 13th February 2018
  #200
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loopy C View Post
As a user of several 'similar' categories of processors, there is no doubt as seen in the end result that Gullfoss is operating from unique principles.
I also own quite a few "similar'" processors like Meldaproduction MSpectralDynamics, Sknote Soundbrigade and Sonible Freiraum. They're all pretty good at evening out problematic balances but Gullfoss beat them in my shootouts because it sounded clearer, more natural and more predictable.

For example I revisited a bloated and mushy sounding "songwriting" mix and was horrified by how many changes to the arrangement and additional frequency carving I would have to apply to get it to sound decent. Gullfoss at "vanilla" settings (20% Tame&Recover, the other controls untouched) on the stereo buss cleaned up the whole mix and made it sound perfectly presentable. I would describe the difference as between "can't mix" and "can mix"! Of course I will still make the required individual changes and leave Gullfoss to deal with any remaining build-ups.

Like other posters have said, when the track is already quite clear and bright then the other controls need to be brought into play to avoid the "exciter syndrome".

Need to do some more testing on a proper mix session but right now I'm seriously thinking about not telling anyone outside of this thread about this plugin-I'm normally very happy to share. Sorry Soundtheory but this plugin is just too good so it's your own fault...
Old 14th February 2018
  #201
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Zyzygis's Avatar
 

Andreas, I noticed that the controller mapping for the lower threshold (red area) is jumpy. The upper threshold moves smoothly when mapped. It would be great if this could be fixed.
Old 14th February 2018
  #202
This is an interesting plugin, and I did purchase it.

My initial impression is that it can do something special, in terms of "opening up a mix" that is different than the other multi-band processors I have can do.

What I'm not liking about it (the same thing I perceive with many "magic plugins") is that (on the couple of mixes I've been trying it on) it can easily "cheapify" the sound. It reminds of a kind of high frequency ringing, edginess that I notice on plugins that use linear phase filters.

I'm not sure if it is just something on my mixes, but turning up either the recover or tame parameters is bringing up the high frequencies overall. This makes certain sounds that have high midrange emphasis, like acoustic guitars, get kind of brittle sounding.

If I back off the brightness parameter it can tame this effect. The overall plugin seems "biased" so to speak, towards increase the overall high frequency content of a mix. That seems weird to me.

I guess there is some kind of model frequency response built in, that Gullfoss considers as an optimum?

Anyway, I'm confident this will turn out to be a very useful plugin, if not quite a "set and forget" plugin! I'm going to try it on some vocals next.

Working very smoothly with one instance on PT 2018.1, High Sierra, on Mac Pro 5.
Old 14th February 2018
  #203
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b0se's Avatar
Yes, it does tend to brighten. I use negative Bright settings to keep the intended tonal balance.
Old 14th February 2018
  #204
tft
Gear Nut
 

the brightness parameter is one option to tame the brightness. i find myself excluding the range from 12 khz upwards pretty often, to counteract the mentioned "ringieness". just slide the red line in from the right side.
BUT if there are highs that are recorded in an appropriate way with good sounding instruments (no distortion, no overly strong transients, overall balanced freq-spectrum), the process of gulfoss bringing up highs in the highest octave sounds beautiful.
it may be also a good way to examine the overall quality of a recording. if it sounds bad, exclude it from processing.

Edit: or tame things before gullfoss ... this also gives interesting insights on how it works
Old 14th February 2018
  #205
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Squawk's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squawk View Post
Trying to demo this. Cubase Pro 9.5.10, OSX 10.13.3.

Installed, but will not load. i'm getting an error when inserting on a track.
Is anyone here demoing this successfully in Cubase 9.5 with High Sierra?
Old 15th February 2018
  #206
tft
Gear Nut
 

my overall personal view on gullfoss so far:

there is something special and good on what it does, that i would describe as pleasing and satisfying to my ears and hearing/feeling. when i hear gullfoss-processed tracks or mixes (in a balanced and appropriate way!), there is a kind of "content-ness" in the soundimpression that i encounter. this keeps being so over longer periods of hearing-time and gets very obvious when bypassing the plugin. also there is no sign of tiredness coming up, as with many highfreq exciters for example, that sound exciting at first, but then make your ears tired very fast ...
EDIT: exciters are probably not a good comparison to what gulfoss does ... but with multibandcompressed stuff ears get tired also pretty fast, while sounding exciting at first. also, there is not this kind of "excitement" in the way gullfoss treats sound when i hear it first, it just sounds right.

apart from these broad impressions, there is a lot of details in mixes and instrument-tracks that are brought to the forefront in a good way, also balancing other things "falling out". that was to expect from the initial plugin description, but it is done in a very elegant and unobtrusive way. i also like what it does to the roomimpression from acoustic recordings. it tends to balance how the room reacts to the sound also, which is great and helpful to the overall sound (even digital reverberation ).

for me this all fits very well to what andreas explains regarding the concept of the plugin and the theory behind it.

great plugin with a lot of potential!
i am curious what is coming next based on their perceptual model.
it seems to fit my ears ...
Old 15th February 2018
  #207
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bitman's Avatar
Sounds like it's already there.
Windows version please.
This just isn't fair.

Old 15th February 2018
  #208
Gear Nut
 

Gullfoss sounds good but eats cpu.
Can we expect some optimizations down the road or is Gullfoss already as efficient as it gets?
Old 15th February 2018
  #209
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huub's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by assessor View Post
Gullfoss sounds good but eats cpu.
Can we expect some optimizations down the road or is Gullfoss already as efficient as it gets?
Might be a graphics thing? Om my macbook pro with discrete GPU cpu usage is quite low.
Old 15th February 2018
  #210
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mamm7215 View Post
I’m grateful for your input and candor, Andreas. I can’t wait until you port it to PC. You have a customer waiting in me. Any eta on that?
Sorry for the radio silence! I had to take a short break from everything.

There is no ETA for the PC version yet. It's extremely hard to plan ahead right now because a lot of work that we cannot accurately plan for has appeared. We're trying to improve the situation by hiring a helping hand for support and administration. As soon as we have our hands free again we will try to give an estimate and we will communicate when the internal beta starts.

Andreas
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