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-   -   Pro Tools Native & Apogee Rosetta 800 (https://www.gearslutz.com/board/avid-pro-tools/539713-pro-tools-native-amp-apogee-rosetta-800-a.html)

bottombunk 13th October 2010 08:06 PM

Pro Tools Native & Apogee Rosetta 800
 
Does anyone know if I will be able to integrate PT Native with my Rosetta 800 I already own? Or do I need to get something else to get into Native?

DavidJ 14th October 2010 12:48 AM

Pro Tools Native & Apogee Rosetta 800
 
You will need an X-HD card in your Rosetta, if you don't already have one. Pro Tools Native should see your Rosetta as a Digi 192 I/O interface and allow you to configure it accordingly.

Geetarpicker 21st October 2010 08:58 PM

Another guy here wondering about my Rosetta 800. Mine already has the PT card in it, though I've never used it as such. Can one also assume with the two interface jacks on the PT native PCIe card one could hook up TWO Rosetta 800s for a total of 16 tracks in/out?

Comments?

Thanks!

DavidJ 21st October 2010 09:18 PM

PTNHD w/ Rosetta
 
1 Attachment(s)
It appears you should be able to use more than two. As long as PTNHD sees it as a 192 (which it should) there shouldn't be an issue. Avid say's it hasn't been tested but they haven't done anything to prevent it from working. The diagram below details how Apogee recommends connecting the X-HD.

work2do 21st October 2010 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidJ (Post 5889640)
You will need an X-HD card in your Rosetta, if you don't already have one. Pro Tools Native should see your Rosetta as a Digi 192 I/O interface and allow you to configure it accordingly.

you will also need the adapter from avid. the connection for hd native and all the new avid interfaces is different now.

DavidJ 22nd October 2010 05:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by work2do (Post 5915991)
you will also need the adapter from avid. the connection for hd native and all the new avid interfaces is different now.

Correct. The DigiLink to DigiLink mini adapter comes with Pro Tools|HD Native.

Jeff16years 24th October 2010 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geetarpicker (Post 5915627)
Another guy here wondering about my Rosetta 800. Mine already has the PT card in it, though I've never used it as such. Can one also assume with the two interface jacks on the PT native PCIe card one could hook up TWO Rosetta 800s for a total of 16 tracks in/out?

Comments?

Thanks!

can't you just daisy chain the 800's off of 1 HD card (meaning the HD card that is in the Apogee 800's)

zimv20 25th October 2010 02:30 AM

help w/ understanding the avid interfaces
 
i'm running PTLE with an 002r and a rosetta800. at mixtime, i take 16 channels out to hardware for mixing.

My eventual goal is to get to 32+ channels out to hardware for mixing. At first glance, it seems as though i could get PTN with a single new avid HD i/o interface, but dropping in 4 d/a cards and no a/d.

then i would hook up my rosetta800 via the ADAT port for my a/d (8 channels is more than enough for my needs).

BUT it seems like it won't work that way, that at most i could do 16 channels of d/a with a single HD i/o, and i'd need a second to get 32 channels. is that right? anyone know?

nst7 25th October 2010 04:03 AM

That's correct. Each Digi HD I/O will only do 16 out, 16 in, regardless of digital or analog. So you would need 2 of those to do 32 out.

I don't know how it would work with 3rd party stuff. For example, the Apogee Symphony IO with 2 of its own 16 out cards equaling 32 outs, interfaced with Digilink. Not sure if that would work.

zimv20 25th October 2010 04:16 AM

thanks for the confirmation. perhaps the better path is to sell the 800 and get 2x Lynx Aurora 16.

nukmusic 7th November 2010 01:35 AM

food for thought...

I was thinking of dumping my 002R and getting the X-HD card for my Rosetta 800 to connect directly to the PT Native Card. But now that PT 9.0 is out I may just get the X-FW card for the Rosetta and PT 9 software with the CP Toolkit 2. I already own Protools LE and the MP Toolkit so I should be able get the upgrade pricing. I guess one would have to look at the pros and cons of paying the extra $$ for the Native card. $3500 & X-HD Card($500) vs $2600(or $1850upgrade) & X-FW card($350)

An LE to Native upgrade deal would be nice.

psycho_monkey 7th November 2010 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nukmusic (Post 5974053)
food for thought...

I was thinking of dumping my 002R and getting the X-HD card for my Rosetta 800 to connect directly to the PT Native Card. But now that PT 9.0 is out I may just get the X-FW card for the Rosetta and PT 9 software with the CP Toolkit 2. I already own Protools LE and the MP Toolkit so I should be able get the upgrade pricing. I guess one would have to look at the pros and cons of paying the extra $$ for the Native card. $3500 & X-HD Card($500) vs $2600(or $1850upgrade) & X-FW card($350)

An LE to Native upgrade deal would be nice.

Most dealers are offering an LE to Native discount.

nukmusic 8th November 2010 04:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by psycho_monkey (Post 5974089)
Most dealers are offering an LE to Native discount.

Cool, Thx...I will take a look. Still trying to figure out if its really worth it now that Protools 9 is out. I already own a the Rosetta 800, Protools LE, and the Music Production kit. I personally don't need the other features included in HD.
Upgrading to 9 for $250 and adding the X-FW card for $350 should do me good. I could also bypass getting the X-FW card and just keep the 002R for the Adat & SPDIF I/Os. But I'll look for those LE to HD Native prices.

nomoreflakes 24th November 2010 04:56 PM

is it possible to connect 2 rosettas via x firewire into pt 9 or do I have to buy native?

psycho_monkey 24th November 2010 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nukmusic (Post 5977915)
Cool, Thx...I will take a look. Still trying to figure out if its really worth it now that Protools 9 is out. I already own a the Rosetta 800, Protools LE, and the Music Production kit. I personally don't need the other features included in HD.
Upgrading to 9 for $250 and adding the X-FW card for $350 should do me good. I could also bypass getting the X-FW card and just keep the 002R for the Adat & SPDIF I/Os. But I'll look for those LE to HD Native prices.

I'd say it's worth it, if only for the ADC, session import options, 96k through your Rosetta etc.

psycho_monkey 24th November 2010 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nomoreflakes (Post 6041476)
is it possible to connect 2 rosettas via x firewire into pt 9 or do I have to buy native?

If you can use 2 x Rosetta over FW to ANYTHING, it should work with PT9. If it works under Logic, it should work under PT9. I think the Duets can't aggregate (at least, it's not supported - some appear to have it working), and may well be the same with the Ensemble. I don't know about the Rosettas, but I guess Apogee will.

nomoreflakes 24th November 2010 09:45 PM

just wanted to post apogee tech support reply to that question:

"No, we only support one Apogee hardware unit connected to a Mac via X-FireWire. If you are looking to connect more than one unit then you will need to look into our Symphony system or, as you said, a Pro Tools Native card. However, the Native card and our X-HD-equipped units are not "playing well" together quite yet. Testing and engineering will need to release some updates before full compatibility is supported. With that said, you may want to look at Symphony as a multi-unit solution."

psycho_monkey 24th November 2010 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nomoreflakes (Post 6042453)
just wanted to post apogee tech support reply to that question:

"No, we only support one Apogee hardware unit connected to a Mac via X-FireWire. If you are looking to connect more than one unit then you will need to look into our Symphony system or, as you said, a Pro Tools Native card. However, the Native card and our X-HD-equipped units are not "playing well" together quite yet. Testing and engineering will need to release some updates before full compatibility is supported. With that said, you may want to look at Symphony as a multi-unit solution."

Good to know. FWIW the only rig we ever have any issues with hardware-wise is the one with Apogee converters (although AD and DA 16Xs in this case).

nukmusic 25th November 2010 01:48 AM

This is why I never update to the "latest greatest" as soon as it comes out. I've learn years ago that's its best to have patience.

Someone else also recommended the Symphony card option for the Apogee line and Protools combo. It is less expensive than going the Native card route. But again, IMO I feel its good to wait and see what bugs pop up and can be illuminated.

Thx

JoshuaE 25th November 2010 01:56 AM

Like said before....you need the X-HD card per Apogee interface, aside from the Symphony IO, and you can use one converter per mini digiport on the HD Native card.

Also, just because the manufacturer says its not "supported" doesn't mean it won't work. It just means they haven't tested it in conjunction with whatever they are trying to sell. Plus, it's a good way to sell some new gear. Why test a new product in conjunction with one that is discontinued? Makes no sense for a manufacturer to do so.

JoshuaE 25th November 2010 02:04 AM

I saw Native in action yesterday in a meeting with Avid and I was blown away. The card doesn't have DSP, but it does manage the efficiency of the machine. During the demo they were using an Imogen Heap tune with 150 instances, or tracks, running simultaneously with Waves G-channel on every track, as well as 50 or 60 other plugs. The Mac Pro it was running on was idling at 50% while this was going on and didn't break a sweat!

One huge thing I think people look over when considering PT9 versus PT 9 HD (Native & TDM) is delay compensation on hardware inserts, which for me is a deal breaker, as well as VCA mixing. As much as I love TDM systems, I really feel HD Native is the future.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nukmusic (Post 6043251)
This is why I never update to the "latest greatest" as soon as it comes out. I've learn years ago that's its best to have patience.

Someone else also recommended the Symphony card option for the Apogee line and Protools combo. It is less expensive than going the Native card route. But again, IMO I feel its good to wait and see what bugs pop up and can be illuminated.

Thx


nukmusic 25th November 2010 02:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshua Estock (Post 6043290)
. . . .

One huge thing I think people look over when considering PT9 versus PT 9 HD (Native & TDM) is delay compensation on hardware inserts, which for me is a deal breaker, as well as VCA mixing. As much as I love TDM systems, I really feel HD Native is the future.

Pretty much in the back of my mind also. I'll just wait til others test the waters to give more real world reports. So many different workflows and setups for in-house tests to prove "all is well". heh

Thx again. Keep the reports coming.

JoshuaE 25th November 2010 02:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nukmusic (Post 6043337)
Pretty much in the back of my mind also. I'll just wait til others test the waters to give more real world reports. So many different workflows and setups for in-house tests to prove "all is well". heh

Thx again. Keep the reports coming.

Very true. For me Native is a completely viable option; however, I hardly ever record more than 16 simultaneous inputs. For somebody that is recording symphonies or doing some serious live tracking I feel TDM is still completely viable.

psycho_monkey 25th November 2010 03:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshua Estock (Post 6043290)
IOne huge thing I think people look over when considering PT9 versus PT 9 HD (Native & TDM) is delay compensation on hardware inserts, which for me is a deal breaker, as well as VCA mixing. As much as I love TDM systems, I really feel HD Native is the future.

PT9 (non HD) has delay compensation on inserts. The only difference is you have to give it the delay times yourself (as you would have to if you used Apogee, Lynx or any non-Avid converters with HD as well, HD only compensates correctly for converters it recognises correctly).

VCA faders, yep you're correct.

nst7 25th November 2010 04:13 AM

VCA is available in regular PT9 with the Complete Toolkit.

jimmyboy7 25th November 2010 04:14 AM

Be careful!!! I already had to return my native card!!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshua Estock (Post 6043273)
Like said before....you need the X-HD card per Apogee interface, aside from the Symphony IO, and you can use one converter per mini digiport on the HD Native card.

Also, just because the manufacturer says its not "supported" doesn't mean it won't work. It just means they haven't tested it in conjunction with whatever they are trying to sell. Plus, it's a good way to sell some new gear. Why test a new product in conjunction with one that is discontinued? Makes no sense for a manufacturer to do so.

I had to return my Native HD because it did not work with my Rosetta 800 and XHD setup. So unless you want a lot of trouble WAIT!!!! I spoke to Avid and APogee and they said there is no support yet. Apogee sadi they may have a solution in a few months ;)

JoshuaE 26th November 2010 02:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nst7 (Post 6043647)
VCA is available in regular PT9 with the Complete Toolkit.

Very true. However, after purchasing PT9 for $600 and Production Toolkit 2 for $2000 you quickly see why Avid is charging what they are for an HD Native Card. For only $900 more you get the card and PT HD 9. Is that increase cost worth it? I tend to think it is.

jimmyboy7 26th November 2010 06:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshua Estock (Post 6046370)
Very true. However, after purchasing PT9 for $600 and Production Toolkit 2 for $2000 you quickly see why Avid is charging what they are for an HD Native Card. For only $900 more you get the card and PT HD 9. Is that increase cost worth it? I tend to think it is.

I couldn't agree more :)

G-Spot 26th November 2010 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bottombunk (Post 5888692)
Does anyone know if I will be able to integrate PT Native with my Rosetta 800 I already own? Or do I need to get something else to get into Native?

As said above you just need the X-Firewire card...
But instead of buying the X-Firewire card, I bought a M-Audio Profire 2626 for just 130€ more. You connect the Rosetta with the 2626 throught ADAT and at the end you get 16 in/outs (18 with Spdifs) 2 headphone outputs and 8 extra mic-preamps. Can't get better for the price.
Worked solid under PT M-Powered 8 and working solid know with PT 9.
I'm seeling my Rosetta 800 because I'm going to get the SSL Alpha Link (or the new Burl gooof).

nomoreflakes 26th November 2010 07:57 PM

There must be thousands of people in this boat right now.

Is anyone out there successfully running PT9 (Native or otherwise) with multiple Rosetta interfaces ?

Actually, anyone who is connecting Rosettas to PT 9 how are you doing it (X-HD or SYMPHONY). Just like to know.

peace