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jonnyb8390 20th November 2009 04:13 AM

Toft ATB - Weak signal to tape
 
I know I've got a "pro-sumer" console, but I wonder if anyone else has had this problem, or if it's just something that I have to deal with: In order to get a hot signal from my Toft ATB to Pro Tools via an Aurora (fixed trims), I have to gain the mic pre up so much that it nearly distorts before leaving the console.
I'm aware of the unbalanced direct outputs and I have them connected as such according to industry standards:
Source (Toft):
Tip = Hot
Sleeve = Cold
Shield is unconnected
On the DB25 destination end, all 3 conductors are connected appropriately. Should there be any signal loss when going from unbalanced to balanced? Is this just a crappy console?

Thanks in advance.

Jim Williams 20th November 2009 05:40 PM

I'll leave that last line for others to answer. The direct outs will do +21 dbu max. It is unbalanced so a -6 db drop compared to balanced output gear is normal. To retain some working dynamic range, raise the gain trims on your converter to avoid clipping.

Also avoid using the master balanced outputs to drive 600 ohm transformer based outboard gear. The 072 opamps cannot drive a load below 2k ohms without severe THD and level losses. If you must drive 600 ohm transformer input outboard gear like vintage compressors and the like, do the Toft mods I posted as that will allow driving 150 ohm loads without problems.

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades

jonnyb8390 21st November 2009 04:04 AM

Thanks Much
 
Very diplomatic and informative.

deda 21st November 2009 05:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Williams (Post 4804736)
I'll leave that last line for others to answer. The direct outs will do +21 dbu max. It is unbalanced so a -6 db drop compared to balanced output gear is normal. To retain some working dynamic range, raise the gain trims on your converter to avoid clipping.

Also avoid using the master balanced outputs to drive 600 ohm transformer based outboard gear. The 072 opamps cannot drive a load below 2k ohms without severe THD and level losses. If you must drive 600 ohm transformer input outboard gear like vintage compressors and the like, do the Toft mods I posted as that will allow driving 150 ohm loads without problems.

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades


You are a source of many many well thought of mods and a man with an opinion, a respected opinion.

I know from reading many of your posts and threads here and other forums you flat shoot straight and have saved me money by posting your historical findings several times.

Based on the ops quote from his last post "Very diplomatic and informative" is quite descriptive of your style, very commendable.

BUT I need you to bend that diplomatic trait just a hair to answer a question. If unable to answer based on your I'm sure long delicate relationships, well you won't.

But the question is why and for what reason did Toft use all Unbalanced outs on their Pilot and 1st revision boards? They have all balanced now but all the used ones I keep finding have the unbalanced outs. What advantage does an unbalanced out have over a balanced one, someone thought it was a better mousetrap.

Some sellers have claimed to just convert to a balanced line thru various gadgets at the output or in the patchbay. BUT I am of the understanding that to have the older Tofts with the unbalanced outs converted to a true balanced console that it would require modding each and everyone of the outs INSIDE the Toft with this appropriate mod, all of them including of course the master outs.

Thank you for your consideration of this conundrum that has me baffled.

Regards ,,deda,,

voidtunes 21st November 2009 12:34 PM

I had the same problem: before Jim spilled the beans!
 
No more problems here!> Finished the Jim Wills mod on the ATB today! I have to admit I havent spent any time mixing on it yet but from my 10 min test I have already noticed a huge difference. I did the master bus and all the subs. HOLY COW what a difference. The 1st thing I noticed was a defined tightening of all the transients and the massive amount of clean headroom. The noise floor has all but gone. I can now run it right into the red with no apparent distortion. Heaps of nice high end. JUST REALLY GOOD CLEAR SOUND

Have to say it wasn't the easiest mod but with a mates help we got it done in a dayjkthtyrt

BTW: If anyone is interested I have enough parts to do the master strip mod again. Obviously I don't need the spares so there up for sale $100 and ill throw in some Linea tech LT1355CN8's.

DO THIS MOD IT CHANGES YOUR ATB FOREVER!

Thanks again JIM.kfhkh

jonnyb8390 21st November 2009 10:40 PM

can you give me a link to the mod?

Sincerely,

Lazy

voidtunes 22nd November 2009 07:12 AM

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/high-...updates-7.html



Its on a post by Jim about half way up the page ATM nammed PIMP YOUR TOFT