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-   -   I ask for your help and evaluation of my demo mix (https://www.gearslutz.com/board/post-your-rap-amp-hiphop-music-here/1320799-i-ask-your-help-evaluation-my-demo-mix.html)

Mate Wise 3rd August 2020 06:03 PM

I ask for your help and evaluation of my demo mix
 
Hi all, dear professionals, I would like you to provide adequate criticism and tips for your mix. It was recorded in a Rode NT1-A microphone, directly into the Native instruments komplete 6 card, in a room not prepared for recording. I drive in cheap Philips headphones, and focus on the analyzers by reference track.. I would like your advice on obvious errors, and what you think should be changed in terms of processing.. sorry for my poor English translation, I am not a native speaker .. and I use a translator

Link a demo mix - https://yadi.sk/d/l3L3T9PHrRSXCA

asicbeast 3rd August 2020 07:11 PM

My thoughts & first impressions
 
Salute !

Just for my interest, could you please provide some Information regarding your mixbus processing ?

:cop:

(Listening in mono on an avantone mixcube)

First of all, IMO, you did well !

My first Impression was that there was a quite audible difference in Level between the first two claps when the beat drops.
The rapper begins after the first clap and as soon he raps on the clap, the clap gets lower in level. What might be a creative choice, it's not in this case IMO!
After Looking at the file in my DAW in interest of the LUFS, i saw a Pretty "lifeless" file limited at -1.0db at around 8-9LUFS which Kind of fitted to what i've heard before.
I think that's just a bit to much and just not needed. I think a Little more dynamic mix would translate better to the vibe of the Music.
I like you apporach to get a "juicy" vocal there, but some more defined Accents or noticeable but subtle Automation could help there.
(Maybe i just hate obvious reverbs on vocals kinda washing out everything, no offense intended)
I think the track would Benefit from less compression or Maybe a Change in the processing ?

You said something About watching the analyzer with reference Songs, could u please post one or two of them aswell so we get an Impression of which Sound you are trying to accomplish? :cowbell:

Peace !

Mate Wise 3rd August 2020 09:41 PM

9 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by asicbeast (Post 14894948)
Salute !

Just for my interest, could you please provide some Information regarding your mixbus processing ?

:cop:

(Listening in mono on an avantone mixcube)

First of all, IMO, you did well !

My first Impression was that there was a quite audible difference in Level between the first two claps when the beat drops.
The rapper begins after the first clap and as soon he raps on the clap, the clap gets lower in level. What might be a creative choice, it's not in this case IMO!
After Looking at the file in my DAW in interest of the LUFS, i saw a Pretty "lifeless" file limited at -1.0db at around 8-9LUFS which Kind of fitted to what i've heard before.
I think that's just a bit to much and just not needed. I think a Little more dynamic mix would translate better to the vibe of the Music.
I like you apporach to get a "juicy" vocal there, but some more defined Accents or noticeable but subtle Automation could help there.
(Maybe i just hate obvious reverbs on vocals kinda washing out everything, no offense intended)
I think the track would Benefit from less compression or Maybe a Change in the processing ?

You said something About watching the analyzer with reference Songs, could u please post one or two of them aswell so we get an Impression of which Sound you are trying to accomplish? :cowbell:

Peace !

On my master tire there is such a chain, I will attach it with photos

Thank you very much! Yes, you are right about everything! Your advice is very valuable to me! My reference tracks were as follows
“Future ft Drake - Live is Good”
“Future - Posted with demons” When I mixed revebiratsiyu for vocals, it seemed to me that the vocals are too dry for this track, and then after a while, I came to the conclusion that (most likely my ears were blurred) and I needed to rest... but now my suspicions have been confirmed, thanks to you. I would like to know how the dynamics you wrote about are determined . I just look at the references and they sound up to "-6 -7 Lufs” and there is “0.6 True peak" so I squeeze all the juice on the master bus for such lufs readings..

asicbeast 3rd August 2020 10:00 PM

I think the problem with the "dynamics" im referring to might be just that. By trying to achieve such a ridiculous loudness you will definitely lose some or maybe even the most important aspects of the sonic quality!
Thats not due to your lack of skill, its just beyond "healthy limitations" of audio processig IMO
I think if your target loudness would be a bit lower, with less compression, and a bit of softclip, the music will have so much more impact und the listener because the "breath" in the music is maintained! Music is about the absence of loud passages aswell :) dynamics


Im not meaning to criticize you!

Im happy that i could help u a bit.


If your client trusts you and notices the difference, you will be fine.

Mate Wise 3rd August 2020 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asicbeast (Post 14895269)
I think the problem with the "dynamics" im referring to might be just that. By trying to achieve such a ridiculous loudness you will definitely lose some or maybe even the most important aspects of the sonic quality!
Thats not due to your lack of skill, its just beyond "healthy limitations" of audio processig IMO
I think if your target loudness would be a bit lower, with less compression, and a bit of softclip, the music will have so much more impact und the listener because the "breath" in the music is maintained! Music is about the absence of loud passages aswell :) dynamics


Im not meaning to criticize you!

Im happy that i could help u a bit.


If your client trusts you and notices the difference, you will be fine.


Thanks you ! I uploaded a photo my “master”

asicbeast 3rd August 2020 10:12 PM

Yeah i saw. Sorry. I somehow didnt notice...

Looks nice and interesting!

What would happen if you hit that proL2 with small lookahead for like a db and maybe not that much final gain reduction?
That stereo width button on the bx is sometimes magic too...

Anyways, looks pretty advanced what youre doing.

I think you dont need that loud final master as in your demo.
I mean, will it be released on spotify anyway?

Peace!

Mate Wise 3rd August 2020 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asicbeast (Post 14895291)
Yeah i saw. Sorry. I somehow didnt notice...

Looks nice and interesting!

What would happen if you hit that proL2 with small lookahead for like a db and maybe not that much final gain reduction?
That stereo width button on the bx is sometimes magic too...

Anyways, looks pretty advanced what youre doing.

I think you dont need that loud final master as in your demo.
I mean, will it be released on spotify anyway?

Peace!

Thank you again, thank you very much for your help! Please explain to me a little more in detail, if it is not difficult for you, I just do not know English, and the translator is slightly mistaken... I would like to know what you mean about “ProL2-Lookahead” ? And the second question is, do I need to stick to 11Lufs for streaming platforms ? Such as " Spotify”

asicbeast 3rd August 2020 11:26 PM

I will answer in depth later. I need some sleep to focus my thoughts.
Good night

Mate Wise 4th August 2020 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asicbeast (Post 14895412)
I will answer in depth later. I need some sleep to focus my thoughts.
Good night


Thanks you, good night ✊🏼

asicbeast 4th August 2020 02:01 PM

Hello again!

You can see in the left bottom of the FabFilter ProL2 there is a knob called "lookahead".
In the trap genre, i had good results by putting a soft-clipper with a soft curve before my final master limiter and then applied only that much gain reduction to grab like -1db of the kicks (with the limiter in this case the proL2).
With a short lookahead, the limiter will distort more and shape the already soft clipped kicks even more.
It kind of gives things the right amount of impact although it still tames the peaks.
This is of course taste preference.

To maintain punch and breathe, maybe an approach in testing different soft clip and limiter algorithms could be helpful!



Regarding the target loudness for streaming portals like Spotify etc:

I think there are various very informative disscussions here in GS already.

IMO going a bit louder than the platforms loudness normalisation level feels right, in case i at least dont want the platform normalisation to make my song LOUDER.

For me, there is no sense to target my projects loudness at -8 LUFS because often the composition and arrangements dont allow without changing the vibe of the music by hypercompressing. And it will mainly be a youtube or spotify upload anyway. So i like to keep things a bit more open and punchy without compromise to the sonic quality. :)

There are Situations in which it would be possible to go that loud, if the mix and composition allow it, but im happy that its not that necessary these days.

If you have any questions, feel free to ask.
I hope you can understand what im trying to say. :)


I think its really important for the music to translate the vibe!
Especially in trap style music.

Mate Wise 4th August 2020 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asicbeast (Post 14896356)
Hello again!

You can see in the left bottom of the FabFilter ProL2 there is a knob called "lookahead".
In the trap genre, i had good results by putting a soft-clipper with a soft curve before my final master limiter and then applied only that much gain reduction to grab like -1db of the kicks (with the limiter in this case the proL2).
With a short lookahead, the limiter will distort more and shape the already soft clipped kicks even more.
It kind of gives things the right amount of impact although it still tames the peaks.
This is of course taste preference.

To maintain punch and breathe, maybe an approach in testing different soft clip and limiter algorithms could be helpful!



Regarding the target loudness for streaming portals like Spotify etc:

I think there are various very informative disscussions here in GS already.

IMO going a bit louder than the platforms loudness normalisation level feels right, in case i at least dont want the platform normalisation to make my song LOUDER.

For me, there is no sense to target my projects loudness at -8 LUFS because often the composition and arrangements dont allow without changing the vibe of the music by hypercompressing. And it will mainly be a youtube or spotify upload anyway. So i like to keep things a bit more open and punchy without compromise to the sonic quality. :)

There are Situations in which it would be possible to go that loud, if the mix and composition allow it, but im happy that its not that necessary these days.

If you have any questions, feel free to ask.
I hope you can understand what im trying to say. :)


I think its really important for the music to translate the vibe!
Especially in trap style music.

Hi ! thank you very much for your response ! I took your advice into account )

I made two versions today:

The first version with an enlarged LOOK AHEAD PRO L2 up to 2MS and a clipper TRACKS with a semi-soft knee, I made it today after your advice about LOOKAHEAD, etc
1: https://yadi.sk/d/vnZPUzvRTE2wHA

And the second version without applying what I wrote above, I did it yesterday already taking into account your wishes, and slightly changed the approach to the case.
2:https://yadi.sk/d/L1U8LrIRyNozhA

I would like to know now what you think about these versions ? Listening in Apple headphones, I feel more like version 1 ))

asicbeast 6th August 2020 02:32 PM

DAMN rockout

this 2 versions significantly Sound better !
Now the track translates way better ! The Music has more Impact !!

I would go for the Clipper Version.

I compared all versions and tried to match the loudness.
In the Version with Clipper, the drums kinda maintain their Punch. Clap hits hard !!!!!
The no Clipper Version is more dynamic and has a nice open feel aswell.

But for my subjective Impression, i felt like i prefer the Version with Clipper tho :)


Good Job ! I think you are good to go.

Vocal might feel a bit to wet with effects , when i checked mix in mono the vocal came waaaay more upfront, which is no surprise, but u might notice what i mean if u check mix in mono. :) But thats not a Problem at all. Sounds good to me. Peace !

Mate Wise 7th August 2020 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asicbeast (Post 14900118)
DAMN rockout

this 2 versions significantly Sound better !
Now the track translates way better ! The Music has more Impact !!

I would go for the Clipper Version.

I compared all versions and tried to match the loudness.
In the Version with Clipper, the drums kinda maintain their Punch. Clap hits hard !!!!!
The no Clipper Version is more dynamic and has a nice open feel aswell.

But for my subjective Impression, i felt like i prefer the Version with Clipper tho :)


Good Job ! I think you are good to go.

Vocal might feel a bit to wet with effects , when i checked mix in mono the vocal came waaaay more upfront, which is no surprise, but u might notice what i mean if u check mix in mono. :) But thats not a Problem at all. Sounds good to me. Peace !

Yeah ! Thank you very much for your help ! This is awesome dude ! Would you like to know if you have a social media profile ?

asicbeast 9th August 2020 03:19 PM

I dont like to get that deep in social media.
If you want to contact me, holla @ me instagram.com/asicbeast