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franzalicestern 21st June 2020 03:28 AM

MAC MINI 8th GENERATION vs MAC PRO
 
Hello,

I'm really not a big expert about computers, but still, I need to buy a new one able to run Logic Pro X, Ableton 10 and ProTools.

I'm struggling between the new mac mini and the new mac pro, since they pass over 3000€ difference.

The first option would be a mac mini for 3559€:

I7 6 core 3.2 GHz
64GB DDR4 2666MHz
SSD 2TB

The second option would be a mac pro for 7599€:

Xeon 8 core 3.5 GHz
32GB DDR4
SSD 2TB

My question is...is this mac pro worth 7500€? The characteristics are looking worst compared to the mac mini, and if not, just for two cores more, are worth 7599€? Especially when I could get 64GB DDR4 on the mac mini for half of the price of a mac pro?

Thanks in advance for your answers and your help

Best
Francesco

biksonije 21st June 2020 12:43 PM

Doing this for fun, as a side gig or working a pro studio setup that will make serious income?

If first, go for MacPro because of architecture, expanability, air flow, power supply ability... Or wait a year or better two (maybe even 3!) to ARM chips come out and we all can see their weaknesses but also to devs have time to prepare and re-work their digital tolls (DAW, Plugins etc.).

If latter, oh well, then neither! Go search and buy MacPro fastest cheesegrater 5.1 dual CPU machine. That will give you more than enough power for your needs for software you're asking about for next 5-10 years! And all that for whopping 1.000-1.500 EUR! ;-)

PS: I am not a Win (PC) hater but I didn't mention Win platform because I am simply not a PC person. OK if necessary but if possiblity is to have a choice - Mac all day long!

uptheoctave 21st June 2020 12:46 PM

I had the 2018 Mac Mini and went to the new 2019 Mac Pro.

The Mac Mini's single core performance is amazing considering the cost.

The Mac Pro is better for me- the discreet video RAM in the MP means it runs smoother overall, plus I am on HDX so I appreciate not using a noisy expansion chassis.
If you are using a lot of VI's then the Mac Mini might be a better option for you.
I appreciate having the power of the MP.

Monotremata 21st June 2020 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biksonije (Post 14812665)
Doing this for fun, as a side gig or working a pro studio setup that will make serious income?

If first, go for MacPro because of architecture, expanability, air flow, power supply ability... Or wait a year or better two (maybe even 3!) to ARM chips come out and we all can see their weaknesses but also to devs have time to prepare and re-work their digital tolls (DAW, Plugins etc.).

If latter, oh well, then neither! Go search and buy MacPro fastest cheesegrater 5.1 dual CPU machine. That will give you more than enough power for your needs for software you're asking about for next 5-10 years! And all that for whopping 1.000-1.500 EUR! ;-)

PS: I am not a Win (PC) hater but I didn't mention Win platform because I am simply not a PC person. OK if necessary but if possiblity is to have a choice - Mac all day long!

The Mac Pro cheese grater is on its way out. The latest version of Logic starts to choke it doing the most basic 16-20 track mixes over here. Sure you'll get 5-10 years out of one if you stick to 2019 or earlier software. You're going to get some little updates here and there from third party folks but the machine is barely keeping up. I just got my i7 2020 Mac mini last Thursday, its sitting right above the 6 core 3.33Ghz 2010 Mac Pro it replaced. Power-wise the mini has a SLIGHT advantage, they're about neck and neck in the CPU meter on the projects Im working on in Logic at the moment.. BUT the big difference is, the Mini doesn't get "jerky" and sluggish like the Pro does. They both show the same CPU consumption on a project, but the Pro will overload and stop out of nowhere all the time. And these projects played just fine a few weeks ago before the 10.5 update. Even Mac OS shows it. Not only is general access a hell of a lot quicker on the Mini, but its response time is instant. The FSB is twice the speed of the Pro, and the internal SSD blows away the SATA SSD in the Pro. The Mac Pro still "thinks" for a second when it does anything in Mojave. Catalina is pretty much a liquid instant reaction on the Mini. It reminds me of trying to run Leopard on my old Titanium Powerbook G4 1Ghz. Tiger flew on that thing, Leopard was painful and pretty much told you 'Just go buy a new G5 already'. Im surprised I got any work done on that thing with Logic 8.

Musiclab 21st June 2020 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monotremata (Post 14813224)
The Mac Pro cheese grater is on its way out. The latest version of Logic starts to choke it doing the most basic 16-20 track mixes over here. Sure you'll get 5-10 years out of one if you stick to 2019 or earlier software. You're going to get some little updates here and there from third party folks but the machine is barely keeping up. I just got my i7 2020 Mac mini last Thursday, its sitting right above the 6 core 3.33Ghz 2010 Mac Pro it replaced. Power-wise the mini has a SLIGHT advantage, they're about neck and neck in the CPU meter on the projects Im working on in Logic at the moment.. BUT the big difference is, the Mini doesn't get "jerky" and sluggish like the Pro does. They both show the same CPU consumption on a project, but the Pro will overload and stop out of nowhere all the time. And these projects played just fine a few weeks ago before the 10.5 update. Even Mac OS shows it. Not only is general access a hell of a lot quicker on the Mini, but its response time is instant. The FSB is twice the speed of the Pro, and the internal SSD blows away the SATA SSD in the Pro. The Mac Pro still "thinks" for a second when it does anything in Mojave. Catalina is pretty much a liquid instant reaction on the Mini. It reminds me of trying to run Leopard on my old Titanium Powerbook G4 1Ghz. Tiger flew on that thing, Leopard was painful and pretty much told you 'Just go buy a new G5 already'. Im surprised I got any work done on that thing with Logic 8.

Hmm. I'm using a 12 core 5,1 w 32 gig, with 6 drives in the computer , and I'm running 48 channels I/O on a PCIe card. So a Mac mini is out for me, and I earn my living from my studio. I'm running High Sierra, but I usually stay an OS or 2 behind because I'm not in the business of being a beta tester. Long time Logic guy and I'm thinking I'll go to Mojave and see how things are. At some point I'll need to get a new computer but everything is solid here.

Monotremata 21st June 2020 11:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Musiclab (Post 14813361)
Hmm. I'm using a 12 core 5,1 w 32 gig, with 6 drives in the computer , and I'm running 48 channels I/O on a PCIe card. So a Mac mini is out for me, and I earn my living from my studio. I'm running High Sierra, but I usually stay an OS or 2 behind because I'm not in the business of being a beta tester. Long time Logic guy and I'm thinking I'll go to Mojave and see how things are. At some point I'll need to get a new computer but everything is solid here.

Mojave was a pretty smooth ride for me, one of my favorite MacOS's to be honest. It was just the latest Logic update which ramped it up. Running Reaper everything was great. Yours has an extra six cores on mine, and another 8GB of ram, Id think yours will be good to go in Mojave land for awhile. Im running a USB MOTU, with 2 ADAT expanders on it for 24 channels, and everything was perfectly fine for me otherwise. Haven't bothered trying to go back to Mojave on the Mini, I know I can but I figured I would set it up and see how it went and so far so good. Most of my stuff I can't install are old games, but a few synth tools as well. That reminds me I gotta go test Virtual Box and make sure my WinXP/Sound Diver setup still works haha.

Musiclab 22nd June 2020 12:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monotremata (Post 14813575)
Mojave was a pretty smooth ride for me, one of my favorite MacOS's to be honest. It was just the latest Logic update which ramped it up. Running Reaper everything was great. Yours has an extra six cores on mine, and another 8GB of ram, Id think yours will be good to go in Mojave land for awhile. Im running a USB MOTU, with 2 ADAT expanders on it for 24 channels, and everything was perfectly fine for me otherwise. Haven't bothered trying to go back to Mojave on the Mini, I know I can but I figured I would set it up and see how it went and so far so good. Most of my stuff I can't install are old games, but a few synth tools as well. That reminds me I gotta go test Virtual Box and make sure my WinXP/Sound Diver setup still works haha.

Soundiver WOW!

Monotremata 22nd June 2020 12:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Musiclab (Post 14813611)
Soundiver WOW!

Heh yeah still the best librarian out there. I still use it with my AMT8, Microwave XT and Blofeld to edit/store patches. Some recent VirtualBox update broke compatibility with the USB chipset or something though so it hasn't worked for a few months. I may have to give in and buy the new version of MIDIQuest soon.

biksonije 22nd June 2020 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monotremata (Post 14813224)
The Mac Pro cheese grater is on its way out. The latest version of Logic starts to choke it doing the most basic 16-20 track mixes over here.

Really? 5.1 does not allow you to work in Logic with more than 16-20 Tracks?! I got to say to you publicly now that this is borderline with impossible! Sorry.

What resolutions you usually work and what do you have on every track? I'm just trying to figure out! Super heavy VSTi? I am really curious to hear. I really am so if you want to answer OK. If not, it's also good. No problem.

System 10.11.6 over here with dual CPU (2x2.8 GHz) 3.1 MacPro with 64 GB RAM and with SSDs inside and I can tell you my 3.1 works like a charm with 50-60 to 80-90 tracks, depending on arrangement and heavy duty on them. Live 10 latest version (mainly) here. Less PT.

noah330 22nd June 2020 12:43 PM

I went from a cheese grater Mac Pro to a Mac Mini Server that blew it away. The downside was I had to buy an external card cage.

Fast forward a few years and I have the new Mac Mini that I bought as an open box from one of those online retailers.

I love it with my PT Ultimate setup and my core card works great. Probably not for everyone but runs all the plugs, etc... I need flawlessly and didn’t cost much.

If this processor thing ends up being worth it I’ll buy the new pro in a few years but I’m happy. Plus my old mini is still running fine in my home office.

Musiclab 22nd June 2020 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biksonije (Post 14814309)
Really? 5.1 does not allow you to work in Logic with more than 16-20 Tracks?! I got to say to you publicly now that this is borderline with impossible! Sorry.

What resolutions you usually work and what do you have on every track? I'm just trying to figure out! Super heavy VSTi? I am really curious to hear. I really am so if you want to answer OK. If not, it's also good. No problem.

System 10.11.6 over here with dual CPU (2x2.8 GHz) 3.1 MacPro with 64 GB RAM and with SSDs inside and I can tell you my 3.1 works like a charm with 50-60 to 80-90 tracks, depending on arrangement and heavy duty on them. Live 10 latest version (mainly) here. Less PT.

You're 100% right, that's not true I've run a session with 80 tracks no problem. With my 5,1 Mac Pro my starting template has 48 audio tracks, routinely projects here are in the 36 tracks all going out to 48 channels of I/O.

biksonije 22nd June 2020 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Musiclab (Post 14814636)
You're 100% right, that's not true I've run a session with 80 tracks no problem. With my 5,1 Mac Pro my starting template has 48 audio tracks, routinely projects here are in the 36 tracks all going out to 48 channels of I/O.

Exactly! A buddy of mine comped together a 5.1 machine (bought dual CPU but slower one and nothing but default inside) and pumped it up to fastest 2 CPUs, put inside 64 GB of RAM and stuffed in 2 SSDs and left one default HDD inside. So, it's (if I'm correct) dual 3.46 GHz 5.1 machine. Nothing overclocked or silly stuff like that. He runs anything between 120 and 160 tracks in PT.

Me on the other hand work primarily in Live 10 (latest vesrion) and on 3.1 dual 2.8 (bought two 3.2 CPUs but one was faulty so I'm on dfault 2.8 CPUs) machine with 64 RAM. What can I say? Great for my needs. I easily run anything between 40 and 100 tracks.

I am not saying that there are no sessions with 200 or 300 tracks. No way. If one needs that and needs a machine that can handle ghen by any means, go straight to Apple shop and get fastest new MacPro and stuff in nVME drives and at least 128 RAM. If work needs that computing power and speed it is absolutely necessary. But other than that, and I see here (and elsewhere) all sorts of BS like this or that machine can't do this or that. Such a BS! I am searching at the moment for fstest dual 5.1 machine because I know why and for my work it is way more than I'll ever need!

So, if any of you here reading this Thread want to ditch your 5.1 dual cheesegrater (leave basic HW inside - it's all I need, I have my own drives and the rest) I will consider buying it if it was not touring and being tossed around! Seriously, send a PM and we'll go from there. If the price is right... ;-)

Monotremata 22nd June 2020 04:55 PM

Well your machine has more than double the memory of mine, and you're also running an OS 4-5 years older than me, which also means you're not running the latest version of Logic (and you're not running Logic at all apparently). I think you may have missed that little tidbit in my post, your machine can't be compared to my situation. Regardless of what YOUR Mac Pro is doing, mine is overloading and stopping playback while the CPU is running at like 10% constantly. These projects played back fine under Logic 10.4, and on the new Mac mini running Logic 10.5.1, they're smooth as silk.

biksonije 22nd June 2020 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monotremata (Post 14814719)
Well your machine has more than double the memory of mine, and you're also running an OS 4-5 years older than me, which also means you're not running the latest version of Logic (and you're not running Logic at all apparently). I think you may have missed that little tidbit in my post, your machine can't be compared to my situation. Regardless of what YOUR Mac Pro is doing, mine is overloading and stopping playback while the CPU is running at like 10% constantly. These projects played back fine under Logic 10.4, and on the new Mac mini running Logic 10.5.1, they're smooth as silk.

Nah mam, I get it. And I hear what you're saying. Now, different DAW or not, be honest. Don't you think 16-20 tracks can kill the machine so that it freezes, chokes, glitches and what not?! Come on! Really?! I am not trying to be smart one here nor force anything but either that machine has some serious faults and something is seriously wrong because old machine like mine (and many, many users here, hobbyists or pros still use machines like mine and run big pro studios) or some part of story simply doesn't add up.

And yes, I am running older OS, I am not working in Logic and my double the RAM size is not the main thing! Clock is! But hey, it can be all sorts of things. Bottleneck somewhere, hardware not bought as for optimized system, something not set up correctly... Who knows...

Hopefully you and OP will sort things out and have a setup for maximum pleasure and nice workflow. So far, my museum machine is amazing. I ađ so getting 5.1 cheesegrater! Never "closed" boxes like iMacPro or MacMini. Not the best design and architectire. And of course all other optimized HE you as user put inside plays the big role! Getting rid of any and all bottlenecks for easy workflow is what we all need. Hope you will make yours run smooth as baby's butt as for OP as well! If fastest and strongest machine is neccessity - go for it! If I had that much cash and would absolutely need fast and new machine I'd get tower any time over the "closed" boxes like Mini o iMac designs. But that's just me.

Stay safe all and take care!

Monotremata 22nd June 2020 07:00 PM

Well all I know is these tracks played perfectly fine before Logic 10.5, and no change was made to this system whatsoever so do with that what you will.
I never said the system was 'freezing', what I said was during playback with the CPU meter at maybe 10% the songs are spiking and overloading randomly out of nowhere.. Now, without adding anything else to the system, tell what what the culprit could possibly be other than the new update to Logic??

The Mac OS has changed ALOT since 10.11, so Im glad it still works for you, but you are also stuck to a certain degree in 2015 with El Capitan. Considering what's been done to the OS itself, you can't really compare your system to a 'modern' one, I mean to start, your SSD's aren't even running the same file system all of mine are.

Everything has already been well sorted here, the Mac mini got here 4 days ago and is running as great as can be.

Musiclab 22nd June 2020 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monotremata (Post 14814719)
Well your machine has more than double the memory of mine, and you're also running an OS 4-5 years older than me, which also means you're not running the latest version of Logic (and you're not running Logic at all apparently). I think you may have missed that little tidbit in my post, your machine can't be compared to my situation. Regardless of what YOUR Mac Pro is doing, mine is overloading and stopping playback while the CPU is running at like 10% constantly. These projects played back fine under Logic 10.4, and on the new Mac mini running Logic 10.5.1, they're smooth as silk.

I'm not running 10.5 I am running 10.4.7 on my Mac Pro 5,1
w 32 gig of ram and 6 drives in it. Last week I mixed 2 tunes , one had 40 tracks one had 46 tracks going to to my 48 channels of I/O and outputting tc to my automated console, Smooth as can be. I haven't had the burning desire to go to 10.5 because I heard some complaints on GS, at some point I will after I feel it's a bit more solid. 10.4.7 runs great.On this computer I've done projects with 60 tracks running at 24/96 just fine off my SSD drives.

poshook 22nd June 2020 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by franzalicestern (Post 14812209)
Hello,

I'm really not a big expert about computers, but still, I need to buy a new one able to run Logic Pro X, Ableton 10 and ProTools.

I'm struggling between the new mac mini and the new mac pro, since they pass over 3000€ difference.

The first option would be a mac mini for 3559€:

I7 6 core 3.2 GHz
64GB DDR4 2666MHz
SSD 2TB

The second option would be a mac pro for 7599€:

Xeon 8 core 3.5 GHz
32GB DDR4
SSD 2TB

My question is...is this mac pro worth 7500€? The characteristics are looking worst compared to the mac mini, and if not, just for two cores more, are worth 7599€? Especially when I could get 64GB DDR4 on the mac mini for half of the price of a mac pro?

Thanks in advance for your answers and your help

Best
Francesco

Regarding Mac Mini spec, the last i7 with 6-Cores and 12MBL3 Cache was i7-8700.

So for 3600 Euro you will get following components (current prices):

"two generations old" CPU i7-8700: 300 Euro
Integrated GPU Intel 630: 0 Euro
64GB SO-DIMM DDR4 server memory (unnecessary amount, unnecessary expansive type for this kind of computer, but OK): cca 400 Euro
SSD NVMe 2TB: cca 300 Euro
Good motherboard for this components costs around: 50 Euro

If we exclude the case and power source this setup is worth around 1000 Euro. What is funny that for the price Apple will give you 1 Year of warranty.

Are you sure you pay 3600 Euro for this in 2020?

Monotremata 22nd June 2020 11:59 PM

Well, Apple lowered the prices on the Minis and all the options for them just this morning (the one I bought 2 weeks ago is $100 cheaper today), but the i7 with factory 64GB of RAM and a 2TB SSD is 2369.00 euros. Pretty sure they're not using server memory though, at least in the Mini.. ECC shows as disabled on mine here.

In USD, the price of the i5 got dropped $50 (the i3 only dropped $20) and the i7, RAM and HD upgrades are all $20 cheaper, and the 10Gb ethernet upgrade is $10 cheaper.

biksonije 23rd June 2020 05:35 PM

Have you read around how many people were complaining about latest Logic. Just saying. Maybe your Logic is causing you problems? I really can't say.

Anyway, my moto is if it's working who cares which OS iteration you run or which version of PT, Logic, Cubase or anything actually? If something is not possible to achieve anymore and your livelihood demands that change, then by all means go and upgrade. Both HW and SW, OS, machine, CPUs, RAM...

Anyway, if original fellow poster is still reading this thread my opinion still stands. If this is livelihood and demands best - MacPro tower is THE option to go! Period!

I even didn't read that carefully (can't afford one at the moment) does Apple makes latest MacPro towers as a dual CPU monsters? If so, I'd go with dual CPU option and would choose as fastest clock as wallet allows it. If you need memory choose enough right from the start because this machine is probably going to power your studio setup for next 10 years. At least! Mine is 12 years old and be running 13 soon and if God allows it, who knows how many more years will it run smooth as baby's butt. Don't you just love MacPro machines?! kfhkh

Monotremata 23rd June 2020 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biksonije (Post 14816964)
Have you read around how many people were complaining about latest Logic. Just saying. Maybe your Logic is causing you problems? I really can't say.

Anyway, my moto is if it's working who cares which OS iteration you run or which version of PT, Logic, Cubase or anything actually? If something is not possible to achieve anymore and your livelihood demands that change, then by all means go and upgrade. Both HW and SW, OS, machine, CPUs, RAM...

Anyway, if original fellow poster is still reading this thread my opinion still stands. If this is livelihood and demands best - MacPro tower is THE option to go! Period!

I even didn't read that carefully (can't afford one at the moment) does Apple makes latest MacPro towers as a dual CPU monsters? If so, I'd go with dual CPU option and would choose as fastest clock as wallet allows it. If you need memory choose enough right from the start because this machine is probably going to power your studio setup for next 10 years. At least! Mine is 12 years old and be running 13 soon and if God allows it, who knows how many more years will it run smooth as baby's butt. Don't you just love MacPro machines?! kfhkh

Apple doesn't make dual CPU machines anymore. You don't need dual CPUs when one Xeon W has up to 28 cores in it, and multi-core performance isn't even all that its cracked up to be to begin with.

People complain about something every time a new version of Logic (or Cubase, or DP, or Pro Tools, or MacOS, or Windows, etc) is released.. All I know is on my new Mac mini its running flawlessly, on the old Mac Pro, nah.

biksonije 23rd June 2020 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monotremata (Post 14817017)
Apple doesn't make dual CPU machines anymore. You don't need dual CPUs when one Xeon W has up to 28 cores in it, and multi-core performance isn't even all that its cracked up to be to begin with.

People complain about something every time a new version of Logic (or Cubase, or DP, or Pro Tools, or MacOS, or Windows, etc) is released.. All I know is on my new Mac mini its running flawlessly, on the old Mac Pro, nah.

Right. Thanks for mentioning that. I took a peek on Apple's web page on architecture and machine config. You are correct. Only single CPU options available.

And yes, absolutely correct that people complain on latest versions. And which ones does that? The ones who install the moment something new is out! Nobody of right mind jumps for latest release before reading about issues or problems. Prudent way is to have Admin's rights to choose not to go with every single update as soon as it's out. Anyway, that's how I do it with my setup. I never had situation in my life that I installed something only to discover latest version is buggy. Or laggy. Or not working at it's best (or should I say optimal).

Regarding your setup, I couldn't honestly tell you what's the deal but if your Mini gives you what Tower doesn't - Mini is the way to go!

uOpt 23rd June 2020 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by franzalicestern (Post 14812209)
The first option would be a mac mini for 3559€:

I7 6 core 3.2 GHz
64GB DDR4 2666MHz
SSD 2TB

The second option would be a mac pro for 7599€:

Xeon 8 core 3.5 GHz
32GB DDR4
SSD 2TB

My question is...is this mac pro worth 7500€?

No, the price on the Pro is not reasonable.

However, it has a couple of advantages:
  • Although min and max clock are similar it will hold a lot higher CPU frequency under much more load. This can be +50% or more effective CPU power.
  • It has error-correcting (ECC) RAM, which I like.
  • It uses registered memory and has more memory slots, so it can be expanded to many times more RAM.

uOpt 23rd June 2020 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monotremata (Post 14817017)
Apple doesn't make dual CPU machines anymore. You don't need dual CPUs when one Xeon W has up to 28 cores in it, and multi-core performance isn't even all that its cracked up to be to begin with.

A dual-processor system still has some advantages:
  • Twice as many memory slots.
  • PCIe lanes for I/O are distributed over the 2 CPUs. Each CPU only has half the I/O load of a single-processor Xeon.

Monotremata 23rd June 2020 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biksonije (Post 14817034)
Regarding your setup, I couldn't honestly tell you what's the deal but if your Mini gives you what Tower doesn't - Mini is the way to go!

Yeah so far the only thing the Mini really has over the Pro is that its more stable running Logic haha. Powerwise, these same songs are hitting almost the exact same CPU usage with the i7 that they did with the 6-core Xeon. I do notice the FSB speed though, cause alot of calculations and the OS itself are alot quicker, but overall, the Mac Pro still had the juice to keep up for the most part. I think its just the rest of the system beyond the CPUs that were slowing it down now.

I really love that tower design too, its still got a less than a year old SSD in it with my Mojave install though, and my Win 10 setup in it is on its own dedicated drive so its still going to be in use.. I think now Im just gonna leave it running Win 10 full time, until I need one of my old sample conversion apps and I need to reboot into Mojave! Come November or so whenever Steinberg drops Cubase 11, Ill be cross grading to it from Logic so I can go either Mac or PC in the future.. Im sure the ARM thing will work out just fine, but just in case it doesn't..

biksonije 23rd June 2020 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monotremata (Post 14817128)
Yeah so far the only thing the Mini really has over the Pro is that its more stable running Logic haha. Powerwise, these same songs are hitting almost the exact same CPU usage with the i7 that they did with the 6-core Xeon. I do notice the FSB speed though, cause alot of calculations and the OS itself are alot quicker, but overall, the Mac Pro still had the juice to keep up for the most part. I think its just the rest of the system beyond the CPUs that were slowing it down now.

I really love that tower design too, its still got a less than a year old SSD in it with my Mojave install though, and my Win 10 setup in it is on its own dedicated drive so its still going to be in use.. I think now Im just gonna leave it running Win 10 full time, until I need one of my old sample conversion apps and I need to reboot into Mojave! Come November or so whenever Steinberg drops Cubase 11, Ill be cross grading to it from Logic so I can go either Mac or PC in the future.. Im sure the ARM thing will work out just fine, but just in case it doesn't..

Yeah. But probably the biggest issue regarding new ARM architecture will be waiting. For quite some time on SW and devs catch up. My guess is at least a year. Or even two. It's simply like that. So, if announcing is 2021 and releasing 2022 then another year or two after that takes us to 2023. Or even 2024. So yeah, I get you. But in my case, I'll try to get my hands on one 5.1 fastest dual machine which will give me considerable jump both in computing power and OS level. That will simply get me by for another 5 years. Minimum! Which in my case is fine.

poshook 23rd June 2020 08:41 PM

I purchased Mac Pro 3.1 first 8-Core machine for 4000 Euro in the back of the days (2008). Two years later, all 4-Core and 6-Core Mac and PCs outperformed this machine CPU wise hands down (PCs for a fraction of price). GPU was very basic ATI 1600XT and working in Final Cut was a pain in the ass. 5 years after purchase I sold it for 700 Euro and built 4-Core i7 hackintosh for those money that gave me +50% increase in CPU and 20x GPU performance. Now I have 2 years old i7-7820x build with 32GB RAM, RX570 GPU and 4x 1TB SSD NVMe. Similar setup is easily available for about 1000 Euro today. With 10.14.6 Mojave and Logic Pro X 1.5.1 I get more than 300 tracks in Logic Pro Multicore Benchmarktest !. Try running this test to see how good is your current machine and where you can move with setup for 1k. Apple is not an investment. Investment is the freedom in your creative process no matter how intensive is your project for computing. IF you need to decide from the two and money is not an issue for you, go for Mac Pro as it is +25% faster. Just keep in mind that for 7599 Euro you can easily build 4 fully equipped 18-Core Intel i9 machines

biksonije 23rd June 2020 09:17 PM

You are 100% correct in terms of what you get for money. OP was aksing between Mac Mini and Mac Tower.

I am completely in agreement with you on computing power for ridiculously lower price comparing to Apple.

But if you ask me personally I'd go for Apple every single time. But that's my personal opinion.

poshook 23rd June 2020 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biksonije (Post 14817439)
You are 100% correct in terms of what you get for money. OP was aksing between Mac Mini and Mac Tower.

I am completely in agreement with you on computing power for ridiculously lower price comparing to Apple.

But if you ask me personally I'd go for Apple every single time. But that's my personal opinion.

Understand. If you ask me personally I'd go for OSX over Windows every single time and this is the reason why did not come back to Windows. But after my Apple hw experience I am not sold anymore.

Another reason against purchase is upcoming ARM hw. Apple is willing to sell several times overpriced outdated technology 9 months before ARM desktops release. And this is slap in the face in my opinion

biksonije 23rd June 2020 11:29 PM

Yes, they tend to do that every 10 years. But overall, Apple is professional hardware. PC (self constructed so-called work stations) are joke in most of the cases. Not going to start with drivers and components poor compatibility. And don't want to even start with Win as operating system.

I chose Apple more than 25 years ago and never looked back. Yes they were expensive. Always were! But that's the price of quality. Apple workstations were always thought of and designed for narrower niche than Windows user base. I am an Apple person because those systems simply work. Period. Pro machines and pro systems for pro usage.

And yes, Apple and some of their moves are quite bad. To be the least of terms I have in mind.

blayz2002 24th June 2020 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poshook (Post 14817587)
Understand. If you ask me personally I'd go for OSX over Windows every single time and this is the reason why did not come back to Windows. But after my Apple hw experience I am not sold anymore.

Another reason against purchase is upcoming ARM hw. Apple is willing to sell several times overpriced outdated technology 9 months before ARM desktops release. And this is slap in the face in my opinion

Before you get too emotional. Do you really think there is going to be an Arm based Mac Pro in 9 months? And a Mac Pro you buy today is going to stop working in 9 months? They going to have take baby steps into this change.

I guarantee you that Intel based Mac Pro users will be on Gearslutz posting about how they are still using 2019-20 Mac Pro’s in 10 years time.

Change hey, you’re dammed if you do and dammed if you don’t.