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-   -   Neve vs SSL (https://www.gearslutz.com/board/high-end/1290550-neve-vs-ssl.html)

Youcef 7th December 2019 11:33 AM

Neve vs SSL
 
Hi everyone,
I'm at the point where I have to go on a large analog console.
I am lucky to have a budget of 50000 euros, but I have a hard time deciding between a 4000g SSL and a Neve VR.
I have some experience on SSL but my experience with the Neve is very limited so I have a lot of questions about it:
1 \ First, is it a split or an in-line
For example if I have 48 tracks coming out of Pro Tools how many tracks will they occupy on the console.
2 \ For rooting I know that SSL has a better matrix but I think that the Neve sounds better even if it is far from an old 80 series, so what is more important.
3 \ Finally I know that there is a very good replacement of the automation of the 4000g, the THD Labs for those who might be interested, which allows you to control the console through the DAW. Is there an equivalent on for VR.
Thank you in advance for those who will take the time to answer.
PS: Sorry for mistakes or wrongful uses of words I don't speak english very well.

elegentdrum 7th December 2019 11:41 AM

Track on the Neve, mix on the SSL. What are you going to use it for more?

It really comes down to how you like your EQ to work. Do you like the EQ emulations of a Neve or SSL?

Youcef 7th December 2019 12:17 PM

I'm gonna to use it more for mixing, and I love the sond of ssl EQs.
The only one problem is that I'm not a fan of SSL Pres

Ol' Betsey 7th December 2019 01:29 PM

Question:
Quote:

Originally Posted by elegentdrum (Post 14369079)
Track on the Neve, mix on the SSL. What are you going to use it for more?
Do you like the EQ emulations of a Neve or SSL?

Answer:
Quote:

Originally Posted by Youcef (Post 14369115)
I'm gonna to use it more for mixing, and I love the sond of ssl EQs.

Done!

R.

cheu78 7th December 2019 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Youcef (Post 14369115)
I'm gonna to use it more for mixing, and I love the sond of ssl EQs.
The only one problem is that I'm not a fan of SSL Pres

Unless you really want to have an SSL room, for client needs..
I'd seriously consider a Daking MK2 instead.. Great pres, great eq's compressor on every channel, incredible routing, clever monitoring options and functions..
It's designed to be serviced with ease, and only this is already worth ditching the other 2 options imho..

There are several videos and some posts here on GS.. Check it out..

howdy

Cheu

Youcef 7th December 2019 03:50 PM

Honestly, never heared about this desk.
It's like a reproduction of the API 2448.
And for the automation... how does it works ?

EvilRoy 7th December 2019 04:15 PM

I was considering a VR but read bad things about it. It runs really hot and needs constant service. I went with a D&R. It’s like a poor man’s SSL except the automation speaks midi, no need to be strapped to an ancient computer. The downside is no EQ recall. D&R are based in the Netherlands so they should be more common in Europe than the US, but that’s just a guess.

Youcef 7th December 2019 04:47 PM

Are the EQs as good as an old SSL 4000 ?
I would say no but I think the price isn't the same at all.
As you can see through my English null, I'm not American but Belgian so it's great they are based in Netherlands.

cheu78 7th December 2019 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Youcef (Post 14369408)
Honestly, never heared about this desk.
It's like a reproduction of the API 2448.
And for the automation... how does it works ?

Time to discover something new for you :)
Daking is a well established brand..

It's not a "reproduction" of an api, it took the lineage from the Trident A range, as far as I know (at least from a preamp/eq perspective..)
I believe the compressors and routing are entirely Daking made, design wise speaking.

Do a search here on GS, here's GS member Skip Burrows writing a review:
The DAKING MKII Review: By Skip Burrows

Here's their website, if you scroll down you find a lot of youtube videos where they explain everything in details:
http://www.daking.com/daking-console/

I'm not related with this company, but it's probably where I'd put my money if I had that kind of $$ and mixing (and/or tracking) needs.
This is very cleverly designed and a lot of the old daking vertical modules are praised more than the neve counterpart by a lot of talented and successful engineers fwiw.

I hope this helps,

howdy

Cheu

grouphome 7th December 2019 08:51 PM

I saw those new PSU's for 4000 series consoles. Looking promising.
Also new computer options.

I'd say get a 4k and get some neve channels to track through

Youcef 7th December 2019 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheu78 (Post 14369910)
Time to discover something new for you :)
Daking is a well established brand..

It's not a "reproduction" of an api, it took the lineage from the Trident A range, as far as I know (at least from a preamp/eq perspective..)
I believe the compressors and routing are entirely Daking made, design wise speaking.

Do a search here on GS, here's GS member Skip Burrows writing a review:
The DAKING MKII Review: By Skip Burrows

Here's their website, if you scroll down you find a lot of youtube videos where they explain everything in details:
http://www.daking.com/daking-console/

I'm not related with this company, but it's probably where I'd put my money if I had that kind of $$ and mixing (and/or tracking) needs.
This is very cleverly designed and a lot of the old daking vertical modules are praised more than the neve counterpart by a lot of talented and successful engineers fwiw.

I hope this helps,

howdy

Cheu

I visited Daking's website, so the console is great :) but if it's at a similar price I do prefeare an old SSL 4000g with automation and PSU replacement and some Neve channels strips.
In any case thank you for your contribution.

Youcef 7th December 2019 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grouphome (Post 14369942)
I saw those new PSU's for 4000 series consoles. Looking promising.
Also new computer options.

I'd say get a 4k and get some neve channels to track through

Certainely the best thing to do.
Thanx.

j.frad 7th December 2019 11:24 PM

Getting a used VR at this point doesn't seem like a good idea unless it was fully reswitched and recapped by a competent team.

Running costs are very high.

An ssl might be easier to maintain.

Digiplex 7th December 2019 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by j.frad (Post 14370181)
Getting a used VR at this point doesn't seem like a good idea unless it was fully reswitched and recapped by a competent team.

Running costs are very high.

An ssl might be easier to maintain.

I second that! I’d love to have a Vr but the power bill alone would be extremely high and the cost to have it recapped. The Ssl wouldn’t be cheaper either unless you added an atomic power supply and a new computer.

If I had a 50k budget I’d be looking at a used Aws or maybe the Trident 88. The Daking would be about 100k for a 24 channel version last time I looked. So it’s not within your budget. Even the 16 channel one is 79k.

Skamm Goodiez 8th December 2019 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digiplex (Post 14370190)
If I had a 50k budget I’d be looking at a used Aws

this.

dlmorley 8th December 2019 09:16 AM

If you want classic, I'd go 4000G. Logic tells me a used AWS948 would be a good choice though if you don't mind modern.

Liquidaudio 8th December 2019 09:29 AM

Belgian here (Anvers) I bought my 4000G from AES Pro Audio in the UK, They make cut down versions. I have a 16 channel without automation, planning to expand with more buckets, so I have a modular SSL as my budget grows over the years. Wish I could blow 50000 euros myself in one go!

If you want a Neve VR well that's their other speciality, they make 36 channel versions. Seems enough for me. They recap em clean em up, make them like new.

My SSL is like it's factory fresh, well at least on the inside, but I like a little wear.\

The SSL will give punch like nothing else, if you want the butter you get some Neve pres. It's the classic combo.

Youcef 8th December 2019 10:17 AM

I found a 48 channel SSL 4000G selled with automation and PSU replacement under 50k, it's in great cosmetic condition and just need to fix some issiues on the ultimation faders

Youcef 8th December 2019 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlmorley (Post 14370832)
If you want classic, I'd go 4000G. Logic tells me a used AWS948 would be a good choice though if you don't mind modern.

SSL AWS 948 is a great value and has a very good daw integration, but I need more than 24 channels in-line. I can considere it for a smaller room.

Youcef 8th December 2019 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digiplex (Post 14370190)
I second that! I’d love to have a Vr but the power bill alone would be extremely high and the cost to have it recapped. The Ssl wouldn’t be cheaper either unless you added an atomic power supply and a new computer.

If I had a 50k budget I’d be looking at a used Aws or maybe the Trident 88. The Daking would be about 100k for a 24 channel version last time I looked. So it’s not within your budget. Even the 16 channel one is 79k.

100k for 24 channel version!!! :lol:

Liquidaudio 8th December 2019 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Youcef (Post 14370897)
Bonjour, tu sais pas comme c'est bon d'enfin pouvoir parler français sur ce site, sinon tu sais ou on peut trouver de bons préamlis Neve d'époque. Et on plus je me rends compte que j'ai poser la question alors que je pouvais déjà y répondre. La ssl consome moins, a une meilleure automation de très bons EQs, et la maintenance est plus facile.

Oui bien mais je suis Flamand, ma Francais es terrible! :lol:

If you want to find vintage Neve preamps, which to me sounds like a crazy idea because they make spot on remakes these days, I would check Vintage King or Funky Junk France perhaps.

Aurora Audio makes awesome 1073 clones, like racked preamps per 8 or EQ as a set of 8. You can mix and match. A lot cheaper than vintage Neve, maybe you can find some old Calrec preamps, they go for a lot less and sound fantastic, they hold their own against neve preamps.

Yes maintenance is easy on the SSL. I know a good technician here in Antwerp.

Youcef 8th December 2019 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liquidaudio (Post 14370923)
Oui bien mais je suis Flamand, ma Francais es terrible! :lol:

If you want to find vintage Neve preamps, which to me sounds like a crazy idea because they make spot on remakes these days, I would check Vintage King or Funky Junk France perhaps.

Aurora Audio makes awesome 1073 clones, like racked preamps per 8 or EQ as a set of 8. You can mix and match. A lot cheaper than vintage Neve, maybe you can find some old Calrec preamps, they go for a lot less and sound fantastic, they hold their own against neve preamps.

Yes maintenance is easy on the SSL. I know a good technician here in Antwerp.

Pas grave l'ami je parle mal néerlandais aussi.
For the neve pres there is also the bae reeditions wich are great and cheeper than the aurora audio,even I think the sound quality isn't the same at all. Anyway it still far from these good vintage 1073. I'll go for an aurora reedition with one or two vintage one.

dlmorley 8th December 2019 03:13 PM

The API is basically twice the price however.

subspace 8th December 2019 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elegentdrum (Post 14369079)
Track on the Neve, mix on the SSL. What are you going to use it for more?

Or as it pertains to the OP: Track on the Neve 80 series, mix on the SSL E/G series, fry eggs on the Neve VR.

elamberth 8th December 2019 03:32 PM

For $50K, with over 24 in line channels, you are looking at the Trident 88 or Audient new. Otherwise it’s used, where the techs available, power & operating costs & how tolerable you are for reliability/ down time come into play. But I think you know that, hence the original question about the older SSL vs Neve. There are good deals on a used AWS (in your price range) if pairing with an x-desk would give you enough inputs (64) and the limitations of a sidecar with a few auxes makes sense for your workflow/ needs.

Liquidaudio 8th December 2019 03:43 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Best bang for the buck would still be a Trident 80B miles better sounding than any SSL, but hey I wanna mix music not record, add outboard like extra spices.

Even the look of this thing kicks butt with all that wood.

Yes consoles are like classic cars to me.

Here's my humble abode:

Youcef 8th December 2019 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlmorley (Post 14371192)
The API is basically twice the price however.

I need at least 48 channels, so an api legacy axs... 270k :facepalm:
It's 200k over my budget.

Youcef 8th December 2019 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by subspace (Post 14371199)
Or as it pertains to the OP: Track on the Neve 80 series, mix on the SSL E/G series, fry eggs on the Neve VR.

The VR cook it self :lol:

Youcef 8th December 2019 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liquidaudio (Post 14371229)
Best bang for the buck would still be a Trident 80B miles better sounding than any SSL, but hey I wanna mix music not record, add outboard like extra spices.

Even the look of this thing kicks butt with all that wood.

Yes consoles are like classic cars to me.

Here's my humble abode:

Very nice setup.
Record on an old Trident 70 series, mix on an SSL 4000.

Youcef 8th December 2019 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elamberth (Post 14371220)
For $50K, with over 24 in line channels, you are looking at the Trident 88 or Audient new. Otherwise it’s used, where the techs available, power & operating costs & how tolerable you are for reliability/ down time come into play. But I think you know that, hence the original question about the older SSL vs Neve. There are good deals on a used AWS (in your price range) if pairing with an x-desk would give you enough inputs (64) and the limitations of a sidecar with a few auxes makes sense for your workflow/ needs.

The Trident 88 sounds very good but there is no automation.
For the duo: ssl aws with x-desk is great combo, however I'll go with a Matrix with x-rack.