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HELP: DX7 disconnects from Studio One
Old 7th August 2019
  #1
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HELP: DX7 disconnects from Studio One

I’m composing midi in Studio One 4 Artist with my Arturia Essentials 49 controller. I have my mk1 DX7 set up as an instrument. Everything works great, but every time I stop playback on the DAW I have to reconnect my DX7 in the options window. This is unacceptable for any kind of workflow.

The DX7 is properly connected to the midi in/out of my Presonus 22VSL and communicates brilliantly as long as I don’t edit a note or stop playback.

Any ideas?
Old 7th August 2019
  #2
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*gif of Ferris Beuller’s teacher saying anyone anyone anyone
Old 7th August 2019
  #3
kdm
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I can't answer for Ferris (today is his day off), but if you have a External device created for the DX, and a midi send and receive assigned to it, try separating the midi send into a separate Instrument (name it anything) and assign it to the same midi port.

Leave the receive the same (you don't really need it if you are only using the Keylab keyboard, and the DX7 as a sound source).

Studio One treats "Instruments" as sound sources, and Keyboards and Midi Controllers as midi inputs to Studio One. I have a D50 that I created a Keyboard External device to use the keyboard as a midi controller, but had to create a separate "Instrument" to send back to it from any other midi keyboard (including the D50 keyboard, when "Local" is turned off).

When thinking of midi controllers and sound sources as separate devices, even if a single keyboard functions as both, it makes it easier to work with external controllers and internal synths in much the same way.
Old 8th August 2019
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdm View Post
I can't answer for Ferris (today is his day off), but if you have a External device created for the DX, and a midi send and receive assigned to it, try separating the midi send into a separate Instrument (name it anything) and assign it to the same midi port.

Leave the receive the same (you don't really need it if you are only using the Keylab keyboard, and the DX7 as a sound source).

Studio One treats "Instruments" as sound sources, and Keyboards and Midi Controllers as midi inputs to Studio One. I have a D50 that I created a Keyboard External device to use the keyboard as a midi controller, but had to create a separate "Instrument" to send back to it from any other midi keyboard (including the D50 keyboard, when "Local" is turned off).

When thinking of midi controllers and sound sources as separate devices, even if a single keyboard functions as both, it makes it easier to work with external controllers and internal synths in much the same way.
Wow! I will certainly try this. Danke schoen!
Old 8th August 2019
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdm View Post
I can't answer for Ferris (today is his day off), but if you have a External device created for the DX, and a midi send and receive assigned to it, try separating the midi send into a separate Instrument (name it anything) and assign it to the same midi port.

Leave the receive the same (you don't really need it if you are only using the Keylab keyboard, and the DX7 as a sound source).

Studio One treats "Instruments" as sound sources, and Keyboards and Midi Controllers as midi inputs to Studio One. I have a D50 that I created a Keyboard External device to use the keyboard as a midi controller, but had to create a separate "Instrument" to send back to it from any other midi keyboard (including the D50 keyboard, when "Local" is turned off).

When thinking of midi controllers and sound sources as separate devices, even if a single keyboard functions as both, it makes it easier to work with external controllers and internal synths in much the same way.

@ kdm do I have one number right? https://app.box.com/s/dk8920oi9865xu62gribffv7rbeeg82w

I have the same problem(s) with this configuration.
Old 8th August 2019
  #6
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Quetz's Avatar
Is the keylab a synth?
If not, set it as your default midi input and leave the 'send to' blank.
For the DX leave 'receive from' blank and leave send to as the midi port it's on.
Create an instrument track with input as keylab (should be automatic when you set it as default input) and output as your DX instrument.
Create an audio channel in the console with its inputs set to the analogue ins the DX is wired to.
Click the monitor button on the midi track and you should be good to go.
Old 8th August 2019
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quetz View Post
Is the keylab a synth?
If not, set it as your default midi input and leave the 'send to' blank.
For the DX leave 'receive from' blank and leave send to as the midi port it's on.
Create an instrument track with input as keylab (should be automatic when you set it as default input) and output as your DX instrument.
Create an audio channel in the console with its inputs set to the analogue ins the DX is wired to.
Click the monitor button on the midi track and you should be good to go.
Thanks!! I will try it and let you know.
Old 8th August 2019
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quetz View Post
Is the keylab a synth?
If not, set it as your default midi input and leave the 'send to' blank.
For the DX leave 'receive from' blank and leave send to as the midi port it's on.
Create an instrument track with input as keylab (should be automatic when you set it as default input) and output as your DX instrument.
Create an audio channel in the console with its inputs set to the analogue ins the DX is wired to.
Click the monitor button on the midi track and you should be good to go.
Okay. Same result: everything works fine until I stop playback or edit a note on the piano roll in Studio One.

I may be misinterpreting your instructions. By “port” do you mean the physical ports on my DX and Presonus (22VSL only has one midi in/out)? Those are all hooked up correctly (out to in, in to out), or do you mean the channels in Studio One options. Should those be on “all” or select a same single channel on Keylab controller, Studio One, and DX (all set to one)? I’m only running one external instrument at a time.

I appreciate your help, and I will gladly PayPal you for your time.
Old 8th August 2019
  #9
kdm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dadrian View Post
@ kdm do I have one number right? https://app.box.com/s/dk8920oi9865xu62gribffv7rbeeg82w

I have the same problem(s) with this configuration.
That should work, but you could also try removing the "send to" for the Keylab keyboard in S1's External Device setup, just to test the DX7 problem.

I really don't think that is the problem as that is a separate midi device (USB) from your Audiobox, and I'm sure if you are running Arturia synths, you want the Keylab to send and receive.

The only other potential problem to consider is the DX7's midi messages. Being one of the first generation of midi devices, it may be sending a midi message back to Studio One that it doesn't expect and causes S1 to disconnect; or S1 may be sending a message the DX7 doesn't respond to, or doesn't respond as S1 expects.

Do you have "Send MIDI clock", "Use MIDI clock start" and "Send MIDI Timecode" checked? If so, uncheck all three - you should rule out any other midi messages that might be sent to the DX7.

If none of this works, you should contact Presonus support. I assume the Audiobox is the Presonus interface. It may be an issue with that devices' midi ports with S1 (i.e. a unique Presonus "feature" with their interfaces that is problematic here).
Old 8th August 2019
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdm View Post
That should work, but you could also try removing the "send to" for the Keylab keyboard in S1's External Device setup, just to test the DX7 problem.

I really don't think that is the problem as that is a separate midi device (USB) from your Audiobox, and I'm sure if you are running Arturia synths, you want the Keylab to send and receive.

The only other potential problem to consider is the DX7's midi messages. Being one of the first generation of midi devices, it may be sending a midi message back to Studio One that it doesn't expect and causes S1 to disconnect; or S1 may be sending a message the DX7 doesn't respond to, or doesn't respond as S1 expects.

Do you have "Send MIDI clock", "Use MIDI clock start" and "Send MIDI Timecode" checked? If so, uncheck all three - you should rule out any other midi messages that might be sent to the DX7.

If none of this works, you should contact Presonus support. I assume the Audiobox is the Presonus interface. It may be an issue with that devices' midi ports with S1 (i.e. a unique Presonus "feature" with their interfaces that is problematic here).
I think what baffles me the most is that the drop out wasn’t happening initially. I was in DXHeaven!

My other synths (newer) don’t do this, so I think you may be right about the DX7’s prehistoric midi implementation.

I will contact Presonus and see if they have any ideas.

Thanks, and let me know any time if you have any other suggestions.
Old 8th August 2019
  #11
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@ kdm also, none of the boxes you mentioned are checked.
Old 8th August 2019
  #12
kdm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dadrian View Post
I think what baffles me the most is that the drop out wasn’t happening initially. I was in DXHeaven!

My other synths (newer) don’t do this, so I think you may be right about the DX7’s prehistoric midi implementation.

I will contact Presonus and see if they have any ideas.

Thanks, and let me know any time if you have any other suggestions.
Now that I think about it, since the DX7 is only receiving, it must be a DIN cable signal issue between the DX and Audiobox. My guess is the DX is dropping a signal in the DIN cable back the Audiobox as a response to a "stop" message being sent by Studio One. Since there isn't a way to change the DX's signal patterns, perhaps Presonus knows of a way to stop whatever message S1 is sending (that may not be possible either, but worth asking).

It may be that this momentary signal back to the Audiobox causes it to send a "disconnect" message to S1. The only way to know for sure would be to put a signal meter on the midi cable (I'm not sure there is anything designed for this outside of hacking a cable and putting a logic scope/oscilloscope on it); and run an app like MidiOx to view midi messages between S1 and the midi port.
Old 8th August 2019
  #13
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Quetz's Avatar
If you're not using the physical keyboard on the DX7 unplug the cable going from DX out to audiobox in, you don't need it and it may be causing problems.

You don't need to pay anyone for their time ;-)
If people can't/don't want to help, they'll just not answer
Old 8th August 2019
  #14
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Thanks again @ kdm and @ Quetz

I will keep trying and let you know.
Old 8th August 2019
  #15
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Okay @ kdm @ Quetz @ HBSU -

Here are some new clues I’m working with:

1. If the single midi track is pretty much note on/off only, no disconnect when I stop playback.

2. If the midi track has some pitch bends, it definitely disconnects on stop command, but will play all day when I return to any set point (without stopping playback).

3. Clicking on any note in the piano roll “plucks” the note with a long release, and disconnects the DX7 UNLESS I have the “audition note” box unchecked.

It seems that the DX7 hates any command stronger than note on/off from either my 22VSL, Studio One, or both.

Oh, and I tried disconnecting the midi from the DX out and the 22VSL in. Didn’t change anything.

Any new suggestions with that info?
Old 8th August 2019
  #16
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skythemusic's Avatar
I'm having the same issue using my DX7 as a controller especially for Kontakt in Studio One. I'm using an Elyseum usb 3 U3-88c and it loses connectivity regularly.
Old 8th August 2019
  #17
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John Fast at Midi Solutions If I could figure out what info from Studio One is causing the interruption, they have a product that could filter it.

I have the issue posted in the Presonus forum. Does anyone know if Presonus support people read those questions, too, or is that just a user forum?
Old 8th August 2019
  #18
kdm
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It is mainly just a user forum. I think the moderators are end users, but Presonus may post from time to time. Submit a support ticket and see what they say. They might blame it on the DX7, but if they could at least tell you what message Studio One sends, that might help.

I would be interested to know if this happens with Cubase as well.
Old 9th August 2019
  #19
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Quetz's Avatar
Open up the midi monitor while you play around, it'll log in real time every message that's sent and received.
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