The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
dialnorm,qc,and loud fx
Old 2nd September 2011
  #1
Gear Nut
 

dialnorm,qc,and loud fx

Hi there. I'm on a feature doc right now that has a lot of scenes with background yelling and crashing. If I make the scenes as dramatic as I want, my dialnorm measurement goes way loud because of the frequency content of my fx. If I was only sending a dialog stem to the lm-100, my numbers would be to spec. When it sees the whole mix, I have to suck the life out of these scenes to not go over. Should I be sending, say, just the center channel or dialog stem to the lm100 and not worrying how the fx are piling up, or will qc fail because they'll be looking at the full stereo or ltrt? I think I know the answer, but I'd like to hear some thoughts about this. Thanks.
Old 2nd September 2011
  #2
Gear Guru
 
charles maynes's Avatar
 

I would say it is the full package that you are delivering- it all has to work dramatically and to the spec.
Old 2nd September 2011
  #3
Lives for gear
 

Yelling IS dialog....sorry. Yes, it's a drag.

phil p
Old 2nd September 2011
  #4
Lives for gear
 

Welcome to the music business Circa 1983. The start of Dynamics? What's That?
Old 3rd September 2011
  #5
Gear Nut
 

Not sure what Rick is suggesting, but thanks for the comments. The director heard my first pass which was loud and loved it. When I dialed it back to conform, he wondered where all the drama went. Got me thinking if I could get away with it somehow, but I'm sure you're right that it would fail a qc process for broadcast.
Old 3rd September 2011
  #6
this one of the reasons why features have different mixes for:

1. Theater
2. Broadcast
3. DVD / Blue-ray
4. Airlines

we have to teach our clients about the right and wrong way to do projects... inevitably sound suffers because they already over spent every where else, and most directors still think PICTURE PICTURE PICTURE... .... oh yeah..sound...

cheers
geo
Old 3rd September 2011
  #7
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by georgia View Post
this one of the reasons why features have different mixes for:

1. Theater
2. Broadcast
3. DVD / Blue-ray
4. Airlines

we have to teach our clients about the right and wrong way to do projects... inevitably sound suffers because they already over spent every where else, and most directors still think PICTURE PICTURE PICTURE... .... oh yeah..sound...

cheers
geo
What would you do differently for DVD vs. theater/festival?

Are you finding that clients will go for doing 2 or 3 or 4 mixes, or have you figured out a way to make that happen as you go? (I'm hoping you have done this and might tell me how you do it!)

phil p
Old 3rd September 2011
  #8
Gear Nut
 

I second phil's question. Wouldn't a mix for dvd done at -27 dbfs dialnorm with say peaks at -5dbfs be appropriate for theater?
Old 4th September 2011
  #9
sure, you can do one mix fit all... I do it all the time.... but that's exactly what it is... one mix made to work everywhere.
I much prefer to do a theater mix, then to some tweaking for broadcast, and DVD. And yes, I do multiple mixes when I deliver feature film mixes. Theater mixes allow for more dynamics than Broadcast and DVD... Remember, theaters are designed ( well most anyway ) to be tuned to the same spec as a dub stage.. so mix in, nix out... but at home listening to the same mix, you can end up with the kids yelling/crying, the dog barking, the traffic outside all getting in the way of a wonderfully dynamic mix that worked like a dream in the theater. Or, you can decrease the dynamic range, make sure all the dialogue is limited to a tighter dynamic and specific level, while raising the whispers and lowering the yelling all to fit in a -27 dialogue norm world... Also most movies at home are heard in stereo at best, so I also look to assure the LtRt or LoRo mixes are given a little tweak here and there to make sure it plays well in 5.1 and in 2 track versions.

Sure, do one mix and it will probably work for everything... It's not my preference and it's not what I want to do . I prefer to do slightly different mixes, delivering a high level of quality for my clients knowing that listening environments vary from theater, to home, (both off a DVD and off "the air"), ... It doesn't require much more work, and everyone is much happier...

cheers
geo
Old 4th September 2011
  #10
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by georgia View Post
sure, you can do one mix fit all... I do it all the time.... but that's exactly what it is... one mix made to work everywhere.
I much prefer to do a theater mix, then to some tweaking for broadcast, and DVD. And yes, I do multiple mixes when I deliver feature film mixes. Theater mixes allow for more dynamics than Broadcast and DVD... Remember, theaters are designed ( well most anyway ) to be tuned to the same spec as a dub stage.. so mix in, nix out... but at home listening to the same mix, you can end up with the kids yelling/crying, the dog barking, the traffic outside all getting in the way of a wonderfully dynamic mix that worked like a dream in the theater. Or, you can decrease the dynamic range, make sure all the dialogue is limited to a tighter dynamic and specific level, while raising the whispers and lowering the yelling all to fit in a -27 dialogue norm world... Also most movies at home are heard in stereo at best, so I also look to assure the LtRt or LoRo mixes are given a little tweak here and there to make sure it plays well in 5.1 and in 2 track versions.

Sure, do one mix and it will probably work for everything... It's not my preference and it's not what I want to do . I prefer to do slightly different mixes, delivering a high level of quality for my clients knowing that listening environments vary from theater, to home, (both off a DVD and off "the air"), ... It doesn't require much more work, and everyone is much happier...

cheers
geo
Thanks-- I too would like to be able to do diff mixes for the various purposes, but it doesn't get to happen very often (that anyone will pay for).
I was honestly hoping you had a method for outputting a DVD and a b'cast mix at the same time, I guess a form of this could be done with a really elaborate mixer template...this bears some thought....

phil p
Old 7th September 2011
  #11
Lives for gear
 
Jfriah's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by philper View Post
multiple mixes...but it doesn't get to happen very often (that anyone will pay for).
Old 8th September 2011
  #12
Gear Addict
 
adogg4629's Avatar
 

Dif. mixes

In all honesty, I think that while a lot of this can be explained to clients as "mastering" for TV, DVD, theater...etc... most will only care up to the point at which they have to take out a wallet.
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump