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Dialogue Editing Question
Old 9th November 2009
  #1
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Dialogue Editing Question

Hi guys.

Is there a way to edit a Production Audio file and then have that change made to all subsequent audio files (regions) that are rooted from it in Pro Tools?

Example: Sc001B is the Production file. I do some eq to it. Now I want to have that change made to Sc001B_1, Sc001B_2, Sc001B_3 and so on.

Currently, I'm just making presets for each scene and camera. This is working well, just slower than I'd like. I know the pencil tool does / did this, so I'm hoping there are other methods that will produce the same effect. I just need to save some time.

thanks a lot
Old 9th November 2009
  #2
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TVPostSound's Avatar
Snapshot automation.
Old 9th November 2009
  #3
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minister's Avatar
pg 732 of the PT 7.x manual. And learn the key commands.

Also Saving Presets.

But this not something I have a DX editor do, this is mixing.
Old 9th November 2009
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minister View Post
pg 732 of the PT 7.x manual. And learn the key commands.

Also Saving Presets.

But this not something I have a DX editor do, this is mixing.
What is the section you're referencing here. I don't have my version 7 ref. guide. I'm rocking the PT8 ref. guide now.

What I'm doing is literal Dialogue Editing. The EQ I'm talking about is very corrective. Taking out camera and generator hum, mic phase because of slap back. That sort of thing.

Any perspective or matching type EQ I'm leaving for mix.
Old 9th November 2009
  #5
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Big Andy - what do you mean by "all subsequent audio files (regions) that are rooted from it in Pro Tools"?

Overall I suspect it's your workflow that needs adjustment.

I would suggest this: Divide your dialogue tracks up so each track represents a different noise reduction or corrective EQ. Put ALL of your production audio into these tracks. It should already be organized by source (camera or mic). I tend to hear common problems in a lot of the audio - the same hum, or the same broadband noise - usually I have just 6 or so tracks for a full length.

Once I am satisfied I've used the takes I prefer and the dialog is clear - I do whatever additional editing or plug-ins I need, then just print the tracks out.

This is the best workflow for you to use. You can't apply a plug-in setting to audio files in your regions list, they must be in your edit window. Therefore, the best way - short of audiosuiting each file individually - is to divide by track/NR and work from there.

I find this works very well. And it doesn't take THAT much time - if you've only got the proper takes to work with, it should be more than 8 hours!
Old 9th November 2009
  #6
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thanks for the suggestions DynaForte. My work flow is almost exactly the same as you stated above. I'm not stating that my work flow is slow or that there is anything wrong with it. I'm not asking for workflow suggestions, just is there a way to do this. I'll elaborate on this after I get some rest. It is a little confusing I admit.

Think Avid vs Final Cut and how they deal with media. That'll set you on the right path for now.

Thanks
Old 9th November 2009
  #7
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TVPostSound's Avatar
Quote:
What I'm doing is literal Dialogue Editing.
Then Eq, and denoise is NOT part of your workflow. That is done by the mixer.
Old 9th November 2009
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Andy View Post
....Think Avid vs Final Cut and how they deal with media. That'll set you on the right path for now.

Thanks
As others have noted here, Pro Tools doesn't do "embedded" nondestructive clip-based processing in regions and the sub-regions that are derived from it.

All processing is done in the timeline, and however it's written (real-time or snapshot), ultimately it's all dynamic automation. So you can't EQ one region and tell Pro Tools "now apply this to every region within the session that's sourced from that same soundfile." So, many people have settled on the option of creating separate tracks for each source and processing the track in one snapshot pass. Or, creating a set of presets and dropping snapshots in as needed. But that gets tedious.

It is kind of a bummer. Avid WAS thinking of this stuff back in the day with their AudioVision app. Then they bought Digi, and Digi snuffed it. And now, "Digidesign is Avid."
Old 9th November 2009
  #9
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minister's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Andy View Post
What is the section you're referencing here. I don't have my version 7 ref. guide. I'm rocking the PT8 ref. guide now.

What I'm doing is literal Dialogue Editing. The EQ I'm talking about is very corrective. Taking out camera and generator hum, mic phase because of slap back. That sort of thing.

Any perspective or matching type EQ I'm leaving for mix.
Snapshot Automation. Your PDF is searchable.

Literal Dialogue Editing in my experience has never included EQ or nois reduction. Have you discussed this with your mixer?
Old 9th November 2009
  #10
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dr.sound's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by minister View Post
Literal Dialogue Editing in my experience has never included EQ or noise reduction. Have you discussed this with your mixer?
Minister,
I believe that Andy is BOTH the Dialog Editor and Mixer.
Otherwise I agree, leave it to the Mixer in a calibrated room to
do what he/she is paid for.
Old 9th November 2009
  #11
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cubivore's Avatar
 

is the OP talking about automation or audiosuite? i'm so confused by this thread! i know he mentioned pencil tool, so i guess it's about automation, but if it's audiosuiting something that's another case entirely.

if it's about audiosuite, then there IS a way to apply EQ to all subclips. just set the plugin to OVERWRITE and it will apply to all subclips. i've done this many times where i've edited a buttload of audio, only to find out the mixer wants to add some dc removal or HPF. i can do this without upsetting my timeline or having to zoom in to every region in a multi-hundred minute project.
Old 9th November 2009
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TVPostSound View Post
Then Eq, and denoise is NOT part of your workflow. That is done by the mixer.
Hey now---don't be scaring the guy.
It depends where you work; what the normal job description/workflow is, and...what you are being paid for.

I've been in two vastly different workflow areas where DIA editor does nothing but cut and make the volume relatively equal; compared to DIA editor doing EQ, noise reduction, ALTs, and pre-mixing.

But ANDY--my question is: are you talking different TAKES or are you talking different sides/files of a multi-channel recording?

Aside: if your regions are the same length, and you're doing stuff in the tracks as plug-in automation, you can open the same plug in Audiosuite, copy the automation and paste to Audiosuite and hard-process the files. (unless, of course, your automation is changing within the region length)

-Jeff
Old 9th November 2009
  #13
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gsilbers's Avatar
 

i agree that the op shouldnt do EQ nor any fx but also as stated above , depends on the gig.

if the file you are referring to that came from production you can audio suite it and then edit that audio file. just keep a clean copy one just in case.
if its already edited, then too bad.

if the file has to be EQ in some areas but not in others then no, youd have to do it each region individually. or as stated above, just edit everything and whenever you find the offensive region just put it in its own track.
Old 9th November 2009
  #14
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minister's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr.sound View Post
Minister,
I believe that Andy is BOTH the Dialog Editor and Mixer.
Well why didn't ya say so?! That's a horse of a different collah!
Attached Thumbnails
Dialogue Editing Question-horse-differnt.jpg  
Old 10th November 2009
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jfriah View Post
Hey now---don't be scaring the guy.
It depends where you work; what the normal job description/workflow is, and...what you are being paid for.

I've been in two vastly different workflow areas where DIA editor does nothing but cut and make the volume relatively equal; compared to DIA editor doing EQ, noise reduction, ALTs, and pre-mixing.

But ANDY--my question is: are you talking different TAKES or are you talking different sides/files of a multi-channel recording?

Aside: if your regions are the same length, and you're doing stuff in the tracks as plug-in automation, you can open the same plug in Audiosuite, copy the automation and paste to Audiosuite and hard-process the files. (unless, of course, your automation is changing within the region length)

-Jeff

LOL, Marti is correct on the fact that I'm Editing and Mixing this piece. I'm so sorry I haven't explained my position more clearly. Jeffria, your suggestion is exactly what I've been doing. I was just checking to see if there was an easier way. I'm a Y1, but this dialogue editing thing isn't new to me.

And don't worry, Nothing Scares Me... I work here too! Sorry for all the confusion folks.
Old 10th November 2009
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailor View Post
\All processing is done in the timeline, and however it's written (real-time or snapshot), ultimately it's all dynamic automation. So you can't EQ one region and tell Pro Tools "now apply this to every region within the session that's sourced from that same soundfile." So, many people have settled on the option of creating separate tracks for each source and processing the track in one snapshot pass. Or, creating a set of presets and dropping snapshots in as needed. But that gets tedious.

It is kind of a bummer. Avid WAS thinking of this stuff back in the day with their AudioVision app. Then they bought Digi, and Digi snuffed it. And now, "Digidesign is Avid."
This is also exactly what I was talking about. Thanks everyone for your patience in decoding this thread.
Old 12th November 2009
  #17
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dwaynedelario's Avatar
 

If you are indeed Audiosuiting, use the proper timeline drop order to drop your takes into a sequence, then use the "Object" version of the hand-tool to select all regions (make sure you have "region by region" selected in your plugin window. Upon processing, instead of creating one big region you will still have your separate takes with your EQ applied.

If you are doing an assembly with said audio files afterward, use a batch rename tool to name the files as they were before processing.

-Joe
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