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Consumer TV sets for post- 24/25p? Please help:)
Old 6th October 2019
  #1
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KarmaPolice's Avatar
 

Consumer TV sets for post- 24/25p? Please help:)

Hi there! I´m in the market for a affordable tv set for a small tv mixing stage. Been looking at this:

https://www.amazon.de/dp/B07PMDF69G/...ding=UTF8&th=1

Problem: from my experience even high end consumer sets have problems when you feed them a signal from eg a decklink card in 24p / 25p. Motion shuttering that is. When you turn on interpolation you get that "soap opera effect" and still no really defined movement. 24p is another thing...

So what do I have to look for, it seems to be really hard to find out the framerates possible (eg 48 Hz for 24p). These numbers are nowhere to be found on manufactorors websites. Even professional reviews never talk about these things, its just endless pages about contrast values and backlight bleeding and stuff...

Signal path: Pro Tools Ultimate - Decklink SDI - SDI to HDMI box - TV set

Hope somebody can shed some light, thanks
Old 4 weeks ago
  #2
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Mundox's Avatar
We have 10yr old non-smart Sony Bravia LCDs in the rooms.
All frame rates play fine out of Decklinks.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mundox View Post
We have 10yr old non-smart Sony Bravia LCDs in the rooms.
All frame rates play fine out of Decklinks.
Sony gear is infamous for not supporting 25p. At least none of their later projectors do. They can only support 50i, same on their pro-sumer cameras. No idea why. Seems like it's company policy. If you want reliable 24 and 25P stick to LG or Samsung.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #4
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I have a 65" Sony bravia led TV (KDL-65W855C) and no issue with 25p, 24p and other formats. I even worked on a 60fps video without problem. Plugged in HDMI from an AJA card.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nixt View Post
I have a 65" Sony bravia led TV (KDL-65W855C) and no issue with 25p, 24p and other formats. I even worked on a 60fps video without problem. Plugged in HDMI from an AJA card.
Here's a list of supported formats of a random current top of the line bravia TV I just copied from the Sony site.

HDMI™ Signal: 4096 x 2160p (24, 50, 60 Hz),
3840 x 2160p (24, 25, 30, 50, 60 Hz),
1080p (30, 50, 60, 100, 120 Hz), 1080/24p,
1080i (50, 60 Hz), 720p (30, 50, 60 Hz),
720/24p, 576p, 480p

No support for 1080P at 25fps, only 50i. Which pretty much reflects my experience I had with every Sony TV or projector I've tried in the past. We have one Sony projector in a room we don't use often and it just displays an "out of range" error when we play 1080P 25fps QT.

I can only see 25fps being supported at 3840 x 2160p

I guess your AJA or PT QT output is set to output 50i from a 1080P/25 QT. Or own a super-rare model that supports 25P at 1080.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #6
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I guess it's a rare model then because the output from PT is 1080p/25 and the TV even shows this info when I open a new session (1080p). I didn't get a 4K TV though. I don't need it.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nixt View Post
I guess it's a rare model then because the output from PT is 1080p/25 and the TV even shows this info when I open a new session (1080p). I didn't get a 4K TV though. I don't need it.
Weird indeed, you are lucky. I have spoken to a bunch of colleagues and they all told me they same story. No 25p with Sony. Some of them even convert the QTs to 50i to avoid the cross-conversion artefacts others just swapped them out for a different brand as 99% or their work was to 25p.

Which model do you have?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apple-q View Post
Which model do you have?
It's the KDL-65W855C. My work is also mostly 25p, when it's not it's 24p.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nixt View Post
It's the KDL-65W855C. My work is also mostly 25p, when it's not it's 24p.
Strange. Found this:

https://tvusermanual.com/guide-kdl-6...l-GSx5pe#Specs

VIDEO SIGNAL
1080 / 24p (HDMI™ only) YES
480 / 60i YES
480 / 60p YES
576 / 50i YES
576 / 50p YES
720 / 24p (HDMI™ only) YES
720 / 30p (HDMI™ only) YES
720/60p YES
1080 / 60i YES
1080 / 50i YES
1080 / 30p (HDMI™ only) YES
1080 / 60p (HDMI™ /Component) YES
1080 / 50p (HDMI™ /Component) YES

Again no 25P whatsoever listed.

Seems like yours can do some magic. Or it's just not listed.

:-D
Old 4 weeks ago
  #10
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Jamie Mac's Avatar
Most of the world (outside of the Northern America) watches content in 25 fps so it would seem very strange if a tv cannot play it back.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie Mac View Post
Most of the world (outside of the Northern America) watches content in 25 fps so it would seem very strange if a tv cannot play it back.
Normal HD TV in the PAL hemisphere is broadcast at 50i usually so for the consumer it doesn't matter. 25p is something we do in post. Or films shot at 25 for DCP. So for us it does ironically.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #12
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nixt's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by apple-q View Post
Seems like yours can do some magic. Or it's just not listed.

:-D
Strange indeed.

Anyways to come back to the original question, I also have Samsung TVs plugged the same way (HDMI out from AJA) and they work fine in 25p or 24p. I have seen this "soap opera" effect on some Samsung TVs out of the box but you can easily fix this issue by tweaking some settings on the TV. Just check out this page for example : https://www.tomsguide.com/us/samsung...ew-4663-7.html
Old 4 weeks ago
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apple-q View Post
Normal HD TV in the PAL hemisphere is broadcast at 50i usually so for the consumer it doesn't matter. 25p is something we do in post. Or films shot at 25 for DCP. So for us it does ironically.
I’m sorry I was talking about frames not fields. 50i is still 25 frames.

Anyway it doesn’t really matter what your tv can handle as the OP’s Decklink handles the PsF conversion for 25p content to 50i, by creating two fields for every frame. Its a setting in the driver menu:

“1080p HD and 2K are output ad 1080PsF segmented video”
Old 4 weeks ago
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apple-q View Post
Sony gear is infamous for not supporting 25p. At least none of their later projectors do. They can only support 50i, same on their pro-sumer cameras. No idea why. Seems like it's company policy. If you want reliable 24 and 25P stick to LG or Samsung.
I have no issues with 25, 23.98, 24 progressive or 50i frame rates.
Most stuff I play out is 25p. Whether the card is outputting what TV wants to see or not I don't know.
What I do know is that I would never prefer Samsung or LG over Sony, at home or work. Tried them both.
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